Firespinner

I'm sorry for your loss. I helped a geocoin travel around a while back and it was a beautiful coin in rememberance of a cacher who had passed. A photo of her playing the violin was embedded on one side and the other side had her geocache name and some cool artwork. I thought it was a really sweet way to remember her, that way she was still in the game in spirit and is still traveling cache to cache. I know minting coins is EXPENSIVE but maybe you could take up a collection from the cachers who knew your friend and try to get some minted as a group?

I am guilty of this! I went on a lovely geocache bike ride last weekend and I have still not logged online. It's not because I dont' want to but because i either forget to log, or I get on to log and then get distracted by interesting reading in the forums. Liek even now.....I'm in the forums but I have to leave in a couple minutes to drive the kidlet to school....so no logging them now either. Hopefully I will this afternoon

I think its because with a geocache, you are given coordinates and what path you take to get to those coordinates could be different depending on where you start, how accurate your GPS is, whether you can read it well or not. Basically you're given an end destination and how you get there is up to you. Even if you start them off on the trail, if they are reading the GPS wrong or it is drifting a lot, if they think its' pointing off the trail, many geocachers would go off trail to find it. With the older game of letterboxing, you are given the instructions on the actual path to take. For example: If you start them off at the beginning of the trail and then you say walk 10 feet forward to the sign post, turn left at the trail intersection and go 50 feet. Cross the creek and continue on the trail for 100 feet until you see the large tree at the fork. Take the right trail fork for 20 more feet and arrive at the letterbox under the bird identification plaque. So they HAVE to stay on your trail to arrive at the letterbox and thus you can make the instructions to follow. With a geocache, if the trail looks like it turns left and the GPS is pointing straight ahead, many cachers would take the 'quick route' and go straight and off trail rather than walking left and seeing if the trail curves back on-track to the cache.

another idea.....it won't help for today but for future rainy days............. When its nice and you DO go to geocaches, have students collect leaves along the way and preserve them in an album along with the day and place you found each leaf. THen when you have another rainy or too-cold day to go outside, you can teach them to use taxonomy charts to identify the trees by name. If there are any animal prints near by, they could even make quick plaster molds and then on rainy days do research and figure out which animal left the tracts. I don't think I'm allowed to post a company name in the forums, so I'm sending you a seperate PM of a great company for science students to study nature. They have all sorts of resources for teachers about track identification.

Have them do a group art project to make a travel bug (the one I saw from an 8th grade class was a decorated stick) and then discuss what goal the class would like for their travelbug. Vote or discuss until one travel bug goal can be decided upon. Then when you meet on a nice day, release that bug in a geocache. As it progresses, you will have logs of where it has been. On the next day that you meet when it's raining, you can use that time to chart or draw on a big map the path the class travel bug has taken. :-) They could even be tasked with keeping a class journal and researching one interesting thing about every town/place the travelbug has stopped and visited. :-) They could also work on a class signature item as a rainy-day craft.

um....not at all. You can buy a used GPS unit on ebay for $50. It might not be top-of-the-line but it will give you Long and Lat coordinates which is all you really need. And on that note...there are many geocachers who do NOT use a GPS at all. I found 7 before I bought mine. Pen and paper....not too pricey. Car and Gas?......Maybe if you are driving all over doing micros. I usually go geocaching by bike.....free pedal power. If I do drive to them, I do not go out specifically for geocaching but I grab a cache while already out on the way to something else. Goodies......those are relativly cheap. Now, I don't mean give cheap crap like popcaps and coupons, but you can get some fun stuff for cache's that aren't too expensive. I cleaned my house and got lots for stashing....the trinkets that are cute but don't fit into my decor or are just sitting around not getting used but are perfectly good. So far, geocaching has been relatively cheap! It's been much less expensive than my beading, wool spinning, crafting hobbies. It's certainly cheaper than my husband's computer hobbies. And when compared to all hobbies/ sports.....I would say it certainly doesnt' rank as one of the costliest. It doesn't come near to the cost of such sports/ hobbies as skydiving, scuba diving, yachting, car racing, horse racing.....I coudl go on and on and on. Geocaching can be cheap.

I had heard of "flash mobbing" and thought the idea was funny. I started looking online for information on flashmobbing in my area (couldn't find any) and there was a side bar advertisement about geocaching. I was curious and clicked on it.....was instantly hooked.

I went back and used clues to figure out who this was. If I'm right, it looks like he IS a premium member. He also does seem to be keeping tons of TB's saying things like he'll hang on to them until he goes on a big trip, but then never logs again about them. Can't Groundspeak at least remove his premium status? I know it won't help much but it would at least protect some premium caches for a while until he sock puppets.

That is AWESOME! I will have to try pulling that one off next time! :-) The JW's think I"m just a smart a** because I told the truth. They came knocking on my door and I told them I couldn't talk right now, I was running out to pay my taxes and buy a birthday present. That is REALLY what I was doing....I even had my keys in hand and was heading for the door when they knocked. It wasn't until later when I remembered how anti-birthday/celebration and anti-govt/taxes they were. lol.

You would attempt to punish the cache owner for the papers you find in his cache - even if they were placed there by someone else? You have already been to the cache, got your smiley and presumably would not be returning. This is a perfect example of the intolerance that everyone has been talking about in this post...What possible harm has occured to you to cause you to file the "needs archived"? If you carefully read what they wrote it says "I would email the owner about it. IF THEY SAY THE CACHE IS SUPPOSED TO HAVE THOSE IN IT, THEN SUMBIT A NEEDS ARCHIVED LOG. " (for the record....not yelling, just put it in all caps to make it stand out). The purpose of that woudl be to find out if the cache is supposed to be pushing an agenda. THere are several around here that have been stuffed with tracts by cachers without the cache owners knowledge, and in that case, yes the cache owner should not have their cache archived. The point was probably to archive those caches which are intentionally set to push an agenda, which against the rules. There are a few around here which DO have tons of religious tracts in them and then when you look....surprise...they're set on church grounds. The church doesn't mention that its hidden at a church on the log page, they dont' mention religion at all so they could get around the reviewer and the rules, but then they keep their cache stuffed with tracts. It is clear that those caches were put with the purpose to prostalitize. If someone emails the cache owner and tells them that the cache was stuffed with tracts, and the cache owner SAYS THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE IN THERE, then it is obviously a cache that breaks the rules.

Andy, While I will admit that I haven't read every post on this page, I have to say the ones I have read don't seem to be "bashing" Christians. The original question was about the appropriatness of stuffing a cache with religious tracts. From my own experience, the only tracts I have EVER seen are put out by Christian churches. I've never seen Jewish tracts, Pagan tracts, Muslim tracts...etc. So that is probably why people are mentioning Christians as the people who are doing this. I think its wrong to push Christianity through bible tracts which are often mean and cruel. I think it is just as wrong for JW's to pounce on me at my doorstep or for the local guy here (I still can't figure out what religion he is, but its not Christain) to stand in front of the PuttPutt and scream his dogma to all who are just trying to sink a little colored ball in a hole. Christains were mentioned because the tracts in the original post are almost always christian tracts. Now, that does NOT NOT NOT mean that all Christians do this. It does NOT NOT NOT mean that Christians are all pushy, nosy people who think everyone must believe their way. IF anyone has been bashed, its the over agressive people who push their religion, not Christians in general. Please don't lump all Christians in this group of zealots. Not all Christains try to push their religion on others just as not all Pagans work dark magick, not all Muslims hate americans, not all JW's pound the pavement knocking on doors, not all Penacostls talk in tongues, not all Wiccans think they're some one famous reincarnated....I could go on and on. My point is that Christains were brought up because 99% of the time, the religious tracts in question are Christian. It's those religious tracts that many find offensive...and please don't lump all Christains in there. While MOST religious tracts are Christain, MOST christains do NOT leave bible tracts. It's a select few that do, just as its a select few from each religion that stand out and tend to give the whole religion a bad name.

Do you feel the same way if the pamphlet is about ecology, geocaching, nutrition, hiking etc? Or is it only bad when you don't approve of the message? I dont' think propaganda of ANY sort should be in a cache. I guess my point wasn't clear enough. Trade items such a necklaces, bookmarks anything of that sort is fine because its not trash....a cross or a carrot pendant, it doesn't matter to me. Paper pamphlets, coupons and advertisments aren't ok. They get musty and messy and fill up cache space that could be used for real trade items. I dont' care if its a Christian tract, a "Pagan tract", an Arby's coupon or a paper about the 4 food groups...it doesn't belong in a cache. I am a vegetarian and I would never think its ok to put PETA papers in a cache trying to convince people to stop eating meat. 1. It wont' turn anyone vegetarian to find these papers and 2. it annoys meat eaters who are just trying to have fun caching and 3. if they get damp, they ruin the cache! So bottom line in my opinion, pamphlets propaganda, brochures, etc promoting ANY agenda do not belong in a cache.

I am Pagan as well but I see it a little differently than you. I agree that pamphlets and tracts should NOT be allowed in caches. Tracts, while funny to some, are usually offensive and instead of saying a positive message about what the person believes, they usually ridicule or threaten a group (be it Pagans, Non-religious, Gays, Minoiritys..etc). Besides the fact that all these little papers tend to fill up a cache, get musty and make a mess. However, I have no problem at all with trade items and geocoins. THese aren't geotrash because they don't preach and they don't mess up a cache. I've seen many beautiful cross pendants, religious geocoins, bookmarks, etc. I'm sure that many people would love to find them in a cache. If a cross pendant is in a geocache, I probably wouldn't trade for it because it's not my religion but someone will be thrilled to find it. I've never met anyone thrilled to get a bible tract. SO I think pamphlets and tracts should definately NOT be put in caches, but I see no problem with a geocoin. Geocoins aren't meant to be kept, they are supposed to move and they are like a little peice of the owner who released them. If Jesus is the most important influence in a person's life, I see no problem with it being on their geocoin, and if you don't like it, don't move the coin. But its very different than having a cache filled with hate-messages that tracts provide.

I got a glorious case of poison ivy last time I went caching. I bought Ivarest and was most disappointed. It was basically a calamine lotion with some menthol in it....it took forever to dry and then if you bumped the area, it just peeled off and you were itching again. I'd seriously avoid wasting money on that brand. SO I went to the pharmacy and got overwhelmed by the selection of remedies for poison ivy/ oak/ sumac. I took two of them to the counter and asked the pharmacist which was better (they listed two different active ingredients). He said neither and that if it was him he would get the "corticool" I bought that and it has been GREAT! If you put too much on, it still peels off like a sunburn when its bumped, but if you only use a little and rub it in good it really helps. I think it not only helped the itching, but it's helped it to heal much faster than normal too.

There's one around here (or so I've heard...haven't looked for it myself) which is somehow rolled up in a pair of stained mens underwear decorated strategically with chocolate sauce and mustard. I guess the effect is supposed to be that some drunk had a massive 'accident' and ditched the underwear.

Mine is because I spin fire. The art form is called Poi. You can see it slightly in my icon. That is me on my knees leaning back and those large bright circles are balls of fire on chain that I'm spinning. I am part of a fire performance group (Soul Fire Tribe) and I've been spinning fire for about 4 years now.

That's what I was thinking. I had thought that, but a coors light can would definately be larger than a micro. And the hint still made me think of the 'other bullet"

so far I've only had two that I'd call being really stealthy. Both were light pole caches..... 1. As soon as I approached the light pole, a couple came up from the other side and got in the car right next to the pole. There was no hiding, and no way to pretend that I was heading anywhwere else. So I leaned against the pole, put my GPS unit up to my ear and pretended it was a cell phone. Unfortunatley, the people didn't leave right away and they had their windows down, so I spent 5 minutes having a pretend one-sided conversation about how I was at the designated meeting place and couldn't find them. I kept describing the light pole (the one by the tree right next to the Olive Garden), where I was parked and when we were meeting. Finally the couple drove away and I snagged the cache. 2. I pulled up in the Meijer parking lot and saw the cache quickly.....it was a painted magnet container designed to look like part of the bolt mechanism holding the trash can onto the pole. Unfortunatley, I also saw the cop sitting in his car in the parking spot next to it. I pulled up, got a store-bag from the trunk and proceded to clean the kids mess from the back seat. I walked up and threw the trash away with the right hand, while the left hand snagged the cache. Back in the car, I took it apart, signed the log, reassembled. Then I found a few more items I could throw away from under the passenger seat and repeated the two handed trash/cache process to put the cache back on the pole. The cop just thought I cleaned my car. :-) I am going to invest in an orange vest and clip board....those two items get you access to many places without question.

here's an odd thing.....now that I have read all the replies and reconsidered when to log a DNF....I have ran across two instances yesterday (one in the forums, different topic and one on a cache page) where the owners do NOT want DNF's logged. One has deleted other cachers DNF's and the other specifically says on the cache page that DNF's should NOT be logged. I guess it's one of those things that different cache owners will want different things......can't please everyone. **shrug**

The cache page write-up states "Oh yes, watch out for the bumblebees.", so the hint is appropriate to the cache, yet still perfectly in sync with your original thoughts. hehehe....but it's listed as a micro! I saw the write up about the bumblebees, but since it was plainly in the write up, it didn't make sense that it would be the same reference in the encrypted hint. That's why I thought the encrypted hint was hinting at another type of buzz. As to the "ahem" size..... THAT particular toy would indeed qualify as a micro......it's a small toy known for its function and not its size. I really should shut up now. lol. :-)

Wow. I can't believe that I'm about to say this.....lets see how to say this in a family forum....... I have heard of a silver bullet but when I saw your post, I though there MUST be some other use for the term, but then I decoded the "hint". That only confirms my previous suspicion....... its an adult toy. How the heck did this make it past a reviewer? man....I still hope there is some other explaination.

I think they are absolutely still valid caches and should be +a part of the general cache community! And, I don't think you can count the smiley if you didn't sign the log. If you can't do a 5 star terrain rating, then dont start out going for it in the first place. (I know I can't do terrain more than about a 3, so I don't attempt the harder ones). It wouldn't be fair to count them if you didn't sign the log. As to the need for special equipment or skills, that is what the star rating is for....a one star is usually paved/wheelchair accessable....a five star means you better have some equipment and be in good physical condition. Some people use caching as a way to get excercise or add extra enjoyment to their other outdoor hobbies (mountain climbing, scuba diving..etc). The cache page usually will tell you if you need climbing gear, scuba gear, etc. If there are puzzles to figure out first, it should be specified somewhere in those puzzles if you will need gear or not. Basically, I think most cache owners are pretty straight forward in telling you if you will need special equipment. If you dont' want to hunt something that hard, then dont, but it should still be available for those who do want the added challenge.

I would guess that the rules would require the log since that's one of the basics of geocaching. And rules aside, I wouldnt' like that kind of cache and I'm probably not the only one. It would definately not be allowed to be called a general cache but one of those "additional logging requirement" kind.

And if you HAD found the cache in any of those situations, you also would not have posted a Found It log for the same reasons? Of course I would have claimed the find. If I found it within 5 minutes or a half-a'd search was sufficient, then it would count. I guess it just came down to the fact that I felt that logging a DNF was like claiming that I did make a justifiable effort to find it and if I didn't put the effort forth (for whatever reason) then I shouldn't claim to have done so. I guess it's kind of a pet peave of mine when people claim to be something they're not or claim to do something after one half-a'd attempt. So I was thinking of a half-hearted search and DNF log along the same lines. ie..someone I used to know who claims that they love playing the guitar....although they purchased one, strummed it once, then tossed it in the closet to collect dust when they found out that learning took effort....they seem like a 'poser' since they still call themselves a guitar player because of that one half-a'd attempt 5 years ago. I know that might not make sense to most people...but then again, I've never claimed to be normal. LOL. After reading all these comments everyone left to this topic, I will be re-thinking my position on this though and probably logging them more often.

I've heard this excuse many times, sparing the cache owner worry. Rarely will a cache owner think a cache is missing because of one DNF. This is especially true if your log mentions that you only searched for 5 minutes. Good point. I guess i coudl still mark an DNF and explain that I only looked 5 minutes. I just thought it would be kind of rude and make people wonder why I bothered looking if I was going to go out and be lazy about it. After reading all these responses, I'll probably log them more often.