Lyme Disease

[Pinster56]

I am from Massachusetts and I pulled an attached deer tick off me a couple of days ago. Unlike other tick bites I have had before, this one is giving me a large rash that is radiating out from the bite site. I read somewhere the tick has to be stuck on you for at least 48 hours before it can transmit Lyme Disease. It was only stuck on me a few hours. It's been a couple of days since I removed it and I feel fine. Should I be concerned?

[catskill05]

Got it 2 years ago in CT while hiking. If you had the rash, get the antibiotics now. I waited a month or so and got really sick. takes a while to get back to normal. Blood tests don't always show it either, so you might need to "push" the doc a little. Good luck, if you get the doxy. you'll be fine

-catskill05

 

p.s. ask the doc, but if you get high dose for 2 days before the 48 hrs is up, that sometimes works and you don't need a month of meds

Edited April 19, 2005 by catskill05

[+sTeamTraen]

Go to your doctor and explain about the tick. If s/he doesn't say the word "Lyme's", go to another doctor. S/he will probably give you antibiotics, which is what you need. There is a substantial incubation period for Lyme's and if you get it treated in the first week or so you should be fine.

 

A friend of mine didn't notice the tick until it had already dropped off. He then proceeded to ignore the red, spreading rash - especially when it went away by itself. Then he got ill and was off work for 3 months.

Edited April 19, 2005 by sTeamTraen

[+carleenp]

I am from Massachusetts and I pulled an attached deer tick off me a couple of days ago. Unlike other tick bites I have had before, this one is giving me a large rash that is radiating out from the bite site. I read somewhere the tick has to be stuck on you for at least 48 hours before it can transmit Lyme Disease. It was only stuck on me a few hours. It's been a couple of days since I removed it and I feel fine. Should I be concerned?

Normally it takes over 24 hours. But I have heard of instances of lyme being transmitted in less. I don't think the hour figures out there are a firm rule for all cases and I have seen some sites state as little as 4 hours. Also ticks can carry all sorts of diseases besides lyme and bites can get infected even if a tick borne disease is not present. Since you have a rash the best thing to do is call the Dr. right away and get a round of antibiotics that will likely take care of any of the above possibilities.

Edited April 19, 2005 by carleenp

[+Miragee]

Yes! I would get to your doctor ASAP and have him/her prescribe antibiotics. The bulleyes rash is an almost certain indication of Lyme disease.

 

Check out Lymenet.org for lots of information about Lyme disease and doctors who are "Lyme Literate."

 

Lyme disease is very serious when it goes untreated. I've had chronic Lyme disease for many years and may possibly have to take antibiotics the rest of my life.

[+voogadah]

My son contracted Lyme disease here in Northwestern CT. We give our children "tick checks" every evening before bed, and we did not find any on him. The next day he said he had something behind his ear, and it was a deer tick, which we removed. Within a week he developed the bullseye rash which covered part of his face. We took him to the dr and she gave him antibiotics right away. Three weeks worth. For the next three years my son complained of chronic migraines and has developed severe photosensitivity (lights bother his eyes). I think the disease affects children differently than adults, and they still don't know everything about the disease. One disconcerting part of it is that the rash (which is a red flag) is not always present, so some peole go untreated and have pretty severe symptoms. My brother in law (who lived in Lyme, CT) was on introvenous antibiotics because it was not found until the disease had progressed.

Some web sites say the tick needs to be on 48 hours, but really, would you leave a tick on and time it? My son is proof it can take less than 24 hours. It may even have something to do with the method of tick removal for all we know (the researchers may be adept at removing them, a parent or first timer may squeeze or otherwise disrupt the tick). Lyme disease is seriously nasty, and besides causing joint pain and photosensitivity, it can cause severe neurological damage. Use bug repellent if you are in Lyme territory. If you don't, you may wish you did!

Check every evening and again in the morning, in the armpits, groin, behind the knees, behind the ears, and any other nooks and crannies. If you have long hair, wear it up and wear a hat (you may go to bed with one in your hair and your mate wakes up with it). Hope this helps.

[+BilboB]

Why are you asking for medical advice in the geocaching forums? We hunt for McToys and trinkets hidden in metal boxes in the woods.

[+Vic303]

My husband & I have had the Lyme vaccine. No ill effects either. It's been a couple years since we did the series of shots. Once the kids are old enough to receive it, I'll get them vaccinated too. I know it's not a perfect vaccine, but it's better than nothing, especially when combined with repellent, tick checks etc. It never gets cold enough down here in DFW to kill ticks.

[tiber]

I've had it three times now. The first time was the only time I actually got the rash. The other two times I had all the symptoms but no rash. I would STRONGLY suggest getting the testing done if you think you need it. While I'm not as bad as some of the stories posted here, I can still wake up in the morning a gross the fiancee out cracking all my joints as I sit up. It could be a lot worse.

[Pinster56]

Well, I have the rash but no other symptoms and it's been three days. In any case, I am having a doc take a look at it today........

[+clearpath]

I got it two years ago in central Missouri. I never did see the tick (had to of been attached less than 24 hours) and the doc said a lot of people that contract the disease, never see the tick. I developed a bull's eye rash on my ankle, and got the antibiotic. I was offered several different treatments. The best was an antibiotic that could cause severe sun sensitivity. Because I was not able to promise to stay out of the sun for 3 weeks, I had to go with a less powerful antiobiotic. I never did get sick so I guess it worked well.

[mauricelcassidy]

i got it. it sucked. i found the tick after a festival in maine. pulled it off and didnt think twice about it. never got a rash until after the headaches came along with dizzy spells and fever. i had a constant headache for 2 weeks and the dizziness and fevers came and went. went to the doctor and they said lymes. got blood work done. "well i could be lymes OR mono we arent sure" got more blood work done. "its lymes AND mono". sweet!! yea no. anyway the mono never affected me which im glad. they gave me antibiotics just as the red splotches began appearing all over my body. those quicly went away and i got better. i still get occasional dizzy spells, and i never attributed it to the lymes but as someone metioned above i have a higher sensitivity to light. (i never wore sunglasses before) anyway. one thing i dont know what they will give you for antibiotics. but the ones i had said dont expose yourself to long periods of sun. let me tell you ive had some bad sun burns but that was magnified incredibly. hope you fare well and dont have to go through all the crappy stuff.

 

peace, bob

[Pinster56]

Well I went to the doc and she ruled out some things that it ISN'T (allergic reaction, cellulitis) and the rash is starting up again around the bite site, so she said why take a chance, so she gave me an antibiotic. Basically she said better safe than sorry. Curiously, she didn't take a blood test so I will never know for sure. Thanks for everybody's input. I never realized it was so serious...I just don't always understand whether the information age makes us overly concerned about things. I am 48 years old and when were kids we ran around in the woods without repellent and nobody ever worried about (or got) Lyme Disease!

[+vree]

according to the CDC:

Lyme disease was first recognized in the United States in 1975, after a mysterious outbreak of arthritis near Lyme, Connecticut. Since then, reports of Lyme disease have increased dramatically, and the disease has become an important public health problem in some areas of the United States.

so it's *relatively* new and why you didn't know about it when you were younger. glad to be learning new stuff, thanks for the link above, idiosyncratic!

[+Miragee]

Well I went to the doc and she ruled out some things that it ISN'T (allergic reaction, cellulitis) and the rash is starting up again around the bite site, so she said why take a chance, so she gave me an antibiotic. Basically she said better safe than sorry. Curiously, she didn't take a blood test so I will never know for sure. Thanks for everybody's input. I never realized it was so serious...I just don't always understand whether the information age makes us overly concerned about things. I am 48 years old and when were kids we ran around in the woods without repellent and nobody ever worried about (or got) Lyme Disease!

Don't worry about not having had the blood test. They are notoriously unreliable. And, since Lyme disease is "controversial," some doctors will claim a positive test is a "false positive."

 

Be glad your doctor is understanding about how serious Lyme disease is. I went to doctor after doctor and until I finally found one who was "Lyme Literate," could not get them to either test me for Lyme disease, or prescribe the antibiotics (originally taken for a dental problem) that had helped me feel better.

 

Only in this past year, after two years on Ceftin, and almost eight years on antibiotics, have I started feeling well enough to participate in recreational activities.

 

Lyme disease is very serious and debilitating if it goes untreated, or under-treated!

[+Miragee]

according to the CDC:

Lyme disease was first recognized in the United States in 1975, after a mysterious outbreak of arthritis near Lyme, Connecticut. Since then, reports of Lyme disease have increased dramatically, and the disease has become an important public health problem in some areas of the United States.

so it's *relatively* new and why you didn't know about it when you were younger. glad to be learning new stuff, thanks for the link above, idiosyncratic!

Actually, I think the disease has been around for a long time. It was only in 1975 that it was given that name.

 

Interestingly, the doctor who named Lyme disease, Allen Steere, M.D, is one of the "bad guys" now when it comes to treatment of chronic Lyme disease. Two much more knowledgeable, and trustworthy, doctors are Joseph Burrascano and Brian Fallon.

 

Here is another interesting link:

 

World International Lyme Disease Emergency Rescue Network

 

And a link about treatment:

 

Burrascano's Treatment Guidelines

[+Isonzo Karst]

A friend of mine contract Lyme (at Martha's Vineyard), came back to Florida and later that same year got West Nile. She's heavy into DEET now.

[+M-T-P]

Anyone try the new Lyme Coke?

[+Polgara]

I am from Massachusetts and I pulled an attached deer tick off me a couple of days ago. Unlike other tick bites I have had before, this one is giving me a large rash that is radiating out from the bite site. I read somewhere the tick has to be stuck on you for at least 48 hours before it can transmit Lyme Disease. It was only stuck on me a few hours. It's been a couple of days since I removed it and I feel fine. Should I be concerned?

Yes, you should go to the doctor. The rash is a tell tale sign of Lyme disease & Rocky Mountain spotted fever, both of which are devastating without treatment.

 

Most doctors go by your history to diagnose Lyme disease, usually people complain of joint aches, fatigue, malaise, and the rash. However, not everyone gets the rash.

 

The test for lyme is serologic, which means they are looking for antibodies that you produced against the bacteria causing the disease. Most tests are false negatives, because they get performed too early. You need to wait around 4-6 weeks in order for your body to have produced enough antibody to be detected in this test. For that reason, most doctors will prescribe doxycylcine without the final results, and treat you based on signs & symptoms alone.

 

The bacteria that causes Lyme lives in the GI tract of deer ticks. Once the tick bites you, it begins to feed on your blood and in that mechanism, the bacteria gets regurgitated by the tick into your blood, which is how you contract the disease. FOr some people that could take just a few hours, for others it could take longer.

 

Rocky mountain spotted fever has a very particular rash of red dots on the soles of the feet and palms of the hands.

 

Good luck with treatment,

 

-Pol

[+clearpath]

Why is it that dogs have a pill that stops all ticks from biting? But we humans have nothing of the sort. You would think that a pill stopping all tick bites would be a hot seller. Oh well ...

[+M-T-P]

Why is it that dogs have a pill that stops all ticks from biting?  But we humans have nothing of the sort.

Most canine tick treatments don't stop them from biting. It just kills them or sterilizes them so the population in your yard drops. Then, there are fewer left to bite.

 

Do you really want a toxic insecticide pumping through your veins? Just from the sound the previous sentence, you know it will never get FDA approval for human use.

[+clearpath]

Do you really want a toxic insecticide pumping through your veins? 

Sometimes my neighbor offers me free Coors Light (there's not much difference) and it hasn't killed me yet ...

[+voogadah]

Also, most dogs have been spayed or neutered. The insecticide won't pass to potential offspring. But since kids today are popping Ritalin and such, perhaps someday in the future....

[+Apple Dumpling Gangg]

The year before last we went camping in New Jersey. Unknown to us at the time, the campground we had arranged to camp at was having a large outbreak of deer ticks. The kids ended up covered with ticks (which is how we found out about it), my husband got bit by one (only on for maybe a few hours as we were very careful about checking for them at that point) and I thankfully did not get bit by any. The kids ended up fine, but about a week after we got home my husband's arm developed a red ring. He wanted to ignore it, but I made him go to the Doctor. The doctor took one look at the rash and put him on antibiotics for 3 weeks. The rash was the only symptom he ever had, maybe because we caught it so early. I did have the kids tested a few weeks later just to be sure they hadn't caught it too.

[+flask]

yep. insist on treatment. besides, then you'll also be safe from anthrax.

[+fly46]

A friend of mine contract Lyme (at Martha's Vineyard), came back to Florida and later that same year got West Nile. She's heavy into DEET now.

Hey, she was one of the lucky ones..

I remember when the WN outbreak started and all we heard was that someone died, then someone else died, etc...

 

 

RMSF is *massively* serious - oh, and I looked it up, regardless of what some people say, it *is* in areas as far southeast as Tennessee, so if you get bit by a tick, CHECK IT OUT if you have even a possible symptom of either RMSF or Lyme.

 

I got bit by one fourth of July and I'm extremely lucky I got it out within about a minute (I felt it bite me) and no symptoms.

 

I'm still not a DEETaholic, but I always make sure to check myself for bugs when I emerge from the woods - and I'll drive home stark naked if I have to.

[+RakeInTheCache]

I have just been diagnosed with Lyme disease (a.k.a. Borreliosis) Have just started taking the Doxycyclin antibiotic.

 

I was tipped off due to a rash on my leg on the inside part of my knee. It's now quite large. I remember many weeks ago what I thought was a fly bite at the location the was very ichy and I scratched it a lot. I haven't really read anything to indicate that a tick bite itches, so I'm wondering if it was a fly bite. Some of what I have read indicates that you can get Lyme from biting flies.

 

Anyway, I went to a dermatologist and he immediately decided to take a blood sample and have it analyzed.

 

It's curious because I have never developed any of the flu like or other symptoms and still feel fine today.

 

Time will tell if I have caught this in time to avoid future problems.

 

There does seem to remain quite a bit of mystery around this disease, with doctors disagreeing about how to diagnose and also treatments. A bit frustrating.

[+Girls Phind Squirrels]

we were in NH and NY in August camping and caching. Three of the team came down with it.

[+sbell111]

...Most doctors go by your history to diagnose Lyme disease, usually people complain of joint aches, fatigue, malaise, and the rash. However, not everyone gets the rash. ...

I always have all those symptoms, except for the rash. I bet it's just because I'm old.

[+oldsoldier]

I contracted it a few years back, never developed the symptoms, but came back positive with the blood test. I was on antibiotics for a wekk, and never developed any problems yet. Of course, I attribute most aches & pains nowadays to getting older, er, WISER.

[+Snoogans]

I sweated out a lyme tider test after getting a rash after a tick bite I received caching down the Pacific Coast Highway. That was the most tick infested day of cachin' a ever had and I missed just one.

 

The result of the test was negative, but the effect was my tongue in cheek motto:

 

geocaching: Wayyy more chances to contract West Nile, or Lyme Disease than the average person.-Snoogans (sometime in 2003)

 

T-Shirts available soon.

[+Metaphor]

I'll know if five days. In August, I had a bullseye around a bite-- well, more of a halo bruise with a little swelling around an obvious insect bite. I went in for a check, and the doctor dosed me with doxycycline for three weeks. Blood test was today, so I'm hoping for a clear diagnosis.

 

Don't wait -- I have two close friends who now have chronic Lyme's because one didn't think it was serious, and the other didn't steer his doctor in the right direction, and had over a year before getting an antibiotic regimen. Now, it's too late, and they are both pretty messed up.

[Bag o'Tricks]

Don't get too excited by a negative test result. None of the tests are terrific in terms of their reliablity. Ther are many false positives as well as many false negatives.

 

Yes, there is significant disagreement in the medical community concerning proper treatment. There is even a surprising contingent of the medical establishment that doesn't really believe that there is such a thing as Lyme Disease. And heaven help you if you find yourself in an area with very few cases of it and seek a diagnosis.

 

All of this knowledge has been gained the hard way. Both my wife and I have been successfully treated for Lyme, which we were fortunate enough to have diagnosed almost immediately. My case was diagnosed and I had begun treatment a couple of days before the bull's eye rash appeared. Unfortunately, my older daughter has an advanced case of Lyme - and it took 8 doctor's representing 5 specialties ( and some rather pointed advice from us) to arrive at this diagnosis.

 

Bag o'Tricks

[+Ambrosia]

The test for Lyme Disease is very inconclusive. If you have the common bull's eye rash a doctor should give you the antibiotic treatment right away. You do not want it to become chronic, it is a very scary disease.

[+CYBret]

A friend of mine is heading off to a hospital in Kansas City, Kansas for Lymes testing. If it comes back positive she's going to be going through 2-4 weeks worth of treatments there. They've exhausted just about every other possible diagnosis and while she didn't test positive for Lymes last time they're going to give it one more shot.

 

I'm really hoping this is it. The last two years of her life have been miserable and the whole "not knowing" aspect of it has just made it worse.

 

The lesson seems to be, though, don't mess around with this. If you think there's a chance you got it, get it taken care of early and easy. I've gone through the antibiotics once myself just to be safe.

 

Bret

[+Girls Phind Squirrels]

Insist on treatment if you have been in an area where the disease is prevalent. Don't take no for an answer.

[+landjet]

This is somewhat of a long read, but provides some great insight (IMHO) about Lyme Disease, testing and treatment with much of the focus being on why it is so difficult to diagnose and treat.

 

In my case, I have had several bites over the years with a noticeable increase in reaction. Not having medical insurance and just plain ignorance of the disease itself has prolonged my decesion to be checkd. Having now reached a point of cencern for myself, I wanted to do a little homework before I went in for an exam so I could justify (to myself and to the Dr) asking for specific tests.

 

Turns out, some of the info from the report even the Dr. was unaware of. Not exactly a comforting thought, but as you understand more of the disease itself, it is easy to see why. With over 300 different strains of Lyme Disease and a reported 20-30% of infected ticks having also another pathogen there is no simple outright symptom or cure.

 

 

Conflict Report .pdf

 

It was certainly worth the read for me. Perhaps others may benefit as well.

[+RakeInTheCache]

With over 300 different strains of Lyme Disease and a reported 20-30% of infected ticks having also another pathogen there is no simple outright symptom or cure.

 

Exterminate the ticks. I think we've done that with a few other species. (However, in my case, I still think it was a biting fly that transmitted it to me due to severe itching.)

 

BTW, I'm a few weeks into the treatment. Felt just a slight nausea/vertigo/fatigue/lethargy, but nothing debilitating. The rash, which was pretty dispersed as it was, is now almost unidentifiable.

Edited October 10, 2006 by RakeInTheCache

[+Metaphor]

Yeah! Tests came back negative. No Lymes. Advice: Get on an antibiotic regimen early.

[+Beffums]

After growing up in the northeeast (where the highest number of cases occur) and never once having even the slightest scare of Lyme's, I just finished spending the past 6 weeks recovering from a combo attack of Lyme disease and Rocky Mtn spotted fever. Probaby due to the combo effect, I had the rash ALL over me -- large splotches from head to toe, down both arms and both legs -- you get the picture. I have the bonus feature of always knowing when I get a tick bite, as I'm allerigic to fleas and ticks. This time I got bitten while out helping some friends find a cache that I'd already found!! But no, this time I had the joy of encountering the evil sickly tick with both diseases. Go Kentucky! Oh well. Luckily, the treatment for both diseases is the same -- potent antibiotics. Double lucky in my case - my allergic reaction had caused them to give me mega doses of steroids which likely made the rash show up more clearly.

 

However, please don't disregard any signs or symptoms of Lyme disease. The test is notall that expensive (the RMSF test was about $200, but the Lyme's test was only about $30). And, the consequences of untreated Lyme's disease are. The disease will eventually cause chemical changes in your brain, and the neurological consequences are much more severe than the advanced arthritis that many fear. You can take meds to numb the joint pain. We have no treatments for the brain damage that this disease can cause. A simple extended round of antibiotics is almost always sufficient to stop the disease -- so long as you catch it in time. After prolonged exposure to the disease, the treatments become much more expensive and are much less likely to work.

 

Oh, and to answer the original question (from a long time ago...): NO - the tick does not need to be attached for 48 hours to transmit the disease. That is a myth. And a dangerous one, since it leads many people to think that they can't possibly have a problem. I know roughly when I got bit (we were only in the woods for about 40 minutes), and exactly when we found the tick on me (about 5 hours later). I know of several others who also contracted Lyme's in much less than 48 hours.

[+Harry Dolphin]

Lyme Disease! Not Lymes or Lyme's. One doesn't say influenzas, or cancer's, or 'I have a cold's.'

[/pedantic mode off]

 

From what I read of the literature: The bacteria is transmitted when the tick is full of blood, and starts regurgitating. This usually takes twelve hours or more. 'Usually'.

I did not see the tick that transmitted the disease to me. It appears to have bitten me on the right shoulder blade. From my geocaching adventures, I have a pretty good idea of when I was bitten. The rash first appeared about two weeks later. I was geocaching in western Pennsylvania at the time. By the time I got back home (three days later), the rashes had spread over most of my body. (It was quite decorative.) What surprised me is that none of the rashes were actually circular. Oh, well. The antibiotic did a great job of ridding me of the rash and fatigue. I do not know, however, if I am suffering residual effects. I've had a lot more aches and pains recently, but then again, I am growing older. (Probably even older than sbell!)

[+BuxCamper]

Had Lyme's 2 or 3 years ago and probably got it around my house in suburban Philadelphia. Don't know how much time between the tick and the rash showing up but it was a classic bulseye. Not everyone gets the rash. I did feel flue like for a few days before the rash and going to the doctor.

 

He had no qualms about prescribing me three weeks of antibiotics. What works is not particularly strong or exotic but your body needs the constant exposure. (Just tell co-workers who ask why your popping pills that they're to quiet the voices in their heads. )

 

After a checkup at three weeks I felt much better but still a little off. Some research on the web recommended four weeks and I mentioned it to the doctor. Again he had no qualms about giving me another weeks worth. Plus he had me get an EKG. After getting the script filled I noticed he gave me 10 days, a normal antibiotic regimen. Was this force of habit on his part, I don't know.

 

At four weeks to the pill I noticed I finally did not feel off.

 

Better to be safe than sorry. Long term damage from Lyme's can be pretty devastating.