Announcing Geowoodstock 3

August 21, 2004

Here is the long awaited announcement for GeoWoodstock3.

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...9e-922becbaed7e

20.7k · August 21, 2004

Is that Jeep TB going to be in purgatory for the next nine months?

6.4k · August 21, 2004

So everyone for 100 miles around has to get that in their monthly email and look at it on the upcoming events page and nearby caches page for 9 months? I thought they normally only listed events 3 months in advance?

Skirting the guidelines to get your event listed 6 months before anyone elses on top of the previous forum spamming about it leaves a bad taste in my mouth about how this event is being run.

It's just an event. I've been to several other events that have had hundreds of people attend. They did it without bending or breaking the rules on this site.

Edited August 21, 2004 by Mopar

August 21, 2004

We're sorry Mopar that you have a bad taste in your mouth about this event. From previous discussions from geocachers one of the biggest complaints was that they were unaware of the event. Yes we are doing everything we can to get the word out about the event and trying to give everyone as much advance notice as possible. As has been previously noted this is not just another event. Our normal monthly events which generally host 50 to 100 cachers are posted a month to 2 months in advance. But this is a National Level Event. One for cachers from across the country and the world, we just felt in the interest of making this event available for as many as possible it needed to be posted as soon as possbile so people had the oppurtunity to plan their vacations next year.

I am sure there will be those who will not come to the event for their perceived reasons or choices. But we will encourage everyone to be here to meet and greet as many of their fellow cachers as possible and to enjoy our hospitality. If in the process we offend some we apologize now. I guess the point of caching is that everyone has the oppurtunity to play and participate in the sport the way they see fit.

The Federation

Promotions Director

1.4k · August 21, 2004

Hmmm, maybe all that Mopar wants is a list of other guidelines that you don't think apply to you for whatever reason you think is important enough. So then he won't be cause by surprise. Hmmm, can we all do that? Hey Jeremy, I've decided I'm not got to follow the rule about burried caches. Just thought it's fair to let you know.

August 21, 2004

We're not sure which side we are on here, but the cache page is clearly written. It states that the event is not on the posted start date but is rather 6 months after that. The regional approver knew that when he or she approved it, so rather than complaining to The Federation, maybe the local approver should be consulted for the rational used in approving this cache so far in advance. Therein lies the source of the early posting.

Florida Approver, if you are reading this, please enlighten everyone regarding this apparent bend in the posting policy.

Thanks

1.2k · August 21, 2004

Or perhaps the page was edited after it was approved. That has been know to happen. Normally if a variance was granted there would be no reason to flaunt that the guidelines were being skirted. By my count this is the third time guidelines were broken. It will be interesting to see how many more happen. I don't remember this problem with the last 2 GW's.

Enthusiasm is on thing. This is another.

I cant wait to see what #4 is. Maybe caches placed for the event, claiming they are permanent that mysteriously get archived right after the event is over? Or caches placed as traditionals that have the test changed the night before claiming in an attempt to make them a temp Locationless. Anyone want to start a pool?

Even the title of the cache page "GeoWoodstock III - NEFGA Style!.

Implys that it is going to be different. What was so wrong with the last two that this one has to be different. O wait I remember, they followed the rules.

Edited August 21, 2004 by Lapaglia

August 21, 2004

By my count this is the third time guidelines were broken.

I'm so glad to see that you've been appointed official guideline score keeper What other perceived guideline violations have you seen ? It interesting that you should choose "guideline" instead of "rule" in your post. In looking up the definitions of the words (yeah I know I've got no life) I found:

Guideline - A useful principle having wide application but not intended to be strictly accurate or reliable in every situation.

Rule - An authoritative, prescribed direction for conduct, especially a governing procedure observed by the players in a game, sport, or contest.

I think geocaching is built more around flexible guidelines than hard fast rules. The guidline is that events should not be posted more than 6 months in advance. This is reasonable for local events because there is no reason to post my "Meet & greet" event (that will be attended by 8 people) a year in advance. On the other hand, this is an event that some people will travel a couple thousand miles for. It only makes sense to give them as much heads-up time as possible so that plans can be made. I don't think that explaining why the date is wrong on the cache page is "flaunting" anything. It's just explaining why that's not the correct date.

6.4k · August 21, 2004

Actually, I would say the "guideline" is 3 months in advance. That's normally as far in advance a normal event will be posted. The "rule" is 6 months max, since the site itself will not even allow you to post an event any further then that in the future. If they intended 6 months to be a guideline, it wouldnt be hard coded into the website.

August 21, 2004

@federation: Thank you for posting this information now. I'll make the trip from Europe to Florida and I appreciate the ability to long term planning.

August 21, 2004

I usually don't get involved in this sort of thing but it does seem to be a little unfair to the locals who will have this thing on their unfound list for a long, long, time. It won't be 9 months, it will be more like 11 if Geowoodstock 2 is used as an example. That event was 7 weeks ago and the cache page has yet to be archived.

Thank goodness for GSAK where you can filter the thing out.

5.3k · August 22, 2004

I for one do not see a problem posting an event as much as a year or more in advance, Sometimes you have to book travel more than 6 months in advacne to get a good price. Groundspeak should change the guide line (Is it a guidline or a rule) as has been said in the past regarding other topics "Guide lines are not rules"

With the growth of geocaching, guide lines may need to be changed in the future.

Besides, what is the so called problem with posting "Events" allowing more time for people to make travel plans if they do not live in the arae of the cache.

I may atten this event, comming from Calif. I will more than likely try make this a 7 day vacation.

August 22, 2004

I for one am glad to see the event page posted, and am willing to look at it for months. WE were unable to attend GW2 due to a previous engagement. Had we known about GW2 a couple of months earlier, we would have taken our vacation in Tenn. instead of New York. From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

6.4k · August 22, 2004

I for one do not see a problem posting an event as much as a year or more in advance, Sometimes you have to book travel more than 6 months in advacne to get a good price. Groundspeak should change the guide line (Is it a guidline or a rule) as has been said in the past regarding other topics "Guide lines are not rules"
With the growth of geocaching, guide lines may need to be changed in the future.

Besides, what is the so called problem with posting "Events" allowing more time for people to make travel plans if they do not live in the arae of the cache.

I may atten this event, comming from Calif. I will more than likely try make this a 7 day vacation.

Except, being in California, the only way *YOU* found out about the event was via the forum post. Nobody that has to travel saw that event page get posted. So just the forum post coupled with some info on their website would have acomplished the same thing, right? Without having to claim they are special and above the rules.

6.4k · August 22, 2004

I for one am glad to see the event page posted, and am willing to look at it for months. WE were unable to attend GW2 due to a previous engagement. Had we known about GW2 a couple of months earlier, we would have taken our vacation in Tenn. instead of New York. From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

Psssst. I've found a few caches in my day, and only 3 of *my* finds where under a lamp post in a parking lot. Gee, I find time to whine in the forums and still do caches that require 3hr hikes. How cool is that? :blink:

Edited August 22, 2004 by Mopar

2.3k · August 22, 2004

I for one am glad to see the event page posted, and am willing to look at it for months. WE were unable to attend GW2 due to a previous engagement. Had we known about GW2 a couple of months earlier, we would have taken our vacation in Tenn. instead of New York. From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

Psssst. I've found a few caches in my day, and only 3 of *my* finds where under a lamp post in a parking lot. Gee, I find time to whine in the forums and still do caches that require 3hr hikes. How cool is that?

Mopar, if you keep telling lies like that I'm am going to have to issue a warning to you. I know for a fact that you regularly do caches that are MORE than a 3 hour hike. Please get your facts straight before posting in the forums

1.4k · August 22, 2004

Except, being in California, the only way *YOU* found out about the event was via the forum post. Nobody that has to travel saw that event page get posted. So just the forum post coupled with some info on their website would have acomplished the same thing, right? Without having to claim they are special and above the rules.

YA! What he said!

1.8k · August 22, 2004

I for one am glad to see the event page posted, and am willing to look at it for months. WE were unable to attend GW2 due to a previous engagement. Had we known about GW2 a couple of months earlier, we would have taken our vacation in Tenn. instead of New York. From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

Psssst. I've found a few caches in my day, and only 3 of *my* finds where under a lamp post in a parking lot. Gee, I find time to whine in the forums and still do caches that require 3hr hikes. How cool is that?

Mopar, if you keep telling lies like that I'm am going to have to issue a warning to you. I know for a fact that you regularly do caches that are MORE than a 3 hour hike. Please get your facts straight before posting in the forums

ROTFLMAO!!! This caused me to spew corn flakes (with banana slices) all over my keyboard.

:blink:

5.3k · August 22, 2004

I for one do not see a problem posting an event as much as a year or more in advance, Sometimes you have to book travel more than 6 months in advacne to get a good price. Groundspeak should change the guide line (Is it a guidline or a rule) as has been said in the past regarding other topics "Guide lines are not rules"
With the growth of geocaching, guide lines may need to be changed in the future.

Besides, what is the so called problem with posting "Events" allowing more time for people to make travel plans if they do not live in the arae of the cache.

I may atten this event, comming from Calif. I will more than likely try make this a 7 day vacation.

Except, being in California, the only way *YOU* found out about the event was via the forum post. Nobody that has to travel saw that event page get posted. So just the forum post coupled with some info on their website would have acomplished the same thing, right? Without having to claim they are special and above the rules.

Regarding forum post, you might find this hard to beleive but not all geocachers read the forums. If this event was listed in the event calender in the date it is to be held, any geocachers who are planing a vacation in which they can also do a little caching would have the option of going to this event. On my last job we had to request or vacation time for the year in Nov. with the 90 day "Guide line / Rule"

I would not have to option to go to this event.

I am still waiting for a reason why posting event evan a year in advance would create a problem, no one has come up with one.

5.3k · August 22, 2004

I for one am glad to see the event page posted, and am willing to look at it for months. WE were unable to attend GW2 due to a previous engagement. Had we known about GW2 a couple of months earlier, we would have taken our vacation in Tenn. instead of New York. From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

Psssst. I've found a few caches in my day, and only 3 of *my* finds where under a lamp post in a parking lot. Gee, I find time to whine in the forums and still do caches that require 3hr hikes. How cool is that?

Then there are those geocachers who for medical reasons can not do or are not allowed to do long hikes. What does your doing a 3 hr. hike have to do with this topic anyway.

I am still waiting for a Valid reason that posting an event a year ahead is a problem.

August 22, 2004

Sorry folks that this is such a problem for some of you all. I am sure none of the locals are complaining about seeing this for 9 months. For those who have a problem with giving others plenty of time to prepare for an event of this nature I am sorry that you feel that way. For those who are waiting for the next shoe to drop so you can say we did this or we did that I am sure you will find something to say along the way. Just keep watching. For those who want to come to GeoWoodstock and have a good time experiencing caching in Jacksonville come along we will be happy to have to you. Stay tuned to the Cachepage and the Southeast forums for updates. We are also working with the State and Local organizations to try and help get the word out about future caching plans.

I can assure you that no rules have been broken in listing the cache page for GeoWoodstock. Everything we are working on is run by our local cache approver and posted with his permission. There has not been nor will there be any slight of hand cache placements or page editing. For those who have acused us of such activity I am sorry you feel the need to say such things.

Again we invite one and all to come and spend some quality time with other cachers and enjoy the experience of GeoWoodstock3 on Memorial Day Weekend 2005.

1.1k · August 22, 2004

I for one would like to add my $.02 that I'm GLAD to see this thread, and the event page, posted so far in advance, for the benefit of all who might need more than a couple-three months to plan their travel and vacation time. I'm planning to bookmark the Waypoint and will share it with as many other cachers as I can for their benefit/planning. The great caching state of Mississippi WILL be represented!

Now, Fed, you know what *I* (and perhaps others) am/are looking forward to seeing as the date approaches: Your promised listing of the many caches BY CATEGORY available in the Jax'ville area (and it seems to me a sensible place to make that available would be via a link ON THE CACHE EVENT PAGE ITSELF to a separate page), so that those who want to crank numbers on lampposts/guardrails and other drive-ups that they might find fun (or handi-'cessible) may do so, while others who would prefer to see the more interesting sites and/or caches in the area may also do so (or, if they're like me, spend multiple days doing a combination of the above for the best sampling of what the area has to offer, and still bang some nice stats while we're at it!).

Remember, those who are traveling a fair distance will want to use their time as efficiently as possible...visiting cachers could easily be overtaken by "cache white noise" in an area as cache-dense as the Jax'ville metro area, without this sort of advance scouting help.

-Dave R. in Biloxi

Edited August 22, 2004 by drat19

August 22, 2004

I for one am glad that this event was posted as early as possible. There are many people that have work and travel plans that need time to work out. We have several people from other countries that are planning on attending and this also gives them the opportunity to plan and respond. Also I see that the event page was set up to give an ongoing update to the events and plans as they are being constructed. They are working with travel agencies to try to get reduced rates and, local business, and even out of state business and people involved in the preparations for this. Why all the whining, should we judge you by your actions and deeds or just by what you say.

Wouldn't it be better to offer assistance in getting the word out to your local community or is it better to whimper that I will have to look at this for several months.

As cachers cant we all work together or should we all just throw stones at other communities because we feels ours is better.

If you can't do that then maybe you should just do what was taught may years ago.. If you can't say something nice don't say anything.!!

1.1k · August 22, 2004

Clearly national events need much more advanced planning and announcement. I just mentioned this event to my wife and we are now officially "thinking about it" - largely because we were able to see the information at the web site. If we found this out in December it would already be too late for us to thread this into our very busy lives.

Also, having planned national events myself, I know that organizers need to be able to gage interest level much earlier than 6 months in advance.

The solution is to implement the necessary tools at the web site to accommodate them. The solution is definitely NOT to abuse the folks who are taking the initiative to create a great event. (Thank, "the Federation", whoever you are).

So I'll make a suggestions (Jeremy are you listening?): for event caches there should be a bit of data collected at set-up as to whether it is local, regional, or national. And those who want calender information routinely would then be given the option which they want to see. The three types would have different advanced dates (I would suggest maximum advanced postings allowed as follows: local - 2 months, regional - 6 months, and national - 364 days).

And while I am in idea-sharing mode (or mood): It would be useful if one could click a button on an Event Cache page to explicitly indicate interst and to sign up for an e-mail list for updates and to give organizers a vehicle for communicating with those who are interested in attending. (Maybe listserv is the right tool?) The watch-list is NOT the tool I am suggesting - that tool is anonymous and gives the organizers no info as to who and how many might actually be considering attending.

1.1k · August 22, 2004

I've posted a "sticky" thread on our state's Geocaching Web Site ( http://www.msga.net ) with the link to the event page, and a thread title of "Memorial Day Weekend '05: Start your planning now", so that those of us planning to represent our state can get it on the calendar early.

I would encourage anyone else active on their state web sites to do the same.

-Dave R. in Biloxi, MS

August 22, 2004

Thanksks Drat19 we are hoping other will do the same and in the near future our promotions committee will be contacting as many of the caching groups across the country to set up contact points to be contact point between us and them. We appreciate all the help and support.

1.3k · August 22, 2004

So everyone for 100 miles around has to get that in their monthly email and look at it on the upcoming events page and nearby caches page for 9 months? I thought they normally only listed events 3 months in advance?
Skirting the guidelines to get your event listed 6 months before anyone elses on top of the previous forum spamming about it leaves a bad taste in my mouth about how this event is being run.

It's just an event. I've been to several other events that have had hundreds of people attend. They did it without bending or breaking the rules on this site.

I personally agree that the rules shouldn't be skirted. Some people in our state were told that they could NOT list an event more than 2 months in advance PERIOD. Now I find out that the absolute hard-coded deadline is 6 months and if you just fudge the date you can get around that.

I also would hate to have to look at that on the state page for 9 months. I'm one of (many) people that use the "state" page on gc.com to keep up with geocaching in my state. If anything - it'd cause me to subliminally ignore the cache. I feel the same thing about posting a sticky for this.

I was contacted about promoting this, but the impersonal nature of it (cut/pasted) kinda turned me off too. I recall somebody getting upset in the forums about getting spammed about an event. I don't feel the same way - but I think if you're gonna take the time to look up a profile to pm - you could also take the time to type in "Dear username," in front of the cut/pasted text.

I guess, however, any publicity is good publicity.

sd

August 23, 2004

Glad to know the dates and info.. Makes long term planning alot easier. :blink: I'll be there! Looking forward to it!

1.8k · August 23, 2004

It was good to know the upcoming plans as far in advance as possible. It will certainly help in making arrangements to visit.

As far as the method of announcing it, my opinion is a firm "I don't care." There are plenty of other things to worry about. :blink:

2.5k · August 23, 2004

Or perhaps the page was edited after it was approved.

Are you saying that the approvers are stupid? We've been talking about GW3 since the day after GW2. The day after that, Jacksonville stepped up to offer. It's been widely known for over a month already.

This isn't an issue about lying to an approver. They know what Geo Woodstock is, and when that was approved as a cache page, they knew that it wouldn't occur until Summer - even if the date was omitted from the page and added later as it was approved.

You can't expect the top cachers in the world (and even those of us who aren't) to have to make plans to travel somewhere on the spur of the moment. Airlines don't like it (the closer to flight time you book, the more suspicious you look), it makes it more difficult if there's an issue (ie, booked flights, unavailable car rentals, etc) that you have to work around, and if you need time off of work, most businesses don't like employees to say "Oh, by the way, I have two week notice and I'm attending this event." They like planning as much in advance as possible.

Oh, and Mopar? How does the fact that you hike miles for caches have anything to do with this? Are you discounting people that just aren't capable of that? If I can't walk that far, does that make whatever I say not as reliable as what you say?

August 23, 2004

For cryin' out loud :blink: .... I feel this was a good thing. Alot of folks asked for as much notification as possible. Mopar, maybe you can jump up and leave at a moments notice but there are alot who may need the very advanced notice. I for one can now start to make plans (time off at work, travel plans, extra cache to spend) ASAP. BTW...if you are not a local, why should it matter to you about he notifications they are getting?? Geez Lighten UP!. There's just too much dadgum whinning, pissing and moaning in these forums over stupid SH&%T! It's just a freakin' activity we all do for recreation. AHHHHHHH!!!!

Many Chicago area cachers I have talked to about this are going to be glad that the event has been given a set date and such this far in advance. If we hike 3 miles or 3 feet to a cache we are all still cachers that enjoy it either way.

Edited August 23, 2004 by Sox Fan

August 23, 2004

It was good to know the upcoming plans as far in advance as possible. It will certainly help in making arrangements to visit.

As far as the method of announcing it, my opinion is a firm "I don't care." There are plenty of other things to worry about.

Ditto! We've still got that nagging "chicken & the egg" thing to deal with for now.

If the unfound or upcoming events page bugs some folks couldn't they always log it as a find to get it off their list & change it later? It's not about the numbers anyway, right? :blink:

2.7k · August 23, 2004

clan_Barron & fly46

You DO know who Lapaglia is, don't you?

August 23, 2004

Only speaking for myself, I don't know who LaPaglia is? Can you enlighten us?

2.7k · August 23, 2004

Only speaking for myself, I don't know who LaPaglia is? Can you enlighten us?

LaPaglia is in a unique position to understand volunteer reviewer issues. I'll leave it at that and let LaPaglia clarify any further if the need is felt.

38.2k · August 23, 2004

I personally agree that the rules shouldn't be skirted. Some people in our state were told that they could NOT list an event more than 2 months in advance PERIOD. Now I find out that the absolute hard-coded deadline is 6 months and if you just fudge the date you can get around that.

I agree. I knew about this well in advance thanks to a forum post I saw a few weeks ago. Skirting the rules to post a cache page was unecessary.

I for one would like to add my $.02 that I'm GLAD to see this thread, and the event page, posted so far in advance, for the benefit of all who might need more than a couple-three months to plan their travel and vacation time.

It would seem that a forum thread is a far better way to communicate the date and allow for planning. Forum threads are there for all who log into the forums to see. Most people won't even see the cache page unless it pops up in their zipcode search, so the cache page is useless to people in the other parts of the country anyway.

They have guidelines for these things and people shouldn't be breaking them because they think THEIR event is so important. Of course everyone thinks THEIR event is important and soon everyone will be following suit. Not a good situation. Especially when it is so uncessary. Rumour has it that the last event of this nature received quite a turnout, despite the fact that the guidelines where adhered to.

1.4k · August 23, 2004

I am still waiting for a Valid reason that posting an event a year ahead is a problem.

I've heard a few and don't think they are really big problems. I wish we could, but as long as it's a rule that is supposed to apply to everyone it's kinda selfish to think it shouldn't apply to you (I use the general you here).

6.4k · August 23, 2004

Oh, and Mopar? How does the fact that you hike miles for caches have anything to do with this? Are you discounting people that just aren't capable of that? If I can't walk that far, does that make whatever I say not as reliable as what you say?

Sorry Fly, not at all. Perhaps you should re-read the post I was quoting:

From what I have seen here in this thread are a couple of people that are actually glad that it is posted and a bunch of whiners just lurking in the forums because they have no life. Get out your GPS andd go find something and let the forums alone!

What I find amusing about this is when a TV news anchor says a geocacher needs to "get a life", there are people so upset they think the guy should resign his job. When one of the organizers of the so-called premier cache event in the world says it; it's perfectly fine.

My reply was simply to point out that I have a fair amount of finds myself, only a few hundred shy of the person making the statement. And while I may have a few hundred less, I do not live in the land of a film canister under every lamp post and a hide-a-key on every dumpster. As a matter of fact, there are only 3-4 people in this state over 500 finds. A great day of caching around here is 4-5 caches, and that's perfectly fine by me. Just don't tell me I need to "get a life" because I don't spend my weekends touring Walmart parking lots.

It's stuff like the rule bending, spamming, insulting, and commercializing of GW3 that has already caused some of the "big names" around the country to comment elsewhere that they may not attend. It's one thing for people to not attend an event because of conflicts with real life. When even a percentage of people who COULD go won't because of reasons like this, maybe it's time to look within.

Edited August 23, 2004 by Mopar

4.8k · August 23, 2004

I think consistency with the guidelines is important. I feel uncomfortable when a certain group or event gets something that others have been denied or cannot have.

I also think 9 months is not necessary for planning. Generally airfares and hotels etc. are readily available at normal prices up to a month before travel (21 days before for airfare). I have often read that it is a bad idea to book too far in advance because the airlines keep prices in the distant future high and lower them as time approaches. Prices then go up again 21 days or so before.

I also think that a large number of local groups are aware of the date already. I went to an event in Nebraska this weekend and a good number of people there were aware of it.

Mostly though, I think that equal treatment is best. How about voluntarily disabling the cache page until 6 months before the event? I don't think that would harm people and would put everything back on equal footing.

Regardless, thanks for your work on the event. :blink:

Edited August 23, 2004 by carleenp

1.2k · August 23, 2004

Another question. After looking over the Cache page I had to wonder.

Is this about GW3 or the local Group.

with a name like: GeoWoodstock III - NEFGA Style I'm not sure if its the Group of the event thats being promoted. Why the need to change the "style" of the GW events. It is my understanding that the last two were fantastic. If it ain't broke why fix it.

In my opinion, and I am only stating my opinion, NEFGA should take a step back and re-evaluate their reasons for hosting this event. Double check the guidelines on Commercial caches (events) and try to do the great job that I believe they can do. This feels like a case of enthusiasm overtaking common sense.

I have always said that I would rather have people that are too enthusiastic and have to reign them in than to have to motivate people to work harder.

I believe that the intentions of NEFGA are honorable. I also believe that they need a little balance and restraint (read common sense) in this venture. There are many thing currently at cross purposes to the guidelines with this event. All are fixable and none would hurt the event to change.

Again I truly believe that NEFGA is doing all of this because it wants to do the best it can for the Geocaching Community and the event.

Michael LaPaglia

President

C.A.C.H.E.

5.3k · August 23, 2004

They are not rules, they are Guidelinesas such they are ment to be bent and reshaped to fit the occasion, there is not good reason not to announce event caches as much as a year in advance, I would like to see a requirement that an event be posted no less than 60 days in advance.

I tried to find the guidline regarding advance notice of an event cache but I could not find the guideline, is this one of the secret guidlines, If anyone has a link please post it.

4.8k · August 23, 2004

They are not rules, they are Guidelinesas such they are ment to be bent and reshaped to fit the occasion, there is not good reason not to announce event caches as much as a year in advance, I would like to see a requirement that an event be posted no less than 60 days in advance.

I tried to find the guidline regarding advance notice of an event cache but I could not find the guideline, is this one of the secret guidlines, If anyone has a link please post it.

I believe the site software itself does not allow placement over 6 months in advance. Hence why the GW3 cache page at the moment says the date placed is in January.

Anyway, whether guidelines or rules, I prefer consistency and don't think 9 months advance time is really necessary. It seems unfair to those who have asked for more advance time in the past and were denied. It also seems unfair for any in the future that get denied. It just makes me uncomfortable. I don't feel comfortable with special treatment when I don't see it as being necessary. If I saw it as necessary, I might feel it was OK to bend the rules, but I don't feel that here.

6.4k · August 23, 2004

They are not rules, they are Guidelinesas such they are ment to be bent and reshaped to fit the occasion, there is not good reason not to announce event caches as much as a year in advance, I would like to see a requirement that an event be posted no less than 60 days in advance.

You are confusing/joining 2 different issues.

I don't see any problem at all about announcing an event well in advance. Like Carleen and I have both mentioned, it really is too early to make those kind of firm plans, but I don't mind having that day circled on the calender and in the back of my mind for when the date gets closer.

The main issue here is the event page itself. What has been mentioned before, and everyone keeps ignoring, is that nobody outside the local area would ever find the event page without being told about it elsewhere. Because of this, the claim that the event page is needed for early planning is invalid.

So, posting the event page does no real good helping out of towners find out about the event, but there are legit issues mentioned already with listing an event this far in advance.

Since 6 months advance notice is hard coded into the website, I see that as more of a rule then a guideline. You simply can not post an event any further in advance without kludging it like this event has done. The site doesn't allow it. There is no guideline to flex.

Edited August 23, 2004 by Mopar

38.2k · August 23, 2004

I believe the site software itself does not allow placement over 6 months in advance. Hence why the GW3 cache page at the moment says the date placed is in January.

I hope people are't taking a quick glance at the page and buying airline tickets for January. Now wouldn't THAT be funny!

Anyway, whether guidelines or rules, I prefer consistency and don't think 9 months advance time is really necessary. It seems unfair to those who have asked for more advance time in the past and were denied. It also seems unfair for any in the future that get denied. It just makes me uncomfortable. I don't feel comfortable with special treatment when I don't see it as being necessary

I think Carleen hit it right on the head...as always.

5.3k · August 23, 2004

If it is not posted in the guidlines it is not a guidline or a rule . As far as consistency, as I have stated as well as others, some people need more time to plan on attending event. In my last job I was required to submitt my vacation time in November for the following year. I have atteneded events by other groups (non geocahing) that are planned and posted as much as three years in advance, this is the way it happen in the real world, lots people just can not just make plans to travel cross country or interntionally on short notic, Geocacing is a world wide sport, Geowoodstock it not an event that is just for locals. I would have attended Goewoodstock 2 but I found out about it only a week before the event.

I have seen the comment that people can find out about geowoodstock by reading the forums. Not all geocachers read the forums, This is like saying we do not need to post events because anyone can read about them in the forums, what a bunch of BS

Also if the powers that be want a guide line or rule to limits the advance notice of an event they need to post that guideline or rule, If it is not posted it is not a guidline or a rule. This would be like buying a new car. then being notified after you signed the contract, that you will have to wait 3 months to get your new car because the dealer does not sell out of his stock.

5.3k · August 23, 2004

I don't see any problem at all about announcing an event well in advance. Like Carleen and I have both mentioned, it really is too early to make those kind of firm plans,

For some people it is not to early, this may be true for you but not for someone that has to make travel plans more than 6 months in advance,

6.4k · August 23, 2004

If it is not posted in the guidlines it is not a guidline or a rule . As far as consistency, as I have stated as well as others, some people need more time to plan on attending event. In my last job I was required to submitt my vacation time in November for the following year. I have atteneded events by other groups (non geocahing) that are planned and posted as much as three years in advance, this is the way it happen in the real world, lots people just can not just make plans to travel cross country or interntionally on short notic, Geocacing is a world wide sport, Geowoodstock it not an event that is just for locals. I would have attended Goewoodstock 2 but I found out about it only a week before the event.

Like I said, I have no issue with announcing the event in advance.

I have seen the comment that people can find out about geowoodstock by reading the forums. Not all geocachers read the forums, This is like saying we do not need to post events because anyone can read about them in the forums, what a bunch of BS

And yet you have STILL ignored the rest of what I said about this, so I will be blunt.

How does a geocacher in San Fransisco or Europe who does not read the forums, does not belong to a local association (I understand from other posts in this thread all the local groups gave been emailed about the event), and does not know any other geocachers, currently find out about GW3? It does not show up in their weekly notification. It does not show up on their local event calender. If they happen to be going to FL in May, and check to see if there is a local event to attend in May, they won't see it. How does someone outside of FL just happen to stumble upon this event?

Also, would this type of geocacher even go to such an event? I suspect the people who are inclined to attend an event thousands of miles away are not casual cachers. They are most likely active here in the forums and in their local caching community, and are friends with like-minded cachers. They will find out about it through those channels, not by doing random searches for events in other states or countries on mythical dates.

Also if the powers that be want a guide line or rule to limits the advance notice of an event they need to post that guideline or rule, If it is not posted it is not a guidline or a rule. This would be like buying a new car. then being notified after you signed the contract, that you will have to wait 3 months to get your new car because the dealer does not sell out of his stock.

And how many times do you walk into a dealership the first time and drive out with a new car 15 minutes later? This is more like going to buy a new car and being told that you need to wait for a credit check before they will approve your purchase.

38.2k · August 23, 2004

I have seen the comment that people can find out about geowoodstock by reading the forums. Not all geocachers read the forums, This is like saying we do not need to post events because anyone can read about them in the forums, what a bunch of BS

So explain how the cache page is going to help anybody who lives further than 100 miles from the location to find out about the event. Since I typically don't search for caches in Jacksonville, it won't show up on my search pages, or notification list and I'm fairly certain that you won't see it if you do a zipcode search from your home.

Geowoodstock it not an event that is just for locals. I would have attended Goewoodstock 2 but I found out about it only a week before the event.

And how far in advance was that cache page created? I'm sure quite a bit more than a week ahead of time. And you missed it anyway, so obviously the page serves no real purpose to anyone but locals.

Edited August 23, 2004 by briansnat

August 23, 2004

Thanks so much for the advanced notice. Now I have time to plan and organize my trip. Some people will gripe about anything. Ignore them and focus on the 99% that appreciate the hard work that goes into organizing such a huge event. I look forward to heading south in May to visit and cache.

Deermark

August 23, 2004

I do not live in the land of a film canister under every lamp post and a hide-a-key on every dumpster. As a matter of fact, there are only 3-4 people in this state over 500 finds. A great day of caching around here is 4-5 caches, and that's perfectly fine by me. Just don't tell me I need to "get a life" because I don't spend my weekends touring Walmart parking lots.

I live in the land of which you speak (Jacksonville, Fl) and I must say that of my finds here in Northeast Florida only 3 have been lightpole hides (and they were parts of a multi), NONE have been anything attached to or near a dumpster (OK, there was one. It was this big ol' 12"X36"x6" plastic sweater box that you had to enter the woods near a dumpster) and only one has been in a Wal-Mart parking lot. I'm glad that you live in an rural enough area where you can do 500 3 hour long cache hikes - I respect that. I live in an area without as much wide open spaces (but we do have a bunch of parks) so don't disrespect my finds (or anybody else's) just because I only have to walk 40 foot from my Jeep to the cache. We have about 30 active cachers in the area so that just translates into a lot of caches to find. Finally, the SuzyQ's telling you to get a life has nothing to do with how many caches you've found (or how difficult they were to reach). The point was that your time complaining about Geowoodstock (as well as my time complaining about your complaining <_< ) could be better spent caching instead of complaining about others in the forums

Announcing Geowoodstock 3

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