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Do The Regular Posters Intimidate?


El Diablo

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I'm a newbie and yes I feel intimidated by the forums regulars. . . . I have had questions answered by forum regulars, notably "sputnic 57", but I have dozens of other questions that I hesitated (and would like) to ask.

I hope my answer didn't discourage you from posting other questions. If so, I sincerely apologize.

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sorry folks, but now I am really rolling my eyes

are we gonna all hug and sing Kumbaya'?

 

people should be able to post in joking manner without worrying about intimidating

there is a difference between having some fun WITH people, and making fun to ridicule

 

a forum without humor would be one to avoid, IMHO

Edited by GixxerUT
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I do not think that the regulars intentionaly flame noobs, A noob being a noob may not really know who all the regulars are. I think all the regulars posters try to cut the noobs some slack. I do not read all the areas the members post in, and I do not read all the treads, so I can only speak from threads I have read.

 

Some times I wonder how some meMbers with high numbers of post ever get out to do any caching. :huh:

 

Not respondable fur mizpeld wurds

Edited by JohnnyVegas
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I'm a newbie and yes I feel intimidated by the forums regulars. . . . I have had questions answered by forum regulars, notably "sputnic 57", but I have dozens of other questions that I hesitated (and would like) to ask.

I hope my answer didn't discourage you from posting other questions. If so, I sincerely apologize.

 

Please, please I was commending you for your help.

 

I'm not good with words, and sometimes I don't say/type what I've meant to say.

 

Your replies are alway polite and contain thorough answers.

 

I should not have mentioned anyone by name, but I assure you that I have only respect for you thoughtfulness and help. And I meant to point you out as an example of how one can and should help newbies.

Edited by Hide-and-Seek
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I rarely post on these forums because I choose not to give anyone the power to judge the manner in which I choose to participate in the sport of caching. Besides that, I'm too busy planning my next adventure to worry about whether anyone 'feels bad' about what is said in the forums. For those of you who live by every word posted here--may you enjoy what you think is important.

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Yes some of the forum regulars are down right nasty to newbies.

And my take, removing any unnecessary words: some of the forum regulars are down right nasty.

 

Yes, some are simply nasty, and enjoy stirring the pot, poking the flames, pouring salt on the wounds, etc., etc. Nothing can really be done about those trolls except to ignore them as best you can.

 

Additionally, part of the problem is this forum is not spoken word. You may "hear" something said one way when you type it, but people will very likely read it differently than was intended. When read by someone else, all verbal inflection and non-verbal cues are lost. They will "hear" it differently, and it sometimes takes a bit of clarification to un-wad any panties that were bunched in the process of trying to get your point across.

 

And perhaps it's just the "polite southerner" in me, but there are many more polite ways of Markwelling someone. How hard is it really to post the Markwell AND a note saying something along the lines of "Thanks for posting. you can find more information on your topic (HERE). If you need any more help, feel free to post again!" It's not that difficult to make a newbie feel welcome.

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I have been reading about Newbies getting dumped on....how about honest questions from Non-Newbies = "old timers" with a legit concern about why something is wrong either on the site or with their cache?

 

I have seen many of the people (including several mods that come in with their "regular" screen names) 'gang up' (so to speak) on one person & keep bashing away. I have come to the conclusion, that if John & I are having a problem...we will just E-Mail someone that we trust & that might correct said problem.

 

I have rarely seen a successful outcome from someone coming to the forums to ask why their cache was either denied after going through the proper channels. And according to the rules, that is what you are supposed to do if that situation arises.

 

Also, when someone comes on the forums to complain about their cache getting archived...? Yet again, bashing. :huh:

 

That is why we tend to stay either in the Benchmark or Off Topic forums...

 

Shirley~

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I'm a newbie and yes I feel intimidated by the forums regulars. Need an example, how about trgrhappy's post in this topic. While such posts can be funny, they intimidate the newbie that’s asking for help. I have been treated well on this forum, and I have had questions answered by forum regulars, notably "sputnic 57", but I have dozens of other questions that I hesitated (and would like) to ask. What I don't understand is if regulars don't want to read or answer an obviously newbie question, don't. And why do some feel they have to post first, and with "do a search". Over the last two months I have spent more time on Groundspeak than most, watching and searching for answers, some without success. For one I have found the Groundspeak “search” failing, two this site is huge, and three (and most important) even when I do find an answer I often don't understand.

I think this post says it all. Did anyone else notice the intimidatee has more forum posts then the intimidator?

I think mostly it's a perceived problem. The people really feel intimidated before they even get here. They may be intimidated by the technology involved in this game. They may be intimidated by using a computer and internet forums. They may be intimidated by being a total stranger walking into a what appears to be a huge auditorium filled with 1000 people who all appear to be pals.

It's like starting your first job, and doing it in a new state. You don't know your way around, you don't have any friends, and you don't know what to expect. You are going in without any type of safety net. Some people are going to be intimidated by all that, no matter who is doing the posting, as the quoted post above shows. I don't know how to make these people feel any better to start. I wish I could. If they stick it out, they usually settle in and learn their way around and become part of the community.

 

Some people feel they are experts after 3 caches, and expect everyone to change to do things the way they think is best. This has nothing to do with caching or the forums either. Going back to my first day on the job analogy, these are the same people that come into work on their second day and tell the CEO and all their co-workers how they SHOULD be doing their job. These people are going to have a hard time wherever they go. There is no helping them. Fortunately they don't usually seem to retain any long term interest in geocaching, maybe because everyone else is wrong. Those that do keep on caching, figure out how things really work and then fit in pretty well.

 

The rest are more sociable people. They don't feel intimidated not knowing anyone at a party; instead they see lots of new people to meet, and lots of new things to learn. They walk around, listen to the conversations to get a feel for things, and then jump right in with relevant comments. They feel comfortable and confident with themselves, which is why after only 12 forum posts people might think they are one of the regulars.

 

We need to work on the first group, help them see it's not such a bad place once you get to know everyone. I'm just not sure how.

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I am hardly a regular poster, but have never been attacked thus far. Regardless, my skin is pretty thick and I wouldn't take things lying down if it were to occur.

 

That all being said, I make no hesitation at all discussing the pros and cons of hunting when there are obvious misinformed opinions put forth or reasonalbe questions are asked.

 

Mike

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I rarely post in the forums not because I have given POWER to others to intimidate me, but rather because I've decided that the "cost" of posting usually exceeds the "benefits", if you will. I lurk around very frequently and learn alot that way, but when I need to ask a question or join the conversation, I'll usually choose either my regional forum or a totally innocuous topic, like Original Haikus, or something.

 

It's not that I've been personally intimidated, but I've observed a lot of other, braver newbies get shot down and I do have thin enough skin that I know I would take that more personally than I should, so I just choose not to subject myself to it. (Man, the grammar of that last sentence needs help - oh well.)

 

I do clearly remember one recent thread in which someone got summarily banned for a week for what looked to me like simply poking good-natured fun at someone's avatar. I was so appalled at the harsh response that I e-mailed the cacher in question to ask if there was something more going on or some past history that warranted that action. My e-mail was the only notice he'd had that he had been banned - no warning, no e-mail notification, nothing. He had just been unable to log in and couldn't figure out why. He hadn't even been able to see the post telling everyone else that he had been banned. That seriously spooked me!

 

As for all on-line boards being this way, I disagree. Granted, I have little experience in the matter, but 3 other forums I frequent - all of them camping related - rarely, if ever, sink to flaming and I've always felt very comfortable posting in them.

 

JMHO

Mrs. Car54

 

P.S. At the risk of being told that we shouldn't mention individuals, I just want to say that I've always found carleenp's posts to be helpful and respectful and I really enjoy Auntie Weasel's sense of humor. :huh:

I got banned once for a week. I had no idea that I was sent a warrning a couple or times because they were sent as PM, at the time I had no idea what a PM was so I never saw the warning. It seems to me it would have been better to have just sent my an e-mail.

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Not intimidated really but just a level of frustration with people posting to some ones question that do NOT really help the person. Many people come here for help and ask a honest question and they get responses that are not helpful at all. Like I resently ask one about allowing waypoints to be logged a a diffcult multi. I had one person come back that he liked to figure out how to do multis with out hitting all the stages. Well on mine if you don't hit all the stages your NEVER solve the multi. So did he provinde any help to my posted question? The answer is NO!!! So why bother. I guess people just like to hear themselves talk. If it is a frivilious question, on intened by the poster to be so then yes your answer can be in kind, I do it if im really bored like answering this question.

cheers

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there's no question that this board is one of the most polite out there--5 minutes on most others will prove that. i have felt comfortable almost all of the time i've been lurking, except for a few times very lately. i wouldn't say there's a big problem or a definite trend forming. the very fact that an "oldbie" would suggest this conversation proves that a concern exists to keep this board friendly, clean, and helpful. however, i find it irritating when a newbie has a question or, as more often the case, suggestion that is shot down in a nasty diatribe about "we've already thought of this...we've discussed this a million times...you haven't been here long enought to shine my shoes...blah...blah...blah..." i've seen people who aren't even all that "oldbie" jump on those bandwagons, proving that the littl'uns will always chase piggy. there are a lot of newbies around here lately, myself included, who all want to contribute to the sport and care about its future progression. it's not a sin or crime that we haven't been caching since the stone age, only a few short years ago, and haven't been privy to every conversation that's ever floated around here. there will certainly be times when a newbie has an innocent suggestion or question that sounds ridiculous or harmful to those who've put more thought into the sport. remember, given the newness of this sport, this will always be the case. however, there's no reason why this should result in such a slamming that they don't want to come back. the conversation turns to all sides becoming defensive, and becomes more an exercise an arguement, or worse yet, philosophy, than true debate on the merits, or lack thereof, of a specific idea. you can say, "well, fine" to that, but what about the rest of us who just read that? there's no reason why some conversations become more of a spitting contest than anything else. we're all adults, and we're not really impressed at someone's post count or # of finds, we're impressed by someone who says, "good question/suggestion, newbie. we talked about that once and decided it might not be a good idea because..." no doubt there are good reasons why something wouldn't/shouldn't work, but we don't know them yet. no one needs their intelligence or motives questioned, it's just that when you're new and excited about something you roll it around in your head quite a bit, enjoying the novelty of it all, and naturally come up with ideas, questions, etc. there are a few oldbies around here who've lost my respect lately, knowledgable players who choose to play this game, yes, some people definitely forget it's a game, as if it were a death match to win every conversation. no matter how brave everyone says they truly are, we all know d*** well that it's easy to be a tough guy behind a computer screen. i don't believe that anyone would be as rude, harsh, and critical in person as they are on this board at times, and anyone who protests this should look real hard at the reasons why they feel the need to protest. most of us belong to regional geocaching groups, but why on earth would we consider attending an event, just to spend time with people who act like they invented air and water? i think that we need to consider how our conversations on "the big board" play down to our "little boards." there's not as much anonymity here as some people seen to think. it's extremely short-sighted to act like a smug two year-old who owns the ball, the bat, and the only glove here, but then turn around and try and be the nice guy at the geocaching picnic next summer. there are many boards to exorcise one's need to be a tough guy, and many of us use them and know the difference, i'd just like to see some people be reminded that this isn't one of them.

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"I think mostly it's a perceived problem. The people really feel intimidated before they even get here. They may be intimidated by the technology involved in this game. They may be intimidated by using a computer and internet forums. They may be intimidated by being a total stranger walking into a what appears to be a huge auditorium filled with 1000 people who all appear to be pals. "

 

uhhh, no.

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. And why do some feel they have to post first, and with "do a search". Over the last two months I have spent more time on Groundspeak than most, watching and searching for answers, some without success. For one I have found the Groundspeak “search” failing, two this site is huge, and three (and most important) even when I do find an answer I often don't understand.

I also think this type of a post is uncalled for, Noobs may not know about the search option, I have used this option and it does not work very well.

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I'd consider myself a newbie to this sport/forum but there are a few things that people should do to "protect" themselves when venturing into a new territory. Read the FAQs, read the Newbie guides, etc. I spent a couple of weeks reading this site before I ever posted anything or got a GPS. I knew what a "Markwell" in a thread meant before I was dealt one. I did searches on things that I knew I would need to know. People just don't help themselves at all and then they get hurt feelings when they ask a question that is covered by FAQs and "READ FIRST" threads. I moderate several forums and it happens no matter what the subject matter is.

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Interesting thread -- lot's of thoughts going back and forth.

 

Although I have stated my thoughts earlier, I was thinking on it and reading the posts and it occured to me that some of the challenges between old and new folks relates to game perception.

 

Folks that have been playing the game for a long time have definate ideas of what the game is all about and how it should be played. To newbies, the game is new and they are still looking for ways to "own" the experience for themselves. Anytime you have this influx of new ideas into a semi-established environment there will be some conflict of sorts. Even calling it semi-established is risking the ire of old timers I would guess.

 

Most of the serious flaming I have seen or experienced has fallen into two categories:

 

One - don't change the game

Two - misunderstanding of a persons thoughts/intent

 

The first category is when the suggestion of a new rule or behaviour is offered - old timers just don't like someone telling them to do something new. Many times that is justifiable because the topic has been discussed and tested. Sometimes it would be good to change. If we consider the game as a static object then change should not be tolerated, but if we think of the game as evolutionary, then we need new ideas to prevent it from becoming static.

 

Misunderstandings are more difficult. I have been accused of US-bashing (which is a farce if you knew me). I have had a single line from an entire thought quoted out of context (for example, if I were to preface the line "Maybe I don't get it, but <thought>" and the line "Maybe I don't get it" is pulled with the thought removed and a quick "yup" added.) I've even been accused of promoting a particular ethical or political viewpoint. Not something I plan on doing on a website dedicated to finding hidden objects for fun!

 

Was I? no. Was I percieved as doing the above? of course. Did it take us off-topic? very much.

 

As many have stated - misunderstandings are natural when we remove the non-verbal ques from communication - text-based communication created in the "moment" is particularly devoid of these non-verbal ques.

 

Solution? Well... that's hard. My view is that we are not going to get everyone to sign-up for a course in Informal Logic so that we can collectively recognize falicious arguments and trains of thought! We need to just learn who to ignore and whom to trust. Some "old timers" are a well of information, some old-timers are crusty old fools that are a source of scorn and ridicule.

 

As in most things with this game - rules aren't going to work, guidelines will be good and sometimes ignored, -- so the power is within the individual to decide whom to trust and whom to ignore. As people become "known" their credibility, or lack thereof, will become known. I haven't been here long and already have a few folks who I like reading posts from and a few that......well, you have to edit them for the good parts. Trickier are those on the margins - 90% good info, 10% venomous junk.

 

What I do recognize in all cases is a true passion for this game. It's great! To think that I can travel to any part of the world and go on a "meaningful walk" to an area that I might normally miss. I like the forums, I'm okay when I get called an idiot sometimes (especially when I have typed something idiotic), and ignore those that deserve it.

 

As a community, I also hope we can help new folks along. I have recieved more than one PM where an old timer has sent me a note "ignore X, they're just mean" or the like.

 

There is a saying "If you have nothing good to say, say nothing". I think it is important for old-timers to "choose their battles" and not simply repond for the sake of responding. If the topic has been discussed, I like a link to the thread - maybe my search keywords were not correct to return the thread where it was previously discussed.

Edited by Lemon Fresh Dog
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I'm a newbie. Heck, I'm still trying to figure out which GPS to buy! I found geocache.com from a Boy Scout web site. It interests me enough to know I want to try this.

 

The newbies like me will ask questions that the vets consider "dumb". Don't flame, just say "look here" with a link.

 

BTW, I spen the first 2 full days on this forum reading the "start here" section. There's still tons I don't understand, that's why I keep coming back.

 

Intimidated about posting? Nah. But I try to be more cautious in my posts.

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I'm a newbie. Heck, I'm still trying to figure out which GPS to buy! I found geocache.com from a Boy Scout web site. It interests me enough to know I want to try this.

 

The newbies like me will ask questions that the vets consider "dumb". Don't flame, just say "look here" with a link.

 

BTW, I spen the first 2 full days on this forum reading the "start here" section. There's still tons I don't understand, that's why I keep coming back.

 

Intimidated about posting? Nah. But I try to be more cautious in my posts.

More cautious? Why? If you have an honest question, go for it!

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More cautious? Why? If you have an honest question, go for it!

 

Wow! Thanks. I appreciate the encouragement. I should have clarified that "cautious" meant I at least try to do a search.

Sometimes the search doesn't come up with the info you need (I am notoriously bad at using the right search terms to find what I am looking for). It is one feature of the forums I wish I could improve. Either that, or I need to take an extension course at college on "Search Techniques". Sometimes I need to have things explained to me in different terms, as well. You can have 15 people sy the same thing, and one guy words it different, and *boom* the light comes on. This is what the Getting Started forum is for, and all these other wonderful areas Groundspeak lets us run around in. I know *I* need them.

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Since I'm still a tadpole I guess I qualify as a "newbie". The few times that I've posted I've been told that the topic has been discussed before. Usually with a link to that older thread which I found useful. However, I'm sure a lot of "Newbies" don't want to look foolish by asking questions that have already been asked. Let's be gentle with them as we were all "Tadpoles" once. :D

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My .02 cents for what it is worth. I haven’t figured out who is a moderator and who is a regular poster, but don’t feel like anyone has been unfair personally to me. The heated discussions between members are uncomfortable, and uncalled for, in my opinion. I find them intimidating and they don’t change any ones mind anyway. I hate it when I read someone saying something along the lines of “you haven’t done it long enough” or “haven’t found enough caches to make a comment in this thread, or "we have already talked about this" I love it when the few members, who are concerned for others feelings, tries to come to the rescue. I have spent the last month reading the forms very thoroughly as I wanted to learn everything I needed to know, from using the equipment and software to the lingo and protocol. I believe that after I have it figured out I will not be a part of the forms as I find them too rough for me.

 

2Tango

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I hate it when I read someone saying something along the lines of “you haven’t done it long enough” or “haven’t found enough caches to make a comment in this thread, or "we have already talked about this"

I'm curious, how should such a situation be handled?

If you feel the need to comment, post a link to the discussion in order to assist the person. I know I appreciate it.

 

If you feel they haven't played the game long enough, keep it to yourself. Although you may feel that more experience would be benficial to them, it does not really help them in any way to indicate that their stats aren't "good enough". You have no idea what other activities they participate in relating to orienteering or the outdoors.

 

(my opinion only needless to say)

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No seriously, how should the situation where a newbie is spouting off about things which he couldn't know because he simply doesn't have the experience. I really would like to the know.

 

I'm not talking about a question or a suggestion. I'm talking about "you should" or "we must" types of things that go contrary to what "the old timers" already know.

 

...and I'm asking anyone to let me know.

 

EDIT: LFD got in there between then and now... Anyone else?

Edited by CoyoteRed
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In many cases, “newbie” is a**umed even when it isn’t necessarily so. I opened a simple discussion in this forum and had cheap shots thrown my way because some chose to view me as a new player. I am not. There is a reason why I can’t post under my normal name outside the Off Topic area.

 

I’ve been around a lot longer than the poster who levied this cheap shot, and longer than the one who posted this "troll" comment too. :D

Edited by YouKnowMe
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Hmmm.. the words "MUST" and "SHOULD" get me a little worked-up because, as anyone reading my posts knows, very opposed to controlling others. (yes, I *know* you and I have exchanged *words* on a certain issue CR, but I still swear to God I wasn't proposing any controls over others)

 

I think the best course of action is to simply state:

 

"I disagree with your comments. The topic has been discussed <HERE> previously. Welcome to the game - enjoy playing!"

 

There is probably a pretty minimal risk that some new suggestion will be adopted to ruin the game. Especially suggestions that are asking for greater control or game modification.

 

I'm a big fan of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" for the game. New people are just excited. They see the potential and want to start working towards their utopian view of the game. Old timers can learn from them, but also educate them on the fact the the game is pretty good "as is". The challenge is to do so in a respectful way when inside you're going "oh lord, not again ... they want to tell me I have to buy one of THESE containers, hide it in one of THESE locations, and put 6 of THESE items in it"

Edited by Lemon Fresh Dog
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In many cases, “newbie” is a**umed even when it isn’t necessarily so. I opened a simple discussion in this forum and had cheap shots thrown my way because some chose to view me as a new player. I am not. There is a reason why I can’t post under my normal name outside the Off Topic area.

 

I’ve been around a lot longer than the poster who levied this cheap shot, and longer than the one who posted this "troll" comment too. :D

I thought we weren't being specific.

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(yes, I *know* you and I have exchanged *words* on a certain issue CR, but I still swear to God I wasn't proposing any controls over others)

Well, one is the fact the subject matter is contentious and has raged for a while.

 

Second, I wasn't refering to you about the "must" and "should" statement.

 

I'm reminded of an old joke about a group of guys that only knew a certain number of jokes and they had told them so often they numbered them. So, now joke telling around the campfire goes...

 

"27" HAHAHAHAH!!!

 

"3" Bwaahahaha!!!

 

"19" HEHEHEHEHEH!!!

 

Maybe, we need something like that, "The Ultimate Markwell," complete with copy-n-paste responses with links.

 

At least then when a newbie goes "but what if" then we know it's something new.

 

(I already did my project. Somebody else's turn.)

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In many cases, “newbie” is a**umed even when it isn’t necessarily so.  I opened a simple discussion in this forum and had cheap shots thrown my way because some chose to view me as a new player.  I am not.  There is a reason why I can’t post under my normal name outside the Off Topic area. 

 

I’ve been around a lot longer than the poster who levied this cheap shot, and longer than the one who posted this "troll" comment too. B)

I thought we weren't being specific.

I agree -- we shouldn't drag up the past. Mostly because I think I'll come out looking like a fool in many cases! :D

 

Being an old-timer doesn't give you any status in my opinion. Being intelligent, helpful, funny and respectful -- that's the stuff I like!

 

In fact, there is a fine line between experienced and knowledgable and being dead wood. If we use stats as a measure of quality, we risk the ability to learn from new folks. We also then open a can of worms - is a 200 cache 1/1 person more experienced to comment than a 20 cache 5/5 person that has been climbing/hiking/skiing/biking for 20 years? I, for one, won't go there.

 

So, how can new people get respect?

I have two rules: (Seems to be a theme lately)

 

First: I assume you are intelligent, respectful, concerned and have honourable motivation for being here.

 

Two: As you post and comment, you will either prove me right or wrong, so your first 20 or so posts are "free" in my opinion and if you make a statement that I think is not too smart, I will assume it is part of your learning process and that you are intelligent, concerned and have honourable intent.

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No seriously, how should the situation where a newbie is spouting off about things which he couldn't know because he simply doesn't have the experience.  I really would like to the know.

I don't know how well I would do or have done in the context of these forums.

 

But, I have read others who appear to do it gracefully, in spite of the apparent arrogance of the poster. They manage to come at it more like an understanding parent or teacher than a frustrated collegue.

 

I have seen polite references to previous threads that address the issue at hand and people's opinions on it. I have also read posts where an experienced cacher has just politely suggested that the newbee's views might change after they have done more caching or met more cachers in person, or whatever.

 

From experience with face-to-face and telephone customer service, my standard line used to be, first, second and third most important points . . . check you ego (get rid of it) before you walk into the fray.

 

After the ego is out of it, if you are the experience one, remember that you are the experiened one, and keep your ego out of it.

 

Finally, ask questions instead of making statements. As often as not, with the right questions being asked, the "missguided" person will figure it all out as if they did it on their own. And people generally seem to be more willing to accept ideas they come up with than ideas that are given to them by others.

 

Anyway, that's my two cents worth to a geocaching collegue that I respect, and that I that's riled my ego more than once (because, of course, he hadn't realized he was wrong). :D

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I've participated in other forums enough to know that each has its own "personality" or "culture," so I spent more than a week doing as much reading as I could to sort of get to know the lay of the land here. The division between the "Getting Started" and other topics is helpful. Those who don't have patience with newbies can certainly avoid most contact with them!

 

By the time I was ready to post, the "geostorms" had started, and voicing an opinion during any of that would have been intimidating (and admittedly sort of out of place for someone new.)

 

The only really intimidating thing for me is worrying that I'll be labeld a sockpuppet simply because I'm still a tadpole. :D

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I've participated in other forums enough to know that each has its own "personality" or "culture," so I spent more than a week doing as much reading as I could to sort of get to know the lay of the land here. The division between the "Getting Started" and other topics is helpful. Those who don't have patience with newbies can certainly avoid most contact with them!

 

By the time I was ready to post, the "geostorms" had started, and voicing an opinion during any of that would have been intimidating (and admittedly sort of out of place for someone new.)

 

The only really intimidating thing for me is worrying that I'll be labeld a sockpuppet simply because I'm still a tadpole. B)

Hrm... methinks thou doth protest too much! :D Just kidding...

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Lets keep this thread on topic, its not about where long lost cachers are.

 

Thanks

I would have to easily say that this is part of the reason people feel uncomfortable posting. Somebody says one thing that is relevant and someone replies with something that's half relevent, then a mod comes running in yelling because - heaven forbid - we might get off topic. That then translates into posts where people say something and then the next reply is someone cracking about "oh no, you're OT, where's a mod?" or "In before the close" or whatever because of mod actions.

That in turn makes people uncomfortable because they feel that they can't openly post without the threat of being moderated.

 

Do I think veteran posters make new posters feel unwanted here? Yeah, actually I do.

Someone comes in and asks a question and before you know it, there's not only a reference to a dead horse but a graphic to go along with it. And yet, it's only when something doesn't suit you. Why not just be helpful and answer someone's question? Although, by jove, that 200 monkey post gets re-posted about once a month around here and nobody dead horses that. The difference? 1 wet monkey, 2 frozen monkeys, and 197 charred monkeys humor you where the 400th incarnation of a post about what you carry in your pack bores you to tears.

 

There's also the belief that some people have that just because you have 25 finds means you're a moron. There aren't even 400 cachers in the 1k club, but for some reason, if you don't have lots and lots of finds, you're stupid and could never contribute anything useful to a discussion in here.

 

As for the spelling thing, yeah, it does sometimes make you look ignorant when half of the words you type are misspelled or when you post a huge paragraph without any punctuation. But, hey... Even Albert Einstein was thought to be retarded at some point in his life. Let's just put forth a darn good effort to make sure that what we post is readable.

 

We bash people for the type of cache they have, we bash people for as many finds as they have, etc... And it's on both ends of the spectrum.. CCCooper gets bashed for having so many and then newbies get bashed for having so few. Someone doesn't like micros, but someone doesn't like multis, but if you look at their stats, they're not hiding any that combat the problem. We like good swag, but we don't trade up.

 

Interestingly enough, if we met a cacher on the trail, we wouldn't have a button to check his/her stats right away and we wouldn't assume the person was a moron. Lets not do it in these forums, and lets be welcoming and accepting to everyone that's around here.

 

Eye halve a spelling checker

It came with my pea sea

It plainly marks four my revue

Miss steaks eye kin knot sea.

 

Eye striks a key and type a word

And weight four it two say

Weather eye am wrong oar write

It shows me a strait a weigh.

 

As soon as a mist ache is maid

It nose bee fore two long

And eye can put the error rite

Its rare lea ever wrong.

 

Eye have run this poem threw it

I am shore your pleased two no

Its letter perfect awl the weigh

My checker tolled me sew.

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If I may interject, perhaps some parts of the discussion could best be handled via Private Messages or emails.

I do that alot.

It's amazing how happy a new cacher is when you send them a message privately and explain what the issue is.

 

Someone came in the forums one day complaining about something a new cacher was doing, so I sent the cacher an email and explained that someone had said something, which was why I was contacting them, and then explained what the norm was for their issue. They were very happy to have a level headed, helpful email, and I got a very nice response back.

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I think mostly it's a perceived problem. The people really feel intimidated before they even get here. They may be intimidated by the technology involved in this game. They may be intimidated by using a computer and internet forums. They may be intimidated by being a total stranger walking into a what appears to be a huge auditorium filled with 1000 people who all appear to be pals.

It's like starting your first job, and doing it in a new state. You don't know your way around, you don't have any friends, and you don't know what to expect. You are going in without any type of safety net. Some people are going to be intimidated by all that, no matter who is doing the posting, as the quoted post above shows. I don't know how to make these people feel any better to start. I wish I could. If they stick it out, they usually settle in and learn their way around and become part of the community.

 

Mopar that was a very nice post and I think it kinda puts it in a nutshell.

 

I've seen many great thoughts in here. It's nice to see some people that rarely post giving their thoughts. One of the analogies I saw used was when some one asked an age old question and it was followed by someone posting a pic of beating a dead horse. If that had happened to me the first time I posted...I would have went and crawled under a rock out of embarassment!

 

El Diablo

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Well, one is the fact the subject matter is contentious and has raged for a while.

 

Second, I wasn't refering to you about the "must" and "should" statement.

 

I agree. I promise we will never discuss the topic again (haha)

 

I didn't think you were referring to myself specifically, but I like to think that I can relate to what you are saying in your post.

 

You've been here awhile, you have a lot of finds -- caching seems to be a really big part of your life. If I was you and someone (anyone) came along and started saying "hey there, you MUST now do what I say..." -- I'd find it pretty hard to be gracious in my reponse!

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GixxerUT took a pretty good ribbing when he opened a discussion on the term "Muggle." He doesn't seem to have been intimidated at all.

 

I think it's perfectly OK to apply different standards of treatment to

 

(1) Newbies seeking information, and

(2) Newbies starting or wading into spirited discussions of Geocaching policy, conventions, lore, terminology, etc.

 

In the 2nd case, it's not an attack to point out that someone's newness may be driving his opinion. This doesn't justify personal attacks, but it doesn't call for kid gloves, either. I'm supporting CR in this, though I'm intimidated by his bluntness :D

 

Someone brought up bullying earlier in this thread--it's a fallacy to think that only the regular posters are capable of bullying. An opinionated newbie may be a bully who's new to this particular schoolyard. Several of us here were recently labeled "brain donors" by one such.

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I've only recently started posting here, but I have been posting in different formats for years and years... USENET and before that BBS's. Eventually you just learn that some half the people who come across as jerks didn't really mean it that way and the other half I feel sorry for if they are taking some ASCII text from some invisible person that they don't even know so seriously.

 

I learn a lot in forums and find them beneficial for just about everything in life (how sad is that?)... from learning how to drain my waterheater to gapping the spark plugs on my jetski, etc.

 

Besides, I've spent some time posting on religious forums and if you can take the brunt of some of those folks you can pretty much handle anything. :D

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In many cases, “newbie” is a**umed even when it isn’t necessarily so.  I opened a simple discussion in this forum and had cheap shots thrown my way because some chose to view me as a new player.  I am not.  There is a reason why I can’t post under my normal name outside the Off Topic area. 

 

I’ve been around a lot longer than the poster who levied this cheap shot, and longer than the one who posted this "troll" comment too. B)

I thought we weren't being specific.

Especially when using a sock puppet account. :D

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GixxerUT took a pretty good ribbing when he opened a discussion on the term "Muggle." He doesn't seem to have been intimidated at all.

 

I think it's perfectly OK to apply different standards of treatment to

 

(1) Newbies seeking information, and

(2) Newbies starting or wading into spirited discussions of Geocaching policy, conventions, lore, terminology, etc.

 

In the 2nd case, it's not an attack to point out that someone's newness may be driving his opinion. This doesn't justify personal attacks, but it doesn't call for kid gloves, either. I'm supporting CR in this, though I'm intimidated by his bluntness :D

 

Someone brought up bullying earlier in this thread--it's a fallacy to think that only the regular posters are capable of bullying. An opinionated newbie may be a bully who's new to this particular schoolyard. Several of us here were recently labeled "brain donors" by one such.

different standards.......yeah

 

I have read lots of great posts here.

I chose to post that thread in the general discussion, rather than the Getting Started for a good reason; I figured coming into this (after lurking first) that 'veterans' can take their shots in the general discussions. And I was willing to take the shots.

Maybe thin skinned people that get rattled outside the Getting Started forum deserve to be weeded out......cuz isn't the general forum mostly FOR the sake of the veterans?

Cuz really, geocaching can occur exclusively without forum discussion or involvement.

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I'm just curious how many other people feel intimidated by the forums regular posters?

 

I was told that this paticular person wouldn't post because they were afraid of being ridiculed by regular posters such as my self.

Not intimidated but annoyed to the point of avoiding the forums, especially the general discussions. There are too many off-topic, ranting and self-indulgent postings. Forums lose much of their attraction when regulars start treating them like chat rooms. Granted, the tone is not as hostile as some enthusiasts' forums but it's bad enough to repel many potential contributors. Some restraint by the regulars wouldn't hurt.

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