Team Noltex

I agree with playing within the framework of the rules AND the traditions of geocaching. For instance, the error that was made with Travis and I a few nights ago happened when I went to place the TB at a pre-selected cache. The cache description said nothing about a park or closing hours. When I got there, I noticed that it was in a park and after starting toward the trail I thought that I had better check for any signs with posted closing hours. I found a sign that said the park was closed from dusk to dawn and since it was around 8:00 pm, knew that I had to abandon that cache, even though there were no closing times listed on the description. I didn't want to take the chance that placing it there would result in a penalty. We had to quickly chose another cache and accidentally chose a members only. Honest mistake for sure but an error nonetheless. Having made too many mistakes in my life to count, I know that they are often not intentional or premeditated. No hard feelings toward VDS or anyone else on Team North. There's lots of game left, so lets play! Jeff Automobile ACCIDENTS are called that because if they were purpose they'd have to be called something else!

I got up to look at this forum this morning and after reading the new posts I went back and re-read all of them from when the controversy started with an eye toward respect and civility. I really didn't see much more than reasonably intelligent people making arguments about a matter in dispute. No argument over someone's actions can ever exclude an examination of the person's mental state - intent, knowledge, negligence or recklessness. That is what law is based on. However, examining that mental state is not automatically a personal attack, though it might fee like it is from that person's point of view. I want to be able to argue points of rule like this without personalities getting involved. Otherwise, it takes all the fun out of it for everyone. None of my comments are meant to ever attack someone personally. I don't do that and don't tolerate it in others. I say this because the only way you know me is through what I write and with only a few exceptions we don't know each other personally. If there were no controversies (minor only, please!) we'd probably quickly lose interest in the game. They are going to happen and we should be able to handle them reasonably. We argue, there is a resolution and we move on. I truly hope that we can keep this game on that level without feelings getting hurt. Please let me know directly if you feel anything I say is not up to that level.

If you weren't looking to get around the closing time listed on the cache description page, you wouldn't have bothered to look on a web page for info on a cache you did in August. You'd punch in the coords and go there, just like everyone else.

shallow justifications for over-zealousness.

I appreciate your voice of reason Travis. However, VDS' "good faith error" is no different than yours in picking a members only cache two nights ago. North capitalized on what the ref ruled in that instance was an error, why should it be different this time?

Seems a bit too coincidental that vds "forgot" to log the drop off time at a park that closes at 10:00 pm, then had to go back to edit it to match, since the cache description clearly states the closing time. And this, after picking up the bug at 9:12 pm from a park where the cache description also clearly states that the park closes at 9:00 pm. Lots of tracks to cover, huh? I agree with Happy, lots of pre-emptive defensiveness indicates wrong doing. A ruling please?

Well, since the parking coords for Watch Your Head that are given on the description are IN the park, the safest thing was to not use that cache.

I bought a used ST Map on Ebay a couple months ago. It worked fine for a couple weeks, then developed lines on the display. I called Magellan, told them about the problem and even told them that I bought it used. To my shock, they told me the repair was covered, so I sent it in, feeling very pleased. I got the box back about two weeks later and to my complete amazement, not only did they send me goodies (windshield mount, neoprene carry case, serial cable), they sent back to me a brand new ST PRO! Not only did they do warranty work when they technically didn't have to, they upgraded my GPSr! That's first rate customer service in my book.