Ghostcaching?

January 1, 2005

While window-shopping the new GPS units at a local store, I fell into conversation with a young lady who was also checking them out. The conversation turned to Geocaching and she told me she was a Ghost-Cacher.

According to her, Ghost-Caching has been around almost as long as Geo-caching itself, and this is what she told me about it. {She was only passing through Reno and didn't say where she actually lived, so she didn't mind telling me about her Ghost-caching, she said}

I'll call her Ruth. Ruth said the first thing a Ghost-Cacher needs is a member in good standing in the Geo-caching community. This member gets all the new Hides and MO posts, and immediately passes them on to his 'clan'.

Ghosters have two goals: First, to beat the other members of their clan to the cache, and, even better, to beat Non-Ghosters. Ghosters, if they signed the logs, [which they don't] would put; Took Nothing, Left Nothing, Didn't Sign Log. They take only photos and pride themselves on leaving the cache exactly as they found it. And they take GREAT pleasure in pretending to be Muggles when the Non Ghosters arrive. If they can email the clan with "RFTF" {Real First To Find}for a cache, they consider it a Gold Star Day.

Ruth was starting to talk about how 'clans' are built, but she had to leave so this is all I know about it.

Are Ghost-Cachers a known part of GeoCaching? I looked but couldn't find any reference to them anywhere here.. How does "Management" feel about them? Assuming the lady wasn't just pulling my leg about GhostCaching, does their style of GeoCaching effect 'our' style at all?

Rat

January 1, 2005

Well, there you go. You HAD to say something didn't you? You hear that? That's black helicopters. Oh, right, you can't hear them in "whisper mode." Better grab your bug out bag and get out, get out NOW!

Ruuuunn!!!!

3.9k · January 1, 2005

First I've ever heard about it.

El Diablo

9.4k · January 1, 2005

I'm too apathetic to pull out the indifference meter.

Edited January 1, 2005 by Jeremy

2.6k · January 1, 2005

The first rule of Ghosters is, you never talk about Ghosters.

The second rule about Ghosters is you never talk about Ghosters.

24.7k · January 1, 2005

...Assuming the lady wasn't just pulling my leg about GhostCaching, does their style of GeoCaching effect 'our' style at all?

Rat

They are known, and have various levels.

Some are merely 'off the grid' and sign the physical log but have no online presence. These tyeps can run 40-50%.

Some well...we know they exist but really, you only find then when you bust them finding the cache or coming out from a hike that is from a cache and then there is no record of the visit.

I call them parasites. They rely on the good will of everyone else to play the game. If everyone was a ghost cacher then geoaching would not exist because why bother placing a cache? Some people like to think they do it to give back, but if you never get any feedback at all, and nobody ever found your cache...then you don't even know you are giving back. Me, I place caches for the logs, the logs tell me of someone had a good time, or not. If I never knew then I'd certainly not place caches.

Another form of ghost cacher is cache maggot. They find and steal the cache. One step worse than a parasite.

Edited January 1, 2005 by Renegade Knight

3.8k · January 1, 2005

My alter ego is the world leader in Ghost Caching, I have not signed the log, took nothing and left nothing in 134637 caches worldwide, I'm so good at it that you can never tell that I was there.

2.3k · January 1, 2005

Another form of ghost cacher is cache maggot. They find and steal the cache. One step worse than a parasite.

There are some caches out there you wish would get stolen and tossed into the nearest dumpster...

January 1, 2005

I have never heard of ghost cachers as an organized group. Certainly it stands to reason that there are those who will seek a cache and not bother to sign the log or report the find on the website, but as far as those folks actually organizing and taking pride in not signing the logbook or not logging the find on the site that is news to me.

I can't fathom why anyone would wish to do that as a point of principle. Laziness or apathy? Sure, but to organize it just seems odd.

I don't really care that people do it, I just can't wrap my brain around why anyone would want to form a group that specializes in it. It kind of seems to me like a rebel without a cause.

9.4k · January 1, 2005

It kind of seems to me like a rebel without a cause.

There's no need to label a group as rebels without a cause. I'm not really interested in it but hey, no harm no foul.

January 1, 2005

I see ghost cachers.

Seriously, not logging online is selfish. If you're going to play, have the courtesy to provide the cache placer with some return on his or her investment.

January 1, 2005

Geocachers refer to these people as "crackpots."

January 1, 2005

I see ghost cachers.

Seriously, not logging online is selfish. If you're going to play, have the courtesy to provide the cache placer with some return on his or her investment.

I guess around where I live, there must be quite a few "ghost cachers". The caches around here (mine included) have a lot more logs in the logbook than the on-line log.

While the owner won't know it if they rely only on the on-line log, they could be pleasantly surprised when they do cache maintenance.

January 1, 2005

It kind of seems to me like a rebel without a cause.

There's no need to label a group as rebels without a cause. I'm not really interested in it but hey, no harm no foul.

How about 'rebel without a clue' then?

((hee hee hee - they will never guess that I am really the leader of this group which prefers to remain secret. I suppose we will rise to the publics attention when we have a trial and punishment session and beat 'Ruth' with a damp log book but that will soon die down again.....))

January 1, 2005

It kind of seems to me like a rebel without a cause.

There's no need to label a group as rebels without a cause. I'm not really interested in it but hey, no harm no foul.

I didn't label anyone as anything.

January 1, 2005

they could be pleasantly surprised when they do cache maintenance.

No, I would find it annoying. I like the email, and it also alerts me to the condition of the cache, as well as how frequently I should make maintenance visits. Secondly, I usually check the finder's profiles, simply to see who visited my efforts. I get a warm fuzzy seeing names I know, people from far away, noobs just getting started due to my help, experienced cachers providing feedback... that's the payback of placing a cache. Since I live in a rural area, these visits are fairly far and few between, so the payback is even more appreciated.

Ghost cachers don't allow me any of the above. If it's a philosophical point to the ghost cacher to not accumulate numbers, I think that's fine, but log a note instead of a smilie. They should have the courtesy to acknowlege someone's efforts that gave them the opportunity to find a cache.

As Wilfred Brimley says. "It's the right thing to do."

2k · January 2, 2005

Interesting. As a cache owner I would prefer to know if someone visited one of my caches, but that's okay -- play the game, have fun. I agree it would be a problem if everyone did this.

1.8k · January 2, 2005

Don't guess anybody's hurtin' anything.

So, tell me, what was Ruth wearing up under the sheet?

January 2, 2005

did some googling, but couldn't find any mention of ghost caching. Lots of results for caches associated with ghost towns, but no ghost cachers.

I still don't understand why someone would organize a website to log finds that they didn't log. It just seems like it defeats the purpose of not logging.

2.6k · January 2, 2005

did some googling, but couldn't find any mention of ghost caching. Lots of results for caches associated with ghost towns, but no ghost cachers.

I still don't understand why someone would organize a website to log finds that they didn't log. It just seems like it defeats the purpose of not logging.

The OP said she emailed the CLAN. There was no mention of a web site. Just email bragging.

January 2, 2005

Well, I probably didn't say it right. As I understood her, they didn't organize a website. They keep in contact by e-mail.

I was more interested in IF they actually existed than I was in the minor details, but 'Ruth' said the Clans were maybe four or five people, and there might be three or four clans in a city the size of Reno. The "Insider Member" would email the MO and Newest Hides to all of them at the same time and they would compete on both a clan and an individual basis to find them first. Proof of the find would be a photo.

I would think having Ghoster clans would make perfect sense. I mean, if they can't [or don't] share a find with the Regular Cachers, who else could they share it with? I can't imagine how such a number of Ghosters could be organized without giving it all away, but apparently they can. Hmmm... maybe they were all family first, and then spread out to include other friends.

So.. if the first rule of Ghosters is...you don't talk about ghosters, maybe that rule shouldn't have been written in vanishing ink in the bylaws..? But that would be talking about... Hmmm...

Rat

January 2, 2005

The OP said she emailed the CLAN. There was no mention of a web site. Just email bragging.

ah, OK, a private competition then. I can understand that.

2.6k · January 2, 2005

So.. if the first rule of Ghosters is...you don't talk about ghosters, maybe that rule shouldn't have been written in vanishing ink in the bylaws..? But that would be talking about... Hmmm...

Rat

3.8k · January 2, 2005

Who ya gonna call?

Myself, I don't believe in ghosts.

2k · January 2, 2005

I have heard of something "sort of" like this come to think of it. That would be groups that pre-post their caches to a "clan" so that the cache can be searched prior to it becoming part of the geocaching.com site.

Sort of a "I placed a cache HERE, go see it, don't sign the book, take a photo and watch people visit it when it gets approved on teh site." A little different from what you described, but with some similarities. I don't much care for that -- I prefer the FTF to be the REAL FTF.

2.5k · January 2, 2005

At first I thought you meant something like this, but I can see now that I was mistaken.

1.8k · January 2, 2005

Let's see... You place a box of stuff out there in the world for anyone to find. You post the information on a website that can be viewed by anyone in the world with an internet connection.

Gasp! So that means...There might actually be OTHER people who go and LOOK for the cache? The horror? :unsure:

Hmmm...Why do I suddenly not care about ghost-caching? :rolleyes:

January 2, 2005

Our best guess would be that Ghost Cachers are like Lurkers. Or mayhaps they're a group of disgruntled cachers who forwhatever reasons are now ignored by the rest of their local Caching Community, so they went and formed themselves a little pity-party underground group of sorts in order to get the jump on their former comrades who STILL no longer really give a hoot about them!

7.2k · January 2, 2005

Maybe they like the "underground feeling" of it, like the feeling geocaching used have. Maybe they like the feeling of "being in the know" even over other cachers, just like some cachers do with muggles. (Would that make us "ghost-muggles?")

Personally, I see no harm in it (if this person wasn't pulling RR's leg.)

Come to think of it. We might have run in to a ghost cacher real early in our involvement in the hobby. We were signing in a short distance from the hidding spot in a fairly open park. Parking was within 50'. Joggers passing by. Heavy traffic. You had to time the grab. A young man rode up on his motorcycle and parked. He got off and appeared to start looking for the cache. We finshed signing in shortly and approached him, because there was no way we could return the cache without him seeing and it wouldn't be right to just let him look for a cache that was not there--it was in our hands.

He called himself "Magic Dingo" which was similar to an active cacher "Johnny Dingo." We hadn't seen his logs, but we were new ourselves and didn't think much of it.

However, we never have seen a log by "Magic Dingo." There is no "Magic Dingo" listed on this site. We've met "Johnny Dingo" and know this is not the same person.

Ghost-cacher, someone who didn't stick with it long enough to even sign up, or he decided on a different name?

Makes you wonder.

January 2, 2005

Until this site becomes "members only", you will have this type of activity going on. Like it or not! :rolleyes:

2.6k · January 2, 2005

Our best guess would be that Ghost Cachers are like Lurkers. Or mayhaps they're a group of disgruntled cachers who forwhatever reasons are now ignored by the rest of their local Caching Community, so they went and formed themselves a little pity-party underground group of sorts in order to get the jump on their former comrades who STILL no longer really give a hoot about them!

WoW! The OP didn't mention any ulterior motives on the Ghosters part. Ghosters sound like an innocent side activity that in no way effects any other cacher in any way.

I don't think outrageous assumptions are necessary.

January 2, 2005

For what it's worth, 'Ruth' didn't seem to think this was anything except another way to play the game. My impression was she considered herself as part of the geo-caching world...just playing under different guidelines.

Rat

3.8k · January 2, 2005

Ruth?

3.8k · January 2, 2005

She probably thinks it's just a silly game. :rolleyes: :unsure:

24.7k · January 2, 2005

For what it's worth, 'Ruth' didn't seem to think this was anything except another way to play the game. My impression was she considered herself as part of the geo-caching world...just playing under different guidelines.

Rat

In the greater scheme of things ghost cachers don't matter because there are enough non ghost cachers to keep the hobby viable. However if all there was, was ghost cachers and the only evidence you ever saw your cache was being visited was the social trail, and a few distured blades of grass... It would not be long before you as a cache owenr realized that you were not having any fun anymore and that would be that.

I don't confuse those who sign logs and say thanks with the ones who don't. I know which ones keep the hobby viable.

January 2, 2005

The first rule of Ghosters is, you never talk about Ghosters.
The second rule about Ghosters is you never talk about Ghosters.

And if it's your first night ghost caching, you HAVE TO FIGHT!

January 2, 2005

Ok, I guess it's time to wrap this topic up. My question was more than answered...ghosters DO exist [even though the first rule is to NOT mention them, we have to mention them in order to SAY 'we don't mention them'] but how many may exist is unknown and probably not overly important. It's possible one member, Coyote Red, even met one. If that's so, at least it seems Geocachers have nothing to fear from them should further encounters occur.

Most 'regular' cachers would prefer Finders acknowledge the efforts of Hiders, and for that reason frown on Ghosters. But no one seems to find any real threat or problem with Ghosters, who do seem to abide by their rule of not disturbing caches.

I do find it a little odd that no one commented on the 'Member in good standing' who is vital to the Ghosters, and who must be a little two-faced. But then... what can be said?

Thank all of you for your comments! As far as I'm concerned --unless someone has a comment that just has to be posted -- I personally consider this topic closed.

Rat

3.8k · January 2, 2005

"member in good standing"=Ruth? :rolleyes:

January 2, 2005

Septic tank, did you read the original post?

Rat

January 4, 2005

Last night somebody broke into my apartment and replaced everything with exact duplicates

2k · January 4, 2005

Ok, I guess it's time to wrap this topic up. My question was more than answered...ghosters DO exist [even though the first rule is to NOT mention them, we have to mention them in order to SAY 'we don't mention them'] but how many may exist is unknown and probably not overly important. It's possible one member, Coyote Red, even met one. If that's so, at least it seems Geocachers have nothing to fear from them should further encounters occur.
Most 'regular' cachers would prefer Finders acknowledge the efforts of Hiders, and for that reason frown on Ghosters. But no one seems to find any real threat or problem with Ghosters, who do seem to abide by their rule of not disturbing caches.

I do find it a little odd that no one commented on the 'Member in good standing' who is vital to the Ghosters, and who must be a little two-faced. But then... what can be said?

Thank all of you for your comments! As far as I'm concerned --unless someone has a comment that just has to be posted -- I personally consider this topic closed.

Rat

Check out these two clans

GBESgeocachers

Nevada Geocaching Assoc.

Some pretty nice folks in both outfits.

And by the way welcome to geocaching, there are a ton of caches you can still get to in Sparks and Reno, despite the snow.

January 4, 2005

there are a ton of caches you can still get to in Sparks and Reno, despite the snow.

Really?? There's a virtual only three blocks from me, and I walked down to it, but the physical was way out in avalanche-land...

Thanks for the {OT} welcome! I ride bikes a lot, was hoping to ride to my first find.

Will probably run into you one day.... or meet for a cuppa..?

Rat

January 4, 2005

Sorry.. I realize this is OT, but I can't ask it anywhere else and I promise it's my last post in this thread.

Rusty, I've pondered it and looked at all the local listed sites, but... which ones do you think can be found thru 30+ inches of snow?? lol. You can email me with the 'list' if you want to avoid OT posting..

Thanks!

Rat

1.1k · January 4, 2005

Although it isn't what Ulmar had in mind it is just another way to play the game. So what is wrong with it. I mwan MICROS are not in the real spirit of the orgional game nor virtuals etc.... But is another way to play the game. To TNLNSL is not the orgiaonl game so homwny people do that????? O'well it is only a game play it the way you see fit as long as it does not ruin it for others.

cheers

6.5k · January 4, 2005

Ghosters have two goals: First, to beat the other members of their clan to the cache, and, even better, to beat Non-Ghosters. Ghosters, if they signed the logs, [which they don't] would put; Took Nothing, Left Nothing, Didn't Sign Log. They take only photos and pride themselves on leaving the cache exactly as they found it. And they take GREAT pleasure in pretending to be Muggles when the Non Ghosters arrive. If they can email the clan with "RFTF" {Real First To Find}for a cache, they consider it a Gold Star Day.

I too have never heard of this activity, but it seems like another harmless sect.

The only negative is that these folks, unless they have a gc.com alter ego will never hide a cache and "give anything back" to the game this way.

I do wonder how the ghosties log DNF's since they don't even log their finds.

January 4, 2005

I do wonder how the ghosties log DNF's since they don't even log their finds.

Maybe they are ghostposting their DNF's on ghostcaching.com? :lol:

I noticed the domain ghostcaching.com is up for grabs, so maybe the TPTB should register the domain, just in case?

January 5, 2005

Oh my gawrsh, next we'll be discussing how ghostcachers arrive unseen at new caches by black helicopters in "whisper mode" !

January 5, 2005

While window-shopping the new GPS units at a local store, I fell into conversation with a young lady who was also checking them out. The conversation turned to Geocaching and she told me she was a Ghost-Cacher.
According to her, Ghost-Caching has been around almost as long as Geo-caching itself, and this is what she told me about it. {She was only passing through Reno and didn't say where she actually lived, so she didn't mind telling me about her Ghost-caching, she said}

I'll call her Ruth. Ruth said the first thing a Ghost-Cacher needs is a member in good standing in the Geo-caching community. This member gets all the new Hides and MO posts, and immediately passes them on to his 'clan'.

Ghosters have two goals: First, to beat the other members of their clan to the cache, and, even better, to beat Non-Ghosters. Ghosters, if they signed the logs, [which they don't] would put; Took Nothing, Left Nothing, Didn't Sign Log. They take only photos and pride themselves on leaving the cache exactly as they found it. And they take GREAT pleasure in pretending to be Muggles when the Non Ghosters arrive. If they can email the clan with "RFTF" {Real First To Find}for a cache, they consider it a Gold Star Day.

Ruth was starting to talk about how 'clans' are built, but she had to leave so this is all I know about it.

Are Ghost-Cachers a known part of GeoCaching? I looked but couldn't find any reference to them anywhere here.. How does "Management" feel about them? Assuming the lady wasn't just pulling my leg about GhostCaching, does their style of GeoCaching effect 'our' style at all?

Rat

How many legs do you got. Not to offend you but do you think she was real?

24.7k · January 5, 2005

I do wonder how the ghosties log DNF's since they don't even log their finds.

Maybe they are ghostposting their DNF's on ghostcaching.com?

I noticed the domain ghostcaching.com is up for grabs, so maybe the TPTB should register the domain, just in case?

Um...it's probably taken by ghost cachers but how would we know?

Ghostcaching?

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