Notes Instead Of Dnf's

[+CoastieGeorge]

Is it cool for people to log a note instead of a DNF? I log notes AS notes and DNFs as DNFs myself, but have seen people who don't. It kinda pissed me off. I know its not a big deal, but I or my friends place a tough cache, its like we WANT to see a DNF. It says "your cache is hiding" instead of "I can't sack up and log it correctly"

sorry guys, just had to get that one off my chest.

[+cache_test_dummies]

I suppose to an extent it depends on the situation. I log DNFs as DNFs if I searched for, and couldn't find, the cache.

 

But if I went after a cache, but for some reason couldn't or didn't get close enough to actually hunt for the container, I might log a note. Say, for example, the area that I intended to park in couldn't be reached. Or I couldn't find the trailhead I was looking for. Or I got halfway into the woods, decided I didn't have enough time, and turned around without ever approaching the cache site. For each of these situations, I might log a note instead of a DNF.

 

But if I have arrived at the cache site, and searched for the container, I log a DNF if I couldn't find it.

[+Birdsong-n-Bud]

sorry guys, just had to get that one off my chest.

 

LOL

 

I had to chuckle when reading this, as I was noticing that trend happening as well and wondered, "Wussup wit dat??"

 

I tend to take a relaxed attitude toward caching, and I guess the bottom line for me is that a DNF is recordes as "not found"...whether it is done in note form or the more traditional frowny-face. As an owner of multiple hides, I really need to know if someone sought it and couldn't find it, to ensure it has not gone missing.

 

The only problem here is that speed-readers may miss the blue frownies when scanning for DNF's in determining the difficulty level of a cache.

 

But I do see some people as having angst in doing things like...oh, asking for directions when lost (heh heh), admitting they ate forbidden diet food in the closet , or...documenting a DNF with a BIG BLUE frownie beside it.

 

To me, as long as there is a note, it is better than not logging anything at all in the big picture. But I still have to chuckle when I see the note instead of the frownie. You learn a bit about the person's personality through it <grin>.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I don't guess I understand the concept of wanting DNF's to start with...is it about a fun experience or being a PITA? We have one really evil hider here where lotsa folks DNF, and she won't give a clue unless you post the DNF first. Her caches are rarely hunted.

 

Way too much of a power trip indicated in your question - let folks play the game their way.

 

Ed

[+Kit Fox]

Just yesterday, I posted a note instead of a DNF. I quit searching for the cache right after I started. This was because the cache hiding spot was located in the local bum, outhouse. There was feces everywhere, and I wanted to protect my health and that of my daughter's.

 

I chose to quit rather than make a thorough search. The owner archived the cache after my note. This note wasn't indicative of my logging styles. I DNFed three times on a 3 1/2 star cache (that was buried) and have DNFed on a few 1/1 1.5/1 caches. Of the two easy caches, one was in fact missing, the other was well hidden.

Edited April 24, 2005 by Kit Fox

[+Birdsong-n-Bud]

This was because the cache hiding spot was located in the local bum, outhouse. There was feces everywhere, and I wanted to protect my health and that of my daughter's.

 

In my opinion, I think that is a very appropriate reason to post a note instead of a DNF log. You never really got to search, and there was an something about the cache that needed obvious tending before you could proceed.

[+CoastieGeorge]

Yeah,

I understand the power trip thing....BUT, when the guy has emailed you asking for several hints and directions.....I have logged DNF on a couple pages twice. Granted I had been to that spot more than 4 or 5 times.

It just aggravates me. I guess that it is something I will have to learn to deal with.

[+cachew nut]

I get notes once in a while on my cache hides when someone couldn't find parking really close by. It's not like there isn't any place to park, it's just farther than they care to walk. What can I do, archive the cache?

 

The notes are informative in that they tell me that there is some interest in the cache, even if they did not hunt it. I view those notes as a DNF on parking and not on the cache.

[+Deneye]

I don't believe in only searching for a cache once..which means it'll take a couple or few tries before i'll log a DNF. I mean, what's the point of spending time & effort and coming back emptyhanded and then quitting? To me a DNF is a quit...it's a last straw. You log a DNF when you've finally given up and can't get it with what you have or know you won't be able to get it anytime in the near future. If on the otherhand you know you can come back and try again, or are determined to find the cache, then a note is better IMO.

 

Just yesterday I traveled 100 km (60 mi) one way to look for a couple of caches that i couldn't find 2 weeks ago...and still couldn't find them. One i logged as a dnf because at the moment i don't think i'd find it even if it was in front of my nose (which it probably is anyway! ) and the other I logged as a note because I couldn't even get close....but I know that i'll be back up that way again and will search again regardless. There were also 2 other caches in the area which I couldn't get to due to a lack of a boat for one and muggles for the other...I never logged either of those because i feel i din't even attempt to hunt them down.

 

If after getting an extra hint from the hider to find their cache, do you log it as a find? Most people probably do.

 

In the long run, it doesn't really matter though. Each plays the game how they like.

[bogleman]

I agree with Deneye, I will not log a DNF unless I have a specific reason to do so. I have playing hide and seek for about 6 months now and there was one hide that took me about 5 visits, 20 minutes of searching each time. I consider a DNF as a failure for me, then I would ignore the listing. Also if I see several DNF on a log why should I even consider waisting my time searching for something that may or may not be there.

Ian

[+Kit Fox]

Yeah,

I understand the power trip thing....BUT, when the guy has emailed you asking for several hints and directions.....I have logged DNF on a couple pages twice. Granted I had been to that spot more than 4 or 5 times.

It just aggravates me. I guess that it is something I will have to learn to deal with.

There is a cacher in our area that won't log DNFs, but they will pester cache owners for hints when they can't find the cache. Next time this person emails you for hints, tell them to log a DNF, and then you will help them.

[+Apple Dumpling Gangg]

So far we have only posted DNFs for caches that we felt were missing. We don't post a DNF until we have given up. There is one cache nearby that we have been out to 3 times so far without finding it. But many people logging the find admit to it taking several trips to find. I think I would only post a note if there was a problem with the cache or cache area to let the owner know about it.

 

So far there was only one that we really needed hints to find because the coords were over 100 feet off. Found out we were very close to it on our first trip out searching after asking for a hint from someone that found it.

[+Renegade Knight]

Is it cool for people to log a note instead of a DNF? I log notes AS notes and DNFs as DNFs myself, but have seen people who don't. It kinda pissed me off. I know its not a big deal, but I or my friends place a tough cache, its like we WANT to see a DNF. It says "your cache is hiding" instead of "I can't sack up and log it correctly"

sorry guys, just had to get that one off my chest.

Wow.

 

If I quit looking for the cache but I have more looking that I could do I log a Note. If I have exausted every place I can think of to look or I'm flat out done looking for the cache it's a DNF.

 

I don't know how your scale works, but that's how mine works.

[+tozainamboku]

I tend to log DNF if I searched for the cache. I like having the record of each time I went out and searched. But lately when I log DNF I been getting hints sent to me by previous finders when I didn't ask for a hint. Since some people interpret a DNF as a request for a hint, I'm stuck with the following options:

 

1. Don't log anything

 

2. Log a note

 

3. Log a DNF but in every log put in in CAPITAL letters: PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME HINTS.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

If I didn't find the cache, whether my fault or not, I log it accurately as a DID NOT FIND. There is no other way to log a cache when you didn't find it. Doesn't matter why.

[+Birdsong-n-Bud]

I don't guess I understand the concept of wanting DNF's to start with...is it about a fun experience or being a PITA

 

As a cache owner, DNF's are very vital. If there is one, a cacher might have overlooked it. If there are two, chances are good it may have gone missing and immediatly I'll head out to make sure the cache is intact.

 

It isn't a power trip thing (for me). It's a way of checking the integrity of the cache. I am actually disappointed when I see a DNF logged, not happy.

 

However, the person who won't give out hints needs to really get off their high horse, in my opinion. They seem to have an "I win" attitude when they frustrate cachers.

[+Divine]

If I didn't find the cache, whether my fault or not, I log it accurately as a DID NOT FIND.

That's how I do it too.

[+sept1c_tank]

If I didn't find the cache, whether my fault or not, I log it accurately as a DID NOT FIND.

That's how I do it too.

Yep. Me too.

 

But for those who feel there is some kind of stigma attached to DNF (absolutely ridiculous reasoning), a note is the next best thing.

 

Just yesterday, I posted a note instead of a DNF. I quit searching for the cache right after I started. This was because the cache hiding spot was located in the local bum, outhouse. There was feces everywhere, and I wanted to protect my health and that of my daughter's.

 

I chose to quit rather than make a thorough search. The owner archived the cache after my note...

 

I would have still logged the DNF (and added a note).

[+CoastieGeorge]

maybe I'm backwards. I log DNF if I didn't find it and think its still there(I make a point to go back and try harder on those when I have hours to spend), but a note if I think its gone.

[+Renegade Knight]

Some people take DNF = Did Not Find and others the DNF = Could not find.

 

The only time I want to see a DNF log is when you have tried everthing and literally could not find the cache. A DNF when you ran out of beer and had to go back to the store for more and never made it back to the cache site doesnt' really tell me much about the cache difficutly. I use the DNF ratio to help keep the difficulty calibrated.

 

Of cours since both types of DNF logs exist you have to read the log itself to know what's really going on.

 

BTW Both are valid and I know people who do it both ways. Some if they step out the front door to find your cache and their rig blows up just then will log a DNF.

[+sept1c_tank]

... A DNF when you ran out of beer and had to go back to the store for more and never made it back to the cache site doesnt' really tell me much about the cache difficutly...

Sure it does.

[+SpankytheWizard]

I came to realize the importance of the DNF's this past week. I am new to geocaching and have put out two caches. Even though both are fairly close to each other, one started getting finds and the other was just sitting there. No notes, no dnf's - nothing. I finally went by and found out that the first stage micro was missing. How many more weeks and trips by fellow gc'ers would have passed before someone posted a DNF? I had fallen into the habit of not posting anything myself because I didn't want the "stigma" of having a bunch of DNF's and looking like someone who couldn't find his fanny with bot hands AND a set of coordinates. Now, I see that the DNF and Note entries serve a multitude of purposes. They notify the cache owner of a possible problem; alert fellow cachers that the cache may be missing or in need of some TLC and, finally, provide cache reviewers with a third-party notice of an ongoing problem. Like previous posts I will start to use a DNF if I actually did not find it while looking for it and use a note just to pass on further information. Sometimes I get to the general area and realize I can't go the final distance. That is NOT a DNF or a note. That is just passing by.

[+Moose Mob]

There's over 100,000 caches that I DNF (yet).

[+fratermus]

If I didn't find the cache, whether my fault or not, I log it accurately as a DID NOT FIND. There is no other way to log a cache when you didn't find it. Doesn't matter why.

Well, shoot.

 

We could have just gotten that doctrinal info first and saved ourselves a lot of thoughtful discussion.

[+Renegade Knight]

There's over 100,000 caches that I DNF (yet).

Crap, I need to get to logging all the caches I'll never ever, get around to doing.

[+briansnat]

You log a DNF when you've finally given up and can't get it with what you have or know you won't be able to get it anytime in the near future. If on the otherhand you know you can come back and try again, or are determined to find the cache, then a note is better IMO.

 

I agree with Deneye, I will not log a DNF unless I have a specific reason to do so.

 

I really don't understand attitudes like these. When you search for a cache, there are two possible results. You find it or you don't. There are log types for each. If you look and find it, its a "Found it". If you didn't find it, its a "DNF". Pretty simple - or at least it should be. I don't understand why people need to add all these grey areas.

 

By not logging your DNF's you are denying the cache owner (and other geocachers) important info. If everybody had the same attitude as these two, how am I as a cache owner, supposed to know if the cache is harder than I originally rated it so I can adjust the difficulty rating?

 

Also, as a cache owner, a pattern of DNFs will send me out to make sure the cache is still there. One DNF won't, but if I see two or three in a row, I'm going to check on my cache. Now if Deneye comes along and looks for it twice and doesn't log DNFs, then Bogleman comes along and doesn't log his DNF, then Moose Mob comes along and logs a DNF, as far as I'm concerned I'm not going to check on the cache because I only see one DNF. This will delay a needed maintenance check and cause other geocachers to waste their time looking for a cache that probably isn't there.

 

Also if I see several DNF on a log why should I even consider waisting my time searching for something that may or may not be there.

 

This is exactly why you should log your DNFs. You're using info from other geocachers decide whether or not to look for a cache, but you are not providing the same info for others. If everybody had your attitude, you wouldn't see those DNF and WOULD be wasting your time looking for the cache.

Edited April 25, 2005 by briansnat

[+halley-peabody]

I believe that if you look for a cache and you don't find it then you should log a DNF. I have done this with the two caches that I found myself in the area of and made a concerted search for. There were two others where I did not do this, for different reasons. One of them I got to the place where the cache was supposed to be located and found it occupied by three or four non-cachers. Considering the size of the area I would have had to ask them to stand up so I could look underneath them, so I left and will be back. The other I got to where the cache was supposed to be and found myself standing on a sidewalk next to a busy street with dozens of cars driving by every minute, and since it was right next to a large intersection there were many other cars, lots of them stopped, and their occupants looking around them. I don't care for that sort of cache so I left without looking.

 

So my policy is to log a DNF if I did not find it after looking for it, and to do nothing if I got there and did not look for one reason or another. In the latter case I might leave a note if I feel I need to tell the cacher something, but otherwise not.

[+cudlecub]

I have some tough urban micros hidden out there and the dnf logs let me know just how tough it is. They also help me know if a cache has ended up missing. When I'm near one of my caches I will check up on it, but it's not something I do on a weekly basis. I rely on the other cachers to help keep me in the know. I log all my dnf's and expect others to do the same.

[bogleman]

You log a DNF when you've finally given up and can't get it with what you have or know you won't be able to get it anytime in the near future. If on the otherhand you know you can come back and try again, or are determined to find the cache, then a note is better IMO.

 

I agree with Deneye, I will not log a DNF unless I have a specific reason to do so.

 

I really don't understand attitudes like these. When you search for a cache, there are two possible results. You find it or you don't. There are log types for each. If you look and find it, its a "Found it". If you didn't find it, its a "DNF". Pretty simple - or at least it should be. I don't understand why people need to add all these grey areas.

 

By not logging your DNF's you are denying the cache owner (and other geocachers) important info. If everybody had the same attitude as these two, how am I as a cache owner, supposed to know if the cache is harder than I originally rated it so I can adjust the difficulty rating?

 

Also, as a cache owner, a pattern of DNFs will send me out to make sure the cache is still there. One DNF won't, but if I see two or three in a row, I'm going to check on my cache. Now if Deneye comes along and looks for it twice and doesn't log DNFs, then Bogleman comes along and doesn't log his DNF, then Moose Mob comes along and logs a DNF, as far as I'm concerned I'm not going to check on the cache because I only see one DNF. This will delay a needed maintenance check and cause other geocachers to waste their time looking for a cache that probably isn't there.

 

Also if I see several DNF on a log why should I even consider waisting my time searching for something that may or may not be there.

 

This is exactly why you should log your DNFs. You're using info from other geocachers decide whether or not to look for a cache, but you are not providing the same info for others. If everybody had your attitude, you wouldn't see those DNF and WOULD be wasting your time looking for the cache.

My message may have been misunderstood. I understand your point, and that you want the input from the DNF log; but if I am looking for a 4-5 star micro for 5 minutes in a high traffic area or a light pole cache that is 20' off the ground, I do not see the need to log a DNF since I could not complete a detailed search or simply walk up and grab it and sign the log. An example - I post a found it note for the light pole cache that I found it, I just couldn’t sign the log because it was too high and I did not have anything to grab it with.

Being new to the game I have yet to have any serious difficulty in finding a regular or small cache. I would definitely log a DNF and send a private email to the owner seeking clarification or explaining what I found if I could not find or access the cache.

My objective in finding the cache (mainly micros) is to search for it on my own and as good as I can before I log a DNF or ask for clarification/hint especially if it is a very active cache that other people are finding on a regular basis. I may not be looking hard enough or in the right spot.

[+Team Perks]

I log DNF's or notes depending on what I feel is best for that particular cache and that particular situation. I honestly don't see the need to nitpick as long as you knew that I went there and for whatever reason, I wasn't able to find the cache.

 

Geez people, quit splitting hairs and go find a cache or something.

[+Gas Guys]

 

Geez people, quit splitting hairs and go find a cache or something.

I'll second that. Note, DNF - they both alert the cache owner to a potential problem.

 

Now I just need to post some notes and DNF's for the caches that I want to get but can't because I'm at work...

[CoyoteRed]

What burns me is when someone logs a DNF as a find.

[+greende]

I used to not log DNF's. I don't know if it was because I hate to admit defeat or not. However after reading this topic on several occasions here in the forums since I have become a cacher, I always log my DNF's. I usually include some type of explanation as to why (mostly stupidity on my part) and promise to return if I can. That's just how I play the game right now. I personally don't have strong feelings against logging a note but I now agree that a DNF is more accurate. Human nature is such that I think it is less of a blow to our psyche to just post a note saying that it was not found for whatever reason.

 

 

Edit: For typing

Edited April 25, 2005 by greende

[+Renegade Knight]

I log DNF's or notes depending on what I feel is best for that particular cache and that particular situation. I honestly don't see the need to nitpick as long as you knew that I went there and for whatever reason, I wasn't able to find the cache.

 

Geez people, quit splitting hairs and go find a cache or something.

Knock that off. You make too much sence.

[+Tharagleb]

I am of the opinion that a DNF should be logged every time you search for a cache and give up because you cannot find it. This does *not* include not being able to find because you ran out of time. If I only have 5 mins to search for a micro and then have to high-tail it back to work, I will not log a DNF. A DNF is used by later cachers to decide whether or not they want to try and find the cache. Two or more DNFs in a row may indicate the cache is actually missing.

 

Everybody please play by my rules okay?

[+Divine]

If I only have 5 mins to search for a micro and then have  to high-tail it back to work, I will not log a DNF.

I will, because I didn't find it.

 

A DNF is used by later cachers to decide whether or not they want to try and find the cache.

I use a DNF to record my personal and caches' geocaching history.

 

Two or more DNFs in a row may indicate the cache is actually missing.

It might do that. Still, better read the actual logs too.

Edited April 25, 2005 by Divine

[+MariettaGecko]

Just to add my $0.02 to the subject...

 

I have the following policy RE found, not found, and notes:

 

If I searched for the cache and was able to find it AND SIGN THE LOG (barring issues like the log being a pile of wood pulp that i replaced with a new one), I log a find.

 

If I searched for the cache and was unable to locate the cache despite a definite effort to search, I log a DNF.

 

If I told my GPS to Goto, but was unable to locate a place to stop and get out of my car safely, I might post a DNF if I think it is warranted (I searched carefully for a location to stop, but was unable to locate such a location) or post nothing.

 

If I arrived on site and was unable to give the cache a concerted effort to find it, I usually try to log a DNF if I feel that it would possibly be useful to the cache owner or other cachers for me to do so. Otherwise, I do nothing.

 

Notes are generally reserved for the case that I am dropping a bug for mileage, I forgot to drop a bug in my found it log, or I am posting a note of maintenance to one of my caches.

 

I appreciate it when people post DNFs, and I, too, use DNFs as a means by which to see if there is a problem with the cache. If three or four people all post DNFs to my cache, I will go perform maintenance. If I don't see any DNFs, or I see a DNF or two followed by a legitimate Found, I'll accept the DNFs as simply people who maybe didn't have time for a decent search.

[+sbell111]

This thread comes up pretty frequently, in one form or another. I always find it interesting how people will split the hair in different ways. I've even noticed that my methodology is continually evolving.

 

If I get to ground zero and am looking for the box, but fail to find it. That's a DNF, in my opinion.

 

If I get abort the hunt before arriving at ground zero for a reason that has nothing to do with the cache (my wife called me away, I'm hungry, I'm demotivated, I hit my head and forgot my name or why I'm in the woods, etc) I may post a note, or I may just not post anything.

 

If I never make it to the parking area for whatever reason, I will rarely log anything.

[+nfa]

I have had a good time reading this thread...and some chuckles too!

 

wouldn't it be cool if the "log-police" logged their events/notes/DNFs the "right way" and let everyone else attend their own events or write notes and DNFs the way they want to...

 

I would never dream of catching up to the golfer/canoer/hiker/skiier in front of me, and telling him that he is doing it all wrong, but it seems as though that is exactly what some people in this thread (and others like it) are eager to do with their fellow geocachers...

 

thoughts exorcised, commence flaming

 

nfa-jamie

[+Jamie Z]

I would never dream of catching up to the golfer/canoer/hiker/skiier in front of me, and telling him that he is doing it all wrong, but it seems as though that is exactly what some people in this thread (and others like it) are eager to do with their fellow geocachers...

The difference is that in those activities you mentioned, other players' actions have no effect on anyone else.

 

In geocaching, the logs can affect subsequent hunters, and to a greater extent, the owner.

 

To correctly apply the logic of other activies, you might imagine there was an online database of golf course conditions, and some people neglect to mention that the golf course is closed after they go there.

 

Or say you wanted to paddle a nearby stream, so you check the paddler website and everyone says how great it is. When you go there, the stream is dry. Later you find out several people went to go paddling, but since there wasn't any water, they decided not to tell about their adventure.

 

In addition, geocaching has always been an activity centered around sharing your experience. Why do you think there is the requirement for every cache to have a logbook? When one doesn't sign the logbook, the website offers cachers the courtesy of sharing their experience with the cache owner and anyone else who is interested.

 

Nope. I'm sure not going to tell the hiker at the trailhead that he's using the wrong boots, but I'll mention to him that the trail is under water a few miles in. And if I came out of the woods having found out that the trail is closed and see some other hikers who already knew that, I'm going to ask them why they didn't tell me.

 

Jamie

[+Jamie Z]

Oops. I sent that before I was finished.

 

Geocaching is an activity centered around sharing your experience. As you know, geocachers are an awfully friendly community. Do you know many local golfers? Have you been to a local hiker "event"? I bet you know lots of geocachers.

 

Suggesting to people that they log their notes or DNFs or whatever is simply saying to your buddy, "So.. how'd it go?" Much of the reason I like to read logs is to know about others' experience on the same caches that I enjoyed.

 

We're not the log police. People just want to know what others are up to.

 

DNFs are good all around, and those are just the external advantages.

[+sbell111]

...We're not the log police. People just want to know what others are up to....

Well, that's not at all creepy.

 

I agree with your basic point that if one got to ground zero and looked for the cache, but did not find it, they should log their experience on-line. This is really a warning to others that it -might- have gone missing.

 

That being said, if a person is after a high difficulty cache and doesn't put in much effort, do we really need the warning. If anything, that DNF would give the wrong message.

[+The Puzzler]

So, what exactly is a DNF?

 

If my car broke down 5 miles before getting to the start of the hunt, is it a DNF?

 

If I start up the trail, but find myself on the wrong side a the river and don't have time to get to the other side, is it a DNF?

 

If I get to the cache site and there is a family picnicking on top of the cache so I can't hunt it, is that a DNF?

 

What if the cache is hidden in a fairly exposed area and I am just nervous about being seen and decide to give up before looking thoroughly enough to find it? Is that a DNF?

 

If I have 5 minutes to stop and and search for a cache near my home with the expectation that I will spend 5 minutes today, five minutes next Wednesday, and then hunt it for real on the weekend if it is not yet found, is the first visit a DNF?

 

What if I am searching for a cache at a favorite park and am loving the search but have to call it off to get the kids home to bed? Even if I expect to hunt it again next weekend should I log a DNF?

 

For me personally, whenever I have gotten to the cache site and cannot find a cache for whatever reason, I will log it as a DNF . . . unless I don't perceive my search to be over (i.e., I plan on returning to hunt more thoroughly in the near future). But hey, others will surely disagree with my idea of a DNF and that is jolly fine.

[+JohnnyVegas]

I have seen notes posted in which a the area of a cache was closed of due to contruction and I have had to post a note when the area of a cache was temp. closed to the public. IF access to a cache area is closed off, and you can not search the area, that is not a DNF..

[+briansnat]

I would never dream of catching up to the golfer/canoer/hiker/skiier in front of me, and telling him that he is doing it all wrong, but it seems as though that is exactly what some people in this thread (and others like it) are eager to do with their fellow geocachers...

The difference is that in those activities you mentioned, other players' actions have no effect on anyone else.

 

In geocaching, the logs can affect subsequent hunters, and to a greater extent, the owner.

 

To correctly apply the logic of other activies, you might imagine there was an online database of golf course conditions, and some people neglect to mention that the golf course is closed after they go there.

 

Or say you wanted to paddle a nearby stream, so you check the paddler website and everyone says how great it is. When you go there, the stream is dry. Later you find out several people went to go paddling, but since there wasn't any water, they decided not to tell about their adventure.

 

In addition, geocaching has always been an activity centered around sharing your experience. Why do you think there is the requirement for every cache to have a logbook? When one doesn't sign the logbook, the website offers cachers the courtesy of sharing their experience with the cache owner and anyone else who is interested.

 

Nope. I'm sure not going to tell the hiker at the trailhead that he's using the wrong boots, but I'll mention to him that the trail is under water a few miles in. And if I came out of the woods having found out that the trail is closed and see some other hikers who already knew that, I'm going to ask them why they didn't tell me.

 

Jamie

BINGO!!!!

[+briansnat]

So, what exactly is a DNF? 

 

If my car broke down 5 miles before getting to the start of the hunt, is it a DNF?

My criteria is if I plug in the cache coordinates and hit "go to" on my GPS and don't find the cache, its a DNF. If I plugged in the coords on my front porch and the car got a flat tire on the way I'd log a DNF. Why not? There is probably a good story behind it and as Jamie mentioned, sharing stories is a big part of this sport.

If I start up the trail, but find myself on the wrong side a the river and don't have time to get to the other side, is it a DNF?

Absolutely!

If I get to the cache site and there is a family picnicking on top of the cache so I can't hunt it, is that a DNF?

Darn right!

What if the cache is hidden in a fairly exposed area and I am just nervous about being seen and decide to give up before looking thoroughly enough to find it? Is that a DNF?

You were looking for the cache and didn't find it, right? DNF

If I have 5 minutes to stop and and search for a cache near my home with the expectation that I will spend 5 minutes today, five minutes next Wednesday, and then hunt it for real on the weekend if it is not yet found, is the first visit a DNF?

See the previous. When Jeremy comes up with a log type for "Didn't Find It, But Didn't Look Very Long" you can use that one.

What if I am searching for a cache at a favorite park and am loving the search but have to call it off to get the kids home to bed? Even if I expect to hunt it again next weekend should I log a DNF?

Yep.

[+Jeep_Dog]

If I make an attempt to find a cache, and don't find it, I DNF. I personally see no shame in DNFs. It is part of my caching history.

 

With 138 finds, I've got 14 DNFs.

 

Two of those were on the same cache that was a multi and had bad coordinates for the final. That was very important info for the cache owner and fellow hunters.

 

Five were DNFs for caches that had gone MIA. Very important information for the cache owner and fellow hunters.

 

One was for a cache I'd previously found, and just wasn't there (stopped by to drop off a TB). Very important information for cache owner and fellow hunters.

 

One was for a cache I'd previously found, but is a VERY devious cache. I just found humor in not finding a hard to find cache after I'd already found it. Nonetheless, very good information for fellow hunters on the devious nature of the cache.

 

The remaining five were just bad hunting on my part, or lack of time to search at the cache site. If due to lack of time "hey, I only spent 5 minutes on this one since I was on a lunchtime caching adventure, and knew there were 3 others in the area I wanted to hit before I had to get back," or "only spent 5 minutes searching since the family was waiting in the cachemobile" or "got distracted since my toddler jumped into a stream" I state as much in the DNF logs. That way, the cache owner knows the hunt was not an all-out search, so no need to panic, yet other cachers get the info that the easy 1/1 involves more than a cursory 5 minute hunt.

 

I've got a cache very near a virtual. The virtual gets more logs than my physical cache, and the cachers have found the "easy finds" in the area, but write NADA on my cache and another harder one nearby. I know darn well they've gone for the two harder ones, didn't find, didn't log. What a shame, since I'd like to know the traffic that my cache generates at the site of a museum, finds and no-finds alike. Also, last weekend, on my weekly cache-maintenance run, I found it out of the hiding spot (and making the clue irrelevant), and those that logged the find on the virtual and didn't find this cache, well, I could have put it to the top of the maintenance run priority list, getting back up as it was designed quicker.

 

In my opinion, DNFs, if not just as important, can be more important than finds. Then again, that is my particular caching style, that I do not endeavor to force down others' throats.

 

EDIT: Further note on the DNFs for my cache above. In my experience, DNF hunters tend to tear up the location of a cache more than quick finds. With respect to the environment the cache is placed in, DNFs are important in that I know to survey the damage or geotrails in the cache area (even if I know the cache is still there, due to follow on find logs).

Edited April 25, 2005 by Jeep_Dog

[+sbell111]

I have an idea! Why don't we close one of these duplicate threads?

[+DrAwKwArD]

My criteria is if I plug in the cache coordinates and hit "go to" on my GPS and don't find the cache, its a DNF. If I plugged in the coords on my front porch and the car got a flat tire on the way I'd log a DNF. Why not? There is probably a good story behind it and as Jamie mentioned, sharing stories is a big part of this sport.

I think Briansnat has it right in spite of being blatantly obstinate. At this point we can rule out the notion of "don't post DNF until you've tried dozens of times and are SURE it isn't there." This is ridiculous and is harmful to the cache owner. What if the cache is 50 miles from your home and you've got one shot to find it? What if you're completely bored with the search and really don't care if it's there or not? That's still a DNF.

 

I'll tell you what, if someone with 500 cache finds posts a DNF on one of mine even though he only searched 5 minutes it would get my attention! I would hate to think that some people are so vain that they would abandon the thought of finding a cache simply because it has one DNF w/a clear explanation of the cache hunt. I'm not opposed to posting a note, however, notes tend to say, "hi, I'm just posting a casual comment, nothing serious such as I DID NOT FIND THIS AFTER LOOKING IN THE AREA."

 

And the number one reason to post DNF over a note? Us GSAK users won't see that attention-getting RED log in the the log's column! To us, the cache will simply appear to be there for the taking.

[+briansnat]

I think Briansnat has it right in spite of being blatantly obstinate.

 

Me, obstinate? I'm not obstinate. I just keep arguing until everyone agrees with me or gives up.

Edited April 26, 2005 by briansnat