Criteria For "geogarbage".

[Raggedy Mandy]

I've read a lot of threads about so-called "bad" things to leave in a cache. What I'd like to discuss is criteria for bad items, with an eye toward banning them in caches. I know a rule won't stop someone who's determined to be a pain in the hiney, but it might be a good start.

 

I visited the Mall of America cache II this weekend. It was a very fun puzzle to solve, and I enjoyed it, until I found the cache. I don't think that caching is about the swag, but it's always nice to see non-garbage in a cache. I was really surprised by the amount of broken McToys, ticket stubs, and last, but not least, a boarding pass stub from a John Hagedorn. (Come on! If you're going to leave geogarbage, don't leave something WITH YOUR NAME ON IT.)

 

Can I humbly propose the following "banned items" list in addition to weapons?

 

1. Not broken. McToys are fine, but broken ones are just lame. Throw them in the kitchen trash like the rest of us, okay?

 

2. Nominal value. It doesn't have to be expensive, but if you wouldn't pick it up out of a cache, maybe you should think twice about leaving it. Examples are ticket stubs, boarding passes, bottle caps, and acorns. If you're ashamed of logging the item, as apparently most of the people above were, don't leave it.

 

PR

[WH]

Everybody has different ideas of what good trade items should be. I think what we can all agree on are banning things such as guns, knives, food items, cigarettes etc etc. Beyond that one person's trash is another ones treasure.

[+carleenp]

I found a parking ticket in a cache once (they scratched their name out with black ink). I couldn't decide whether it was OK because I was so amused by seeing it there, or whether I should remove it because it was a lame item to leave. I ended up leaving it.

 

Anyway, I don't know if a "rule" about trade items would do much and you never know when someone might be amused by a really lame object. But to the extent this thread makes a list of bad trade items, I say that couldn't hurt.

[GrandpaCannon]

I think we already have a rule that covers this and it is "Trade fairly." Now I suppose that maybe these people just left these items and didn't trade, but I doubt it. Someone who leaves actual garbage in a cache will not be stopped by a new rule.

[+The Leprechauns]

Finding caches = Fun.

Fun = Good.

More Rules = Bad.

[+briansnat]

I think any item that you would ordinarialy throw in the garbage should go in the the garbage and not in a cache. Apparently a lot of people think caches are great recepticles for their trash. In addition to broken and dirty McToys, I've found candy wrappers, bottle caps, acorns (in an oak forest), pine cones (in a pine forest), long expired coupons, empty "airline" booze bottles, used metrocards and phone cards with no rides or minutes left, losing scratch off lottery tickets, a single, Lifesaver candy and worse.

 

However I don't think this warrants adding items to the list of banned stuff. First, it isn't necessary, and second it would be practically endless.

Edited May 17, 2004 by briansnat

[+bigredmed]

Rules are good.

 

1. Trade fair

2. The golden rule applies.

3. If you wouldn't want to pick it up out of a cache, don't put it in there.

4. Themes are to be respected.

5. Put toys in caches that are in parks that kids go to. Put biners and match holders, etc in caches that hikers go to.

 

By in large, the good trade item fits the theme of the cache (explicit or implied) and has an element of "coolness" to it.

[+flask]

i don't think more rules will help.

 

shame doesn't work either. and some people are beyond education. most people, when given a chance, want to be resectable.

 

so nothing dirty or broken. nothing that promotes hate or illegal acts. nothing that you'd normally throw out. nothing that land managers have asked us to keep out of caches. as the sport grows it will become important for the major listing services to advocate this position strongly in order to keep using the largest playing fields possible.

 

i also don't (usually) leave things in caches that have political content, religious content, or content referring to alcohol or tobacco consumption. i do not leave items advocating points of view in what are controversial topics of the day.

 

it doesn't matter that i think (proper personal noun) is the biggest idiot that ever walked the planet, nor that i think (intangible noun) is just wrong. you maybe don't care that i support (legal measure). conversely, i am not at all offended by (intangible noun).

 

i appreciate that you may not want to discuss these with your kids at a cache. i respect that you should be able to cache in peace.

[+clearpath]

Banning the items will only make them show up more in the caches. I have seen knives, matches, food and cigs in caches already. As for junk, someone deposited a bunch of empty sunflower seeds (just the empty shell, if you will) in a cache that I visited. It was not a lame cache either. Just someones idea of a joke ... I guess.

[+Sagefox]

We all know that broken toys, scraps of paper and bottle caps will placed in caches. We also know that a solid majority of geocachers never read the forums (and that makes their life is so much easier!). So comments on this forum about what should not go into a cache will always fall on deaf ears.

 

Another approach to this problem would be to spread the word that it is ALWAYS O.K. to remove broken toys, water damaged and moldy items and any other junk from any cache you visit. You don't need permission to do this and you don't need to leave anything if you are in TNLN mode.

 

I'm not talking about really cheap items that no one will ever want - the cache owner gets to remove that stuff during regular maintenance. I'm talking about damaged goods, bottle caps, cigaretts, pornography brochures, condoms, match books with two matches, scraps of paper, unsigned ticket stubs with no great significance, popsickle sticks, food items (unless in cans or well sealed), and other items mentioned in earlier posts.

 

And... while we are at it. Anytime a cacher finds a large item that prevents the container lid from closing it should be removed even if you don't have anything to trade. An open container lid during rainy season will cause damage to the logbook as well as the cache contents. I've seen far too many web page entries that say "cache is too full and we couldn't get the lid closed".

[+Lazyboy & Mitey Mite]

Finding caches = Fun.

Fun = Good.

More Rules = Bad.

There ya Go

[Toron]

We have seen this type of topic many times in the forums. (heck, I started one once, and I'm still scraping off the charred parts from all the flames.) What this indicates to me is that this is a worthwhile topic ( it's important to a number of people)

 

I have followed the feedback and thought about the subject. Here is my proposed solution *drumroll*

 

The concept of a trade even cache. (Yes, I know trade even/up is a standard, but bear with me.) If a cache hider states in the cache page that this is a trade even cache, it means the he or she is commiting to maintaining the quality of the cache by occassionally removing downgraded trade items. The difference between this and what is already done is subtle and in line with many already established practices.

 

1) someone who leaves a lame item (ie, some of the ones listed earlier in this thread) shouldn't be surprised/offended if it's removed.

2) it reminds cache seekers of the trade even/up practice.

3) it informs would be cache seekers that they can reasonably expect decent swag for trade.

4) it allows for any range of swag quality that a cache hider chooses. (hey, I might WANT a cache of ticket stub exchange at my Hollywood cache)

 

Possible problems: some disagreement between the hider and the trader about the value of an item.

 

I like this proposal because it allows a cache hider who values trade item quality to take the initiative. It is no radical departure from established practice.

[+nfa]

Hi,

 

I clean garbage out of caches as a matter of routine, I consider it an extension of CITO.

 

I have 2 guidelines I use in deciding whether or not to remove something:

• If I saw it on the trail, would it go in my garbage bag, or in my trade-bag
  
• If in doubt, I leave it in the cache
  

By the same token, I also refill looted caches, or those that have only 1-3 McTreasures in them.

 

Some people are always going to leave junk in caches, just like some people are going to abuse their kids...You can't stop it, you can just try to do the right thing, and hope that there are more of us then there are of them.

 

{stumbles off of soapbox looking slightly embarrassed}

 

nfa

[+The Leprechauns]

You should have quit after the profound jello observation. You were doing so well.....

[+Lazyboy & Mitey Mite]

When a cacher complains about the current level of contents in one of my caches I always cheerfully send them this link..... Great Swag Here

[+clearpath]

Possible problems:  some disagreement between the hider and the trader about the value of an item.

That is the 'gotcha' regarding the situation. What one persons perceives as junk, another person collects and thinks it has value. NFA has a good rule of thumb also Team Sagefox has a good point ... if an item is damaged or broken then remove it ...

[Dino Hunters]

I have seen knives, matches, food and cigs in caches already.

Just a question for the more experienced in the forum...

 

Are matches a universally bad item ? I ask because I am planning a cache of items that would actually be useful to people who are along a hike 7km from the nearest road. One of the items I was considering was some matches in watertight containers.

 

Quote is from the geocaching FAQ.

 

"Explosives, ammo, knives, drugs, and alcohol shouldn't be placed in a cache. "

 

Since matches are not listed, and kids will not stumble upon this cache, and since matches might be useful to a hiker way back here, would it be an OK cache item ?

 

Other items I am planning - bungy cords - sleeping bag straps - emergency blanket - rain poncho - garbage bags (emerg raingear) - printed topo maps showing trail out - home made wax/wood firestarters - bottled water possibly - bandaids - duct tape - plastic tarp - etc.

 

Please reply if you have any other ideas for truly useful items in a "survival cache".

 

Thanks

[+Mastifflover]

I have seen knives, matches, food and cigs in caches already.

Just a question for the more experienced in the forum...

 

Are matches a universally bad item ? I ask because I am planning a cache of items that would actually be useful to people who are along a hike 7km from the nearest road. One of the items I was considering was some matches in watertight containers.

 

I would say that they are fine that far away from any playgrounds or parks but there are many others here that will disagree.

[WH]

I have seen knives, matches, food and cigs in caches already.

Just a question for the more experienced in the forum...

 

Are matches a universally bad item ? I ask because I am planning a cache of items that would actually be useful to people who are along a hike 7km from the nearest road. One of the items I was considering was some matches in watertight containers.

 

Quote is from the geocaching FAQ.

 

"Explosives, ammo, knives, drugs, and alcohol shouldn't be placed in a cache. "

 

Since matches are not listed, and kids will not stumble upon this cache, and since matches might be useful to a hiker way back here, would it be an OK cache item ?

 

Other items I am planning - bungy cords - sleeping bag straps - emergency blanket - rain poncho - garbage bags (emerg raingear) - printed topo maps showing trail out - home made wax/wood firestarters - bottled water possibly - bandaids - duct tape - plastic tarp - etc.

 

Please reply if you have any other ideas for truly useful items in a "survival cache".

 

Thanks

If you want a survival themed cache, here are a few ideas:

 

water purification tablets

first aid kit

rope / twine

sunblock

insect repellant

batteries

flashlight

[+Renegade Knight]

Expired cupons come to mind, but I'd like to bring back pocket knives. Those were always cool.

[+SixDogTeam]

One dog's trash is another dog's treasure...

[+flask]

the thing about knives is this: some land managers have specific concerns about knives. many of these managers host caches that are partly maintained by prisoners, or are near prisons. regardless of the viability of any object as a weapon (you can stab someone to death with a newspaper if you're resourceful), it's not worth getting land managers upset. if a think is in one cache, it's likely to get moved to another cache.

 

i am not in favor of getting hysterical. i personally don't see it as a danger. i also don't leave knives in caches.

[+clearpath]

Since matches are not listed, and kids will not stumble upon this cache, and since matches might be useful to a hiker way back here, would it be an OK cache item ?

I don't have a problem with leaving matches (or knives).

 

Other items I am planning - bungy cords - sleeping bag straps - emergency blanket - rain poncho - garbage bags (emerg raingear)...

If I found a garbage bag in a cache I would probably remove it thinking it was junk (or use it to CITO).

 

the thing about knives is this: some land managers have specific concerns about knives. many of these managers host caches that are partly maintained by prisoners, or are near prisons.

The idea that a prison might be nearby is absurd. If some convict is going to stab me, I would rather be stuck with a pocket knife. Than say a screwdriver, fork or newspaper (God forbid). Caches placed by a prison has got to be a small percentage of the total caches placed. But again rules are rules and I doubt TPTB are going to change them to include pocket knives.

Edited May 17, 2004 by clearpath

[+Metaphor]

Man, you found bottle caps AND a boarding pass! You lucky dog!

 

Really, if people want to get rid of junk (which I do occasionally) make sure the junk is something someone might want. There are enough freebie sites, bottle opener giveaways, free flaslight, calculators, etc, etc, etc to be able to find something that you might THINK someone would want... even good McToys, if so inclined. However, junk is junk, and if you are just cleaning the glove compartment, then TNLNSL.

 

For me, good trade means something different (name keychain, pins, cool rocks or crystals, carvings, sig items beyond business cards, foreign coins, magnets, local memorabilia and/or postcards) not (broken, useless, ugly, cheap, crappy crap).

 

I can see why people TNLNSL, but if more people would take the time to leave a trade item that they would want, the trading aspect of the game would rise exponentially. The line about one man's trash equaling another's treasure ends at a certain level. Unless the boarding pass has my name on it so I can get mileage points or the bottle cap lets me walk into the next store I see for a free soda (dang, don't you wish beer companies had that kind of promotion going?), it's a bad trade.

 

Don't hold your breath though. People who leave bad trades are going to do so anyway.

[Dino Hunters]

Thanks for the replies and ideas folks.

 

- no it will not be near a prison.

- yes kind of a survival themed.

- yes garbage bags can be very useful for more than hauling garbage.

- no I do not plan to leave a pocket knife.

 

Additional ideas I have - fishing items - gloves - headcoverings - socks.

 

Never know when a soaking wet/cold cacher may need one of these items eh?

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

Just a couple of points to ponder.

 

1) You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!" Their find count will drop and you will definitely get their attention. It probably will not do much good, but it will make you feel better to delete their logs. As the owner that is you right to do so.

 

2) Just because it is trash doesn't mean that you can't get a lot of miles out of it. Do you remember the thread about the flyrod as a first to find prize? It (the flyrod) came from a dumpster! I repaired the tip (I used to build and repair fishing rods) and used it as the first to find prize.

Being a garbologist has it's advantages.

 

John

[+briansnat]

The idea that a prison might be nearby is absurd. If some convict is going to stab me, I would rather be stuck with a pocket knife. Than say a screwdriver, fork or newspaper (God forbid). Caches placed by a prison has got to be a small percentage of the total caches placed. But again rules are rules and I doubt TPTB are going to change them to include pocket knives.

 

Its not like they send convicted murders serving hard time to clean the parks. These guys are trustees, non violent offenders who are near release. If they were up to no good, they can find many a broken bottle along the way to do damage.

In fact, I'm taking out a crew of prisoners this week and I will be handing them chainsaws and pickaxes to work on a trail.

 

I still place pocket "tools" in caches. I had brought a bunch of nice Swiss Army "tools"...real Victoranox, not some cheap knockoffs, just before the guidelines were changed. I had no use for a bunch of them, so they make their way in caches and finders really appreciate them. Of course they go in remote caches. I wouldn't put them in a cache in a kiddie park.

 

I think matches are fine too. Some waterproof matches in a waterproof container would make an excellent trade item in a survival/hiker themed cache.

Edited May 18, 2004 by briansnat

[Dino Hunters]

I have two rods that I have repaired myself. Good to meet a fellow garbologist!

 

- no it won't be near a kiddie park.

 

- edited for spelling.

Edited May 18, 2004 by Dino Hunters

[+BuckyD]

Just my 2cents:

 

I love finding matchbooks (with matches in them) in caches. I figure that young kids out caching (with the exception of playground caches) are with their parents and have appropriate supervision when they find them, and older kids should already know better.

 

Being on the hiking/hunting end of caching, rather than the kid-friendly family outing end of it, I will be less than excited to find rocks, fake gems, McToys, etc. in caches -- however pretty they are. I am ignorant about any particular cache-rock or cache-gem's value unless its marked as precious by the person that left it, and so to me these items are no different than every other rock/colored plastic I run across. I would, however, squeal like a stuck pig if I found a little Swiss Army tool, matchbook, 'biner, mini-leatherman, flashlight/penlight, new batteries, fishing lure/bobbers, cool pens, guidebook of a neat location I might visit, CD/DVD, keychain, etc.

 

Expired coupons, metrocards, muni passes, business cards, promotional flyers (religious, political, etc.) promote a TNLNSL from me.

[Raggedy Mandy]

I would, however, squeal like a stuck pig if I found a little Swiss Army tool, matchbook, 'biner, mini-leatherman, flashlight/penlight, new batteries, fishing lure/bobbers, cool pens, guidebook of a neat location I might visit, CD/DVD, keychain, etc.

 

Hey! Thanks for the swag ideas....I'm putting together a cache called Summer Fun right now and was looking for outdoorsy/summery ideas. However, I'll probably put in individual towlette packs of sunscreen instead of matches. If you're ever around Omaha this summer, c'mon out and squeal like a pig all you'd like.

 

Does anyone make a multi-tool that doesn't have a blade? I don't want to get in trouble with the powers that be, but gosh, they really are useful!

 

PR

[+flask]

snip

The idea that a prison might be nearby is absurd.

/snip

it ain't absurd. i can think of five caches off the top of my head that are within walking distance of a prison or at least a correctioal center with enough teeth to be surrounded by a mess o' barbed wire and catwalks.

 

while i don't think the knives themselves pose a real danger, i am certain that they pose a perceived danger for the land managers in question. i think this would be a good time for land managers to form a favorable opinion of hosting geocaches. we can worry about contents later. meantime, i have enough trinkets to leave that aren't knives.

 

sure, i liked them. they still make nice party favors for event caches, though.

[+Sagefox]

You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!" Their find count will drop and you will definitely get their attention. It probably will not do much good, but it will make you feel better to delete their logs.

 

As the owner that is your right to do so.

This is a disturbing concept to me. I don't think that would be an appropriate use of the power to delete. I'd be highly miffed if I physically visited a cache and my find log was deleted by the owner.

 

I'm not advocating non-fair trading. It is that a "trade fairly" request as suggested here would make the cache a "theme cache" and upholding any theme is strictly voluntary on the part of the finders.

 

When a cache is placed out in the world and posted to the web site the placer has to be able to take what comes. There is really no choice, after all.

 

If someone physically finds a cache they are entitled to record that find. It would definitely not make me feel good to delete someone's legitimate find.

[+The Geocache Hunter]

Granted there are many trade items out there that are cheap but I also like to throw in the "cool" factor. I've been trading patriotic coins that are very well made yet cost only about $1.50 apiece. They are bronze, a bit biger than a silver dollar and rather thick. One side is a full colored US flag and the other side is either a fully embossed image or a great block letter quote. They are unusual, interesting, and very collectable even though they cost very little. As far as I can tell, they are only available at military Post Exchanges. I still make an effort to make fair trades.

 

Even McGarbage toys can be cool. There is actually a collectable market for them. For example, a E.T. happy meal toy from the 80's is worth some big bucks. Todays McGarbage Lion King is tommorows treasure. Of course the value decreases when opened, broken or chewed on. Or all three in some cases.

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!" Their find count will drop and you will definitely get their attention. It probably will not do much good, but it will make you feel better to delete their logs.

 

As the owner that is your right to do so.

This is a disturbing concept to me. I don't think that would be an appropriate use of the power to delete. I'd be highly miffed if I physically visited a cache and my find log was deleted by the owner.

 

I'm not advocating non-fair trading. It is that a "trade fairly" request as suggested here would make the cache a "theme cache" and upholding any theme is strictly voluntary on the part of the finders.

 

When a cache is placed out in the world and posted to the web site the placer has to be able to take what comes. There is really no choice, after all.

 

If someone physically finds a cache they are entitled to record that find. It would definitely not make me feel good to delete someone's legitimate find.

 

And what about a virtual cache that has certain criteria to be met or the owner will delete the log?

 

If you place a theme cache and tell the people what is expected of them in regards to trading then they have 2 choices. First, trade according to the theme or second TN/LN/SL.

 

The "trade fairly" is the same thing. Trade fairly or don't trade.

 

Nice and simple.

 

John

[+Sagefox]

... You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!"...

 

As the owner that is your right to do so.

This is a disturbing concept to me. I don't think that would be an appropriate use of the power to delete. I'd be highly miffed if I physically visited a cache and my find log was deleted by the owner.

 

...a "trade fairly" request as suggested here would make the cache a "theme cache" and upholding any theme is strictly voluntary on the part of the finders...

 

And what about a virtual cache that has certain criteria to be met or the owner will delete the log?

 

If you place a theme cache and tell the people what is expected of them in regards to trading then they have 2 choices. First, trade according to the theme or second TN/LN/SL.

 

The "trade fairly" is the same thing. Trade fairly or don't trade.

 

Nice and simple.

 

John

I still disagree. With all virtual caches the questions posed by the owner are ONLY to verify that the finder ACTUALLY visited the site. ANY alternative answers given by the finder that can prove they were at the site should be accepted by the owner. I have given alternative answers to virtual questions and been awarded the finds and I always (and often) accept alternative answers for our virts. A virtual cache should bring someone to an interesting place and not simply be a question and answer exercise.

 

But let's step back for a moment here - this game should not be so rigid that people split hairs over what constitutes a find. If a person physically finds a cache, regular, virtual or locationless, then they should be allowed to record a find.

 

I have a light-hearted approach to this game. The day I start getting heavy handed with finders of my caches is the day I'd better just archive them all.

[+briansnat]

Does anyone make a multi-tool that doesn't have a blade? I don't want to get in trouble with the powers that be, but gosh, they really are useful!

 

Yes, Walmart sells them. I bought a dozen a few weeks ago. The were only 3 buck each and were pretty sturdy. Bottle opener, flat head and phillips screwdrivers, and a few other tools that I don't recall.

 

... You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!"...

 

As the owner that is your right to do so.

 

I vehemently disagree with deleting legit logs, unless they contain blatant spoilers, or profanity. Even in those cases I would ask the finder to change them before I deleted them.

 

People work hard to find caches and to delete a log because you don't like the trade is petty. I guess that as an owner its your right to do whatever you want with the logs, so go right ahead and delete them. Just don't be surprised when someone else starts deleting YOUR logs because of some arbitrary reason.

 

If you place a theme cache and tell the people what is expected of them in regards to trading then they have 2 choices....

 

A lot of people download waypoints directly to their GPS and don't bother with the cache pages. I often have no idea what cache I'm searching for, let alone if it has a theme. I'd be pretty ticked if the owner deleted my log because I left a

a Wheresgeorge bill in a cache that was suppsed to have a "cat theme".

Edited May 19, 2004 by briansnat

[+Renegade Knight]

I still disagree. With all virtual caches the questions posed by the owner are ONLY to verify that the finder ACTUALLY visited the site. ANY alternative answers given by the finder that can prove they were at the site should be accepted by the owner. I have given alternative answers to virtual questions and been awarded the finds and I always (and often) accept alternative answers for our virts. A virtual cache should bring someone to an interesting place and not simply be a question and answer exercise.

 

But let's step back for a moment here - this game should not be so rigid that people split hairs over what constitutes a find. If a person physically finds a cache, regular, virtual or locationless, then they should be allowed to record a find.

 

I have a light-hearted approach to this game. The day I start getting heavy handed with finders of my caches is the day I'd better just archive them all.

Interesting angle. But I disagree. A find is involved even with a virtual. If the answer is not found it's no more a find than a photo of the vicinity of a cache.

 

However as always the owner is in charge of the find rules and if they are willing to accept an alternate answer then that's the final answer. Even so you should not go into a hunt looking for an answer, fail to find it, and expect a find out of it.

[+bons]

Does anyone make a multi-tool that doesn't have a blade? I don't want to get in trouble with the powers that be, but gosh, they really are useful!

 

Yes, Walmart sells them. I bought a dozen a few weeks ago. The were only 3 buck each and were pretty sturdy. Bottle opener, flat head and phillips screwdrivers, and a few other tools that I don't recall.

What section of wal-mart were you in? Tools? Sporting goods? Cash register?

[+briansnat]

They were on an end shelf between sporting goods and automotive....so I guess half of each.

Edited May 19, 2004 by briansnat

[2oldfarts (the rockhounders)]

... You might try putting on your cache page "Trade fairly -- if not then we will delete your log!"...

 

As the owner that is your right to do so.

 

I vehemently disagree with deleting legit logs, unless they contain blatant spoilers, or profanity. Even in those cases I would ask the finder to change them before I deleted them.

 

People work hard to find caches and to delete a log because you don't like the trade is petty. I guess that as an owner its your right to do whatever you want with the logs, so go right ahead and delete them. Just don't be surprised when someone else starts deleting YOUR logs because of some arbitrary reason.

 

If you place a theme cache and tell the people what is expected of them in regards to trading then they have 2 choices....

 

A lot of people download waypoints directly to their GPS and don't bother with the cache pages. I often have no idea what cache I'm searching for, let alone if it has a theme. I'd be pretty ticked if the owner deleted my log because I left a

a Wheresgeorge bill in a cache that was suppsed to have a "cat theme".

For the record: we have never deleted anyones log.

 

For all the work that some people put into their cache pages and you don't even take the time to read them before you go looking for their cache? Don't you think the owner would be pretty tick off if you wouldn't even take some time to appreciate his work in putting together his cache page and try to follow his theme?

 

Did I shake the bushes enough, yet?

 

John

[+briansnat]

For all the work that some people put into their cache pages and you don't even take the time to read them before you go looking for their cache?

 

If I plan to go geocaching I will, but often I happen to be in an area and flick on the GPS to see if there are any caches nearby (I have the 800 closest to home on my GPS). In those cases all I have are the coordinates. Heck, sometimes I get there and don't know if I'm looking for a virtual, or real cache and if its a virtual, what info I need for confirmation.

[+Sagefox]

... With all virtual caches the questions posed by the owner are ONLY to verify that the finder ACTUALLY visited the site.  ANY alternative answers given by the finder that can prove they were at the site should be accepted by the owner...  ...A virtual cache should bring someone to an interesting place and not simply be a question and answer exercise.

Interesting angle. But I disagree. A find is involved even with a virtual. If the answer is not found it's no more a find than a photo of the vicinity of a cache...

...Even so you should not go into a hunt looking for an answer, fail to find it, and expect a find out of it.

Technically you are correct. But why take the "hard line" approach?

 

I prefer to be flexible with our virtual cache finders rather than rigid. I want them to appreciate what I brought them there to see rather than give them a hard time about being nuts-on correct with answers. I believe the virtual cache guidelines support this position.

[+Sagefox]

For the record: we have never deleted anyones log.

 

Don't you think the owner would be pretty ticked off if you wouldn't even take some time to appreciate his work in putting together his cache page and try to follow his theme?

I have suspected all along that your suggestion is mostly tough talk as a result of actions by thoughtless cachers that you have witnessed or read about. Never suspected you would actually delete someone's legitimate find.

 

As to your other thought – now that we are in the electronic cache page era I suspect attempts at creating a good cache page are much less appreciated. I'm not miffed by that with finders of my caches and am now even guilty myself after stumbling around with a PDA on my last trip. Sometimes you hit them hot and heavily and sometimes you take time to appreciate the finer points of cache and its web page.

[+Ltljon]

I found a way to deter any further degrading of a cache. This way you're never let down.

[+Phone guy]

I personally think there is nothing wrong with a pocket knife. Please tell me why that would not be OK.

What kid has not had a pocket knife. If the child is too young to have a pocket knife they will not be geocaching alone anyway.

 

Now we once found condoms in a cache. I will add the short cut. This is supposed to be family oriented.

 

Sticks and Stones

Edited May 19, 2004 by Phone guy

[+bons]

I personally  think there is nothing wrong with a pocket knife. Please tell me why that would not be OK.

The following is not a statement of agreement with the quoted policy. It is simply a reference so that you understand why bladeless multi-tools are desired by some cachers:

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx#contents

Use your common sense in most cases. Explosives, fireworks, ammo, knives (including pocket knives and multi-tools), drugs, alcohol or other illicit material shouldn't be placed in a cache. As always respect the local laws. Geocaching is a family activity and cache contents should be suitable for all ages.

[+Phone guy]

I can read ok. I just would like to know why no pocket knives? does anyone know?

[+bons]

Any one of a hundred reasons including:

1) "Think of the children!"

2) "Someone might find it."

3) Licking County (whose parks department got bent out of shape due to finding a geocache with a pen knife inside it) - Talk to Keystone Approver about that one.

 

The above 3 all have various permutations that basicly means that banning knives makes things easier for the find people at Groundspeak to be able to deal with some of the basic fears of park organizations and other organizations who have a fear about allowing geocaching.

 

It's always struck me as a "grease policy". It makes things go easier. It may not be necessary, but it makes people happy and shows a willingness to work with people who have a concern. That's why, even if I don't agree with it, I'm willing to agree to it.

Edited May 22, 2004 by bons