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Hiding a cache and railroad question


Team DAD
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We are relatively new to geocaching but would like to hide a cache. I found a pretty good spot but to get to it you need to cross an active railroad track to get there. I see that Geocaching.com will not approve of a cache placed within 150 feet of a RR track. The cache would be much further away from the track than that, but will the cache be denied if you have to cross the track? Thanks

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Worry about it!!!

 

Is there a safe/legal way across the tracks for pedestrians? If not then the cache should not be placed there.

 

Is there anyway the cache be accessed with out crossing the RR tracks? If so post parking coords so people know where to park so they don't have to cross the tracks.

 

40158_1200.gif I hope you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you've heard is not what I meant. --Richard Nixon

 

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While searching for a cache in Idaho a couple weeks ago we got blown off the tracks by the horn of a train coming around a curve a couple hundred yards away. A startling experience to say the least. Glad it seemed to be a tourist excursion of some sort so it was not moving too fast. Got the blood pumping though. Coords for this cache seemed to be dead on the tracks too - maybe it was just a bad sat day. We never did find it but didn't go back after the train horn moved us along.

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In response to RR, the US Gov. owns 100' and it is trespassing to cross the tracks. Believe or not, there are several properties that use RR crossings to get to a public road that do not have an easement to cross the RR. I would strongly suggest not using the RR to cross, under any circumstances. However, if there is a street or other public ROW (right of way) that runs parallel and use it as a visual marker, that is a good idea. I have posted something similar to this in another thread mentioning that you can contact the local surveyor, county assessor or title/abstract company, to help with determining if you are trespassing.

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Just plant the cache....Some people worry too much and for them they can either find a way around the tracks or find another cache. The rest of us can use the head that God gave us to find a safe place to cross and continue to look for the cache. As for trespassing... unless your near a rail yard the RR cops wont bust your chops. lighten up a little and you'll live longer people! icon_rolleyes.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by Lerch:

Just plant the cache....Some people worry too much and for them they can either find a way around the tracks or find another cache. The rest of us can use the head that God gave us to find a safe place to cross and continue to look for the cache. As for trespassing... unless your near a rail yard the RR cops wont bust your chops. lighten up a little and you'll live longer people! icon_rolleyes.gif


 

The text under your avatar is aprapos with your advice.

 

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quote:
Originally posted by BrownMule:

quote:
Originally posted by Lerch:

Just plant the cache....Some people worry too much and for them they can either find a way around the tracks or find another cache. The rest of us can use the head that God gave us to find a safe place to cross and continue to look for the cache. As for trespassing... unless your near a rail yard the RR cops wont bust your chops. lighten up a little and you'll live longer people! icon_rolleyes.gif


 

The text under your avatar is aprapos with your advice.

 

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On the other hand, you have different fingers.

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we're talking about crossing rr tracks not a freakin mine field for God sakes!! What's the big deal? Has everyone become giant pussies??

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I was merely pointing out some facts as to a RR. I have crossed many a RR, mostly because it was quicker, however, as a family and kid friendly event, I think that a respect for other people’s property, whether it be the government or Aunt Susan’s, needs to be upheld.

 

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quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:

quote:
Originally posted by BrownMule:

...The text under your avatar is aprapos with your advice....


 

Oh come now BrownMule. As a land manager you might have the best advice yet if you choose to give it!


 

I think I just did give the "best advice" as have many others who respect and obey the law.

 

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On the other hand, you have different fingers.

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quote:
Originally posted by BrownMule:

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:

quote:
Originally posted by BrownMule:

...The text under your avatar is aprapos with your advice....


 

Oh come now BrownMule. As a land manager you might have the best advice yet if you choose to give it!


 

I think I just did give the "best advice" as have many others who respect and obey the law. It's really a no brainer. against the law to trespass on Railroad property = don't do it.

 

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On the other hand, you have different fingers.

_

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_________________________________________________________

On the other hand, you have different fingers.

15777_2200.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by Team DAD:

We are relatively new to geocaching but would like to hide a cache. I found a pretty good spot but to get to it you need to cross an active railroad track to get there. I see that Geocaching.com will not approve of a cache placed within 150 feet of a RR track. The cache would be much further away from the track than that, but will the cache be denied if you have to cross the track? Thanks


 

Is that the only way to get to the cache? Or can you get to it from the other side?

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I would follow Renegade Knight's advice--if there is another way to the cache, then plant it. I've gone to a couple similar caches where there was an alternate path, but an easier path along the railroad tracks. If there is an alternate path, post the parking for the alternate path, then if cache hunters decide to use the railroad instead, it's their fault if they get busted, and not yours.

 

"Wear a smile and have friends; wear a scowl and have wrinkles. What do we live for if not to make the world less difficult for each other?"--George Eliot

 

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Thanks everyone. I didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest with this question.

 

Renegade Knight, in response to your question, there may be a way to access it from the other side, I just haven't looked yet. It's just that there was a nice parking area close to the trailhead leading to the spot. The only negative was crossing the RR track.

 

I will determine if the spot can be accessed another way. Thanks again.

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I'd say it depends on exactly what the situation is. I know of a park where the only way in is over some tracks. The safety paths (they used to be called "sidewalks") around my house cross the same tracks four or five times within two miles. If it's an "official" path where you have to cross the track, then I don't see the problem.

 

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quote:
Originally posted by Mopar:

quote:
Originally posted by TEAM 360:

 

Place the cache.


Why bother placing a cache that isn't going to be approved anyway if there is no LEGAL way to get to the cache?

 

+ _"(Mopar is) good to have around and kick. Like an ugly puppy" - Jeremy _


 

I am assuming the world does not end at the railroad tracks and there are people who live on the other side, people who can get at the cache without having to cross the tracks...??

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quote:
Originally posted by Dinoprophet:

I'd say it depends on exactly what the situation is. I know of a park where the only way in is over some tracks. The safety paths (they used to be called "sidewalks") around my house cross the same tracks four or five times within two miles. If it's an "official" path where you have to cross the track, then I don't see the problem.


Yeah, what Dino said!

Just because there is a path doesn't make it legal. If there is a question, post LEGAL parking coords. If people then choose to take the easy way and cross the tracks somewhere closer but illegal, that's their problem.

 

"(Mopar is) good to have around and kick. Like an ugly puppy" - Jeremy

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In Indiana, it's a class B misdemeanor to walk on a railroad right-of-way except at a public crossing, except in one or more of a very strictly defined set of exceptional circumstances that geocachers would almost never find themselves in. The relevant statute can be found here; look at IC 8-3-15-3.

 

Most of the railroad right-of-ways around here are owned by private owners, and not by the government. In some cases, the owner is the railroad company, and in some cases the land is owned by the same person who owns the adjacent land.

 

Notice, too, in paragraph (:D of that section of the Indiana Code, what a right-of-way is defined to be for the purposes of this section. There's no 100' rule or 150' rule or whatever in Indiana. However, keeping in mind the inherent lack of precision of the GPS receivers we use, you should stay at least that far from the tracks anyway just to keep potential finders from wandering into the right-of-way.

 

In any case, if at some point during your journey you're standing between the rails of an active rail line, it seems reasonable to assume that you're on railroad property. Encouraging people to commit crimes, even misdemeanors, is probably not a good plan.

 

In the case of a trail that appears to cross the tracks, read IC 8-3-15-1 carefully and judge for yourself. It looks like just because everyone else does it doesn't mean it's legal for you.

 

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The beauty of the law is for every law there is a hundred other laws to counteract it. It's like antivenom. Find the right one and you are home free and the judge is left wondering just when in the hell happened.

 

If the path is public and used as such and maintained as such (I'm not talking footpath in the woods here) by a government or even quaisi government entity. The RR has for all intents and purposes either given permision for that pathway or the public entity has taken the crossing for their own use and the RR let it slide. Either way I'd not even think twice about the other laws that make RR ROW such a thorn in my side where I work.

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A couple bits of information...

 

If the public has used that trail for years then it can be considered a right of way if actions are not taken to prevent it. To prevent this from happening, all the RR has to do is close that track once a year to prevent access -- which they do, for maintenance. They therefore kill two birds with one stone.

 

One street in NYC is owned by one of the rich families (Rockefellers ??). Once each year they close the street to maintain their ownership.

 

On a recent cache hunt my wife and I were hiking a trail that paralleled active railroad tracks (about 60 yards away). One train was coming up the mountain and we heard it from several miles away. It took quite a while to reach us. A few minutes later an Amtrak train came DOWN the mountain from the other direction. We never heard it coming! It rounded a bend and if we had been on the tracks we would have had only a few seconds (no exaggeration) to get out of the way.

 

Bottom line, it's illegal, dangerous, and unnecessary to place a cache near the tracks. Too many people die each year being stupid. In fact a lot more people die on tracks than in caves. Actually, more people die each year having their tonsils removed than die in caves, but that's another discussion altogether. icon_smile.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by geospotter:

If the public has used that trail for years then it can be considered a right of way if actions are not taken to prevent it. To prevent this from happening, all the RR has to do is close that track once a year to prevent access -- which they do, for maintenance. They therefore kill two birds with one stone.


I don't know one way or the other, but the first part of Fuzzy's link reads to me like that's not true in Indiana:

quote:
The use by the public (of the) right of way or depot grounds of any railroad in this state by riding, driving or walking thereon, shall not ripen into a right to continue to do so even though it has been so used for a period of twenty (20) years or more; nor shall such use be evidence of a grant to do so except where such use is made across such ground to connect a street or highway on each side thereof, and except where a court of competent jurisdiction has adjudged the existence of a street or highway.

 

I too have been very close to the front of a speeding Amtrak train on account of stupidity. As a result, I was also on the business end of a track maintenance bill (though only a three-digit figure) and threatening lawyers.

 

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Well the mountain was so beautiful that this guy built a mall and a pizza shack

Yeah he built an ugly city because he wanted the mountain to love him back -- Dar Williams

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As you all know by know I don't have a problem crossing RR tracks for any reason. I could care less if it's against the law. I think I'm smart enough to cross in a safe location. Not the case for one of of my fellow drivers yesterday. He missed his turn to make his delivery so he went down the next available road and from what I can gather the road kinda ends or is wide enough for a tractor trailer to turn around where the tracks are located. This driver starts to make his u-turn only to get the truck stuck in some mud with half the trailer still on the tracks. Luck would have it that a high speed freight train was heading towards him and BAMMMMM!!!!!!! No more tractor trailer icon_biggrin.gif

At least the moron driver had enough brains to get out of the truck before the train hit the truck. God was watching over all involved because knowone was hurt.

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ROFLMAO!!!

 

Look at it this way...there are THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of miles of RR track in the US.

 

What is the chance that you will get nabbed simply for crossing one? The authorities have little success in busting railroad hobos, so what are the chances??? icon_smile.gif

 

We shoudl all know that when caching or even just walking across teh countryside we assuem the risk for our route.....common sense plays a great role in a successful and healthy journey.

 

quote:
Originally posted by Lerch:

 

we're talking about crossing rr tracks not a freakin mine field for God sakes!! What's the big deal? Has everyone become giant pussies??


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quote:
Originally posted by dzavetsky:

ROFLMAO!!!

 

Look at it this way...there are THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of miles of RR track in the US.

 

What is the chance that you will get nabbed simply for crossing one? The authorities have little success in busting railroad hobos, so what are the chances??? icon_smile.gif

 

We shoudl all know that when caching or even just walking across teh countryside we assuem the risk for our route.....common sense plays a great role in a successful and healthy journey.

 


 

Dude, 98% of the people in America are sooo sissified and politically correct that common sense is harder to find than a needle in a friggin hay stack. If the law is retarded BREAK it!!

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