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Lemon Fresh Dog

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Posts posted by Lemon Fresh Dog

  1. What killed my interest in most all coins.


    Commercialization, Cost, Attitude of People.


    I can count on 1 hand the coins i've purchsed in the last 2 years.


    I had a pathtag made and for a few months really got back into the excitement of trading personals, but even my interest in that has waned.


    I hear ya.


    I will say that I really enjoy having one of those Nero coins in my pile though :)


    I'm not sure if anyone here knows super-old comics, but the Nero character reminds me of a Schmoo for some reason. Gives me a chuckle.

  2. I guess I'll add.


    I the "olden" days. People made their own personal coin so that they could trade for other people's own personal coin. It was pretty simple and you basically "bought" everyones personal coin by fronting the cost to get your own made and trading for them other ones you wanted. This didn't change the cost to you. If you paid $1000 for 200 coins, then traded for 200 other coins, you basically "paid" $5 for each coin. It was normally some sort of split though. You'd trade off half and cache half. Everyone had their own "ratio" - some were even 100% cached, some where 100% traded, etc, etc. Some people even created different metals for different purposes, etc, etc.


    Of course, there were folks that couldn't afford the initial outlay of cash and didn't want that many coins. So other people created runs of coins (usually caching clubs) and sold them to members, friends, etc). People could buy 2,5,50 coins and then trade those ones for others they wanted or even place them in caches!


    Finally, some people started making coins and adding an extra amount over minting costs to generate a profit. The "commercial" coins. Some people pocketed the profit in cash, while others used it to "pay for" their own coins. For example, mint $1000 worth of coins (200), sell 100 of them for $10 each to cover costs and have 100 left for trades, caches, etc, etc.


    Years ago, I did a 600 coin set of coins that were sold at cost. These were trackable (before custom icons) and cost just under $6 each - which is what they were sold to the community for. Anytime I see a simple coin that sells for more than $6-$8 - I know that there is profit being made. More complex designs cost more though... my last coin (trackable, custom icon, big, etc, etc) cost somewhere around $15.50 each or so to make.


    The point being. Commercial coins are "okay", but there are just too many of them and people are not really wanting to fund someone's personal coin project any more. (there are plenty of reasons for that).


    There are also enough companies making coins that if you want a coin for your cache - then go ahead and buy a bunch. There's no exclusion there.


    If you want the community to support your own personal design? Well.. it better be excellent - because that is where the interest is faltering.


    I think that anyone that really wants a personal coin should spend their own money on it and then trade it, cache it, etc. Expecting the community to fund it is probably not going to work as well anymore and may soon be a thing of the past.


    This isn't exclusion. This doesn't create an "elite" coin group either. It does create somewhat of an economic barrier - which we all face every day.


    I've always been on the fence in some regards on this. Community funding has allowed for more coins to be made, more variety, and created an item that is less unique. While I was all for this in the past - because I thought it would stem the tide of theft from caches - that has not happened.


    Now, I find myself back to viewing coins as a signature item pretty exclusively (which is probably the side of the fence I was facing anyhow) and only collect what I consider "pure" coins. Those that are created by some cacher for that cacher.


    I still want a magic wand...

  3. I make no judgement on commercialization of coins. If someone produces a coin and seeks to generate profit on it for whatever reason - more power to them.


    Personally, in response to the OP - I just have lost all interest in 99% of commercial coins. I remain healthily interested in personals.


    That's just my way of enjoying them.


    If you decide to make a coin that requires community funding by way of sales to the coin collecting community - just be aware that that interest may not be what it once was. If your coin is stunning and amazing - then you will do fine. In the old days, you could make a really bad coin, mark it up by $2 over cost, and sell 1000 of them. That would have been a quick $2000 in pocket. (less any expenses, etc)


    Today? - not so much.


    There is certainly enough room for us to all enjoy the coins we want. What may be happening (as per the OP) is that interest in certain "types" of coins is on the wane.

  4. Personally, I define commercial coins as those coins which are produced primarily for a non-cache purpose. For collection and trading. In some regards, any coin can be commercial (at inception or after-market).


    I suppose I would rather say "commemorative" and "signature item" as the two buckets. I still collect "signature items", but I don't really like commemorative edition coins for events, people or subjects that I have no connection to.


    This is the reason that I will actually never sell any of my coins. They still all represent something meaningful to me and occasionally I get a surprise one! :anibad:


    These have "meaning" to me. That's not really a definition of commercial - but it's my personal take on the subject. My interest in the coins I have has not changed - they are all very cool to me. Interest in new coins? It depends on who they are from and how I get them. It's been a few months since I have gotten any coins - but I've dropped a few of my V2's here and there.


    In fact, besides coins - I have a Team 360 Kokopelli stone and some old shot glass that mean as much to me as my Moun10bike V2 that I got from the man himself. :anibad:

    For me, the coins always were and always will be about that special connection to people around the world. That's my "interest" in them.

  5. Minting costs vary widely. Size, shape, thickness, colours, etc, etc.


    You can make an inexpensive (and nice) trackable for the $6-$8 range to be sure. More complex designs can come in at over $12-$15 per coin. I've minted at both ends of that spectrum. (actually, I did some non-trackabe 100 lot sets at about $4 each!)


    Cost could certainly be a factor affecting interest. You can get some pretty nice trading material elsewhere for $4-$6 per item - so why bother with coins? It's a question worth asking.

  6. I suppose it also begs the question: is interest in geocaching itself on the wane?


    Personally, I've always been a fair-weather cacher, cacher of opportunity, or travelling cacher - whatever you want to call it. I don't cache as an activity unto itself, but rather as an added element to my pre-existing travels and journeys. I also gave-up logging caches I don't like a long time ago - the old saying "if you don't have anything nice to say..."


    The entire purpose and use of coins took a dramatic turn somewhere in early to mid 2006 (in my opinion - some would place the date earlier). This was when they started (in general, not all cases) to become caching collectibles rather than artifacts of the hobby itself. Some were certainly released, but the percentage of release-to-held was very low. In fact, some folks "rebelled" and created coins for "release-only", but many more were intentionally or unintentionally created for the purpose of collecting - commercial coins if you will.


    Not that there is anything wrong with that, but it's sort of like commemorative coins versus coins for circulation. True coin collectors (I'm talking about real money here) do not normally collect commemorative coins. When you see the Franklin Mint setting a "Strict limit of 5 per customer" - it's sort of a joke amongst those that collect coins.


    Geocoins were signature items. Then they changed. They were over-minted. People grew confused and tired.


    Many people have talked about a return to the roots of geocoins. That's already happening. Many people have coins that are just personal signature items. Some people have returned to non-coin signature items (for awhile I was using little marbles of the planets - Mars, Earth and Moon - okay, the moon isn't a planet). I just wanted something durable that would "survive" in a wet, damp, cache.


    Back to caches. Caches (at least that I see) have changed as well. The ammo can in the woods has become a micro by the mall. That's an entirely different discussion, but it relates to coins in that you can't really place a coin in a nano-cache (yeah...I know...) and you also can't expect a coin to survive in a cache that is easy to access anonymously and subject to muggleization (new word!)


    All this may seem to make coins less popular, but I maintain that there is still strong interest. I just don't see the interest being by the same people in the same way. So once you buy a coin, you are less likely to "flip" it for profit. It's more of a commemorative keepsake. Unless you find a personal or one that is not for sale :anibad:

  7. In the "olden" days, when there were only a few coins each month - there was a large audience waiting to buy them. The majority of the audience is still there (people come and go), but the selection is so large that their buying power is distributed and no single issue will be huge.


    I disagree. The number of coins back then was just as staggering as today. If you think how many 2005 trackable coins were made and we only officially were allowed to make them in late May of 2005 (and then end of August of 2005 for personals)... that 7 and 4 months respectively and there are tons of coins from that era, not including non-trackables!


    I agree. The number of people buying geocoins in 2005 and 2006 was 5-6 times what it is today, at least it was in coin hotbeds. We had about 50 people in Northern New Jersey alone collecting coins, and some 200 in the region. Now I can count on my (10) fingers all the people in the region who collect coins. Coins also cost and were bought by people who geocached, now they are bought as works of art and collected... different time different market! :P


    There would be 1000 coin runs selling out in a day and 500 selling out in 5 minutes! :D


    :D okay... what if I change that to the "ancient old days" :)


    I well remember there being less than 100 coins in total to collect. As in 100 unique coins.

  8. I've been "collecting" Geocoins for awhile and certainly don't see the interest going down - I see more selectivity and more selection. Which may slow the sales on any specific coin.


    In the "olden" days, when there were only a few coins each month - there was a large audience waiting to buy them. The majority of the audience is still there (people come and go), but the selection is so large that their buying power is distributed and no single issue will be huge.


    Plus, there were too many shenanigans around limited editions, commercial-only, etc, etc. This creates distain amongst the purists, drives values up (initially) and "fatigues" the market for new releases as it confuses what is and is not a "real" geocoin. That's happened in many collectibles: stamps (Tonga), coins (Franklin Mint), Beanie Babies, Comics and more.


    In all those above mentioned hobbies - collectors originally attempted to complete an entire collection, then specialized, and then became "topical" and focused on one aspect of the hobby.


    This is my take. I only really collect Personal coins from people I meet or connect to in some way. I also like technology coins, but the challenge is that as soon as a topical area (caching-related, technology-related, geo-related emerges then the commercial interests will seek to fill that market with product)


    Personally, I think the interest in "commerical" and "product" coins is down, but the interest in coins that have meaning and connection to the hobby and others in it remains.

  9. Although someone took the Jeep that was attached to it - this bug has had a great life with many super logs.




    Today is the anniversary of it's launch (Canadian Thanksgiving) - and it was fun to check out the many things people have written in the log.

  10. We are going on a three day road trip this weekend and we will be dropping some unactivated coins for people to find by surprise. I'm looking forward to the finders logs!


    Coming down to Colorado any?! Heh heh heh. Have a great and fun road trip!


    I tried to drop one off in Denver last week. However, I couldn't find the cache near my hotel. I'm done posting when I leave these things.


    It's on the roof of the parking lot.


    :laughing: I've been to Denver and I'm thinking of a cache near the downtown hotels. Is this the one? The coordinates take you to the bottom of the parking lot. you have to go UP.


    On the topic of coins in caches.


    I delay posting cache finds, because I almost always leave coins in caches as gifts. This prevents "followers" from grabbing more than one coin (or at least discourages it).


    I think it's common courtesy to leave the second coin. Nobody likes the person that takes the last piece of pizza when someone hasn't had any.

  11. Hello there! I am back - I was away from the forums for awhile - sorry for any delays.


    I had 3 PM's that I responded to - so hopefully everyone has heard from me. It's nice to see that some packages arrived, but it's very confusing as to why the one #161 would have taken 2 months.


    I drop all my packages at the same time. So there aren't multiple trips to the mailbox drop. A hand cancel is always weird as well. Oh well.... this will all get sorted.


    I can guarantee one thing - this is the last coin of mine that will see a bubble mailer! (well....I might send some gift ones, but I will never sell any again - it took too long and it makes me feel bad for those that had to wait/are waiting)

  12. I just had a bad experience with delivery, but here's how I do it:


    1) My return address printed on a sheet of Avery labels

    2) Print out addresses, cut and tape onto envelopes

    3) Print the following on CLEAR Avery labels "Metal Game Token, Gift, Value #10" (each element on a separate line.


    Then, take the GREEN custom sticker, stick it on the envelope, take a CLEAR Avery sticker and stick it on top. Voila! No writing at all.


    That said - I have had some VERY bad delivery times in the last batch of 100 coins I sent out.

  13. hello all - I wanted to post a quick bump to let folks know I haven't forgotten you!


    At this point - you either have your Geobone or I'll consider it LOST.


    PM me if you ordered one and DO NOT have it. I will activate it as a lost coin and get you a refund on your purchase price.

  14. Grrrrrrr..... It's actually worse than that.


    I use a mailbox service company and the batch that had all my gift bones were handed into them on the 5th. So they obviously sat on them until the 18th or 19th....


    I am not happy :laughing:


    However, I suppose I am happy that they are arriving.

  15. It's a little stranger that you don't have your coins - because there aren't any border issues. The coins went out in two "groups" - the Dec 10th group and the Jan 5th group. So the coins you ordered Dec 31st would have been in the Jan 5th group - which are the ones arriving now.


    So.....in the event that there is someone here from the Dec 10th group that hasn't gotten their coins, they are probably lost.


    Please contact me if this is the case for you. The best way is via a PM and we'll get the coins activated and deal with the payments.


    I have no replacement coins and if a coin is lost en route then I'd rather not send to the same location. I'd rather activate them as LOST and then refund.

  16. Anyone that can hurt an animal - especially in this way and for this purpose is dangerous. They are mentally ill.


    As for fakes helping thieves?

    I don't think a thief would go through the effort to "hide their tracks" - and nothing would discourage this behaviour - real or fake, at any rate.

  17. I wouldn't mind a DHobby V.1 to go along with my Waypoint 15 coin, but the Waypoint 15 was always my most desired coin so I guess I've reached nirvana, lol. More realistically I've been itching to get one of those new Tasmania coins with the thylacine on it and one of the geocaching 7th anniversary coins.


    Nice! The Waypoint 15 is a real score and the DHobby V1 is going to be a good goal to try and reach!

  18. My Geocoin Heart Desires:


    That at every event, every gathering, and every meet & greet - someone gives someone their first coin as a gift. Preferably a kid!


    Oh....that and a Moun10Bike v1....yeah...one of those :bad:


    It's funny - at some point, I stopped "wanting" geocoins and just sort of figured I'd let what happens happen. The result has been a less frequent flow of new coins, but a far more meaningful one.

  19. I believe that one should take their pants off as often as possible.


    That said - I am very glad the coins arrived.


    It's like sending your kids to college! You just sit around waiting for them to let you know they made it okay!

  20. Part of me likes the idea of fake coins being in caches.


    This way - when someone visits the cache to steal a real coin, they get a fake! haha! to them! Haha! to them!


    However.... it sort of penalizes those that are legitimately interested in moving real coins.


    Then, part of me thinks - if you change the name from "My cool coin" to "A copy of my cool coin" you can warn people ahead of time and they can decide for themselves whether to look or not.


    Then, part of me thinks - that jut warns the thieves.


    Then, part of me thinks - I wish we could do away with the icons on cache listings all-together.... this way there is no "alert" system on coins that can be used by those with less-than-honourable intentions.


    After all - isn't geocaching about finding caches?, not coins?


    So.... my final idea is that I don't log coins into caches many times. This means that my coin *may* go missing, but at least I didn't make it easier for the thief to know I was there. (yeah...I keep track of caches I find and when I find them, but don't always log them either - don't need someone following me for "free" eBay materials). I like to put nice things in caches for kids (new toys) and quality items for adults too ($5-$10 new items that can be used outdoors, for a coffee, etc. - no McToys and old paper)


    It's better to do so incognito and let folks be surprised.


    So.... fake coins! (opps)


    I have no problem with them. If I see a real coin cool, if I see a fake then so be it. I just hope the cache took me on a pleasant hike.

  21. Order placed this morning


    No bones to NY as of yet. Has everyone gotten theirs? (I know.. it's only been 3 weeks)


    No sign of the chaser package yet.


    It went out around Jan 5th or so. I would have hoped it would have arrived in 2-3 weeks. Some of the other gift packages sent at the same time arrived last week - so, once again, it seems there are certain "black holes" for the packages I am sending.


    They are all very much the same type of packaging, labeling, etc, etc. So why some take longer than others is an enigma surrounded in mystery and wrapped in intrigue.

  22. Hmmm..


    Seems like there are TWO types of "missing" coins:


    1) Cacher grabs coin and notes it in the log and/or "grabs" the coin and adds to inventory.

    2) Coin goes missing. No note in logbook, no note online, shows as still being in a cache.


    IF we are talking about type 1 above - then it may be procedural ignorance. I still think it's weak as it's not rocket science, but everyone learns at their own pace.


    IF we are taking about type 2 above - then I still say it's mostly pure theft. Sorry, but that's the deal.


    I had a cache called Lemon Fresh Dog's Coin Cache". It was very obviously stolen. I have placed coins in some of my own caches (close to home) and then visited shortly afterwards to find the coin missing - no log, no note.


    There is a time for understanding and a time for facing facts.


    Coins have a perceived value to them. They are also the nicest item you are likely to find in a cache. Caching is a relatively "anonymous" activity if you want it to be. That all adds up to theft.


    All that said - I still like placing coins in caches!

    For awhile I used non-trackable ones and just left them as gifts.

    My new thing is to use trackables, but state on the page that they can be kept, traded, or moved along, but NOT sold.


    I'm not terribly adverse to just giving a coin as a gift, but I don't want to become part of the eBay supply-chain (unless I'm the one minting, buying and reselling).


    Most unlogged missing coins are due to theft. That's my opinion.

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