BlueDamsel
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Posts posted by BlueDamsel
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And just one more thought....
You could always consider the option of holding a Burning Micro event, a la the Burning Man Festival, but, in this case, instead of burning a wooden giant effigy of a man, you would ask attendees to collect all the lame urban micros within a fifty mile radius, and then burn them in a bonfire. However, I have been hearing rumors lately that the admins at Groundspeak may no longer be enamored of this practice, and that they may have stopped listing such events on their site. And, there is one additional problem as well: many of these lame urban micros are constructed out of plastics, and, when they are burned at temperatures commonly found in a bonfire, they tend to emit large amounts of toxic airborne pollutants as they burn; this means that you could easily run afoul of EPA guidelines for smokestack and bonfire airborne emissions.
Somehow I knew that I'd get a Vinny response. I'm smiling now. Rant over!
I thought the OP was pretty much about the proliferation of rural roadside micros, not urban micros. But I guess if the OP didn't correct Vinny, I must have been wrong. I have, for the record, seen an explosion of rural roadside micros, and I'm sure I will continue to.
Blue Damsel, you won't get much sympathy from the staunch defenders around here if you are finding these caches, or like to "clear out an area" a term I hear so much. Ignore, Ignore, Ignore.
This was partially my point. I can really understand micros everywhere in urban spaces where other things can't be hidden... but it's just kind of a waste of good real estate to put them every 10th of a mile in places such as I described, where more variety is possible. I'll still look for and log these sorts of micros when I feel like it, but it seems like a waste to me to having NOTHING but this type of cache in this type of location, and will continue to seem like a waste, despite the comments to ignore.
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Another good antidote for a case of the "micro-blahs" is ensuring that you are caching with others that are fun to be with. Then, on those occasions when your percepton of a cache is less-than-satisfying, you'll likely never really know it (or at least, won't be tempted to angst over it), cause you are having too much fun just enjoying your friends and companions.
Works like a charm.
You know, this was actually a useful suggestion unlike some other replies here. You'd probably be a fun person to cache with. And you're correct, even the most boring hide is a lot more fun with fun company along.
I think some folks really misread my original post. I wasn't making excuses or even asking for advice. You know, I usually don't even dislike stop sign post micros.... it was just this last trip went kind of over the top. Sort of like having the lunchroom serve eggs every day for a month. Even though you might like eggs normally, the mundane menu of only eggs could be enough to make you not want to eat eggs again for a little while!
(Yes, we have a lunchroom here. And this problem actually happened in our lunchroom... they served a meal that everyone liked, and the feedback was positive, so they started serving this same meal about twice a week for a loooooong time. Now, whenever I see it on the menu, for some funny reason, I get a bad taste in my mouth.)
Anyway, thanks for the truly helpful suggestion. It's refreshing to read some positive replies instead of the snarkiness that seems prevalent on these boards. I always love it when people start complaining about someone making a complaint.
BlueDamsel
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And just one more thought....
You could always consider the option of holding a Burning Micro event, a la the Burning Man Festival, but, in this case, instead of burning a wooden giant effigy of a man, you would ask attendees to collect all the lame urban micros within a fifty mile radius, and then burn them in a bonfire. However, I have been hearing rumors lately that the admins at Groundspeak may no longer be enamored of this practice, and that they may have stopped listing such events on their site. And, there is one additional problem as well: many of these lame urban micros are constructed out of plastics, and, when they are burned at temperatures commonly found in a bonfire, they tend to emit large amounts of toxic airborne pollutants as they burn; this means that you could easily run afoul of EPA guidelines for smokestack and bonfire airborne emissions.
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Somehow I knew that I'd get a Vinny response. I'm smiling now. Rant over!
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If you knew what the caches were and you knew that you weren't enjoying finding them, why did you continue looking for them? Generally, if I'm not enjoying what I am doing, I alter my behavior.
My usual caching procedure is to drive to an area and clean up every cache there, to save driving time and gas. I also don't usually look at the cache notes until I get to the site - because I usually like surprises. Unfortunately, Friday's caching was just not a good surprise. As Vinny mentioned, excluding all micros from a pocket query up front would also exclude micros that are well thought out and well placed with unique containers. I don't necessarily want to exclude all micros for this reason.
However, I will have to say that Friday's experience definitely changed my caching on Saturday and Sunday. I found myself looking at the cache notes up front to see what size the container was. However (and this is the problem with excluding micros) I did visit one micro which was nearby a larger cache just because it was there and a very short walk from the larger one, and it turned out to be a nice little micro that was a bit of an unusual find in a park I would enjoy visiting again, that I didn't know was there. I would have missed it if I'd just ignored it.
Therefore, excluding all micros isn't really a good option.
However I might start excluding all caches by one particular person
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Ok folks, be prepared for a short, but heartfelt rant.
This past Friday after work, I took off to go caching. I drove about 15 minutes northwest of my house, which is enough to get you into a semi-rural area... lots of country lanes, big fields, horses, goats, country houses more than a mile apart each, few cars and people.
As I started caching, I realized that literally every single cache in this area was placed by the same person and of two types: magnetic nano or plastic micro seed tube, and in one of two locations: stop sign pole, or attached to the underside of a fire hydrant. After finding 17 caches, of which the two notable exceptions were a decon box at the beginning of the hunt and a giant bucket at the end, it seemed as if EVERY SINGLE cache within three square miles was a micro of this type.
Given the undeveloped country location with soooooooooo many good places to hide something bigger, something more interesting, something more fun to find.....
WHAT IS UP WITH ALL THE MICROS???
I'm not fundamentally opposed to micros - when well thought out and interspersed with other types of caches they can be a nice challenge and change of pace, but really.... three square miles of the exact same hide?
I realize this has all been addressed before, but I just had to vent.
I return you now to your regularly scheduled program -
BlueDamsel
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I second Tequila here. Get the Oregon. I have heard way too many rumors that Garmin is dropping support for the Colorado, plus if you do a search on these boards you will find that many users have had problems with them (to be fair, some really love them as well). If you do decide you are leaning to the Colorado, it would pay to investigate these issues to make sure you can live with it if they are true.
I have an Oregon and LOVE it. It's the best geocaching device I have ever used, and with City Nav NT installed, it makes a great auto gps. I have nothing but good things to say about it, as I've not found anything I don't like about it yet. I love the touchscreen, and the touchscreen really has advantages when panning and scrolling on a map.
Email me if you'd like more feedback on this device.
BlueDamsel
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I bought a Zagg screen protector about a month ago and installed it on my Oregon 300. It generated serious friction when panning my map or scrolling cache descriptions. I tried to get used to it but I finally gave up on it and removed it. It un-installs pretty easily. I just peeled up a corner with a pocket knife and then peeled it off like a sticker.
So, who likes it and who doesn't. Just curious. Btw, I have the Zagg on my cell phone and digital camera and love it for those devices.
JetSkier
I absolutely hated the Zaggs I bought for my cellphone. My cellphone is touchscreen also and the surface texture of the Zagg was just.... icky.... plus I noticed interference with the touchscreen functions as well. After having a bad experience there I bought a completely different brand for my Oregon. I wish I could remember the manufacturer of the protectors I replaced it with.... something bought online.... Lexovo, Lexoro, something like that (drat... I can't remember)... but I love them... very thin and light and I can't tell the difference between function in having or not having it, yet it is thick enough that it protects against scratching.
I wouldn't buy a Zagg again. Sorry.
BlueDamsel
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Arrgh... this website has been driving me nuts lately with timeouts and double posting!
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I prefer the Colorado to the Oregon. I've never owned the Oregon, but I have used one and several of my friends have them. My Colorado is one of the few that has proven to be stable. I just don't care much for the Oregon's touch screen. No matter which one you get be prepared to use plenty of batteries. I'd highly recommend an external power source if using either of them for 20 hours per day
I'm just the opposite. I love the touchscreen. I own several touchscreen devices and they are really easy to use. I've had problems with physical buttons actually falling off a previous GPS device so they aren't any more fail proof than a touchscreen. But, you'd be wise to check out touchscreen vs. buttons side by side at a store since this seems to be a very personal decision (you either love touchsreens, or you don't, you either love the rock n roller or you don't). There are several advantages to a touchscreen: it's good for left handers, of which I'm one, it is easy to operate one-handed, map scrolling is so slick, plus you can select cache icons on the map with just a touch and the info window pops up, allowing you to do an immediate go-to if you decide to change caching destinations on the fly... plus the main advantage to the Oregon (and I don't know if Colorado has this or not) is the profile system. Basically you can set up different profiles for different uses on the same device, allowing you to change multiple settings with the touch of one button. This makes it an ideal device for switching from auto-routing to off-road use with a minimum of effort and time.
I've really fallen in love with my Oregon. I haven't had any accuracy issues with mine, and it's definitely more accurate than either of my other two GPS units.
I have heard of stability issues with the Colorado. I don't have first hand knowledge of this, but you'd be wise to read up on it before buying and make sure it won't be a problem for you.
And agreed with this poster... you will need NiMH rechargeable batteries and a car power adapter to see good economical battery life with either unit. But, with those additions, you can't beat them for paperless geocaching.
BlueDamsel
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They generally don't work very well for geocaching. Most don't have the compass navigation screen, very few are waterproof or shock resistant, the battery life is insufficient, you can't change the batteries in the field and they aren't designed to be held in the hand.
If you are just going for guardrail and parking lot caches then a vehicle GPS can do the job, but once you walk away from your vehicle you should have a dedicated hand held GPS.
Yup, I second this. Very good advice, esp. when a good handheld can be modified to do autorouting very successfully and is then extremely functional for both purposes.
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I love street routing in a GPS. But the economics of City Nav make increasingly little sense to me.
You can buy a color, touch-screen, speaking Garmin *that includes the maps* for less than the cost of City Nav. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16858108037 Admittedly, this one is discontinued and a refurb, but this class of products is meant for in-car use. Even a low-end Nuvi (again, including new maps) doesn't cost much more than City Nav.
One GPS for the car. One GPS for the belt.
I'd rather not have to work with two units when one will do the work good enough. Now, if I had to rely on my GPS for routing, I might think about buying a separate unit. Also, this just means more chances of losing a GPS due to theft (unless you want to carry the car GPS with you or can hide it well).
For the OP, not sure how well the 60CSx works for routing, so I can't say if it would be worth buying software for it.
I'm with Roddy on this point. I much prefer having one unit that does everything I need it to do. I also don't like leaving my GPS in the car, so once I leave the vehicle, the GPS has to come with me anyway. Might as well just have one device that does both functions.
Regarding routing on the 60CSX, it uses the same City Nav software that the Oregon does. It works great and is well worth the cost.
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Where I live, its two cacher's who cache together who take 95% of the FTF.
Now, its only speculation, but it doesn't matter what time of day these new cache's are published, they are almost always the FTF. So it leads me to believe these people do not have employment or education responsibilities like many cacher's do, so why reward these people? Surely if they had some responsibilities, they would not be able to find them within two hours of publishing.
Instead of concentrating on making a cache "rewarding" only for the FTF, then fizzle out after 10 finds, I believe when a cache is created, it should be done so, so its rewarding for ALL to find for months/years to come. No material items are needed to accomplish this if the cache is placed correctly.
The true spirit of caching isn't getting free-bees. Its about adventure, nature, exploration, and most of all, a common value you share with a community of others. If finding a FTF reward is the only reason you cache, then your not doing it for the reasons many others do it for.
All caches should be rewarding for all, no matter how challanging they may be. If you wouldn't challange yourself without some material reward, then you have other issues Geocaching will never help you outgrow.
I personally just like too spend a buck or two on some McDonalds certificates to leave in caches I find so others after me are rewarded on a cold day, not just the FTF's. And my scouting boys almost always leave something behind, but rarely ever take anything. They understand its more rewarding to give than to recieve, but not to the same people every time. Then its just a "hand-out".
That my friends is what the true spirit of caching is all about!
This is the exact situation where I live, with a pair of cachers being FTF on nearly everything that comes out.
I don't mind leaving a small something for the FTF on a cache, but I wouldn't put a lot of money into it on the average difficulty cache. However, on a puzzle cache I've done, that's proven to be difficult enough it hasn't been found for 4+ months, I have an unactivated geocoin for the first person who finally figures it out.
But, having lately been FTF on several puzzle caches with a high difficulty rating (two that went 11 months without being solved or found), I can guarantee you that the FTF reward for me was the actual solving of the puzzle and finding the cache, not any reward that was within the cache itself. On the last one of these puzzle caches, our team actually left better stuff in the cache than we took out. My team partner left an unactivated geocoin in there, to encourage people to keep trying to solve it, even though the FTF is now history.
I agree with this poster... if you're in it for the stuff, you're bound to be disappointed. If you're in it for adventure and exploration, pretty much every cache out there can offer that much. Even the most lowly lamp post skirt nano has the ability to take you to a place you've never been before.
BlueDamsel
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Sample subpoenas.
They give me a reason for skulking around places that are not ordinarily skulked around. I can explain that I am looking for so-and-so. After that, people generally leave me alone ... and when they don't I ask their name as I look through my stack of subpoenas.
Dang! I wish I'd thought of this. I'm stealing this idea.
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I have recently purchased three of the Garmin 60cx GPS units and want to know if anyone can tell me if I have to purchase three different Highway and City maps or if I buy one if it can be used for all three units?
Any help is appreciated since I am new to this. Thanks
If you buy the Micro SD card version, you can swap the card out between the units depending on which one you're using, but you can't make 3 cards out of it because it cannot be copied. If you buy the DVD version, it is specific to the unit it was bought for, so yes, you'd need to buy three.
This is one aspect of Garmins that I hate, but it's really not Garmin so much as the people who make the mapping FOR Garmin which require this. IMHO, if they unlocked these maps or allowed a multipile installation code for each map copy, i.e., each map could be used on up to 2 units which is a common practice among software makers - for example, my Adobe Creative Suite allows it to be installed on up to two computers per license, which means I can use it at work and at home - I think Garmin would see a lot more customers and satisfied customers if they did this. It seems after reading these boards, that there's a husband and wife, or family team with 2 GPS between them that it seems ridiculous to have to buy more than one copy per family of this type of software.
I did see someone mention on another thread that there is a cheaper route than City Navigator which can be installed on the Garmin units, but I can't remember what the software is called. If I can find the thread I'll come back and edit it into this post.
update: Check out the thread called "Auto Routing for Less" in this same forum. The stuff I was referring to is in that thread, about 3-4 posts down from the top.
BlueDamsel
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I have to agree with Starband. The 60csx is a real powerhouse. Only thing it really lacks is high resolution touch screen. If you put a high res touch screen on the 60csx you would be set.
Yeah, baby. Now there's the ticket. I'd buy such a device in a heartbeat.
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One one hand, as posted above, the Garmin supporters recommend their favorite model without coalescing to a consensus on a particular agreement.
On the other hand, the DeLorme supporters seem to have a common opinion, if you are limited to $200 then go for the PN-20, otherwise the PN-40 is the wise choice.
This might be because Garmin has so many really good models from which to choose, in all price ranges and several different configurations. This makes it easy for people to get a unit that applies to their needs. I actually bought a 60CSX after some stellar recommendations from several friends who all use them and love them, but sent it back and went to the Oregon because I just love touchscreens. There wasn't anything wrong with the 60CSX. It was a personal preference issue.
Not dissing the Delormes at all. They're a good unit from the research I did on them.
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I went the opposite way... I bought the specific unit I wanted for geocaching, then put the auto routing software on it as an extra. Been very, very happy with the result. The auto routing doesn't talk you through directions, but it does beep before a turn is coming up and then again right before you need to make the turn. It reroutes quickly when needed and the maps are as accurate as I could expect. It's worked great.
I have a very good gps for geocaching which is my primary need, so I don't have to compromise there.
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Is there any way around buying the expensive Garmin software to do turn by turn auto routing on my 60csx?
I was kind of coughing up at the price of this one too... although I got my City Nav card for free, after having used it for a while, I feel like it would have been worth the money. I really literally use it every single day and it's been very useful in helping me find addresses and businesses that I wasn't exactly sure where they were. It's saved me enough wrong turns and backtracking on geocache runs that I'm sure it would have paid for itself in gas by now. It routes well, the road map is fairly accurate (the only major road missing wasn't opened until last Sept., so I can't fault them much for that) and it reroutes very quickly if you miss your turn. I've been happy with it.
BlueDamsel
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When I paid $600 for a new CO shortly after it came out, I was less than pleased that they would not allow me to transfer my City Navigator from my 60CSX. I tired nice and angry and got no where. Considering all the problems with the firmware at that point, it was much harder to accept. IMHO, if you pay for software you should be albe to move it to another unit. I made the arguement I was upgrading and not using my old unit anymore/selling it. I ended up selling my 60CSX and also selling CN with it since they would not let me move it to the CO. I guess you are better off if it gets stolen and you get a new unit than if you just upgrade to a better GPS.
Which is one advantage to buying a card vs. a DVD. Not that I had a choice... the card was free... but it's nice to know I can move it to whatever unit I want without needing a lock code. Yes, I can't do stuff with the maps on the desktop, but I haven't needed that feature yet so I guess I don't miss it.
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I just went from a 60CSX to an Oregon 400t. After all the whiney emails/reviews about the dim screen, the drift, the accuracy etc., I have to say loudly that I hvae had ZERO issue with anything I have done so far.
The accuracy, on an overcast, winter Michigan afternoon is 11-17ft.. It is the same as my 60CSX ever got. I am on v 2.8. So more upgrades may come soon under the beta 2.86. All the worry was for nothing. I did try the Colorado 400c at West Marine, to help me decide. I have to say, FOR ME, the rock and roll whell would drive me batty. For geocaching, the field notes, and upload is slick. It is nice, solid, bright when needed, saves on battery when you are not looking at it by dimming (and you can set the options on that). I do not regret it...and I was nervous. I was nervous because the 60CSX treated me right. It was accurate, and well built. I would reccomend either the 60CSX or the Oregon series.
WHO-DEY
Yeah, this description is nearly identical to my experience with an Oregon. I love mine, and have not had accuracy or screen issues as some people report.
The paperless geocaching is the best out there, and since I use mine 80% for geocaching, that's a big deal. And I can't say enough good things about touchscreen operation. I thought it might have problems, but it doesn't.... and the pluses of a touchscreen are just too numerous to mention.
BlueDamsel
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I cannot speak to how easy the OR is to use with one hand (but suspect it could be hard), but I can tell you the CO is much easeir to use with one hand (and not looking at it) than any other GPS I have ever had. With its big buttons (far apart) and the rock n roller, it is a breeze to operate (particularly since it has profiles). A good example is when you are using street navigation to get you to the cache. When I get close I like to switch to off road navigation. I can do this in a couple of seconds with one hand not looking at the GPS. I push the right button, rotate the rock n roller one click, then push the select button twice.
I am sure BlueDamsel could give you info on how easy it is to operate the OR with one hand-and without having to look at it why you are driving down the road. Why I thik it is probably harder with the OR is with the CO you find physical buttons, with the OR you need to see the screen to see what you need to push.
I hope Garmin's next GPS will have a tocuch screen that is easier to see, some hardware buttons, and the rock n roller.
I've found the Oregon is really easy to use with one hand and this is no small feat, since I am a left-hander and most devices of this type are designed with right handers in mind. Having used GPSrs with physical buttons, I much prefer the touchscreen. The "buttons" on the touchscreen are very large and easy to see, so it really doesn't take much effort to use it while driving. It's about as distracting as checking your rear-view mirror. (OK, I can say I haven't even gotten close to being in an accident yet while using it!) As with any device, buttoned or touchscreen, you should make your settings, Go To, or whatever BEFORE you put the car in drive, since both types of devices will require some looking to make sure you pressed the correct thing in the correct sequence to get what you want. The only thing I usually need to do while driving is zoom out to see the map better, since City Nav does the zooming in automatically. I have a Ram mount right next to the steering wheel, so I don't have to glance very far from the windshield to see the GPSr screen.
One thing myotis mentioned is being able to easily move around the map via the touchscreen. IMHO, this is one of the Oregon's biggest features and one of the best reasons to have a touchscreen. It is really nice to be able to just swipe your fingertip over the map to check out adjacent areas next to the current cache without having to zoom, click or scroll. If you see a cache icon on the portion of the map you've swiped to, you can just touch it and the cache info page pops up (the icons are small, so a stylus helps here, but I can do it with a fingernail). If you decide you want to find that cache, you just click Go and you're on your way.
As for visibility problems with the Oregon, I suggest you compare it with other units, turned on of course, at the local sporting goods store if you think this will be a problem. I haven't found it to be aggravating in any way whatsoever, in any light conditions. Yes, it is somewhat dimmer than other GPS screens, but it is still quite readable for any use I've put it to. However, it is not everyone's cup of tea, so if you're considering this unit, make sure you like the way it looks (with backlight turned on... I agree it's absolutely atrocious if you don't use the backlight all the time) before buying. And remember, if you use NiMHs, the cost to power it with full backlight on is negligible.
BlueDamsel
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What is WITH this website lately? I am getting all kinds of double post issues. Sorry.
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BlueDamsel,
I've been enjoying my Oregon for weeks and I forgot to thank you for your suggestion. I called Garmin and they gave me a new lock code for City Navigator 2008. They didn't ask me for a police report number, but I had it handy, just in case.
Thank you so much!
Jeep Del Fuego
No problem, you're welcome. I've never had problems with Garmin customer service, in fact, they've usually been quite helpful with any questions I've ever had.
I think when people run into trouble is when they call up ready to be angry at whoever answers the phone at customer service. I've learned if you ask nicely but firmly, and aren't trying to necessarily get something for nothing, most businesses want to make you happy if it means they can retain your goodwill for future purchases.
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We have a Garmin E-trex Ledgend. and are wanting to buy a new GPS. What would you reccomend. We love the one we have we just want a better one.
Thanks for the info.
CuMoChi
I have really loved using my Garmin Oregon 300. It's probably got the best paperless geocaching functions out there, so if you're planning on using it primarily for geocaching, you might want to seriously look at this device. It's a little spendy, but it is a great unit - I used to use a Legend and the difference in time-saving that the paperless caching provides is well worth the extra cost. I am also a big fan of touchscreens and the Oregon's is no exception. If you also decide to use this unit for road routing, a touchscreen makes ALL the difference when trying to operate the device in the car while driving, vs. buttons which can be awkward to access. I love the Oregon with City Navigator. It seems to be accurate as far as current roads, and it reroutes very quickly if you happen to miss a turn.
One of the best features of this device is the profile system. You can set up separate profiles for geocaching (i.e., topo map turned on, lock to road turned off, etc.), for automotive (topos turned off, lock to road on, automotive view on, etc.), or any other particular use you have, and to switch between these different setting setups is one touch of a button vs. going in and changing everything manually. So, when going to find a cache, I do a Where To, select the cache I want to find, and route to the general area using the Automotive profile. When I get to the approximate site and get out of the car, I switch to the Geocaching profile, which automatically turns on my topos and direct routing, and go from there. It makes things SO easy.
The Oregon can hold up to 2000 caches, of which you can load Groundspeak's maximum of 500 at a time via a pocket query. The cache info on the device includes waypoint name and number, who placed it, when, difficulty and terrain ratings, general description, hint, and last five logs, and it is graphically similar to the geocaching.com website. It does not hold any pictures or images on the cache page, but if they are critical to your find (such as a puzzle cache image), you can load them separately onto the Oregon using the Image Viewer function.
Some users have reported difficulties with the screen dimness. I agree, the screen is dim when you first take the unit out of the box and turn it on. However, this issue is easily remedied by doing the following things: Replace colored backgrounds with all-white backgrounds (instructions at gpsfix.net). Then, keep the backlight on full/constant. If you keep the backlight on but use NiMH rechargeable batteries to get good battery life, enable full GPS function until they are drained, and keep expense down, you will not notice much screen difference or battery life between other GPSr devices. My NiMHs are 2700 mAh and I am getting around 11-12 hours of use per set before they run out.
One advantage of the Oregon's screen is that it is bigger than most other GPSr units, so you can see a lot of map at once. The information panels are also transparent over the map, so you can still see what sits underneath them.
As for accuracy, I think this unit is FAR better than my old Legend and as good as any other GPS device I've personally used. I am noticing under 10 feet accuracy on most caches and within 20 on any others. (You have to remember when judging accuracy finding caches, that a lot of how close you are to a cache depends on not only your unit's accuracy, but the also unit of the cache owner, and whether his waypoints were averaged and how accurately, so take all comments like this with a grain of salt. I am just reporting on my own casual observations of my experiences with my own unit.)
There are also a lot of FREE/shareware topo maps available for Garmins (gpsfiledepot.com) which a lot of folks feel are better than Garmin's topos (I personally think they look pretty good), and if you are into aerial imagery, it can be uploaded to this unit using ExpertGPS or a similar program.
Anyway, feel free to email me if you have any questions.
Hope this helps.
BlueDamsel
Micros, micros, and more micros
in General geocaching topics
Posted
And it won't prevent you from completely missing the point, will it?
Over and out.