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Early Summer Hike


slinger91
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Sounds like it would be a 2-nighter for me.  :D

 

I'd love to make time for this. I'll keep an eye open for this later on down the road.

Heck more like a three nighter for all of us. I'd say 4 nights to be safe. hauling a big pack is a lot different and slower than a day pack. I've done 10 miles in a day wiht a big pack, but the next day I want to relax. :-) I figuring depending on the terrain, 8 miles a day should be reasonable, but one could push it a couple of those days up to 10-12 miles if needed.

Edited by evergreenhiker!
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I would love to join you - but I have very few dates that would work this summer. So I'll keep my eyes peeled on this converstation and see if anything works out.

 

How about an extreme lightweight running effort of one night? I also know from experience that it is very rugged, but I am talking an EXTREME run! Okay, maybe 2 nights... I've hiked 17 miles nearby here in an afternoon (okay, like 1-10pm) with a large pack. So high mileage is possible.

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That option sounds interesting. How many miles one way?

Drawing a very crude route on Topo! makes it out to be about 37 miles. Add at least 10%. So, 40 miles give or take. It looks like it would be "easier" to go from Slate to Billy Goat elevation wise.

The cache is only 14 miles from Hwy 3 in Canada, as the crow flies. I don't have access to Canadian topo maps, but there appears to be a fairly level trail just West of the Pasayten river, which leads from Canada into the US. I don't know what the part until the border is like, but from the border, it's 2 miles along the river, almost without any elevation gain, to the river crossing approximately at N48° 58.39' W120° 34.24', at an elevation of 3900 feet. From there, the trail up to the cache along the Ptarmigan ridge is just another 6 miles or so.

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That option sounds interesting. How many miles one way?

Drawing a very crude route on Topo! makes it out to be about 37 miles. Add at least 10%. So, 40 miles give or take. It looks like it would be "easier" to go from Slate to Billy Goat elevation wise.

The cache is only 14 miles from Hwy 3 in Canada, as the crow flies. I don't have access to Canadian topo maps, but there appears to be a fairly level trail just West of the Pasayten river, which leads from Canada into the US. I don't know what the part until the border is like, but from the border, it's 2 miles along the river, almost without any elevation gain, to the river crossing approximately at N48° 58.39' W120° 34.24', at an elevation of 3900 feet. From there, the trail up to the cache along the Ptarmigan ridge is just another 6 miles or so.

Since 9-11, it's been nearly impossible to get clearance to cross the border at these wilderness trails. One could end up with a fabulous vacation in a sun-drenched cell at Get-Mo.

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That option sounds interesting. How many miles one way?

Drawing a very crude route on Topo! makes it out to be about 37 miles. Add at least 10%. So, 40 miles give or take. It looks like it would be "easier" to go from Slate to Billy Goat elevation wise.

The cache is only 14 miles from Hwy 3 in Canada, as the crow flies. I don't have access to Canadian topo maps, but there appears to be a fairly level trail just West of the Pasayten river, which leads from Canada into the US. I don't know what the part until the border is like, but from the border, it's 2 miles along the river, almost without any elevation gain, to the river crossing approximately at N48° 58.39' W120° 34.24', at an elevation of 3900 feet. From there, the trail up to the cache along the Ptarmigan ridge is just another 6 miles or so.

Since 9-11, it's been nearly impossible to get clearance to cross the border at these wilderness trails. One could end up with a fabulous vacation in a sun-drenched cell at Get-Mo.

You mean you need advance clearance for that, which can be granted or denied? I'd never have guessed that. Thanks for telling me, I have crossed borders like that all my life (albeit never the US border, yet).

 

Do people really get arrested for that? Are the Canadians as bureaucratic about that as well?

 

I might have told this story before... Many years ago, I climbed Mt. Rysy (on the Polish-Czechoslovak border) from the Polish side, and there were quite a few people at the summit. I asked one of the guys about the distance to the next cabin on the Slovak side, and he told me, but also said I wasn't supposed to, if I had come up from Poland. I continued to chat with him about other things. When I started going down on the Slovak side, he pulled out his badge and said he would have to arrest me if I wasn't going back. We were way out in the Middle of nowhere, and going back would have messed up the entire itinerary of my trek, so I told him I wasn't going back. Fine he said, and told me to follow him. So we hiked down the trail until we got to the cabin, had some soup, had some tea, had some rum, and some great political conversations. I ended up hiking with a qualified mountain guide for three days in rugged terrain, and generally had great a great time, until he let me go.

 

I don't suppose US border patrol people would be that much fun :-)

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Interesting! Nope...haven't heard that story before.

I was also hiking in Syria once, not too far from the Lebanese border, with a big backpack. A local farmer asked me what I was smuggling. Nothing, I said, just walking and enjoying your beautiful country. Ah, so you must be a spy, he said, and continued working. Had me worried for a while...

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You mean you need advance clearance for that, which can be granted or denied? I'd never have guessed that. Thanks for telling me, I have crossed borders like that all my life (albeit never the US border, yet).

 

Do people really get arrested for that? Are the Canadians as bureaucratic about that as well?

 

Yes, they are. My brother, sister-in-law, another friend and I were in the San Juan Islands doing some SCUBA diving many years ago. On one trip we strayed (or my stupid brother took us into) Canadian waters and proceeded to go to a nice little island with a bunch of other boats on the beach. As soon as our hull touched the beach a Canadian Customs person told us that unless we produced a certain sum of money to cover our fine, we would be arrested (or something to that effect). Luckily, pooling our money we had enough.

 

ANYTIME you cross the border you are suppposed to check in with Customs FIRST. So, if you are hiking, I'd definitely contact them before the trip and get the appropriate paperwork, or you might end up in a LOT of trouble.

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You mean you need advance clearance for that, which can be granted or denied? I'd never have guessed that. Thanks for telling me, I have crossed borders like that all my life (albeit never the US border, yet).

 

Do people really get arrested for that? Are the Canadians as bureaucratic about that as well?

 

Yes, they are. My brother, sister-in-law, another friend and I were in the San Juan Islands doing some SCUBA diving many years ago. On one trip we strayed (or my stupid brother took us into) Canadian waters and proceeded to go to a nice little island with a bunch of other boats on the beach. As soon as our hull touched the beach a Canadian Customs person told us that unless we produced a certain sum of money to cover our fine, we would be arrested (or something to that effect). Luckily, pooling our money we had enough.

 

ANYTIME you cross the border you are suppposed to check in with Customs FIRST. So, if you are hiking, I'd definitely contact them before the trip and get the appropriate paperwork, or you might end up in a LOT of trouble.

OK - thanks for the warning!

 

So - in order to hike from Hwy 3 to this cache, who do I contact? Can I just go to the customs office at my local little marina and arrange permission to drive to Canada and walk back into the US? And then, which Canadian authorities do I need to ask to allow me to walk back into Canada?

 

And anyway, if you're a US citizen or resident, you're per definition legal in the US, aren't you? In that case, the problem is only for your hike back into Canada, but if your passport was stamped into Canada when you drove in, and it was never stamped out because you never left Canada at an official crossing, you'll be legal at the Canadian sde of the border as well, or won't you?

 

And assuming your crossing IS illegal anyway, what's the illegal part about it? Is it illegal entry? Or Illegal exit? Whose laws are violated, only those of the country one walks into, or both? And in the latter case, if someone's coming from Hwy 3 in Canada and walking towards the US border, is it legal for him to walk all the way to the border, if he is not crossing it? And then, if he crosses it anyhow, does a Canadian border guard have jurisdiction to chase a hiker into US territory and bring him back?

 

These are very hypothetical questions, of course, but my point is that it appears silly to me that once you already have permission to legally *BE* in either country, you would still not be allowed to cross the border at the time and location of your choosing.

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I did a quick check online and could not find anything about crossing into the US, but apparently Canada has something called a "Remote Border Crossing" permit that one can obtain in advance for a $30 fee.

 

EDIT: Upon further review, the program has been suspended for all crossings except for a few in the Ontario area.

Edited by Right Wing Wacko
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I put together some maps and information to help with visualizing and planning this outing. You can click any of the images below to see a full-sized version.

 

I picked the trails that looked like the most logical routes from the two mentioned trailheads to the cache, but there are other options as well. The track as I laid it out came out to 40.43 miles, with the Butte of a View cache located almost exactly at the halfway point.

 

Map:

Butte_of_a_View_s.jpg

 

Elevation Profile:

Profile_s.jpg

 

3D Image:

Butte_of_a_View_3D_s.jpg

 

GPX file of track and waypoints

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You mean you need advance clearance for that, which can be granted or denied? I'd never have guessed that. Thanks for telling me, I have crossed borders like that all my life (albeit never the US border, yet).

 

Do people really get arrested for that? Are the Canadians as bureaucratic about that as well?

 

Yes, they are. My brother, sister-in-law, another friend and I were in the San Juan Islands doing some SCUBA diving many years ago. On one trip we strayed (or my stupid brother took us into) Canadian waters and proceeded to go to a nice little island with a bunch of other boats on the beach. As soon as our hull touched the beach a Canadian Customs person told us that unless we produced a certain sum of money to cover our fine, we would be arrested (or something to that effect). Luckily, pooling our money we had enough.

 

ANYTIME you cross the border you are suppposed to check in with Customs FIRST. So, if you are hiking, I'd definitely contact them before the trip and get the appropriate paperwork, or you might end up in a LOT of trouble.

OK - thanks for the warning!

 

So - in order to hike from Hwy 3 to this cache, who do I contact? Can I just go to the customs office at my local little marina and arrange permission to drive to Canada and walk back into the US? And then, which Canadian authorities do I need to ask to allow me to walk back into Canada?

 

And anyway, if you're a US citizen or resident, you're per definition legal in the US, aren't you? In that case, the problem is only for your hike back into Canada, but if your passport was stamped into Canada when you drove in, and it was never stamped out because you never left Canada at an official crossing, you'll be legal at the Canadian sde of the border as well, or won't you?

 

And assuming your crossing IS illegal anyway, what's the illegal part about it? Is it illegal entry? Or Illegal exit? Whose laws are violated, only those of the country one walks into, or both? And in the latter case, if someone's coming from Hwy 3 in Canada and walking towards the US border, is it legal for him to walk all the way to the border, if he is not crossing it? And then, if he crosses it anyhow, does a Canadian border guard have jurisdiction to chase a hiker into US territory and bring him back?

 

These are very hypothetical questions, of course, but my point is that it appears silly to me that once you already have permission to legally *BE* in either country, you would still not be allowed to cross the border at the time and location of your choosing.

Hypothetically, you could find yourself in Never Never Land. ;)

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fwiw, as a us citizen, once married to a canadian, i've NEVER once been asked to show my passport going into or coming from canada. the only time i ever had to show it was when dealing with immigration, etc..

i had a friend with an eccentric hiking father who constantly ended up on the wrong side of the border peak bagging. would call his wife to come get him, never had an issue at the border. mind you this was way way pre 9/11..

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Hopefully I won't be able to go along but if I can, I will. I say hopefully because I hope to have a job by early summer!!! If not, I'll surely have time to go.

 

I believe the last thing I read mentioned it being over 40 miles. I doubt that could be accomplished in a long (3 day) weekend. I figure five days minimum.

 

Glitche Ente (Dan)

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Hey, just spotted this post and it looks like a great hike. I see some lakes along the way, so if it's done early enough hopefully the woods won't all be shut down or burned up. I've been to Slate Peak and have looked north from there and wanted to hike that area for years. Most important how is the fishing?........:lol:

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This thread seems to be stagnating, is there still interest?

We talked to a friend who is an outfitter and takes pack trips into the Pasayten Wilderness. He says that any earlier than mid July risks encountering a snow storm. After mid August the bugs get bad. He also said four day minumum for the planned route.

We live in Winthrop and can assist with vehicle shifting and such, but aren't signing on for the hike (we'll give you our sticker :D .

Barnabirdy(s)

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I'd say mid to late June. Even with the past several weeks of snow there still is a severe lack of snow in the high country. Unless this cold wet spring continues another 2 months much of the state will be bone dry by July. There's interest on my part that's for sure!

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Is this a dead thread??

Yeah, I was wondering about this too, after our chat last weekend. I'd sure like to go, if someone else arranges it. :P Haven't backpacked for a couple years, would be nice to get out.

 

Oh, and dibs on the Barnabirdys' guest room for start/end of trip. :D

Edited by hydnsek
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