+PFF Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 I was pacing distances from the park boundaries when a neighbor came out to see what was going on. He cornered me and got VERY tense when I tried to brush him off. He was afraid I was going to put a road through "his" park. It quickly became obvious when I started this hobby that it greatly concerns people when a stranger is walking on/near their property. I now make it standard practice to approach anyone standing nearby so I can explain what I'm doing. (I usually open with, "Hi. I hope you can help me.") At a church, I go to office if there are cars in the parking lot, or to the house immediately next door if I suspect it is the parsonage--which often is the case in rural areas, especially for Methodist, Episcopal, and Baptist denominations. At a commercial building, I check in with the receptionist. Recently, at an apartment complex, the mark was "behind the laundry room" which has been turned into the maintenance building, so I explained what I was doing to the supervisor. Good thing, too. Several employees questioned me during the search for the three benchmarks on the property. At a school, ALWAYS CHECK IN WITH THE OFFICE. During school hours, be very careful about photography. Don't let anyone even THINK you are taking pictures of children! My experiences range from the lady who stopped to see if I was having car trouble, to the Cop in a small town who followed me around for a while and then asked why I was taking pictures of water tanks. I have found it helpful to dress neatly (vs. sloppy). I have a bright yellow stobe that I put on the rear shelf of my car when stopped. Lately, I've begun wearing an ID badge which has a photo of a benchmark and the words: BENCHMARK INVENTORY VOLUNTEER The goal is to appear somewhat official-looking, without being misleading. So far, these precautions are doing the job. Let's hear from others who have tested ideas and found them successful. For instance, does anybody wear a safety vest? -Paul- NOTE: Don't park on the shoulder of a highway unless it is absolutely necessary, and if you do, don't use strobes or hazard lights. The highway patrol will tell you they lose several cars per year to the "moth effect"; i.e., drivers unconsciously steering in the direction they are looking. It is likely your vehicle (or YOU) will be struck if you create a visual distraction for approaching motorists. Quote Link to comment
+JoGPS Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 I don’ have many problems, but only get dressed up to hunt benchmarks, but never geocaching… Every now and then someone will ask and will tell them what I am doing ………. JOE Quote Link to comment
+planetrobert Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 that car, despite that a hate the model/made, is badass Quote Link to comment
+seventhings Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 Orange hat, orange vest, orange cone behind the green pickup, clean/neat slacks and shirt and shoes that look more like standard work-clothes than athletic or recreational gear: go wherever and do whatever you want - just act like you're on the job and you belong there. Stay away from schools on school days, respect residential private property, immediately identify yourself as "just a hobbyist" if asked. 7 Quote Link to comment
Markonthedot Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 (edited) i know of a marker on a town park property that i went searching for. bad move be going on a weekend where a little league soccer game was going on. the soccer moms, you know the type like "my daughter kim plays soccer, so you don't belong here" type of mom was annoying me and ticking me off, one actually asked me to leave when i was searching for the marker, not even annoying them and not interfering with anything, just minding my own self. it's not like i was looking for the mark on the field or something, i wasn't even near it. i always tell people i search for fun, but apparently soccer moms are too uptight to listen to me when i'm benchmark hunting. -Mark Edited November 20, 2004 by Markonthedot Quote Link to comment
+PFF Posted November 20, 2004 Author Share Posted November 20, 2004 that car......is badass Mega Dittos! Now I know what I want for Christmas! Complete with a sign! -Paul- Quote Link to comment
+Kewaneh & Shark Posted November 20, 2004 Share Posted November 20, 2004 I've got it pretty easy, I guess. The best thing I've found to use is a fully-equipped survey truck. Lights, traffic cones, orange vest, etc. Theodolite and survey-grade GPS if necessary. But, I've got to admit, JoGPS's Honda looks a lot cooler. - Kewaneh Quote Link to comment
+ddnutzy Posted November 21, 2004 Share Posted November 21, 2004 I just explain to people that I'm a civilian volunteer for the NGS and show them the NGS datasheets that I print off of the NGS site. So far no one has given me any trouble. In fact quite a few of them have come with me to show me where the mark is. I then give them the datasheet and the topomap that I usually have with me. Quote Link to comment
evenfall Posted November 21, 2004 Share Posted November 21, 2004 When dealing with the public, it all really all comes down to how you frame the conversation for them, You cannot let them run you too hard... I just stand there in full gear and listen to them with my hands in my pockets... Depending on their attitudes, I go from a forthcoming explanation, to something like "oh, the city is planning on putting a big petroleum pipe line through here and we are just getting started", or a road, or tenement housing, If I am really feeling sadistic I may say a WalMart with a huge parking lot. Be creative I always say. Then I step back a bit while they TAZ out for a few, and after the froth settles, I just say, "Naw, I'm just checking on a real old old survey marker to see if it is still here. But I had you going there for a sec, eh? :-) They usually go away pretty happy. Surveyors are kind of sardonic you know. It comes from slashing through blackberry bushes in the rain, dipping clogged up old sewer man holes for pipe invert elevations, and other particularly unpleasant situations... :-) Full disclosure is a pretty good practice all the same. Rob Quote Link to comment
+PFF Posted November 21, 2004 Author Share Posted November 21, 2004 One technique is to enlist the assistance of the Security Guard, as I did this afternoon at Wake Tech Community College, near Raleigh. I spotted him as I drove onto the campus. After my traditional, "Hi, I hope you can help me" approach, he showed me to the Engineering Technology Building, helped spot the mark, and agreed to pose as a reference object for the area photo. -Paul- Quote Link to comment
mloser Posted November 22, 2004 Share Posted November 22, 2004 Nearly 400 markers and I have never been refused. Some I admit I did a quickie, if the marker was evident, but there were quite a few that I got permission for. Everyone has been helpful, from the real estate company that told me to "go ahead and dig"--they at least knew what a survey marker was and how important it was, and remembered the last person who had tried (and submitted a Not Found by the way) to the two families who got out shovels and helped me dig up their back yards, curious to help. In a nutshell--Don't be afraid to ask! But be afraid NOT to ask. You are better off being told "no" than getting arrested. Quote Link to comment
+PFF Posted November 23, 2004 Author Share Posted November 23, 2004 All excellent points in this thread! Thanks to everybody for your suggestions and experiences. Bottom line: *Respect property; *Take the inititive and let folks know what you're doing; *Park OFF the road whenever possible--even if it means walking a few hundred feet. Roadside safety is heavy on my heart, right now. As I write this in the early morning hours of the day before the day before Thanksgiving, one of the members of our church is lying in a local hospital--brain dead. She was walking her dog when the animal darted onto a roadway. She dashed after it and was hit by one car and thrown into the path of another. Be safe, and let's have fun with the hobby for many years to come! -Paul- Quote Link to comment
+Onemadfool Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 I just explain to people that I'm a civilian volunteer for the NGS and show them the NGS datasheets that I print off of the NGS site. Question for you...Is this something that is ok to tell people, or could you actually get in trouble for this? I've just started Geocaching and there are ALOT of benchmarks in my area that have not been touched for many, many years. I want to start trying to find them, but I want to make sure of the legality of this before I go telling people anything. Any help on this subject would be appreciated. Thank you! Quote Link to comment
mloser Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 It is completely legal, as long as you are not trespassing, destroying property, etc. That is why this thread exists--to remind people to get permission to hunt on private property and to be careful. Quote Link to comment
+Onemadfool Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 Much Thanks! Quote Link to comment
2oldfarts (the rockhounders) Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 I just explain to people that I'm a civilian volunteer for the NGS and show them the NGS datasheets that I print off of the NGS site. Question for you...Is this something that is ok to tell people, or could you actually get in trouble for this? I've just started Geocaching and there are ALOT of benchmarks in my area that have not been touched for many, many years. I want to start trying to find them, but I want to make sure of the legality of this before I go telling people anything. Any help on this subject would be appreciated. Thank you! Go look for the benchmarks and if someone wants to know what you're doing, Just tell them you're "recovering" a survey marker. No need to claim to be anything special sounding. If you try to give them too much info all you will accomplish is to confuse & iritate them. Most people do NOT want the details, they just want to know that you are there for a specific purpose. Be friendly but it is a "Keep It Simple Stu---" thing. In almost 400 finds we have been quizzed twice, once by a sheriff and once by a railroad security guard (who gave us a number to call to get proper authorization for that stretch of tracks). Don't forget to post any great finds here in the forums. John Quote Link to comment
mloser Posted November 24, 2004 Share Posted November 24, 2004 2old... Your experiences are much different from mine--I have about the same number of recoveries as you guys but I have talked to about 50 people in my quests. Many of them wanted to show me the marker, if they knew about it, and quite a few went "above and beyond" by letting me dig in their yard, HELPING me dig in their yard, or telling me about when the marker was set (so far I have met at least three people who's names were the station names, which was really neat). Most were at least somewhat interested in what I was doing, and many were interested in WHY I was doing it (I compare it to "catch and release" fishing--neither of us end up with anything to take home. That usually gets a smile at least) and tell them that I submit the recoveries to a national database so surveyors have an easier time finding them. Many also recall a surveyor coming by at some point to use the marker. I have never been turned down, and have met all sorts of interesting people in my quest. Quote Link to comment
Markonthedot Posted November 25, 2004 Share Posted November 25, 2004 same here. i've looked for benchmarks on public and private property, and meeting people doing so. some treat me with dignity and respect and sound interested, others make me feel like i'm a bad person (see my above post on soccer moms and their ignorance at times). but most of the time, i have no problems. Quote Link to comment
+Harry Dolphin Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I've only had two people ask me what I was doing, so far, in six months of geocaching. One was at a Locationless Cache (Form Two Lines. Schools with two doors, one for girls and one for boys.) The old Dover High School is now Joe Kubert's School of Cartooning. The 'Girl's' door is now the entrance to a Day Care Center. A guy came out with his daughter, and asked why I was taking pictures. "Because the doors are so interesting." seemed to satisfy him. The other time was when I was looking for a benchmark at the old New York Asphalt Plant. It's been completely refurbished as a park and community center. There I was wandering about with my GPS. Someone came out "what are you doing?" "Hunting for a benchmark." Seemed to satisfy him. That benchmark is either gone, or buried under the new landscaping. DNF. Might even be under the FDR Drive. People at work keep expecting (or hoping for?) me to get arrested. Quote Link to comment
+California Bear Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I've found the old clipboard and safety vest seem to satisfy most folk that I have a legitimate reason to be wandering around looknig at the ground, measuring things and taking photos. As for the being arrested thing, my wife has informed me that if I get arrested doing this, I better not waste my one phone call on her as she has warned me about doing something that looks hinky. Quote Link to comment
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