Found And Destroyed Or Just Destroyed

[+lostinflorida]

I have two marks PE1899 and PE0304 that I can confirm as destroyed by historical,verbal and observation. How should I mark them. Ego says mark and found and then destroyed but I did not find the marker because they no longer there.. NGS has 1899 as destroyed but 0304 as recovered in 86.

 

How do you think I should Mark them

[+sf_troop]

I'd have a hard time justifying a found log if I didn't actually see the mark. One of the first BM's I looked for KK0298, I missed by a couple months. Darn construction crews and their efforts to make our daily travels though intersections a little easier. Sometimes we just have to take our lumps and move on to the next one I guess.

[+lostinflorida]

Thats why I am stuck here I took the time and effort to find out it had been destroyed. So I found out that it is destroyed. And I I take the next step it is filling out the data sheet at NGS or sending emails with Pics attached to the woman at NGS. Perhaps this is an issue for ground speak itself and how they are going to handle or not handle. Finding the two other BM,s today was easy. Was at a cache close to a summit where I figured there had to be at least one. Got 2

 

Thanks for your reply

[+GeckoGeek]

I have two marks PE1899 and PE0304 that I can confirm as destroyed by historical,verbal and observation. How should I mark them. Ego says mark and found and then destroyed but I did not find the marker because they no longer there.

I guess it depends on if you're in this for the total scores or not. It is destroyed and should be marked as such. There has been some argument for changing "destroyed" to "Found in destroyed condition" would would make better sense from a Geocaching score issue and help prevent the "I can't find it so it must be destroyed" syndrome we sometimes see. But so far nothing has happened along those lines.

 

At the end of the day, I don't know as it really matters how you log it with Geocaching. You log will speak for itself and we know what effort it took to do that. To log a solid "destroyed" is almost always more work then a find. Your fellow benchmarkers understand that.

[kc2ixe]

I've sent about 6 destroyed notes into Deb - a couple of them were just pointing out that the datasheets already had notes by the guy who had destroyed them.

 

The others were intersection stations that I either had personally seen destroyed in the past, ot had good photos of what the station looked like, and what the area is now. The most interesting of those was "Little Brown Stack" which had no description. I was able to find some photos at the local historical society of the site, and sure enough, there was a factory of some sort with a brown smoke stack (little comes from Little Neck Bay). Took photos of the site today - LONG gone there was a highway put in that spot in the 1930s!!!

[+seventhings]

I'm certainly not the world's expert, but here are the standards I use to log DESTROYED benchmarks.

 

If I can't find a mark because the old school on which the disk was mounted was razed and replaced with a new school, or the bridge on which the disk was mounted was replaced with a new bridge, I log these as DIDN'T FIND IT on Geocaching.com. When I update the NGS database, I log these as NOT FOUND and note the building/bridge/etc changes that I've observed.

 

If I look for a disk and find only a monument with a stem protruding and I am absolutely, positively beyond-a-shadow-of-a-doubt and to-a-metaphysical-certitude that the disk I seek was once attached to that stem. I log it FOUND IT on Geocaching.com, and then include in the post that I FOUND IT DESTROYED. This applies only to marks with ADJUSTED coordinates. The location of marks with SCALED coordinates can never be ascertained to a sufficient degree of certainty to warrant a FOUND DESTROYED. If I can't find a mark with scaled coordinates, I log it as DIDN'T FIND IT, no matter what else I find at the described location. When I post the recovery of a FOUND DESTROYED to NGS, I do it via e-mail to Deb Brown. She has instructed me in each case to go back and post these as RECOVERED IN POOR CONDITION on the NGS site.

 

The only marks that I log as DESTROYED on Geocaching.com are intersection stations that are either (1) obviously not there anymore or, (2) rebuilt with a cornerstone date after the last observed date and/or the new structure does not conform to the old described structure. The (1)'s are easy - even I can tell when a water tank no longer stands at the described location and its listed (usually) adjusted coordinates. The (2)'s may be a bit tougher - happens with many old churches and happens a lot with watertanks. Many of those old water tanks that were first observed in 1934 have been replaced by late 20th Century waterspheres and the like. When I post a DESTROYED to the NGS database, I do so via e-mail to Deb Brown. So far, she's accepted several of my DESTROYEDs.

 

will