A Cache Title

July 26, 2004

I recently submitted a cache with another cacher that has a questionable title. I would like opinions from some of the cachers with children, if they find the cache name offensive.

The name of the cache is "No Bitchin in the Kitchin". Its not approved yet, so you can't see it. Its a recipe exchange. I like the name i picked, but I realize parents may feel differently.

So whaddya think?

4.7k · July 26, 2004

i vote no.

lke the recipe idea. don't care for the name.

2.6k · July 26, 2004

I can't speak as a concerned parent, because I'm neither of those things, but how about "No Whiners in the Diner"?

July 26, 2004

I think it is hilarious, and I am one of those who has the "concerned parents". I guess you cant win them all, but good luck.

Edited July 26, 2004 by Beta Test

2k · July 26, 2004

Doubt it would be approved. If you know it's questionable why even push it?

This is a family oriented site and my seven year old son goes with me and lot and stands over my shoulder why we look up caches so I would vote against it also.

2.8k · July 26, 2004

Doesn't bother me. I have 2 girls (one is 10 and the other almost 9) but I say a lot worse around them, especially on some cache hunts

Unless the name is integral to the cache, maybe you could change it so it's one less thing you have to worry about somebody having an issue with.

July 26, 2004

<snip> Its a recipe exchange. <snip>

Help a newbie here...what's a recipe exchange? I bring one of my own to put in and take one of yours? So then the next person who comes can choose to take mine or yours and leaves one of their own? I guess I don't get that concept yet - although I have to admit there's a lot I don't get YET...lol I guess I'm just used to "traditional" recipe exchanges where you bring one recipe (with a copy for each person) and take back a LOT (one from each person) so just getting one is a new concept for me...

Just clarifying the idea part.

For the name part - it doesn't bother me, but then I'm not a parent BUT I can see where it would definitely offend many others...so I like Auntie's suggestion!

JMHO

pam

July 26, 2004

I don't see the big deal. I don't have kids but here's the conversation as I see it (in fact I've had and heard dicsussions like with with my nephew):

Kid: Daddy what does B-itchin mean?

Me: It's Bitchin son and it means complaining. So the cache is "no complaining in the kitchen" and the owner has asked people to exchange recipes in his cache so that people can get good meal ideas and they're family's won't complain about always having the "same old thing".

Done, over, no big deal.

Thorin

8.4k · July 26, 2004

The name of the cache is "No Bitchin in the Kitchin".

So whaddya think?

Everyone has a television in their home. Those words (and much worse. Have you SEEN South Park?) are allowed by the FCC for general broadcast even after "the wardrobe malfunction heard round the world." It should not be disapproved for the title alone. Sensitive PC types be damned.

NOW..........

Would anyone have a problem with the title of a new project of mine?

I got an idea from the Burning Man site yesterday: (Clicky, clicky, and then hit the GO button for more Barbie inspired madness,)

Barbie Death Camp & Trading Post

The Cast Off, here in Mammoth, has all these barbies for like, a buck, and well......

Edited July 26, 2004 by Snoogans

2.6k · July 26, 2004

Barbie Death Camp & Trading Post

Oh, man, I can just see that conversation!

"No, no, honey...Barbie's fine. We just sent her to a big farm upstate, where there's room for her to run around and there are lots of other Barbies for her to play with..."

July 26, 2004

I like it. It rhymes. What else rhymes with kitchen? Stichin'?

July 26, 2004

i say why not? when i searched for 'hell' in cache titles i got back 222 results (but some where shell, and not hell, you get my point) i search dadgum and i got back 20 caches. i say why not. as for the kid factor how many 'kids' go online, download the coords, drive themselves to a cache area and look for a cache themselves? just my .02

aj

Edited July 26, 2004 by AJ of Dunbar

7.2k · July 26, 2004

American Heritage Dictionary doesn't consider the word "bitch" obscene. In fact, it is only considered offensive when used to discribe a woman.

So, I don't have a problem with it.

But, then again, you can't please everyone. Somebody is likely to take offense.

3.5k · July 26, 2004

So whaddya think?

I think you could do better.

But it's your cache.

Bret

3k · July 26, 2004

The title doesn't bother me but it will someone and if your approver approves the cache they may get an ear full complaining about the name so it puts them in a tough spot whether they think it's fine or not.

JMHO

July 26, 2004

I agree with CyBret.

Give them an inch and they'll take a mile.

5.7k · July 26, 2004

I can totally relate here. The word kitchen gives me the heebie geebies. No way I would approve any cache with the word kitchen in the title (if I were an approver).

--Marky

July 26, 2004

The name of the cache is "No Bitchin in the Kitchin". [...] I like the name i picked, but I realize parents may feel differently.

My dictionary says "lamenting", "complaining". So how could this possibly be a parents' issue???

BS/2

July 26, 2004

I can totally relate here. The word kitchen gives me the heebie geebies. No way I would approve any cache with the word kitchen in the title (if I were an approver).

--Marky

OMG this is actually making me LOL here!

2.6k · July 26, 2004

So how could this possibly be a parents' issue???

What a word means is only part of the story. Surely, that's true in all languages...?

2.5k · July 26, 2004

Well, as a teacher I can tell you that if a student were overheard saying that phrase in the hallway of the high school I teach at, they would be reprimanded for 'using course or vulgar language' by the school authorities. So perhaps we don't want to encourage its use?

I think that perhaps you would be happier with a more positive sounding title, since you seem unconfortable with this one.

July 26, 2004

Well, as a teacher I can tell you that if a student were overheard saying that phrase in the hallway of the high school I teach at, they would be reprimanded for 'using course or vulgar language' by the school authorities. So perhaps we don't want to encourage its use?

Well, speaking as a bloody lawyer, and supposing we are talking about a public school, I'd certainly try to sue the ministry of education, the local school authorities and you as the teacher for impeding my kid's freedom of speech.

Or, putting, it differently: If you feel that you have to "reprimand" someone for using words that seem inappropriate for you, doesn't this tell more about you than about the kid (or the cache)?

BS/2

July 26, 2004

I decided to change the name of the cache. I didn't feel it was all that bad, but I'm not a parent either. As far as it promoting foul language, well, you can turn on cable and get an ear and an eyeful. I got the phrase "No bitchin in the kitchin" from a country store trinket that my aunt has hanging in her kitchen.

Happy caching and thx for all the input. :blink:

Edited July 26, 2004 by Polgara

1.8k · July 26, 2004

I work in the field of veterinary medicine and use the word "bitch" all the time profesionally. I flipped open a copy of the USDA Animal Welfare Act Regulations, which I happened to have on my desk, and counted the word "bitch" four times on one page of this document.

Anyone offended by the non-derogatory use of this word shouldn't ever deal with federal legislation or dogs. :blink:

July 26, 2004

Well, as a teacher I can tell you that if a student were overheard saying that phrase in the hallway of the high school I teach at, they would be reprimanded for 'using course or vulgar language' by the school authorities. So perhaps we don't want to encourage its use?

Well, speaking as a bloody lawyer, and supposing we are talking about a public school, I'd certainly try to sue the ministry of education, the local school authorities and you as the teacher for impeding my kid's freedom of speech.

Or, putting, it differently: If you feel that you have to "reprimand" someone for using words that seem inappropriate for you, doesn't this tell more about you than about the kid (or the cache)?

BS/2

At least where I live the schools definately have the right to regulate the language in the halls and the classroom. You also can't wear clothing with vulgar words or that advertise drugs. It is all deemd to be "disruptive to education" They can also censor the school newspapers as well since they are the "owners".

7.2k · July 26, 2004

... they would be reprimanded for 'using course or vulgar language' by the school authorities.

It would definitely be a shame that any cache was not approved because a word might be perceived as offensive to some yet is not listed as such in moderm dictionaries in this context.

4.2k · July 26, 2004

Daddy of a almost 6-year old girl.

No worries here. If that was the worst thing I have to worry about protecting her from, I'd be a happy guy.

2.5k · July 26, 2004

Oh Polgara, I didn't mean to imply that you were promoting foul language! Sorry if it sounded that way.

7.2k · July 26, 2004

You also can't wear clothing with vulgar words or that advertise drugs. It is all deemd to be "disruptive to education"

While I understand and appreciate the school's right to keep a handle on the student body, would a student with a shirt or button that said "Bitchin!" be repremanded for vulgar or offensive language?

What about "Stuff?"

July 26, 2004

When a user can use evelbastard as a userId, what is the issue here?

(Not that I take any issue with either)

July 26, 2004

While I understand and appreciate the school's right to keep a handle on the student body, would a student with a shirt or button that said "Bitchin!" be repremanded for vulgar or offensive language?

What about "Stuff?"

Well we all know "Stuff" Happens

July 26, 2004

No. How about fixin in the kitchen?

Edited July 26, 2004 by Team Flying Dachshund

2.1k · July 26, 2004

I can totally relate here. The word kitchen gives me the heebie geebies. No way I would approve any cache with the word kitchen in the title (if I were an approver).

--Marky

OMG this is actually making me LOL here!

Marky your too bad - got me LOL too - thanx

2.5k · July 26, 2004

I don't have a problem with the name you were planning on, but I am quite sure someone out there would complain..

There's a cache out here that's hidden in a screw top container from Skoal. The container was emptied, washed out well, and then only holds a log book. There is NO chew in the container, and yet people complain to the owner about the container. Hey, it's keeping the LOG BOOK dry, isn't it?

July 26, 2004

I think the name was cute.

There was a thread about this a while back:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=59848

Later,

Jennifer

7.3k · July 26, 2004

I'm not going to even get into wether or not the word is appropriate or not.

I just wanted to take issue with how kids are influenced. I heard a couple of times about how this sort of language is pervasive in tv, and perhaps schools, and even from parents.

I just want people to understand that this exposure is not universal. You cannot assume that a child is being exposed to this in their daily life. Take my children, for example. We cannot recieve tv, since we live up a canyon. And we have chosen not to get cable tv. We also homeschool, so our kids are not hearing it there. We, and our friends, do not use that sort of terminology in our daily lives.

Now, while my children are young, I could just skip by the cache, and they would never know. But someday they will be older, and possibly may see it later.

It may not seem to be an issue, but like someone else mentioned, each time these things happen, the next time it will be a little easier, until you could be suprised what could be allowed.

Remember:family friendly. :blink: :blink:

7.2k · July 26, 2004

Believe me, what ever your level of prudishness, there is someone else that will tsk you as less than ideal in their eyes.

I think society has already accepted this word, in this context, as acceptable slang.

7.3k · July 26, 2004

Believe me, what ever your level of prudishness, there is someone else that will tsk you as less than ideal in their eyes.

I think society has already accepted this word, in this context, as acceptable slang.

Actually, as you will notice in my post, I wasn't saying if the word was bad, or not. I just was saying that you cannot automatically assume that everyone has been exposed, or has the same ideas as everyone else about certain words. :blink:

4.1k · July 26, 2004

I decided to change the name of the cache. I didn't feel it was all that bad, but I'm not a parent either. As far as it promoting foul language, well, you can turn on cable and get an ear and an eyeful. I got the phrase "No bitchin in the kitchin" from a country store trinket that my aunt has hanging in her kitchen.

Happy caching and thx for all the input.

:blink:

Inquiring minds want to know....just what are you going to name your cache?

I still vote for the 'No Bitchin' in the Kitchen'. It has a "STYLE" all to it's own.

If people don't like it, they do not have to go find it. They just should quite their 'Bitchin'!!

Shirley~

7.2k · July 26, 2004

Actually, as you will notice in my post...

Yeah, I'm going to blame it on a short attention span I have sometimes. :blink:

:blink:

July 26, 2004

Please go with Auntie's suggestion. It's not worth the hassle, is it? Surely there have to be better ways of creating/teaching freedom of speech.

And yes, if a father explained it to a child and the child repeated it at school, disciplinary action would follow in many of our nation's schools. As a teacher, when it's happened at my school, we'd hear a much bigger uproar if no action was taken.

You can always argue the semantics of words like "stuff" that Coyote Red mentioned, but the courts (and possibly this site) may be more interested in intent since such words when spoken in a school hallway are often aimed at someone. In recent cases involving buttons and t-shirts with controversial slogans, the outcome seems to depend on existing school policies regarding "learning distractions," whether the word/phrase is targeting another person/group, and that county/state's community values.

The current geocaching guidelines may not address your word usage directly, but does it fit the "family-friendly" idea if you can see that many wouldn't like it?

July 26, 2004

I decided to change the name of the cache. I didn't feel it was all that bad, but I'm not a parent either. As far as it promoting foul language, well, you can turn on cable and get an ear and an eyeful. I got the phrase "No bitchin in the kitchin" from a country store trinket that my aunt has hanging in her kitchen.

Happy caching and thx for all the input.

Inquiring minds want to know....just what are you going to name your cache?

I still vote for the 'No Bitchin' in the Kitchen'. It has a "STYLE" all to it's own.

If people don't like it, they do not have to go find it. They just should quite their 'Bitchin'!!

Shirley~

I hid this one with my mom, its her first hide. We changed the name to THe Iron Chef, and added a small twist to its recipe theme.

July 26, 2004

I like your decision, your new cache name, and hope you're the recipient of many finders and fun logs to read.

Disclaimer: This is not to imply that you were trying to be inappropriate with your use of slang in the former title. :blink:

4.1k · July 26, 2004

From the male 'oldfart'....Just remember this is a "family" site not a "kid" site. When it becomes for kids only is when I QUIT!

Obviously people who posted here don't let their kids watch TV if they are that easily offended.

You have to give the kids more credit than you are willing to. Just drive past a bunch of kids playing in the streets and you will probably hear stronger language than "bitchin".

I know it is so difficult to tell your children that some words are not allowed for their use and they must WAIT until they are older and wiser before deciding on their uses. That's why the word "NO" was invented. Such a simple concept.

There is no way to protect your child 100% from the real world. The best you can do is try to explain things in terms they understand.

I'm not a kid (except at heart) and don't wish to be treated as such.

John

July 26, 2004

My 5 & 8 year olds do not read the cache pages at this time. The follow the little arrow and distance display and then look high and low for the cache. I myself would not have chosen the word in question so therefor I recommend a change.

7.3k · July 26, 2004

From the male 'oldfart'....Just remember this is a "family" site not a "kid" site. When it becomes for kids only is when I QUIT!

Obviously people who posted here don't let their kids watch TV if they are that easily offended.

You have to give the kids more credit than you are willing to. Just drive past a bunch of kids playing in the streets and you will probably hear stronger language than "bitchin".

I know it is so difficult to tell your children that some words are not allowed for their use and they must WAIT until they are older and wiser before deciding on their uses. That's why the word "NO" was invented. Such a simple concept.

There is no way to protect your child 100% from the real world. The best you can do is try to explain things in terms they understand.

I'm not a kid (except at heart) and don't wish to be treated as such.

John

Yet again, I still was not saying if the word was bad or not, and I have not been offended.

I was just questioning the supposision that everyone has the same standards or exposure.

I understand that my kids will get exposed to things, and I never said that they have never heard some of these words. I just was saying that we should be carefull not to be loose in our attitudes, and thereby slip in our standards to a point that it does become a problem. Just because you can hear all sorts of words out of your window as you drive along, doesn't suddenly mean that we should post them here.

I did not say that you are a child, for I don't believe that it is just children that should be careful what they hear or say. Just because you are an adult, does not mean you should say, "no one is watching over me any more, so I can do and say anything that I want."

7.3k · July 26, 2004

2k · July 27, 2004

I don't have a problem with it,

22k · July 27, 2004

Removing as it may be taken the wrong way.

No, not because of what Criminal said.

Just because it's not always a good idea to talk about someone's mother. No matter how well meaning.

Edited July 27, 2004 by Elf Danach

5.9k · July 27, 2004

What the Fudge? It's a great name, leave it as is. I a dadgum concerned parent myself and bitchin isn't a "bad" word.

I found four pages of cache names that include the word "kill", five that include the word "hate", and a couple caches that use the word "crap".

Chill everyone, there are far worse things to go bald over.

Edited July 27, 2004 by Criminal

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