National Geo Topo! Compatibility

[+zenner]

I purchased National Geographics TOPO! State Series (Northeast ver 3.4.3) and am having trouble finding a way to convert waypoints that are suitable to upload to a Garmin 60cs. They don't support the 60cs--nor any "common" formats. Customer Support did say it is likely that an upgrade will be available by end of summer tht supports geocaching and the 60cs...but I'm keen on finding a solution sooner than that.

 

Some notes: They support a (proprietary) protocol called ".tpo" (and unfortunately stopped supporting .tpg) as well as "CSV". I looked for a protocol conversion utility that would allow me to import to Easygps or Mapsource (either would allow me to load via USB to a 60cs)...to no avail. I've messed around with Babel to see if I could decipher the CSV format, but all I get are "0's" in all the felds when I convert to gpx.

 

Anyway, if anyone knows a solution, please let me know!

 

Thank you,

 

Hal Zenner

[+-=(GEO)=-]

I believe that GPSBabel can handle NG TOPO waypoints. It will also allow you to convert to .LOC for EasyGPS.

 

Hummm... On second thought, GPSBabel seems to handle .tpg only. Sorry.

Edited July 5, 2004 by -=(GEO)=-

[+Bilder]

I have TOPO software and there is an option to send the waypoint data directly to your GPS.

 

I forget where the option is (I am at work), but it is on one of the pull down menus. Should be a bunch of options for sending data to a handheld or GPS. You can set up your GPS model and such and it will send the waypoints right to it.

 

I have a legend and can send and receive waypoints to the TOPO software with no trouble.

[+zenner]

I have TOPO software and there is an option to send the waypoint data directly to your GPS.

 

I forget where the option is (I am at work), but it is on one of the pull down menus.  Should be a bunch of options for sending data to a handheld or GPS.  You can set up your GPS model and such and it will send the waypoints right to it.

 

I have a legend and can send and receive waypoints to the TOPO software with no trouble.

Yes, TOPO! does support downloading waypoints to various GPS devices, but does not support the 60cs. They also don't support USB yet.

 

Prior to TOPO! ver 3.x, NG supported a format called .tpg (in fact their documentation still describes this format) and this conveyed waypoint information. Babel was able to parse .tpg and convert to .gpx or .loc ... and I would have been fine. However, NG now only supports .tpo (which Babel does not support) and csv (which they do support, but can't figure out how to use).

 

This industry is rife with proprietary protocols. Every vendor seems to have their own spin; and each time I look at a product it has a serious deficiency in one or more area. Some "products" are trying to overcome this (like GSAK and Babel), but for the most part the vendors need to start thinking about interoperability.

 

Thanks...Hal

[+embra]

Donate to Robert's 60CS fund and he'll get the 60CS into the Babel fold that much more quickly.

[+JohnnyVegas]

I have TOPO software and there is an option to send the waypoint data directly to your GPS.

 

I forget where the option is (I am at work), but it is on one of the pull down menus.  Should be a bunch of options for sending data to a handheld or GPS.  You can set up your GPS model and such and it will send the waypoints right to it.

 

I have a legend and can send and receive waypoints to the TOPO software with no trouble.

Yes, TOPO! does support downloading waypoints to various GPS devices, but does not support the 60cs. They also don't support USB yet.

 

Prior to TOPO! ver 3.x, NG supported a format called .tpg (in fact their documentation still describes this format) and this conveyed waypoint information. Babel was able to parse .tpg and convert to .gpx or .loc ... and I would have been fine. However, NG now only supports .tpo (which Babel does not support) and csv (which they do support, but can't figure out how to use).

 

This industry is rife with proprietary protocols. Every vendor seems to have their own spin; and each time I look at a product it has a serious deficiency in one or more area. Some "products" are trying to overcome this (like GSAK and Babel), but for the most part the vendors need to start thinking about interoperability.

 

Thanks...Hal

To me, I do not see why Garmin does not use the same protocols for all their GPS products. At least it has beem my experiance that with any Magellan GPS I have used I did not have to wait for an upgrade to use NG Topo. It is also nice that all my Magellan GPSr use the same data cable and power cable. The only reason Garmin models do not use the same cable is so that the reatailers have to spend more money on inventory. lets not forget the Garmin proprietary chip for the E-map and street pilots, just another way to rip off the customers. They could have used and SD card, but then they would not ba able rake the consumers for the price of the chip. But people seem to rave about Garmin while they are being taken advantage of.

Edited July 6, 2004 by JohnnyVegas

[+Record Holders]

The only reason Garmin models do not use the same cable is so that the reatailers have to spend more money on inventory.

This kind of statement serves no use but to misinform and is obviously just wrong. No one could think that Garmin upgraded to USB "so that the reatailers (sp) have to spend more money on inventory". Garmin upgraded to a better technology (albeit maybe a little slowly), but still allow those that could only handle serial a way out by including two ports on the back of the 60.

 

lets not forget the Garmin proprietary chip for the E-map and street pilots, just another way to rip off the customers. They could have used and SD card, but then they would not ba able rake the consumers for the price of the chip.

This is also wrong, because when the E-map and original streetpilots were designed there were no SD cards to be bought.

 

There are plenty of things to rag on Garmin for that are factual, so please stick to those or if you are going to just spout your opinion, don't try to surround them with made up "facts".

 

Back to the original question, once solution is to buy a serial cable and connect it to the back of your 60. Topo! should handle that fine.

[+zenner]

The only reason Garmin models do not use the same cable is so that the reatailers have to spend more money on inventory.

This kind of statement serves no use but to misinform and is obviously just wrong. No one could think that Garmin upgraded to USB "so that the reatailers (sp) have to spend more money on inventory". Garmin upgraded to a better technology (albeit maybe a little slowly), but still allow those that could only handle serial a way out by including two ports on the back of the 60.

 

lets not forget the Garmin proprietary chip for the E-map and street pilots, just another way to rip off the customers. They could have used and SD card, but then they would not ba able rake the consumers for the price of the chip.

This is also wrong, because when the E-map and original streetpilots were designed there were no SD cards to be bought.

 

There are plenty of things to rag on Garmin for that are factual, so please stick to those or if you are going to just spout your opinion, don't try to surround them with made up "facts".

 

Back to the original question, once solution is to buy a serial cable and connect it to the back of your 60. Topo! should handle that fine.

TOPO! does not support the Garmin 60cs via serial or USB. When you look at their "compatibility" list, you won't find the 60cs. This is not to say that some other "compatible" model might work via a serial interface...but I would assume the risk of any damage incurred if the download failed. That's why vendors list models they have actually tested and confirm basic interoperability.

 

- - -

 

I didn't mean to ignite a flame war over this. My statement regarding "standards" had little to do with Garmin per se. Garmin's use of USB is to be commended. Software products (at the physicial device level) are a little slow to adapt their products to support this interface...but surely they will. It's obvious that new products will continue to evolve that support better and faster interfaces. This is a good thing.

 

My comment was at the *protocol* level. Vendors choose proprietary protocols for various reasons:

- it may be technically better (more efficient / faster / more lightweight) than other protocols, including "open" protocols.

- it may provide a competitive advantage (it allows the vendor to provide some feature that would be difficult to achieve by a competitive protocol)

- keep market share (e.g., Garmin wants its user base to buy their mapping product, because only this product can be loaded to their physical devices...thus barring potential competiotrs, such as National Geographic, from competing. NG is kept "at bay" by limiting them to PC-mapping, not GPS device-mapping).

 

Vendors will likely continue to provide proprietary solutions until it doesn't help them in the marketplace. This, however, is often not in the best interest of us--the consumers. Vendors will change their tune when consumers make a buying decision based on the product's ability to interoperate with other products.

 

Hal

[+Go JayBee]

zenner,

Try "tricking" the software with selecting the Rhino as your device. That was what I had to do with EasyGPS for awhile until a newer version was released which supports the USB/60cs combo.

[+Desert_Warrior]

I use the VISTA data, and modify the peramiters to fit my needs. Yes, you must use a SERIAL CABLE to work with NG TOPO.

 

If you want a good laugh, contact TOPO support and ask about USB. The support guy Michael Wildshut is a real trip. He tild me that Garmin had to send me a driver for the USB cable on my 60CS. I tried several times to get him to understand, but he just couldn't grasp the concept. He swore that NG TOPO supports USB, if I had the cable driver.

 

What a shame - TOPO is otherwise a good program.

[+JohnnyVegas]

The only reason Garmin models do not use the same cable is so that the reatailers have to spend more money on inventory.

This kind of statement serves no use but to misinform and is obviously just wrong. No one could think that Garmin upgraded to USB "so that the reatailers (sp) have to spend more money on inventory". Garmin upgraded to a better technology (albeit maybe a little slowly), but still allow those that could only handle serial a way out by including two ports on the back of the 60.

 

lets not forget the Garmin proprietary chip for the E-map and street pilots, just another way to rip off the customers. They could have used and SD card, but then they would not ba able rake the consumers for the price of the chip.

This is also wrong, because when the E-map and original streetpilots were designed there were no SD cards to be bought.

 

There are plenty of things to rag on Garmin for that are factual, so please stick to those or if you are going to just spout your opinion, don't try to surround them with made up "facts".

 

Back to the original question, once solution is to buy a serial cable and connect it to the back of your 60. Topo! should handle that fine.

Well the 60c is a new model, go back over the years of garmin products, the e-series, Gps12 series, Rinos, Geckos, all use differant cables, think about, why not use the same data cable and power cable. Because you cannot get the same money out of the vendors, I have told this to Garmin reps while placing wholesale orders and they have not had good answeres.

 

Garmin did not invent the chip technology, And lets also not forget that the First street pilot and e-map did not have chips that the usear could program,You had to buy the chip for the area you wanted to use it ina(pre loaded), and they were very expensive, an area like L.A. would run you $150.00 San Francisco was $150.00 and Sacramento was $100.00. It was only after about two years of poor sales that Garmin came out with version that could be progrramed, with there first map source software. And lets not forget, there was nothing to keep garmin from putting out the street pilot with a user programable chip in the first version.

 

These are facts

[+Bilder]

So how about them Seahawks?

[capt caper]

I have no problems usning this way.

 

Get a 4 pin data cable from GPSGEEK.com. for about $ 7.00. Set the gps preference for 76S in NGTopo. Have only the 4 pin cable connected. If you have the USB connectted at the same time also it will not work.

 

This works great for me.

[+zenner]

I have no problems usning this way. 

 

Get a  4 pin data cable from GPSGEEK.com.  for about $ 7.00. Set the gps preference for 76S in NGTopo.    Have only the 4 pin cable connected. If you have the USB connectted at the same time also it will not work.

 

This works great for me.

Thank you. I will try that.

 

Note: I've been in communication with NG and they state that the 60cs w/USB will be supported towards end of summer (we'll see). Also they said increased support for geocaching. Hopeful!

 

Hal

[+JohnnyVegas]

I have no problems usning this way. 

 

Get a  4 pin data cable from GPSGEEK.com.  for about $ 7.00. Set the gps preference for 76S in NGTopo.    Have only the 4 pin cable connected. If you have the USB connectted at the same time also it will not work.

 

This works great for me.

Thank you. I will try that.

 

Note: I've been in communication with NG and they state that the 60cs w/USB will be supported towards end of summer (we'll see). Also they said increased support for geocaching. Hopeful!

 

Hal

increased support for geocaching.

 

It's true...