Offset Cache Type

[+Zartimus]

As cezanne has pointed out before, there may be situation or locations where it is impossible to give the coordinates of the cache, but where it is easily possible to give the coords of a nearby location.

See here for an example:

 

subwA1y

 

This is no regular, as the container is not at the coordinates and it is definitely no multi, as there is only one stage.

Let's put it simple: it's an Offset Cache

.

 

BS/2

What I'm getting from this discussion and the posted guidelines which have changed my thinking somewhat is that offset should probably indicate some sort of numerical trick at the posted co-ords, taking numbers off street signs, info of historical plaques, etc. Short of an actual puzzle to figure out.

 

I'm thinking that kind of cache, you mention above and some others I have could be called a 're-direct', in that they feature a single tag that leads right to the cache, differenciating them somewhat from your typical long multi.

Edited August 19, 2004 by Zartimus

[+Renegade Knight]

If we are going to have offset caches they should be kept simple. Start at point A and from there get to point B. How doesn't matter so long as the offset cache provies the way.

[+RJFerret]

I feel you guys are trying to pervert a means into a category.

 

subwA1y

 

This is no regular, as the container is not at the coordinates and it is definitely no multi, as there is only one stage.

 

That is a Puzzle cache. In fact, I have a similar cache (listed as multi because that was the original intention) where finders have complained that it should have been listed as Puzzle 'cause there was math involved (less than in your example).

 

I didn't change it 'cause the math was so elementary--still, a lot of folks don't want to think on the weekends.

 

offset should probably indicate some sort of numerical trick

 

Nope. 'Cause then what do you use for a micro containing coords to the final? (The traditional definition of Offset as the final is offset from the listed coords?)

 

Just because you might pull dates from a monument at the town center and add numbers to get the coords of the final doesn't make it special...

 

Heck, then if the monument leads you to a cemetary where you get more numbers are you going to want a "double-offset" category?

 

We have enough mis-categorized geocaches listed now without making the categories so specialized that they all become incorrectly listed (or we spend more forum time discussing semantics!)

 

Oy,

 

Randy

[+Hemlock]

Seems like the easiest solution at this point is to just remove the paragraph about "offset" caches from the description page. If the term was never suggested there, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

[+BalkanSabranje]

subwA1y

 

This is no regular, as the container is not at the coordinates and it is definitely no multi, as there is only one stage.

 

That is a Puzzle cache. In fact, I have a similar cache (listed as multi because that was the original intention) where finders have complained that it should have been listed as Puzzle 'cause there was math involved (less than in your example).

Well, there is no puzzle at all at SubwA1y, it is just technically impossible to receive any GPS signals in a tunnel...

Where's the puzzle in the advice: "Go to point A or B, enter the tunnel and grab the cache that lies in the center of the tunnel"?

It would have been easy to calculate the correct position of the cache, but what's the point in it, if you can't find the spot with a GPSr??

 

BS/2

[+The Blue Quasar]

After enjoying this thread very much, as I do enjoy a good debate, I'm going to give it a try.

 

I think everyone can agree that.....

 

-->If the posted co-ordinates are for the cache container, then it's a TRADITIONAL CACHE

-->If the end result is getting a Web Cam Photo of yourself, then it's a WEB CAM CACHE

-->If a bunch of geocachers get together to to talk geocaching, then it's an EVENT CACHE

-->If there is no container and no logbook just a fixed point of interest, then it's a VIRTUAL CACHE

 

The real arguement or debate here is over the terms "MULTI, OFFSET and PUZZLE/MYSTERY"

 

 

To my way of thinking... if I go to the posted co-ordinates and at that location I find something that makes me enter a new set of co-ordinates to continue then I am doing a MULTI CACHE. It doesn't matter if it is the next stop or twenty five stops later that I get to the final geocache container. If every step or stage along the way I am required to enter a new set of co-ordinates to continue then I am doing a MULTI CACHE. So one offset, or numerous offsets are a MULTI CACHE.

 

If however I am given numerous co-ordinates within a cache description and at each of those co-ordinates I receive a picture, or a number or symbol and I do NOT need to work anything out to find the next piece of clue until I have ALL of the parts complete, then I am doing a PUZZLE CACHE. A PUZZLE is taking a bunch of pieces and reconfiguring them to form a solution. Simply stepping from one location to another is not a PUZZLE, it's a MULTI CACHE.

 

MYSTERY CACHE???? I don't see that at all. I cannot come up with an example of a Mystery that isn't a Puzzle, with respect to geocaching.

 

So my advice is.....

 

Remove the word OFFSET as it is nothing more than a fancy term for a specific kind of MULTI.

Remove the word MYSTERY as it only inspires people to not be as accurate about catagorizing their caches.

 

The Blue Quasar

[+BalkanSabranje]

To my way of thinking... if I go to the posted co-ordinates and at that location I find something that makes me enter a new set of co-ordinates to continue then I am doing a MULTI CACHE.  It doesn't matter if it is the next stop or twenty five stops later that I get to the final geocache container.  If every step or stage along the way I am required to enter a new set of co-ordinates to continue then I am doing a MULTI CACHE. So one offset, or numerous offsets are a MULTI CACHE.

Reconsider our example: You get the coordinates for Point A and the instruction how to get from there to the Cache (e.g.: Point A ist the entrance to a cave or a flume/ravine with no GPS reception; you are supposed to enter and walk 15 meters, then turn left and find the cache at an altitude of 2 m above ground).

So obviously only one set of cordinates is involved, still its not tradidional, as the cache is off the given coordinates - hence this type is called "offset cache".

Simple, isn't it?!

[+The Blue Quasar]

That is an interesting case example, and around our area that idea has come up before.... so my take on it is, using your statement of

 

(e.g.: Point A ist the entrance to a cave or a flume/ravine with no GPS reception; you are supposed to enter and walk 15 meters, then turn left and find the cache at an altitude of 2 m above ground)

 

It could be a LETTERBOX since the listed co-ords are the starting point and then once you arrive there you use non-co-ordinate movement to arrive at the site.

 

It could be a MULTI CACHE since you have arrived at one stage, and from that stage are able to access the cache without having to decode anything.

 

It could be a TRADITIONAL since you are giving the last possible co-ords and to assist people you tell them how to find it due to the poor reception. However, in this cache if it was me, I would have extrapolated co-ordinates based on the fact that the GPS does not work in a cave. Chance are pretty high that the cacher will be approaching the Cave Entrance and having the GPS arrow pointing into the cave 15m would suffice to tell them 'go in the cave' but I would have included text to explain that too.

 

After typing each out, I would still say it is a MULTI CACHE. I'll use Zartimus's earlier idea as my example.

 

The co-ordinates posted bring you to a beautiful vista, let's say a waterfall, and there at the co-ords is a look-out with a sign to describe the spot. Either using info on the sign, or like Zartimus likes to do, the tag located at the stage, you are able to recalculate (either in the GPS or your head) how to get to the next place. That meaning entering new co-ords or simply walking a pre-determined amount of distance to get the cache. Again, this is a MULTI CACHE. There is no PUZZLE to solve or MYSTERY to figure out.

 

Calling it an OFFSET is just a fancy term for saying it's a two step MULTI. I can see that it is simple to call it an OFFSET, which currently falls under the definition of MULTI CACHE. To me, no one has yet to prove that an OFFSET is not a MULTI, and therefore there is nothing unique about an OFFSET.

 

And by the way, since I forgot LETTERBOX in my earlier post. To me, a LETTERBOX requires the seeker to start at a posted co-ordinate. Then the seeker might as well turn off the GPS as it will no longer help them. By following clues, similar to following a pirates treasure map or a listing of steps the seeker will find the cache container.

 

As in....

 

1)...Park at co-ords listed

2)...Follow the path down to the first split, then take the rightside path

3)...At the rock with the PVC pipe at the base go up the slope 10 feet

4)...Find the tree with the spilt trunk

5)...The cache is inside the root ball.

 

The cache could be any distance away, but you have the steps to find it without a GPS.

 

The Blue Quasar

Edited August 27, 2004 by The Blue Quasar