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Would You Visit This Virtual?


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Edit: Thanks to those that have posted with a yea or nea, but its starting to get a little out of hand. If the remainder of the comments could be a yes/no I would appreciate it.

 

I don't want to get caught up in the virtual argument right now, and if the polls were working I would utilize them to avoid the long winded arguments. With that said, would you visit this Virtual cache if you were in the area?

 

This site exists in a remote portion of the country with no paved roads for 25 miles and no geocaches within 30 miles. Imagine a vast, arid, high desert Plateau with few interesting features... Until you find this location. An oasis in the middle of no-where. A pool to soak your tired bones in... This is the location, right smack dab in the middle of the pool. "the reward for this cache is the location"!

As for "WOW" factor, its a clothing optional location(thanks Evil Rooster, I had not thought of that). But, please be respectful of others that may venture in and prefer swimwear.

Of course there will be questions to answer and historical facts to be learned.

 

Read below and it will explain why I choose to submit this as a virtual.

 

"Readers Digest" version of the guidelines that are met:

 

A virtual cache is a cache that exists in a form of a permanent object

at a location that was already there. Typically, the cache “hider”

creates a virtual cache at a location where physical caches are not

permitted. The reward for these caches is the location itself and

sharing information about your visit.

 

1) The site for my virtual cache exists in the form of a permanent object(hot springs).The BLM is currently conducting sensitivity studies in the area and while they dont mind people visiting the hot springs, camping, hiking, hunting or what ever, they would rather people dont leave things lying around.

Edit: I guess I need to clarify one issue. The area undergoing the study is an area that covers over 5 million acres, its not an easy task to place a physical cache a mile or two away.

 

Prior to considering a virtual cache, you must have given consideration

to the question “why couldn’t a microcache or multi-cache be placed

there?” Physical caches have priority, so please consider adding a

micro or making the location a step in an offset or multi-stage cache

with the physical cache placed in an area that is appropriate.

 

2) Why no physical, micro or multi cache? Due to the sensitivity study in the area.

 

A trail is a trail, a beach is a beach, a view is a view; but a

trail/beach/view is NOT a virtual cache. A cache has to be a specific

distinct GPS target - not something large like a mountain top or a park,

however special those locations are.

 

3)This is a very distinct GPS target. It is a 12 ft diameter natural hotsprings and if our GPS read the same, the coords should land you smackdab in the middle of the thing... Which is the point of the cache, to get in, test the water, report the temp or a picture of someone enjoying the experience.

Edited by Snootleather
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I don't purposely go to virtuals much anymore after seeing several in a row that really were nothing more than a small monument and a sign. If I come across one of those on my own, I'll log it, but I don't seek them out anymore.

 

This, however, is the type of thing I might purposely go to. It sounds interesting and I love hot springs. :D

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If it was in my caching area, I would definately visit it. Sounds like you met all the criteria, except the last one you listed might be a little iffy...ie, if the spring is the target and it is 12 feet wide, perhaps that is too general. Is there an information plaque there which you can make as the target instead? What did the approver state as to why it wasn't approved?

 

I am still of the opinion that it should matter if it is a virtual or a traditional cache, they should both be approved and not preference given to one over the other. In many many case I have found the virtuals to be a lot more entertaining and fun and informative than many of the traditionals, and we tend to spend more time at the virtuals admiring the area.

 

As a solution, just stick a cache 25 miles away and make then go to the spring and get information from the spring area in order to find the cache. I know it might not serve the purpose, but atleast it would get approved.

 

And lastly, ask the admin to work with you and see what it would take to get you cache approved. Hopefully the admin will not give you the brush off and will take the time to help you.

 

And if it doesn't get approved, don't let it discourage you. Just keep having fun.

Edited by res2100
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I agree with Carleenp. If there's a hot springs, I'd be there. One of my life's greatest joys is visiting these wonderous places and if there a cache to be claimed . . . I'd be in heaven, man! :D (Can you tell we're just thawing out from winter up here?)

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Because of the BLM study, you might be able to get this in as a virt. Because the BLM's been pretty good about geocaching, I don't think TPTB would want to jeopardize that by insisting a regular cache be placed there. But you WILL need a method of verification. Something unique about the site that only a person who has been there will know.

 

It certainly sounds like a cool place and one I'd love to visit, cache or not.

Edited by briansnat
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Absolutely yes. Love desert and love hot springs. But it stands a very little chance of being approved. If the area is too fragile one can argue that it shouldn't even be a virt. Gotta place a log-only micro a mile or two away, I am afraid.

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Absolutely yes. Love desert and love hot springs. But it stands a very little chance of being approved. If the area is too fragile one can argue that it shouldn't even be a virt. Gotta place a log-only micro a mile or two away, I am afraid.

 

....or place a regular cache a respectable distance away and just put the coords to the hotspring on the cache page, or inside the real cache as a bonus virt.

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If there was a physical cache there I think it would be more appropriate to list on GC.com. Of course if sever space for virtuals is not a problem it seems silly not to list it. but brings up the whole virtual/physical cache augment we don't want to get into.

 

On topic: yes, if I was there I would visit it.

 

edit: is this spring in the desert or Alaska?

Edited by geckoee
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This site is more interesting than any physical cache one could place <snip>

 

If you wish to avoid the 'physical vs. virtual' discussion, you probably should have avoided adding your own value judgements. Some folks geocache because they enjoy visiting interesting locations. Some geocache because they enjoy the hunt for a physical container.

 

Pretty much any hot springs I've ever seen covers only a limited area. It's not like you have to put the coordinates in the middle of the sensitive area. Even if you have to go a little ways, I willing to bet you can find somewhere far enough out to avoid added impact but close enough to still make dropping by the springs easy to do. I know that I wouldn't go all that way then blow off a visit.

 

I'm perfectly happy looking for (most) virtuals, but if it's possible to bring people to a cool location and give them a container to search for, it seems like the way to go.

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Yes, I would go also. If a cache leads to a interesting place that I find a challenge or scenic it will be something worth remembering. I'm fairly new to geocaching, but I'm finding the cookie cutter type of caches are far too common. If I can't remember a cache the next day was it really worth my time? Your cache sounds to me like a worthy site and the lack of a physical container would not matter.

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absolutely, yes.

 

besides the fact that i go on record again and again as saying i'm not all that fussy, hot springs are cool

 

theres a website somewhere that lists coordinates for hot springs all over the country (maybe the world, i don't remember).

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absolutely, yes.

 

besides the fact that i go on record again and again as saying i'm not all that fussy, hot springs are cool

 

theres a website somewhere that lists coordinates for hot springs all over the country (maybe the world, i don't remember).

Gee Flask, that just killed a lot of the WOW. :bad:

 

A quick look at my stats shows I'm not against virts, but if it's THAT remote, I don't see how it wouldn't be possible to hide a decent sized physical cache.

I can't imagine the entire 25 mile drive down dirt roads is all too environmentally sensitive to place an ammo can somewhere along the route. I mean a 25 mile dirt road has way more impact on the environment then a .30 cal ammo box. And, if it's that sensitive, you probably shouldn't be inviting people to drive to the spring and jump in ANYWAY. All those tire tracks, and foot prints and stuff are still gonna be here. Your potential to damage the "sensitive environment" is the same in this case, virt or physical. Now that I look at it like that, maybe any sort of cache here is bad.

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Just noticed this part:

they dont mind people visiting the hot springs, camping, hiking, hunting or what ever

You killed it there.

You can't possibly tell me 5 million acres of land is too sensitive for a geocache, but not too sensitive for 4x4ing, hunting or camping on.

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Sounds like a neat place, but that doesn't make it a geocache. A geocache by definition is a stash of hidden things.

 

I wish more geocaches were located at neat places, but I don't wish more neat places were geocaches.

 

I'd like to visit the hot springs, but not as a virtual.

 

Jamie

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If it is SO remote why does it need to be a virtual?Would it be to difficult to maintain?Is it on land where geocaches are not allowed?I would visit it regardless!There is a hotspring here in Arizona called Verde hotsprings ,difficult to get to but very interesting and I have visited it!

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Sounds great to me! I love hot springs and mineral springs. I would tend to agree with BrianSnat with regards to the BLM study. Is there something interesting that would not appear on an internet map regarding hot springs. Is there a neat rock formation, specific kind of tree, rock carving (petroglyph). As far as the need for such points of interest within the cache area, it has more to do with verification than with actual interest in the area.

shellie of M4S

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While not a hot spring, there are two virtuals for desert oasis in Big Bend National Park. Cat Tails Falls and Only in Texas. The logs on both caches make contemplate the 10+ hour drive to west Texas. :bad:

 

To answer your question about visitng your virtual, I would say no, not to log it as a find. I might visit on my own one day though - without logging the virt as a find.

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Sounds similar to Saline Valley Hotsprings in Death Valley National Park. It would have to be a virtual there, of course. I'll pack the vehicle on Friday. BCNU.

I thought of Saline immediately as well. If it is Saline, or a Saline-like place, would the "clothing optional" element add to or detract from the WOW factor? :bad:

 

I would go back to Saline, or go to any springs like Saline, so mark me down as a "yes".

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I have a cache near a hot springs. It isn't nearly as remote as the one you are asking about, only a few miles on a bumpy dirt road. There were lots of places to hide a traditional cache. Why bother with a virtual? If you're that concerned about damaging the environment, you shouldn't be out there in the first place. Virtuals should only be "placed" where a traditional is not allowed.

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Know what would go great with that virtual?

 

A disposable camera, so that people could take shots while they were there.

 

Maybe if you hid the camera in some durable container near where people would park their car. That seems like a good location and it wouldn't ruin the study at all.

 

Now that would be cool.

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Know what would go great with that virtual?

 

A disposable camera, so that people could take shots while they were there.

 

Maybe if you hid the camera in some durable container near where people would park their car. That seems like a good location and it wouldn't ruin the study at all.

 

Now that would be cool.

That's a GREAT idea!

Hey, you could put a little notebook in it too. This way people could log when they were there, and what pic number they took. Maybe even write a bit about their experiences too. Now THAT would be a cool virtual!

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Edit: Thanks to those that have posted with a yea or nea, but its starting to get a little out of hand.  If the remainder of the comments could be a yes/no I would appreciate it.

 

I don't want to get caught up in the virtual argument right now, and if the polls were working I would utilize them to avoid the long winded arguments.  With that said, would you visit this Virtual cache if you were in the area?

It sounds like your trying to see if a virtual can/will be approved here. If that's the case, you're really asking the wrong questions.

"Yes I would visit this location if I was in the area" does not make it a virtual.

I think most people would visit the spot, if they were in the area. I would most likely also visit the nearest place to eat, and since I'm not local, a nearby campground or hotel. Just because I would visit those places, doesn't mean I think the McDonald's, KOA, and Motel 8 should be listed as virtuals too. You haven't made a convincing argument why this can't be a physical cache, and that's the first step to getting a virtual approved.

Edited by Mopar
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