Anyone Dealt With North Herts District Council?

[+lordelph]

Hello all, I've been geocaching for a few months, and now it is time for me to place a cache of my own! Got a nice one planned but the desired location is on land managed by North Hertfordshire District Council. I've emailed a nice letter to the Countryside Management Service of NHDC, but not heard much in a week.

 

Since the email has not been acknowledged, it may be safe assume these guys aren't too 'wired' so a snail mail will follow up.

 

I know there are plenty of Herts cachers here, so I was wondering if anyone has had any dealings with them and might have hints on the best way to proceed.

[Lactodorum]

Hi there and welcome to Geocaching and the Forums. As a reviewer/geocacher based in Hertfordshire and someone who has negotiated a number of agreements my one word of advice has to be PATIENCE

 

Bear in mind thet Geocaching isn't high on their list of priorities so be prepared to have to be persistent. It might be useful to enclose the Geocaching information document located here as very often they will never have heard of the sport.

 

If you need any further help or support please feel free to get me involved.

 

Good luck.

[+lordelph]

Well, I wasn't expecting a fast response, but I thought I'd solicit the advice of some "old hands" before trying harder.

 

I'll send you a copy of the letter I emailed to see if you have useful suggestions before I send the luddites a hard copy...

[+DomHeknows]

can i have a copy or can you paste it here?

I've just sent another email off to another bloke at cheshire county council as there is a different person to handle the area for my next cache.

[+lordelph]

Sure, but I'll edit it to remove specific details about the cache I'm planning - I'd like to keep that to myself until I can get permission to place it. You'll still get the gist of my approach, which was to explain what geocaching is, the guidelines under which participants behave, and how it might provide a positive benefit for the area in question (CITO)

 

I'd love to hear any feedback from anyone who has had similar dealings.

 

Peter Garrett

Countryside Management Service

The Old Dairy

Bedford Road

Ickleford

Hitchin

Hertfordshire

SG5 3RR

Tel: 01462 459395

Fax: 01462 433306

Email: north.cms@hertscc.gov.uk

 

Dear Mr Garrett,

 

I am writing to you to seek permission to place a "geocache" in

(location details here). I'll first provide some background on

what geocaching is and the guidelines under which it's participants

behave, before detailing exactly what I would like to do.

 

What is Geocaching?

-------------------

 

A geocache is hidden container that can only be found with the aid of

clues and a GPS satellite navigation receiver. There are many thousands

of caches thoroughout the UK, and people generally find out about them

from the website at http://www.geocaching.com/

 

Geocaching is a growing sport whose participants generally exercise the

utmost respect for the countryside - the Geocaching Association of Great

Britain created some guidelines which have also been adopted by Hampshire

County Council for all land owned or managed by them:

 

(From http://www.hants.gov.uk/geocaching/guidelines.html)

 

* Ensure the cache container is clearly marked, stating that

the content is harmless and giving the placer's email address

or other contact method. Only items that would be deemed safe

and acceptable for an unaccompanied child to find should be

placed in the cache.

 

* No cache may be placed in such a way as to risk damage or

disturbance to any Site of Special Scientific Interest (SSSI)

or Scheduled Ancient Monument (SAM). Protect our heritage.

 

* When placing a cache on a Right of Way, the onus is on the

placer to seek the permission of the landowner.

 

* No items of food or drink of any kind should be placed in

the cache.

 

* Caches must not be buried, and holes must not be dug in

order to place a cache.

 

* Caches must not be hidden in animal holes or runs.

 

* Cache containers must not be placed inside a polythene bag.

 

* Fences should never be crossed when placing or seeking a

cache.

 

* No caches should be of a commercial nature, either in

location or content.

 

* After placing a cache on countryside sites, the site Ranger

must be informed to ensure that the cache does not compromise

the management of the site.

 

* Maintenance of the cache is the responsibility of the

placer.

 

* When leaving the cache site, after finding or hiding a

cache, there must be no visual sign of disturbance.

 

* For reasons of safety and security Hampshire County Council

discourage geocaching on their land during the hours of

darkness.

 

* Please do not bring geocaching into disrepute, never drive

your car anywhere other than on the highways and byways, and

always park sensibly in approved places only

 

Among one of the more the positive side effects of geocaching is

"Cache In, Trash Out", where participants are encouraged to remove

any litter they find by leaving some rubbish bags in the cache for

this purpose.

 

Proposed Cache Details

----------------------

I plan to base my cache around (the details of local legend)

 

By following clues derived from public locations around Baldock,

participants will end up at the cache location in

(desired location and OS grid ref)

 

The cache will be a small container, with clear markings telling the

finder that it is a geocache and the contents are harmless. I will

hide it above ground just a few metres from one of the many trails

in the woods, and cover it with woodland debris.

 

I also intend to promote the idea of "Cache In Trash Out" by providing

a supply of rubbish bags in the cache, as I found litter on many of

my walks in the woods there.

 

I very much hope I am able to secure your permission to place the

cache. If you have any reservations, perhaps you could contact your

counterpart in Hampshire County Council to see how their policy on

geocaching has been working out. In addition, I'd be happy to

provide regular feedback on how popular the cache is and any comments

I receive from visitors.

 

If I can provide and further information, please get in touch, in the meantime,

I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Kind regards,

 

(contact details, etc etc)

[markandlynn]

I am seeking permission to place a geocache within one of your managed woodlands. I have attached a document which describes in more depth the subject of geocaching and its potential benefits to an organisation such as yours.

The obvious gain is from Cache in Trash out as the impact of this can readily be seen. This is something I and my family try to do whenever we go caching. Other more intangible benefits include regular reports on the areas the caches have been placed.

These reports are automatically emailed whenever someone visits a site that is being watched.

The cache owner also has an obligation to maintain their cache and has a vested interest in making sure the area remains a good caching spot.

Rules and regulations have been set up to control caching in the UK the guidelines for which are in the attached document, one of these being to seek permission from the land owner before placing a cache.

The woodland I have in mind as an initial trial is the Quarry wood along the A41 between Newport and Whitchurch, if this trail could be conducted and the results monitored I would then like to set up an agreed procedure for all your reserves with regards to setting up geocache's. This would probably involve contacting a defined person and mutually agreeing on site the position for the geocache.

I hope you find this of interest and can see the obvious benefits of allowing an “officially approved” geocache on your land (as the Forestry Commission have) and instigating control and approved procedures for the placing of future geocache’s.

That was the letter we used in con junction with the document linked to by Lacky

[+DomHeknows]

thanks guys - they are both good letters and will come in handy for others too i hope.

[+lordelph]

North Hertfordshire District Council have granted me permission to place a cache!

 

Everyone involved in the decision has been extremely positive and supportive, but they seem to want to see how this one pans out before granting any more. That said, if anyone wants contact details for NHDC or copies of correspondence to help with their own negotiations with other councils, get in touch.

[+Nellies Knackers]

I'm sure this has been covered before but is there a webpage anywhere that lists all areas with permissions agreed and relevant restrictions requested? if not how about getting a permission database together at GeocacheUK. I know lots of permissions are posted here but they tend to be broken up in different topics.

Great news about Hertfordshire! Good work.

[+Pharisee]

Try looking at this forum.

[+Nellies Knackers]

Now why didn't I think of that

Cheers John.

[+lordelph]

In case anyone is thinking of adapting the permission request I posted above, The Bramblers have sent me some factual corrections:

 

- It was the GAGB who adopted the HCC guidelines and not the other way round.

 

- HCC have granted permision for geocaching on land owned and managed

by Hampshire County Council Countryside Service and not all land owned by HCC

 

It was also noted that the link to the HCC guidelines fails because the closing bracket looks like part of the hyperlink to the forum and email software. Add a space before the closing bracket and everyone is happy :-)

[+Teasel]

I'm sure this has been covered before but is there a webpage anywhere that lists all areas with permissions agreed and relevant restrictions requested? if not how about getting a permission database together at GeocacheUK. I know lots of permissions are posted here but they tend to be broken up in different topics.

As well as the forum thread that Pharisee indicated, we're also adding agreements to the GAGB Landowner Agreements Database.

 

Where possible, I'm trying to include the boundaries of the areas in GLAD, so that we can provide maps and information about the caches on that land. This is particularly useful where the conditions of the agreement stipulate a maximum number of caches (eg the New Forest Forestry Commission), or where there are small areas of the land which need to be avoided (eg the South East England Forestry Commission).

 

Landowners can often provide files giving the outlines of their land from their computer systems. (They're most often called "shapefiles"). Eg Cheshire County Council and the South East England Forestry Commission have both provided shapefiles of the land where we can cache. I created one for the New Forest manually, but it was quite tedious. So if people negotiating with landowners could check to see whether they can provide any "shapefiles", I'd be really grateful to receive them!

 

Cheers,

Ian