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Is Abject Silliness Dead?


Eric K

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Apply what you (and other non-premium members) are asking for to other businesses. How many business set aside a place for their customers to just hang out without limits, shoot the bull, make noise and generally not add to the business going on with no expectation of something in return?

Why do health clubs have juice bars? Why do coffee shops run free wireless services?

 

How did GC.com survive until now with free forums?

 

I do not begrudge GS from their right to consider an off-topic forum a frill and justify its existence as a perk for the paying membership. What I disagree with is anyone attempting to justify it as a business compensation and certainly justifying it as "well, they're not even in the business of running a forum so to do so *has* to cost extra for the user". Businesses included functions that are not directly related to their main focus. Some even include these things for free because they see it as a means to attract more customers or keep existing customers happy and happy customers always lead to more customers through word-of-mouth sales as well as monetary support through store purchases.

 

GC.com does not *have* to devote part of the membership fee to pay for the new OT forum anymore than they were devoting part of the fees to keeping the AS thread alive or watching this forum cycle through its regularly weekly scheduled topics. They still have the ability and right to request paying membership before using their OT forum. Of course, I don't agree with that decision.

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I think people are just upset that they are being asked to pay for something they previously got for free.

 

So what's a solution. Give back the AS thread to non-paying members?

 

Even though they would have what was available before, I bet they'll still take issue with being excluded from the OT forum.

 

Let them eat cake.

Edited by Elf Danach
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i understand well that a handful of AS regulars are good and upset about the change. on the one hand, it's very sad, but the unpaid will probably find other ways to communicate with the paying members.

 

i don't really care if it's a feature for paying members. i wouldn't buy it as a service. i don't think of it as an inducement to join, but i do think it's fair for a company based on geocaching should want to make non-geocaching related topics accessible to those who support the business.

 

non-members are still allowed to play and to log finds. they can still use the forums. and they can still pm all their friends all they want.

 

there is no cutback to actual geocaching. it's just not a critical value. i DO understand that the dozen or so people who are afffected by this are very upset.

 

and as for the folks who wrote in to say that they MIGHT have become a member but now they're not going to, it's kind of an empty threat. nobody cares if you go off in a snit and take your non-business somewhere else.

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For the record, my problem was not that OT is a premium-member only feature, but I thought it could have been handled better. To just have the thread that so many love and enjoy just disappear, with no explanation, was not the best way to do this. IN MY OPINION.

 

If there had been some sort of notice given, like a day ahead, it would have helped to avoid some of this. And the other irritation I had came about because some paying members got quite arrogant about it all. That wasn't necessary. That's all.

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Apply what you (and other non-premium members) are asking for to other businesses.  How many business set aside a place for their customers to just hang out without limits, shoot the bull, make noise and generally not add to the business going on with no expectation of something in return?

Why do health clubs have juice bars? Why do coffee shops run free wireless services?

To get you to spend more money. I've never been to a juice bar - I'm guessing that you have to buy what you are consuming. As for wireless internet at coffee shops (even the BW3 I frequent has free wireless access now) is to get you to visit more often and spend more time there -- in hopes you'll buy more product.

 

How does supplying an free OT forum (or thread in a forum) benefit GC.com? You aren't paying to use it, and you aren't looking at advertisements when you use it. Where is the return on cost?

 

How did GC.com survive until now with free forums?

Since we aren't privvy to the inner workings of GC.com we have to assume that the server load, storage and bandwidth consumed by the free forums came out of the same server capacity, storage and bandwidth available for the on-topic forums and the rest of GC.com. I.e., it was being paid for by those who are paying.

 

Some even include these things for free because they see it as a means to attract more customers or keep existing customers happy and happy customers always lead to more customers through word-of-mouth sales as well as monetary support through store purchases.

Yes, that is called promoting goodwill. And it is very difficult, if not impossible, to equate goodwill earned to dollars. We already know that only a small percentage of GC.com users use the forum. Even a smaller percentage take part in the OT threads. So, the goodwill created by allowing a free OT thread/forum can't be all that significant. Are you going to stop caching and using the services of GC.com because you can't participate in OT discussions without paying? Are a significant number of users going to leave? Will there be loss in revenue?

 

When I try introduce non-cachers to geocaching it is about the fun and challenges of the hunt and hide: forums (on-topic or off) do not even enter into the discussion. How does sponsoring OFF TOPIC discussions promote sales of geocaching items via the store? I don't see the correlation between free OT discussions and more customers or revenue for GC.com.

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that so many love and enjoy

this is a quanitative value the accuracy and significance of which is debatable. it probably seems like a much more significant value if you're one of the regulars.

 

To just have the thread <snip> just disappear, with no explanation,  was not the best way to do this.  IN MY OPINION. 

 

in my opinion, a valid concern.

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that so many love and enjoy

this is a quanitative value the accuracy and significance of which is debatable. it probably seems like a much more significant value if you're one of the regulars.

 

Exactly. I could have expressed that a little bit better. If you were a regular, whether it be by lurking or participating, this whole thing is easier to understand. If not, then I would imagine it all looks like much ado about nothing.

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I hesitated topic here but what the heck.

I also never visited AS so the move did not affect me.

I am a paying member more because I like to support those that provide a service I enjoy than anything else. I use PQ's I can change what it says under my avatar. and I can post in the members only O.T. area. NONE of these are worth $30 a year but I enjoy this hobby and choose to support it. I also pay $25 a year to a local Ham radio club and I get to use repeater's that are open to the public.

but the public cannot use the remote controls on those repeater's unless they become members of the club. such is life, it's not fair never has been never will be. Now if I was one who was upset that AS was closed and I no longer could post there with my little forum "Family" I would set up a free board and invite them all there here is a link to set up your very own forum.http://www.proboards.com/index.html

I set one up for my friends and family it's easy and ya only get a few banners on each page.

Now you have the tool use it as you wish.

 

Edit Spelling

Edited by GeoCamelCachers
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I also hesitate to comment, since my normal style is very much based on "live and let live". Just some observations that I feel might be important to someone at GC or the GC community at large.

 

a: Whenever a company starts charging for a service that was previously free, there are going to be customers who see it as a "bait" situation. In the early .com days ccompanies that offered free e-mail for instance would have packages where you could get "enhanced" features for a fee, and then started whittling down the services offered for free until the users either payed or left. These companies mostly no longer exits.

 

b: This particular situation is a bit different than a normal company/client relationship. I observe in the forums that cachers feel they have an investment in the success of this site. After all if there were no caches (put out by cachers) than really there would be no GC.com. I may be possible that since the clients feel they have invested in the success of GC.com the process when implementing a change should be different than the process that IBM or MS might follow.

 

c: There is probably a silent group of members out there who are not going to post (I almost did not), but who are feeling badly about these types of moves. It's this silent group that can make or break a company, and they are the hardest ones to figure out what they are feeling. Odds are if there is a vocal minority hurt by this move, than there is also a silent group right behind them.

 

d: Small and seemingly un-important things that can leave a bad taste in the mouth can linger on. I personally checked the Silliness thread out a couple of times only, so no loss for me. On the other hand clicking on a thread re: a frequency scanner that looked interesting and getting the "access denied" screen is not what I prefer. Why can I see the thread title in this forum, but have no rights to read it ?

 

Me - I'm just gonna keep playing geocaching in whatever way best suits my recreational needs. Less likely to become premium now than before.

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Apply what you (and other non-premium members) are asking for to other businesses.  How many business set aside a place for their customers to just hang out without limits, shoot the bull, make noise and generally not add to the business going on with no expectation of something in return?

Why do health clubs have juice bars? Why do coffee shops run free wireless services?

To get you to spend more money. I've never been to a juice bar - I'm guessing that you have to buy what you are consuming. As for wireless internet at coffee shops (even the BW3 I frequent has free wireless access now) is to get you to visit more often and spend more time there -- in hopes you'll buy more product.

 

How does supplying an free OT forum (or thread in a forum) benefit GC.com? You aren't paying to use it, and you aren't looking at advertisements when you use it. Where is the return on cost?

 

Where is the return on cost for the other parts of the forums? There are no ads anywhere in the forums, therefore, no return on cost whether it's OT or not. I can live without an OT forum, I can live without AS. I'm a premium member, but I don't use any of the features of premium membership. I have a PQ that runs twice a week, only because I'm too lazy to stop it. I haven't looked at it since the first time it ran several months ago. The only incentive for me to be a premium member is the hope that my $30 will keep geocaching free for those who either can't afford it or don't want to pay, as it was for me when I started. Had it been a pay to play game, I would never have started.

 

I agree with Pip, there have been too many members showing their arrogance in this thread already.

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My opinion:

 

AS was an experiment. One off-topic thread on a forum where off-topic was shunned. It was used to put all the stuff that didn't fit anywhere else. It grew into more of a chat room that you didn't have to be logged into 24/7 but still got to read it as if you were.

 

The off-topic forum is something new. It has never existed on this site before. Almost all off-topic threads prior to this forum being created were closed for being off-topic to Geocaching.

 

Premium members pay for TPTB to implement new features (among other things). Since the off-topic forum is a new feature, it stands to reason that it should (at least initially) be for paying members.

 

When should the OT forum be free? Maybe never. Pocket Queries have been around for quite some time, but there's no call to make them a "free" part of the site.

 

Nothing "elitest" about it. It's business.

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I don't understand why AS bothered the people who didn't go into the thread. It was one thread. Just don't read it. And as far as it popping up at the top of the page all the time, there are a lot more topics that I don't read. AS could have been just one more. (But it wasn't, and I enjoyed it.)

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I don't understand why AS bothered the people who didn't go into the thread. It was one thread. Just don't read it.

That's probably because you never tried to use the forum's search engine, only to have the results trashed by all worthless hits against AS. Now that it's in a separate area, it can be filtered out.

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I don't understand why AS bothered the people who didn't go into the thread.  It was one thread.  Just don't read it.

That's probably because you never tried to use the forum's search engine, only to have the results trashed by all worthless hits against AS. Now that it's in a separate area, it can be filtered out.

Ah, I see now. Thanks for giving a reason I can understand!

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Yep. As a moderator, I am probably a power user of the search button -- always looking for the answer that will help someone, or a prior statement from Jeremy on a matter of policy, or a prior discussion of the same topic for Markwell purposes or correction of a misstated fact. God forbid that your search term was ever discussed in Abject Silliness, since every post gets quoted five more times. As much as I enjoyed dropping by AS from time to time, this did get on my nerves.

 

Everybody can be happy now. If you visit OT, you have no grounds to complain about the fun that others are having there.

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Yep. As a moderator, I am probably a power user of the search button -- always looking for the answer that will help someone, or a prior statement from Jeremy on a matter of policy, or a prior discussion of the same topic for Markwell purposes or correction of a misstated fact. God forbid that your search term was ever discussed in Abject Silliness, since every post gets quoted five more times. As much as I enjoyed dropping by AS from time to time, this did get on my nerves.

 

Everybody can be happy now. If you visit OT, you have no grounds to complain about the fun that others are having there.

And yep, we ARE having fun! :blink:

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Yep.  As a moderator, I am probably a power user of the search button -- always looking for the answer that will help someone, or a prior statement from Jeremy on a matter of policy, or a prior discussion of the same topic for Markwell purposes or correction of a misstated fact.  God forbid that your search term was ever discussed in Abject Silliness, since every post gets quoted five more times.  As much as I enjoyed dropping by AS from time to time, this did get on my nerves.

 

Everybody can be happy now.  If you visit OT, you have no grounds to complain about the fun that others are having there.

And yep, we ARE having fun! B)

and yep, YOU are having fun! :blink::)

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Yep.  As a moderator, I am probably a power user of the search button -- always looking for the answer that will help someone, or a prior statement from Jeremy on a matter of policy, or a prior discussion of the same topic for Markwell purposes or correction of a misstated fact.  God forbid that your search term was ever discussed in Abject Silliness, since every post gets quoted five more times.  As much as I enjoyed dropping by AS from time to time, this did get on my nerves.

 

Everybody can be happy now.  If you visit OT, you have no grounds to complain about the fun that others are having there.

And yep, we ARE having fun! :blink:

and yep, YOU are having fun! B):)

I've got some pretty good company! B)

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Yep.  As a moderator, I am probably a power user of the search button -- always looking for the answer that will help someone, or a prior statement from Jeremy on a matter of policy, or a prior discussion of the same topic for Markwell purposes or correction of a misstated fact.  God forbid that your search term was ever discussed in Abject Silliness, since every post gets quoted five more times.  As much as I enjoyed dropping by AS from time to time, this did get on my nerves.

 

Everybody can be happy now.  If you visit OT, you have no grounds to complain about the fun that others are having there.

And yep, we ARE having fun! :blink:

and yep, YOU are having fun! B):)

B)

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There are so many OTHER free general forums out there that I find it hard to imagine that off-post topics are limited to, or deliberately moved into a "for paying members-only" section.

 

If my understanding of the situation is correct, then abject silliness is not dead.

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There are so many OTHER free general forums out there that I find it hard to imagine that off-post topics are limited to, or deliberately moved into a "for paying members-only" section.

 

If my understanding of the situation is correct, then abject silliness is not dead.

The original AS is dead, the topic is closed. Other topics have been derived from it though.

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There are so many OTHER free general forums out there

I believe that is precisely why OT is not free here. There's lots of other places we can go to do that. This sight is for geocaching. If you want to go off topic, TPTB accomodated that, but it's not free.

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So I do understand it correctly - Groundspeak is running a paid forum for topics that have nothing to do with geocaching, when at the same time other forums provide the same service for free.

 

Initially, the difference is just abjectively silly. But now moderators here have the access take any posts away from the initial non-paying community and move it to the payed section.

 

To clarify, is this for reasons that they are "premimum" topics or "unrelated to the geocache community"?

 

In the event of my content being placed in either category, will it be moved to an off-topic area, even though the Groundspeak guidelines state "Any messages you post will stay available to the public for as long as this discussion board is online."?

 

If so, then my own content could be exploited for comercial use.

 

Why not just move or delete off-topic posts into a regular area instead of "stealing" them away to those who pay?

 

Those issues aside, I see no reason why paying members can't have their own section of forum where they can initiate their own posts on whatever topics they feel appropriate.

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There are so many OTHER free general forums out there that I find it hard to imagine that off-post topics are limited to, or deliberately moved into a "for paying members-only" section.

 

If my understanding of the situation is correct, then abject silliness is not dead.

The original AS is dead, the topic is closed. Other topics have been derived from it though.

Considering that Abject Silliness was in itself derived from other off-topic threads which were swept together into one place, it seems -at least to me - a natural evolution of things.

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There are so many OTHER free general forums out there that I find it hard to imagine that off-post topics are limited to, or deliberately moved into a "for paying members-only" section.

 

If my understanding of the situation is correct, then abject silliness is not dead.

 

Considering that Abject Silliness was in itself derived from other off-topic threads which were swept together into one place, it seems -at least to me - a natural evolution of things.

But to move it to a place where one must pay to view isn't evolutionary, it's "abjectively" dishonest to those whose content may no longer be visible to them or others who do not pay.

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So I do understand it correctly - Groundspeak is running a paid forum for topics that have nothing to do with geocaching, when at the same time other forums provide the same service for free.

 

Initially, the difference is just abjectively silly. But now moderators here have the access take any posts away from the initial non-paying community and move it to the payed section.

 

To clarify, is this for reasons that they are "premimum" topics or "unrelated to the geocache community"?

 

In the event of my content being placed in either category, will it be moved to an off-topic area, even though the Groundspeak guidelines state "Any messages you post will stay available to the public for as long as this discussion board is online."?

 

If so, then my own content could be exploited for comercial use.

 

Why not just move or delete off-topic posts into a regular area instead of "stealing" them away to those who pay?

 

Those issues aside, I see no reason why paying members can't have their own section of forum where they can initiate their own posts on whatever topics they feel appropriate.

Look at it as if GeoSpeak and GeoCaching.com are providing an extra courtesy for paying members, similar to the "first class lounge" some airlines still provide.

 

The regulars in the old AS took the thread to such an extreme that the managers of the company felt it necessary to isolate its activities from the general population and from those who had no desire to participate.

 

As you have seen, many "Off-Topic" regulars still participate in the public forum, we just have another area where we can break he rules with a tad more impunity.

 

I don't see any attempt to punish non-members here as there are plenty of other forums on the web for the kind of irrelevance we practice on the O-T area.

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From a moderator's perspective, I find it far more "honest" to have a separate off-topic forum. It makes my job easier. In the past when closing a thread that's off-topic, I would have the "what about Abject Silliness?" thrown back in my face on a regular basis. Rather than having to explain away a grandfathered exception, moderators can now uniformly say that off-topic posts are not permitted, except in the off-topic forum.

 

As for "losing" content if a topic is moved to the off-topic forum, by definition the topic should not have been posted in the general geocaching topics area to begin with, so there are no grounds for complaint. If a topic that is originally on-topic should later veer off-topic to the point where it is irretrievable, then perhaps the best thing to do would be for the moderator to close the existing topic and invite interested thread participants to continue the discussion in the off-topic area. This has already been done once or twice.

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There is currently no grounds for complaint, except to point out that the Groundspeak guidelines state "Any messages you post will stay available to the public for as long as this discussion board is online." is no longer a valid statement.

 

However, the moment my content is moved to a place where only paying members can view it (as it seems that others' content has) is the moment where the lack of honesty in the guidelines affects me personally. As to the moderator who will immediately put their "honesty" to the test, your advice to close the topic and leave it to remain publicly viewable is best for everyone. Any off-topic topics that are started can be locked and/or removed - but moving them to a pay-only area is stealing content from others who accepted the guidelines of this forum and expected the operators to uphold their end of it.

 

This topic doesn't fit in this forum. It'd go best in a topic discussing the "Groundspeak website" which could include the store and the forum or anything to do with the Company Home Page. But there is no such forum. This is only a geocaching topic in that it relates to the corporate policy of a company who's business is related to geocaching.

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There is currently no grounds for complaint, except to point out that the Groundspeak guidelines state "Any messages you post will stay available to the public for as long as this discussion board is online." is no longer a valid statement.

I think you've misrepresented the intent of that statement, by only quoting a portion of the paragraph. The entire paragraph is:

 

----------------

Disclaimer: Any messages you post will stay available to the public for as long as this discussion board is online. Please post carefully, once you have posted your message it is here to stay. We will not edit the content you wrote unless it does not conform to these guidelines. If we edit a post and you do not like the changes, we will delete the message at your request.

----------------

 

That's a WARNING, not a PROMISE. It's telling you to be careful what you write, because it could be around for a long, long time.

 

And why aren't you complaining about the message in the "geocaching.com Web Site" forum? Technically, they aren't available to the *public* either.

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The reason I write here regarding geocaching is so others can see it. It is in fact my hope that it remains to be seen by the public, not by paying members only.

 

The intent of my message here is to show that if what everyone's saying here is true, then there is a problem with the guidelines as written. Any editing done by moderators is fine by me. Any removal, either with my permission or without, is fine by me. But to move my contributions and comments from this public forum to an area only viewable by paying members is NOT covered in the guidelines and is NOT with my permission.

 

I'm not posting this in "geocaching.com Web Site" forum because currently it only regards the Groundspeak forum. What is done with my content here might reflect on what is done on the geocaching.com site, however. I don't currently see a reason to make that association yet - I'm only expanding on the discussion here right now. If I observe my cache notes being made viewable for paying members only, then I will want to mention it in that forum.

 

I'll look over there because now I am concerned about the corporation policy regarding taking advantage of my content specifically for profit.

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If so, then my own content could be exploited for comercial use.

Using a free service and claiming the company is making a profit from you is ...uninformed.

 

You'd have a better chance arguing that the shirt you paid for with a Nike logo was free advertising.

Edited by Elf Danach
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The reason I write here regarding geocaching is so others can see it.  It is in fact my hope that it remains to be seen by the public, not by paying members only.

 

The intent of my message here is to show that if what everyone's saying here is true, then there is a problem with the guidelines as written.  Any editing done by moderators is fine by me.  Any removal, either with my permission or without, is fine by me.  But to move my contributions and comments from this public forum to an area only viewable by paying members is NOT covered in the guidelines and is NOT with my permission.

 

I'm not posting this in "geocaching.com Web Site" forum because currently it only regards the Groundspeak forum.  What is done with my content here might reflect on what is done on the geocaching.com site, however.  I don't currently see a reason to make that association yet - I'm only expanding on the discussion here right now.  If I observe my cache notes being made viewable for paying members only, then I will want to mention it in that forum.

 

I'll look over there because now I am concerned about the corporation policy regarding taking advantage of my content specifically for profit.

I'm a little confused. You seem to have major complaints with the way thing are run. You don't like the forum set up regarding OT topics. You post this on your profile page:

"A GPS device and a hunger for adventure are all you need for high tech treasure hunting." according to Groundspeak, which owns and operates Geocaching.com. This is not entirely true... you can get started today even without a GPS receiver.

It seems you are on a quest to root out injustice in the world, Have you considered working with Michael Moore?

 

2 questions:

 

1: if it's that bad, why are you still here? Please don't give me that tired old "Doing it for the community" bit. I don't remember asking you to save me for the EVIL GC.com.

 

2: You seem to have issues with Groundspeak, Inc. from the start. If that is at all true then I guess that my first question "Why are you still here???" warrants this question. Are you here just because it is a forum and you can complain and cause trouble????

 

If its the sanctity of the printed word I suggest you find a different hobby. One that does not involve other people, the INTERNET or interacting with any rules and wording that you yourself did not create.

 

ITS ONLY A GAME!!!!!

Edited by Lapaglia
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I've said it before.

 

It's time to run the sockpuppet software again.

Ya think?

 

I even get sucked into the "Why would anyone place a difficult cache" threads. You want to give people the benifit of the doubt, but this is.........nevermind.

 

Dang there's that topic drift again.

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If so, then my own content could be exploited for comercial use.

Using a free service and claiming the company is making a profit from you is ...uninformed.

 

You'd have a better chance arguing that the shirt you paid for with a Nike logo was free advertising.

If so, then my own content could be exploited for comercial use.

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I'm a little confused. You seem to have major complaints with the way thing are run.  You don't like the forum set up regarding OT topics

 

I've mentioned a single complaint I would make if my content were moved into a pay-per-view section of the forum. The more questions I ask, the more knee-jerk responses I get about this.

 

Imagine writing a "Letter to the editor" and instead of it being printed in the newspaper, you discover years latter it was published in a book that one of the editors wrote after leaving the paper.

 

Is that an unfair analogy?

 

Thanks for quoting my profile - but I think you took it the wrong way.

 

"If it's that bad" (which at this point it seems like a bunch of nonsense posts by a lot of different people were shipped off for paying members only to view) then speak up about it. I suspect it's not as bad, but details are sketchy. The responses seem very defensive, however.

 

"Are you here just because it is a forum and you can complain and cause trouble????"

 

No, I'm here because forums can provide a lot more information that my week of reading the logs over at geocaching.com did. I'm here to ask questions, make comments, and generally learn from others.

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I've said it before.

 

It's time to run the sockpuppet software again.

Ya think?

 

I even get sucked into the "Why would anyone place a difficult cache" threads. You want to give people the benifit of the doubt, but this is.........nevermind.

 

Dang there's that topic drift again.

My participation in the "difficult caches" discussions is not to discourage or demean anyone for making them, but to mention that a significant portion of caches in cache-dense areas are poorly placed, making them unintenionally difficult with little reward.

 

This observation is based purely on my first few weeks of caching. Please read my find logs. What you won't find are logs of me complaining about cachers.

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I've said it before.

 

It's time to run the sockpuppet software again.

Ya think?

 

I even get sucked into the "Why would anyone place a difficult cache" threads. You want to give people the benifit of the doubt, but this is.........nevermind.

 

Dang there's that topic drift again.

My participation in the "difficult caches" discussions is not to discourage or demean anyone for making them, but to mention that a significant portion of caches in cache-dense areas are poorly placed, making them unintenionally difficult with little reward.

 

This observation is based purely on my first few weeks of caching. Please read my find logs. What you won't find are logs of me complaining about cachers.

See thats the problem, you have only been at it for a few weeks and already you are pontificating like you have been here for years. Here is a suggestion: Talk less Cache More. Come back in 6 months when your experience matches your bravado.

 

Trust me NO ONE is going to put your words of wisdom in a book. So you are safe.

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So is this the new AS thread then? Cool.

Uh, no. Cheers is the new "AS" thread - appropriately placed in the Off-Topic forum. I'm pretty sure that attempts to make this thread into the "next AS" would result in complete and utter failure. Due, in no small part, to the fact that the members of AS are all happily using the Cheers thread. AS was a community, you can't replicate that community just by starting another thread.

 

Oh, there's also the part about the mods would close this thread if it becomes off-topic (I'm not sure if it's not too late already, but if this thread gets closed anytime soon then you'll know why)

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Trust me NO ONE is going to put your words of wisdom in a book. So you are safe.

If the analogy holds true, then it means my posts won't be moved to the off-topic (OT) pay-to-view area. This is good news!

 

I never saw the original AS topic, nor have I seen OT. I suspect it's just human nature to need a place to be more informal - if so, then OT will have long life, and this new AS topic will go on as well.

 

What caught my eye about this topic was that it was updated frequently and had an unusual title for a geocaching topic. :lol:

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Trust me NO ONE is going to put your words of wisdom in a book. So you are safe.

If the analogy holds true, then it means my posts won't be moved to the off-topic (OT) pay-to-view area. This is good news!

 

I never saw the original AS topic, nor have I seen OT. I suspect it's just human nature to need a place to be more informal - if so, then OT will have long life, and this new AS topic will go on as well.

 

What caught my eye about this topic was that it was updated frequently and had an unusual title for a geocaching topic. :lol:

For the record when I deal with an OT thread in the On Topic areas. I do it this way.

 

This Thread is now completely off topic. I am closing it for that reason. If you would like to continue this thread please do so in the Off Topic forum by starting a new one.

 

 

Just so any non paying members are not stuck not being able to respond. So this is a non issue.

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I've said it before.

 

It's time to run the sockpuppet software again.

Ya think?

 

I even get sucked into the "Why would anyone place a difficult cache" threads. You want to give people the benifit of the doubt, but this is.........nevermind.

 

Dang there's that topic drift again.

My participation in the "difficult caches" discussions is not to discourage or demean anyone for making them, but to mention that a significant portion of caches in cache-dense areas are poorly placed, making them unintenionally difficult with little reward.

 

This observation is based purely on my first few weeks of caching. Please read my find logs. What you won't find are logs of me complaining about cachers.

See thats the problem, you have only been at it for a few weeks and already you are pontificating like you have been here for years. Here is a suggestion: Talk less Cache More. Come back in 6 months when your experience matches your bravado.

 

Trust me NO ONE is going to put your words of wisdom in a book. So you are safe.

Some things to keep in mind when posting:

 

Respect: Respect the guidelines for forum usage, and site usage. Respect Groundspeak, its employees, volunteers, yourself, fellow community members, and guests on these boards. Whether a community member has one post or 5,000 posts, they deserve the same respect.

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