Lame Caches: A Finders Guide

24.7k · January 25, 2005

Lame Caches: A finders guide.

Yes Virginia there is such a thing as a lame cache. One you won’t enjoy finding. By and large though what you do and don’t enjoy is entirely up to you.

The first rule is this. If you are not having fun, quit that. It stands to reason that if any one cache isn’t fun, and you keep looking for that cache, then you are enjoying not having fun. That makes no sense, so quit when it’s not fun. Quit then go to another cache. That can be a hard lesson to learn.

Almost all caches are more fun after you find them. Remember it while you are looking. It may not help, but it won’t hurt. Especially with micros.

Wet logs. Once you find one you really only have three choices, but you can mix and match. First you can whine about it and stomp your feet. You can sign it anyway with your waterproof pen. Or you can add a dry log in a zip lock and sign that one. My path is to sign the wet log. It’s a challenge, besides I paid extra for a waterproof pen and dammit I want to use it every now and then.

Bring friends or family. Somehow an afternoon of seeking lame caches with good company seems like a lot more fun than an afternoon of debating lame caches in the forums by yourself.

Rise to the challenge. Micro Signature items for micro caches. Bring your own pen to sign with since the dinky stub is hard to write with. Hide a full size cache in that perfect spot 10’ over, mention it in your log., and see what happens. Give it to the cache owner if they are like “Why didn’t I think of that!” List it on another site if they go ballistic.

Show them how it’s done. 528’ over from their lame a$S micro hide a good one. If their next cache is improved, call it a job well done.

Be a cache angel. There is a difference between “your lame cache is cracked, wet, and full of McToys you need to maintain it or you suck.” And “I replaced the gladware container that had cracked with a Rubbermaid one and put in a dry log”. Both drive home the point. One does it better and it’s actually more fun.

Trash: All caches accumulate trash. One mans trash is another mans treasure. However it’s a safe bet that expired coupons, wrappers, and food should just be removed. If a cache is full of Mcjunk leave a stretchy lizard (or similar cool but cheap item). They are something like 10 cents each and kids love them and who cares if they don’t trade fair for it? You just improved the cache. That reminds me…I need to order some.

Don’t make it harder than it is. Every now and then I’m fighting briars and brambles to look in a spot the cache could be. With clothing torn and blood flowing suddenly my brain will kick in and I’ll realize the cache owner probably doesn’t like bleeding any more than I do. Then I look where they wouldn’t have to bleed and find the cache. Sometimes your best tool is your brain, and the best solution is to ask yourself “Where would I hide it?”

Of these the most important is the first. If you are not having fun, you are doing it wrong.

7.2k · January 25, 2005

This simply illustrates that anything goes in your book. Doesn't matter how crappy, it's all good. Right?

January 25, 2005

Not having fun? Who cares about fun?? I'll be damned if I'm going to let a stinking, good-for-nothing lame cache get the best of me!

On the other hand, not having fun is letting the cache get the best of me...

But to walk away from a cache, unfound - failed?? Never!

Oh, suck up your pride and walk away - it's just a game, for goodness' sake!

"Just a game"???

(Schizophrenic, obsessive compulsive, manic depression: not a good mix.) :rolleyes:

24.7k · January 25, 2005

This simply illustrates that anything goes in your book. Doesn't matter how crappy, it's all good. Right?

Rule one. Have fun.

Rule two. Have fun.

Rule three. Have fun.

This is geocaching, as a finder even if everyone played by your "hide a great cache rules" you will still find crappy caches. It's beyond your control. That's life. How you deal with that is up to you.

As a rule, my rule on rules is simple. Have all the ones you need and none of the ones you don't. If you have to err, err on the side of less rules.

I can make suggestions on a good cache, and I have done so in a way that I think is helpful. However I'm not going to legislate it. If time and again you do battle with lame caches in the world and it's souring your fun, you are playing the wrong game. If you still want to geocache, pick someone else who is having fun at it and play their version.

We have a local who it seemed placed nothing but wet log caches. So I did a study on the best pen to write on wet logs. It was fun, I gave them crap (and that was fun) they took the crap in fun, and later I got an email from them asking which pen I settled on so they could buy one for the wet logs they had been coming across. I have a cache with a perpetually wet log and I've not figured out the solution yet because the hide is only conductive to certain containers. Such is life.

If you are not forgiving on other poeples lame caches, then what's the point? Your turn will come.

January 25, 2005

CoyoteRed wrote:

This simply illustrates that anything goes in your book. Doesn't matter how crappy, it's all good. Right?

I would humbly suggest that you missed RK's point. Whatever your standards for "crappy" or "lame" might be, there will certainly be some cache that fits them. When you find this cache (and you will...), you can choose to respond to it in a variety of different ways. Some of these responses (as RK points out) are creative, constructive, and fun. Some (unfortunately popular) are whining...

If you aren't having fun, ask yourself "Why?" If you can use this to make the experience enjoyable, then do it! (and with a grin on your face!) If you can't -- then walk away.

Of these the most important is the first. If you are not having fun, you are doing it wrong.

Well said.

7.2k · January 25, 2005

RK,

You still miss the point.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO HIDE A LAME CACHE!!!

It's not about the learning curve.

It's not about failed experiments.

It's not about teasing your friends with devious hides.

It about making absolutely no effort to entertain your fellow cacher. I mean, come on, you place a crappy little container under a lamp post cover? What is that? What are you showing me? Yet another lamp post? Whoop-tee-doo. You've done a jam up job! Thanks for bringing me out to see this. I just about peed myself with joy.

:rolleyes:

I wouldn't even point that out to anyone in passing. "Hey, look, a lamp post." They'd think me an idiot.

That's pretty much what you are doing when you hide a cache. "Hey, look here."

If that's all you got to give then maybe you are playing the wrong game.

EDIT: address the proper person.

Edited January 25, 2005 by CoyoteRed

38.2k · January 25, 2005

As much as I agree with CR about our general distaste for lame caches, some people actually like them.

I think there is a place for them and I've even sought them myself. There is some entertainment value even to a Walmart lampost micro (which BTW I found my first one recently while visiting my in-laws...they thankfully haven't made it here that I know of).

My problem with the lame caches is that in some areas there are so gosh darn many of them!

7.2k · January 25, 2005

My problem with the lame caches is that in some areas there are so gosh darn many of them!

That and when folks start thinking that is the game.

January 25, 2005

DADGUMIT, did that horse get up AGAIN . . .

7.2k · January 25, 2005

Hey, you're the one that got me on this tear.

Now, it's a crusade.

January 25, 2005

Opps . . . sorry CR, please continue - but it was a thread about making it FUN rather than where we were before - was only kidding, ouch!

7.2k · January 25, 2005

was only kidding

I'm not.

If I can prevent what happened here, then I consider I've done something.

9.1k · January 25, 2005

The premise of the thread accepts that there will be lame caches. I thought the thread was about what to do as a finder of a lame cache. Ought not the complaints about hiding lame caches be lodged in the companion thread, a "Hiders Guide"?

I endorse the FUN rule wholeheartedly. While I prefer finding good caches to finding lame caches, given a choice between the two, I still manage to find ways to make lame caches fun. Find 'em at night. Find 'em in the snow. Find 'em without a GPS. Find as many of them as possible at once. Find 'em in the company of good friends. Lame caches don't bother me as much as they do others. If I get tired of them I can always go find a few 3/3's to make up for it.

All that being said, I hope I never *hide* another lame cache. I did that once, and later archived it of my own initiative. If I have further thoughts on *hiding* better caches I will post to the other thread.

1.8k · January 26, 2005

In my book, a lame cache is still better than no cache at all.

I think RK summarized my attitude very eloquently. All the complaints in the world won't make lame hides go away. I just make the best of 'em and have fun anyhow.

January 26, 2005

HMMMM someone on my side for once. All caches are appreciated by someone. We love all caches and the cachers that take time to put them out for us. Thanks very much for all types of caches.

1.3k · January 26, 2005

All the complaints in the world won't make lame hides go away.

Are you sure about that?

"Micro" Reputation Reparation Discussion.

sd

January 26, 2005

was only kidding

I'm not.

If I can prevent what happened here, then I consider I've done something.

sorry bud,

lame caches are unpreventable and inevitable.

it all depends on who is looking at the cache and what type of cache they consider to be a lame. <_<

that means... there will always be lame caches out there. period. :rolleyes:

1.6k · January 26, 2005

Extremely Well Put RK ! Ditto that here !

FUN is what it is REALLY all about !

Star

January 26, 2005

edited quote due to length:

Lame Caches: A finders guide.

Yes Virginia there is such a thing as a lame cache. One you won’t enjoy finding. By and large though what you do and don’t enjoy is entirely up to you......

The first rule is this. If you are not having fun, quit that......

Almost all caches are more fun after you find them......

Wet logs......

Bring friends or family. .....

Rise to the challenge......

Show them how it’s done.....

Be a cache angel......

Trash: All caches accumulate trash......

Don’t make it harder than it is.....

Of these the most important is the first. If you are not having fun, you are doing it wrong.

Hey, I think I get it....in a Baz Luhrmann/Mary Schmich "Everybody's Free to Wear Sunscreen" kinda way :rolleyes: ....and if I don't.....I guess I'm really out to lunch.

[paraphrase/adaptation]

Have fun caching.

If I could offer you only one tip for the future, having fun caching would be it. The long-term benefits of caching have been proved by techogeeks/hikers throughout the world, whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable than my own meandering experience. I will dispense this advice now....

Understand that lame caches come and go, but those precious memories of great caches you should hold onto. Work hard to set the bar high in cache quality and placement, because with the more experience you get, the more you understand the earlier caches you place when you were young were kinda lame.

Accept certain inalienable truths: some caches will be lame. Geocachers will place caches without serious intensions. You, too, will find some. And when you do, you'll fantasize that when you were young in the sport, all caches were well stocked, every cache was a 5/5 and cachers respected the cachers who hid before them.

It doesn't really matter....

But trust me on the "have fun caching".

[/paraphrase/adaptation]

January 26, 2005

Now, it's a crusade.

Some may not care for your crusade.......

Ever think of that? <_<

My opinion is when somoenes biased opinion takes away from others fun then its best to leave that opinion to oneself...... I'm assuming here though that your crusade is not fun to you..... Maybe you enjoy it though.... :rolleyes:

back to being on topic.......

Well written RK...... I immensely enjoyed both your posts today!!!

Edited January 26, 2005 by top pin

38.2k · January 26, 2005

that means... there will always be lame caches out there. period

If most caches were great, then what we consider to beordinary caches today would be lame. :rolleyes:

January 26, 2005

that means... there will always be lame caches out there. period

If most caches were great, then what we consider to beordinary caches today would be lame.

shh!

you're confusing me! <_<

January 26, 2005

If I get tired of them I can always go find a few 3/3's to make up for it.

Oh what a revalation!!!! I don't know too many lampost caches with a high difficulty rating. If you can't be bothered to look at the rating you don't qualify to complain either. :rolleyes:

9.1k · January 26, 2005

If I get tired of them I can always go find a few 3/3's to make up for it.

Oh what a revalation!!!! I don't know too many lampost caches with a high difficulty rating. If you can't be bothered to look at the rating you don't qualify to complain either.

I just finished telling you that I am perfectly capable of enjoying 1/1 lamp post micros. I believe you've witnessed that first hand. :rolleyes:

It is all a matter of being in the mood to do something crazy with those hides. If I'm not in that mood, I'll go hike up a mountain and find an ammo box. Different fun on different days, that's all.

Oh, and I *do* know of some lamp post micros with high difficulty ratings. You'll know when you get there. :blink:

January 26, 2005

Sorry Leprechaun, I didn't mean you in particular. I just can't understand when people look for a cache rated a 1/1 and expect it to be life changing experience. :rolleyes:

January 26, 2005

Lame Caches: A finders guide.

The first rule is this. If you are not having fun, quit that.

Bring friends or family.

Of these the most important is the first. If you are not having fun, you are doing it wrong.

You go, Renegade Knight!!

Good post, good post!!

(I plan on placing one of those infamouse "lame micros" very soon! Just to say I did!)

Momma Marauder

1.1k · January 26, 2005

sorry bud,
lame caches are unpreventable and inevitable.

True. But when they (caches placed with no consideration to the quality of the location...just a set of coords and a stat) become the MAJORITY, as is the case in some areas and is becoming the case in others, is that the way we want our game to evolve?

All these positive articles in the media that we've seen and that we're seeing ever more of recently...are NOT referring to 35mm containers hidden under lamppost bases in WalMart parking lots, folks. If the articles tout what we generally refer to as "not lame" caches, and if new cachers start looking for caches as a result of the articles and instead get pages and pages of parking lot/bush-base/etc micros, are we not misrepresenting? True, a little extra search effort will yield what the articles tout, but it goes back to the wheat/chaff thing, doesn't it?

So how does this cacher/cache-quality-crusader continue to try to find FUN in a game that this cacher feels is evolving in the wrong direction? By no longer going after "every" cache, and instead focusing on caches whose cache pages and logs make them appear to be of better quality than "just any ol'" cache placement. Which means my caching activity has gone WAY down in recent months, but when I've gone out caching it's been as satisfying as I can make it. I just hate that it's come to this...because it used to be that I could count on ANY day of caching being positive. Now it takes a lot more work to try to ensure that.

-Dave R.

Edited January 26, 2005 by drat19

3k · January 26, 2005

I'm not sure what the fuss is all about. I've enjoyed RK's two "Guide" posts today very much.

But I have never found, or DNF'd, a lame cache. Some of my hunts have been more enjoyable, more exciting, or more memorable than others, but I have never walked back to the car thinking .. "that was a lame cache".

But maybe thats just me. :rolleyes:

January 26, 2005

I'm not sure what the fuss is all about. I've enjoyed RK's two "Guide" posts today very much.

But I have never found, or DNF'd, a lame cache. Some of my hunts have been more enjoyable, more exciting, or more memorable than others, but I have never walked back to the car thinking .. "that was a lame cache".

But maybe thats just me.

No not just you, A lot of people think the same thing.

1.1k · January 26, 2005

But I have never found, or DNF'd, a lame cache. Some of my hunts have been more enjoyable, more exciting, or more memorable than others, but I have never walked back to the car thinking .. "that was a lame cache".

But maybe thats just me.

I agree, I've never walked away from ONE cache thinking it was "lame". However, in an increasing number of regions where I cache, I HAVE thought after a DAY of caching, "I had to weed through x number of "lame" caches in order to hunt for the y number of memorable ones today". And x is always a SIGNIFICANTLY larger number than y recently. It's a trend in the wrong direction.

Of course that may just be ME (but I know it's not).

-Dave R.

7.2k · January 26, 2005

Now, it's a crusade.

Some may not care for your crusade.......

Ever think of that?

Sure, I did. Those who strive for mediocrity will most certainly not welcome my efforts.

Quite frankly, I don't care. My intentions are to promote the raising of minimum standards accepted by the community. I realize I can only do it a bit at a time and that's fine. We've already started the advocacy of not logging a cache you find as absolutely lame or being honest in your logs. It shows in the online logs. It's more telling when you realize that folks who normally log online don't but have signed the logbook. Even more than that is when someone just signs "Found it" instead of their name. That should say something.

I'm with Drat19. There will always be a lame cache or two out there for whatever reason, but to purposely place several pointless caches in one day is simply not where many of us would like the game to go.

7.2k · January 26, 2005

but I have never walked back to the car thinking .. "that was a lame cache".

I have. Maybe it's because I look for the better caches and the lame ones seem to just get in the way.

I do remember one of the lastest caches I was looking for and I pretty much just gave up. I had only looked for a couple of minutes, but I was wondering "what the hell was the point is this?" It was an empty field behind a restaurant. No, not micro, either.

I remember someone asking a while back what happened to make 90% of the people who try caching quit. (or some such number)

Maybe we're talking about it right now.

4.7k · January 26, 2005

an excerpt from flask's open letter to the psychiatric nurses:

remeber that each and every one of you are someone's favorite, and that somebody's life is enriched because you were here. even the one i called "nurse ratched" and bit.

it applies to caches as well.

edit: none of your business why. all right, it was spelling, but it's still none of your business.

Edited January 26, 2005 by flask

24.7k · January 26, 2005

... My intentions are to promote the raising of minimum standards accepted by the community....

A universally pointless cache doesn't exist. If you raise the bar by your standards you are going to rule out caches that I enjoy. If it's my standards, well I already know that BrianSnat's doomed to hate some of my “cool” caches.

People complain about the proliferation of lame caches, but last time I checked there were more of every kind of cache. When I started this game to clear your area you could do all the urban caches and all the hiking caches and have to drive 300 miles for the next cache. Now you can't even do all the hiking caches out there. There are just too many of every cache type including the ones that you and I enjoy with our different standards. If you live in a cache poor area, you are thankful for any cache to come along.

If you take time to wage a crusade against the types of caches that I enjoy, you are fighting the wrong battle for the wrong reasons. But hey, as long as you enjoy that more power to you. :rolleyes:

7.2k · January 26, 2005

There are just too many of every cache type including the ones that you and I enjoy with our different standards. If you live in a cache poor area, you are thankful for any cache to come along.

If you were me you'd think differently.

We found every cache in our area except for the very few new ones that have popped up. That's in a 50 mile radius.

Are we glad a cache come online? You bet. But when the only thing it does is take us to a random power transformer off a random off ramp that leads to nothing but a bunch of office complexs, what's the point?

Especially, when you've come to expect better.

7.2k · January 26, 2005

A universally pointless cache doesn't exist.

Maybe, not. The ones I'm thinking of can be good examples of what not to do.

Thing is, do we need so many of them?

1.8k · January 26, 2005

All the complaints in the world won't make lame hides go away.

Are you sure about that?

"Micro" Reputation Reparation Discussion.

sd

Yes. That doesn't do a thing to get rid of the lame micros near me. :rolleyes:

January 26, 2005

when I first started caching, one of the first ones I did turned out to be a lamppost micro in a parking lot of a movie rental place. It had a theme where you recommended a favorite movie to the next cacher... it took me a couple of tries to find it and it was fun and challenging for me because I had never seen one before. Some people would probably classify it as lame, but I thought it was really clever. it also required much stealth to retrieve, which gave me valuable stealth experience. :rolleyes: so, maybe lame is in the eye of the beholder.

1.1k · January 26, 2005

All the complaints in the world won't make lame hides go away.

Are you sure about that?

"Micro" Reputation Reparation Discussion.

sd

Yes. That doesn't do a thing to get rid of the lame micros near me.

Perhaps. But if one area can get the thought/action process started, others can follow. (Heck, lame micro proliferation happened because of lead/follow, now didn't it?)

-Dave R.

Edited January 26, 2005 by drat19

24.7k · January 26, 2005

...If you were me you'd think differently....

Changing tack slightly, our local cache maggot pretty much steals everything in a 50 mile radius that you would probably consider lame or an easy find even if a good cache.

Ignoring the side effect of discouraged cachers in the area who won't hide new caches it's opend up a lot of territory for new caches. This summer (before they got discouraged by the cache maggot) a bunch of newbies found the hobby and hid caches in area that had been used once by the old timers.

I have found that I enjoy seeing what the new blood comes up with when they put a cache in the same spot. This is true if it's a parking lot, park, or whatever.

It was something I didn't expect, and it's something that will help keep me in this game longer than some who get tired of the same spot.

1.1k · January 26, 2005

when I first started caching, one of the first ones I did turned out to be a lamppost micro in a parking lot of a movie rental place. It had a theme where you recommended a favorite movie to the next cacher... it took me a couple of tries to find it and it was fun and challenging for me because I had never seen one before. Some people would probably classify it as lame, but I thought it was really clever. it also required much stealth to retrieve, which gave me valuable stealth experience. so, maybe lame is in the eye of the beholder.

But it was ONE. Imagine HUNDREDS of them. Or, go to certain (and an increasing number of) areas and you don't have to imagine...you can experience.

-Dave R.

1.4k · January 26, 2005

I'm a geocacher...therefor I cache.

I'm also a fisherman. Been fishing since I was a small child. In that time I've caught thousands of fish, mostly trout...mostly rainbow trout...mostly 8-10 inches long. I usually fish in scenic places.

I know fishermen that are only satisfied if they catch a whopper. They pout and complain when they catch a pan sized bow. I know fishermen that will only fish quality trout streams with a $400.00 pflueger rod and an adams.

I have more fun than they do.

Occasionally, I'll drop a line in the portneuf river. There are very few decent fish there, the banks and bottom are mud, and there isn't many views that I'd call scenic. They won't rise to a fly so I usually use night crawlers. Are the fish in that river lame? Why do I keep going back after those stunted lame hatchery trout? Is it because the first fish I ever caught was in that river? Maybe.

More likely it's because I like to fish. It's close, I know it well, and I've never been skunked there.

The same holds true for geocaching. Believe it or not, I've enjoyed every cache I've ever found and every fish I've ever caught...save one. Many of them would be considered lame by some. I had a blast.

January 26, 2005

CoyoteRed, I think there is only one flaw in your reasoning:

If a cache doesn't show you something, does that automatically make it lame?

Showing the cacher something isn't 100% of the fun for all of us. The HUNT is a big part of it. GETTING there is a big part of it. (but I guess that is really showing the cacher something...)

For the more experienced cachers who know the tricks, there is no hunt either, so it is lame. For the less-experienced cachers, it really IS a hunt.

I think you have the right idea though. I don't think it is acceptable to accept defeat and lower our standards. If every one of us had the passion that you do about it, we could dramatically lessen the amount of lame caches. It would simply be socially unacceptable. Kind of like littering, jay-walking, and gun violence are socially unacceptable in Switzerland; so people don't do it.

Now let me ask you something else: When you DO find a lame cache (on accident of course :rolleyes: ) what do you do about it? Do you loudly proclaim in that person's log that it is lame? Or do you just post a one-liner that says: "TFTC" and covertly send an email to the person telling them that they have in fact hidden a lame cache in the most gentle and fatherly manner possible? If you really want to make an impact and go on a crusade, that is what you should do. SEEK your local lames. Log them politely, then break the news to the owner that the cache is in fact lame. Give them constructive criticism and be as classy and compassionate as possible. Offer to mentor them even. If you get flak from them in return, throw in the towel and move onto the next one.

I agree though. With the minimum amount of consideration and research, one can place a cache that is above the lame threshhold. It may not be great or even fair, but it doesn't have to be lame.

Being loud and vociferous isn't going to win your crusade. You may NEVER win it. But if you're classy, tactful, and tenacious, you will have a good effect. You probably already have made more of a difference than you even know...

I'm still in the phase where lames don't get me bent out of shape.

One last thought: The people hiding the lames are probably not here, or they wouldn't do it, so this probably isn't the place. I don't know about everyone else, but after I read up here for about two days, I was prevented from planting a lame. I was saved from planting a wet-log cache too.

OK, this one really IS the last thought: Maybe we could have Jeremy post a sticky thread in the 'Getting Started' forum entitled: "How to place a cache which isn't lame". Many of the noobs would see it there. Maybe even put it on the front page of geocaching.com...?

January 26, 2005

Smaug1 wrote:

"....With the minimum amount of consideration and research, one can place a cache that is above the lame threshhold..."

I am asking this seriously: What exactly is the "lame threshold?" Establishing that in a clear, objective manner would give me, and I would hope others, a benchmark against which to measure our hides to insure that they are not lame.

8.4k · January 26, 2005

Well RK, I know you meant well, but this has turned into the same stupid argument over what IS and ISN'T lame.

My 2 cents as ever:

The hider is playing a game called geocaching. They are evidently playing it right because their cache was approved.

You are also playing a GAME (sport/hobby/obsession/etc.) evidently called MY version of Geocaching 1.5, or maybe even 2.O. You seem to be failing at your game if you are not able to enjoy it. Snoogans 11/04/04

"Failure is a hard pill to swallow until you realize the only failure you can really have in this sport is the failure to enjoy yourself."

TotemLake 4/26/04

OH, BTW - This was posted on another geocaching website. Some of it really fits here. Infer what you will:

In other words waaa waaaaa waaaaa. My heart bleeds for those that just want to whine about lame caches. RK gave a whole list of options. Go DO them an quit yer b1tchin. :lol:

Edited February 1, 2005 by CO Admin

January 26, 2005

How many times have you seen someone with over 500 finds with just 5 hides...

Could be that folks on this site don't want to hide a cache because of the ridicule they might receive in the logs over it.

2Tango

ps....I wish there was a lamppost hide in this area as I would love to look for it as it really sounds neat.

Edited January 26, 2005 by 2Tango

8.4k · January 26, 2005

How many times have you seen someone with over 500 finds with just 5 hides...

Could be that folks on this site don't want to hide a cache because of the ridicule they might receive in the logs over it.

That argument doesn't hold water. Someone with 500 finds and less than 1 hide per 100 finds knows what's good FOR THEM subjectively and what isn't. They CHOOSE to take more than they give. I'm not saying it's wrong if that's their game. It's just a fact.

It takes effort to hide and maintain caches. People don't consider that when they label them LAME for whatever subjective reason they have.

My point? IT WAS FREAKIN' APPROVED. Move on and don't say anything if you can't say something nice. You never know if it wasn't a small child who hid the cache. Let them enjoy it. Better yet, don't hunt a cache that doesn't have great logs. THEN no one could complain.

2.4k · January 26, 2005

By definition, most caches are mediocre. Even if the overall quality goes, up, most are still mediocre. That's what mediocre means. I expect most caches to be mediocre, and the exceptional ones are surprises. Most can't be exceptional, because by definition, exceptional caches are rare.

Get over it. Hunt caches and have fun, and don't hunt caches you think will be lame. There are too many caches out there to find all of them, so don't try. Hunt just the ones that you think will be fun, and although you'll still be disappointed by some, you'll be more likely to enjoy yourself. And if you don't enjoy yourself, what's the point of doing it in the first place? It's possible to have fun even with mediocre caches, or else everyone would have quit by now.

1.1k · January 26, 2005

ps....I wish there was a lamppost hide in this area as I would love to look for it as it really sounds neat.

Your first find of a lamppost base cache WILL be neat, seriously. I know I felt like an idiot when I logged DNFs on several lamppost base caches before I learned the "secret" of them, and it was very satisfying when I finally did "get it". So yeah, what you've posted is all good...honestly and with no sarcasm.

Now imagine one or more cachers in your area latching on to this particular hide concept (because it's so "neat", plus it's cheap and you can place LOTS of them in a single day just driving around) and BOMBING your area with tens or hundreds of them, creating the new local "standard" to other newbs who might join the sport. The newbs read an article about this nifty, environmentally friendly game where folks go out and explore and hike and discover untapped local treasures, where they can bring their families and find cool swag in cool containers, with breathless and exciting pictures of Mom and Dad and their 2.3 kids having a family-bonding experience for the day...and instead, a zip code search yields pages and pages of nearby caches that turn out to be shopping center parking lots with security and paranoid onlookers watching in post-9/11 America. Do you think those 2.3 kids are going to want to keep looking for more and more of these fun and exciting lampposts, or do you think they're going to whine to Mommy and Daddy that they want to go into that Toys 'R Us down there at the other end of the parking lot?

This is ABSOLUTELY what has happened in many areas and continues to happen more and more. The "cool" caches written about in the articles ARE still out there, but you have to sift through this increasing pile of what we're calling the "lame" caches in order to locate them. Still think it's neat?

-Dave R., still crusadin' but gettin' tired...

Dave's Note to Local Hiders

7.2k · January 26, 2005

IT WAS FREAKIN' APPROVED.

There is a lot that you can get approved. Physical caches have very low subjective standards, if any, so that argument doesn't hold water. Start holding them to a standard just a fraction of that for virts and you'll have a completely different story.

There are too many caches out there to find all of them, so don't try.

Wrong. We've pretty much cached out our area. Even if we want to find more than a cache or two within our area it take some driving time and the associated gas to burn.

If a cache doesn't show you something, does that automatically make it lame?

No. It's a combination of things that is hard to quantify. You touched on other aspects later in your post. It doesn't have to the end game that has the nice view to make it a decent cache. There is a multitude of factors.

I see caching as something similar to handing a friend of yours a piece of paper and asking them to go there and do X--which is basically what you are doing. What will they find? Will they enjoy the experience?

If you are handing them directions to a statue or a park, then they might. Have them solve a puzzle, have the "Indiana Jones" theme rolling around in their head, act like James Bond, and they might enjoy themselves.

If the directions where to visit a lamp post in an office complex...

Lame Caches: A Finders Guide

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