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Disneyland Cache Archived


travisl
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How stupid would the cacher have to be to contact the police department given Jeremy's post?  I sure wouldn't.

Why not? So that by not contacting them making caching illegal in even more areas and giving geocaching another black eye? Whether the cache owner contacts them or not, they will no doubt contact the cache owner.....if Jeremy has the name and number, you can bet he's been contacted. And if he chose not to disclose the cacher's information to the police, he could be arrested and charged with obstruction of a criminal investigation. Definitely not a wise statement<snip>edited out attack<snip>. B)

Edited by Sparky-Watts
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Just wondering, what would they charge the placer with?....littering?

Probably no charges, unless it was placed without permission, then I don't know what they'd do. There is actually a full range of things they could be charged with if it was placed without permission, according to the Homeland Security Act. I don't know the exact wording, but "creating a public panic" is one, "threat by concealment of suspicious device" is another......I mentioned "obsruction of a criminal investigation" because until all the facts are known, the police will treat it as a criminal investigation, and yes, Jeremy has the obligation to provide them with whatever information they request.

Edited by Sparky-Watts
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Just wondering, what would they charge the placer with?....littering?

Probably no charges, unless it was placed without permission, then I don't know what they'd do. There is actually a full range of things they could be charged with if it was placed without permission, according to the Homeland Security Act. I don't know the exact wording, but "creating a public panic" is one, "threat by concealment of suspicious device" is another......I mentioned "obsruction of a criminal investigation" because until all the facts are known, the police with treat it as a criminal investigation, and yes, Jeremy has the obligation to provide them with whatever information they request.

chances are it was placed without permission because if it was the park managers would have known what it was and there would not have been as much panic.

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I'm cancelling my trip to Disney World. We were planning on going in June. Oh well

Personally, I don't think caches should be placed in areas such as Disneyland, but that's just my biased opinion.

 

EDIT: On further thought, what exactly is the rationale you people are using in boycotting Disneyworld? You think they were wrong in evacuating the park when they found a suspicious device? You think they were wrong in asking that it be removed? Please clarify, it just doesn't make sense to me.

Edited by Sparky-Watts
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Hmm...

 

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Friday, March 19, 2004

Bomb scare at Disneyland a false alarm

Officials take precautions after a suspicious object is discovered near the Autopia ride.

 

By CINDY MURPHY and JEFF COLLINS

The Orange County Register

 

ANAHEIM - The Tomorrowland area of Disneyland opened 30 minutes late this morning after a park landscaper found a suspicious package at the bathrooms near the Autopia ride.

 

The Orange County sheriff's bomb squad declared the incident a false alarm after deploying a robot equipped with an X-ray that determined the object was not an explosive.

 

"We don't know whether it was an elaborate hoax or just something left behind," said John Nicoletti, Anaheim city spokesman, who was at the scene.

 

The incident did not delay Disneyland's scheduled 9 a.m. opening, but patrons were unable to visit such Tomorrowland attractions as Club Buzz, Innoventions and Starcade until 9:30 a.m.

 

Officials said that the landscaper found the object around 7 a.m. at the bottom of a staircase. He notified security personnel, who in turn called police. Police summoned the bomb squad.

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I'm cancelling my trip to Disney World. We were planning on going in June. Oh well

Personally, I don't think caches should be placed in areas such as Disneyland, but that's just my biased opinion.

I don't think so either but I am sorry, people need to chil out, come on it was inside a cell phone, maybe whoever paniced and called it in should have thought more about, "lets take this to lost and found" more than OMG its a bomb, this just shows that the terrorist are winning in a way Vigalence yes, Panic No

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Hmm...

 

------------------------------

 

Friday, March 19, 2004

Bomb scare at Disneyland a false alarm

Officials take precautions after a suspicious object is discovered near the Autopia ride.

 

By CINDY MURPHY and JEFF COLLINS

The Orange County Register

 

ANAHEIM - The Tomorrowland area of Disneyland opened 30 minutes late this morning after a park landscaper found a suspicious package at the bathrooms near the Autopia ride.

 

The Orange County sheriff's bomb squad declared the incident a false alarm after deploying a robot equipped with an X-ray that determined the object was not an explosive.

 

"We don't know whether it was an elaborate hoax or just something left behind," said John Nicoletti, Anaheim city spokesman, who was at the scene.

 

The incident did not delay Disneyland's scheduled 9 a.m. opening, but patrons were unable to visit such Tomorrowland attractions as Club Buzz, Innoventions and Starcade until 9:30 a.m.

 

Officials said that the landscaper found the object around 7 a.m. at the bottom of a staircase. He notified security personnel, who in turn called police. Police summoned the bomb squad.

And how much did that little "innocent" geocache cost not only the operators of the park, but also the taxpayers for having to foot the bill for the bomb squad? You can bet it wasn't cheap......this is one reason I don't think caches should be placed in parks such as Disneyland or Disneyworld.....go ahead and flame me for that, but that's just my opinion.

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Hmm...

 

------------------------------

 

Friday, March 19, 2004

Bomb scare at Disneyland a false alarm

Officials take precautions after a suspicious object is discovered near the Autopia ride.

 

By CINDY MURPHY and JEFF COLLINS

The Orange County Register

 

ANAHEIM - The Tomorrowland area of Disneyland opened 30 minutes late this morning after a park landscaper found a suspicious package at the bathrooms near the Autopia ride.

 

The Orange County sheriff's bomb squad declared the incident a false alarm after deploying a robot equipped with an X-ray that determined the object was not an explosive.

 

"We don't know whether it was an elaborate hoax or just something left behind," said John Nicoletti, Anaheim city spokesman, who was at the scene.

 

The incident did not delay Disneyland's scheduled 9 a.m. opening, but patrons were unable to visit such Tomorrowland attractions as Club Buzz, Innoventions and Starcade until 9:30 a.m.

 

Officials said that the landscaper found the object around 7 a.m. at the bottom of a staircase. He notified security personnel, who in turn called police. Police summoned the bomb squad.

And how much did that little "innocent" geocache cost not only the operators of the park, but also the taxpayers for having to foot the bill for the bomb squad? You can bet it wasn't cheap......this is one reason I don't think caches should be placed in parks such as Disneyland or Disneyworld.....go ahead and flame me for that, but that's just my opinion.

I am not gonna flame you, I agree, a vert maybe but not anything else, besides wouldn't this be a commercial cache since you have to pay to get in to the park?

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I am not gonna flame you, I agree, a vert maybe but not anything else, besides wouldn't this be a commercial cache since you have to pay to get in to the park?

I'm not real clear on the guidelines and definitions of a commercial cache, but I just don't like the idea of having to pay to go find a cache. There was a cache placed (most likely without permission) in a state park near here that you had to pay $5.50 to enter the park to find.....when I paid that and found the cache, I was really disappointed. It had been neglected for a year and a half or more, so I filed SBA on it and had it archived.

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I may be more naive than the next guy, but if i was a min-wage earning groundskeeper- and I found a cell phone lying there- i'd be like, "Score!"...not "OMG it's a bomb!!", if you ask me, the "official" story doesn't add up. However, i think that geocaches that require you to pay an entrance fee, like disneyland, should be off limits.

 

that's my 2 cents... B)

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I may be more naive than the next guy, but if i was a min-wage earning groundskeeper- and I found a cell phone lying there- i'd be like, "Score!"...not "OMG it's a bomb!!", if you ask me, the "official" story doesn't add up. However, i think that geocaches that require you to pay an entrance fee, like disneyland, should be off limits.

 

that's my 2 cents... B)

This would be considered a commercial cache these days, I believe. When it was placed (9/27/2002), there probably wasn't a rule about commercial caches and when one did get created, caches like this were grandfathered in.

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This is a very sad situation... the placer of the cache could possibly face some sort of penalization for all the fuss, the patrons at Disneyland were certainly affected, and this is NOT good publicity for Geocaching. This single story is enough to make any land manager consider banning caches entirely.

 

Let's hope everything turns out well.

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This is a very sad situation... the placer of the cache could possibly face some sort of penalization for all the fuss, the patrons at Disneyland were certainly affected, and this is NOT good publicity for Geocaching. This single story is enough to make any land manager consider banning caches entirely.

 

Let's hope everything turns out well.

I guess this is a good lesson on getting Permission. It also will come out what the item really was and the negative press attention will not be good for Geocahing. B)

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I've been wondering about this type of action being taken ever since I starated geocaching. Seems like whoever found it overreacted, but in general ammo cans are used in many of our caches. Those certainly could be seen as being dangerous, even if they are labeled out the outside.

 

I recently placed a cache in a very public area (well hidden, but a muggle might stumble across it). For this cache, I decided to use a clear plastic container instead of an ammo can specifically for the fear-if-found condition. If somebody stumbled across it, there shouldn't be any type of panic.

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Just a comment on the thoughts that a cell phone should not be viewed as threatening and that it was over reacting to call the police:

 

Reading the cache page, it sounds like the phone was attached to something with magnets, which does not make it appear to be just "lying around." The recent attacks in Madrid were set off by cell phones wired to explosives. They were set to go off when the phones rang. I would guess that large public establishments have been told to watch for such devices. If I was in a large public place and saw a cell phone that appeared to be attached to something, I certainly would notify someone. In better days such a thing might be viewed as a curiosity. Unfortunately that isn't the case anymore.

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As a former Disneyland cast member, I would like to add that the Park has had countless bomb threats over the years, most of them hoaxes. In this heightened age of security, a national icon such as Disneyland needs to be even more cautious than normal.

 

Did Disneyland overreact? I don't think so. They shut the gates on Sept. 11, 2001, fearing a similar attack. We had to check people's bags after the sarin gas attacks in Japan. These are the kinds of things you do to protect the security and safety of your visitors.

 

Mind you, I have no love for Disney. I left there after 10 years with a bitter taste in my mouth. But they are not in a position to take these sorts of things lightly.

 

I may be more naive than the next guy, but if i was a min-wage earning groundskeeper- and I found a cell phone lying there- i'd be like, "Score!"...not "OMG it's a bomb!!"

 

Actually, the groundskeepers have a highly respected job, and many of them have worked there for years. It's their Park, and they know every inch of it. If something is out of the ordinary, they are usually the first ones to find it. And a cell phone, hidden in a place where no cell phone could have "just been dropped", will raise a few eyebrows.

 

Should the cache ever been placed there in the first place? Probably not. As it is private land, and does require an entrance fee, it should've been off-limits. But the possibilities for hiding something in the Park are very tempting. I would hope that no prosecution come down for something this innocent.

 

Just my 2 cents. Take it for what it's worth.

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QUOTE=Team GPSaxophone,Mar 19 2004, 08:37 PM] I'm cancelling my trip to Disney World. We were planning on going in June. Oh well

Personally, I don't think caches should be placed in areas such as Disneyland, but that's just my biased opinion.

Cancelling your trip to Disney? Is that not extreme? Seems a little overboard on your part, but hey, at least then the lines will be shorter for me and I can park closer to the gates. B)B)

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I'd think a geocaching rock micro would be more appropriate in this day and age, but the original sounds brilliant! Amazing how much can change in a couple years. A declaration on the cache page of entry fees is all that's required... Prohibiting such placements isn't required, reason IS--bans aren't reasonable.

 

I too boycott the modern commercial disney but appreciate classic Disney. Basically when they went from art to plunder--er, profit-driven.

 

Enjoy,

 

Randy

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That was a very reasonable response, and I agree. I have been very tempted to place caches on land that I know would not approve, but I have refrained fearing bad press for the sport, and a hassle for me. Not that I think this cache placer was at all looking for trouble - caching is fun, and it's really easy to want to share the fun with EVERYONE! But, given the political climate, we have to be careful of appearances, no matter how silly it can seem to reasonable people who would never plant a bomb in the first place.

 

I hope no charges were filed, as it was a mistake.

 

BTW, my hatred of all that is Disney has nothing to do with this cache or the park's reaction to it (which, again, given the climate and number of people the park is "responsible" for, was, unfortunately, appropriate).

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It was a plastic toy fake cell phone to start. I'm not sure about the replacment cache. Were I going to blow up the park I'd use Disney Merchandise myself. There is enough of the gawdy stuff all over the park to where nobody would notice.

 

As for sparky's comment. Since there was no intent on harm, no threat of harm, not even a joking "this is a bomb" sticker on the cache, the parks is responsible for it's own reaction. Were I to leave my backpack (another place I put a bomb if I was going to blow up disneyland) behind by a phone on accident and they decided to overreact the intent of harm on my part is the same as the cache owner. None. However what Disney does is beyod my control. This if they choose to close down the park, or the city, that was their choice. Yes they played it safe but they still played it wrong. False alarms are to be expected in a world of heightened terrorism tensions. Those false alarms are part of the price of being more vigilent.

 

I'll admit all of this is specutlation because I don't know what Disney did or didn't do. But I do know if they prosecute this guy I'm willing to boycot because no harm was intended.

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I agree with you although it is unlikely a terrorist attempt would place a sticker to identify it as a bomb, and I'm fairly certain they would use something a bit more in line with the theme of Disneyland than a cell phone hidden under some stairs. The trouble is there are so many movies and shows today that showed cell phone usage as a means to trigger a bomb. Further inspection should have revealed it to be a fake phone before calling authorities.

 

An excessive reaction? Perhaps. Unfortunately some folks automatically go into panic mode and it is easier to occur since 9/11 than it was before it.

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Further inspection should have revealed it to be a fake phone before calling authorities

The problem with that, is that some bombs can be triggered to detonate upon moving. We were taught that if we saw a suspicious item, notify authorities immediately. We weren't trained to make the call whether it was a harmful device or not, nor would I want to make that decision.

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Yes, I think we're all overanalyzing this a bit. Those people are trained to protect the patrons, not to speculate on whether some suspicious looking object is the type of case that a terrorist is likely to use or whether he'd prefer to shell out a Snitch doll for his dirty bomb.

 

"Speaking as someone who doesn't know ditkus from bupkis, I'd theorize that an actual bomb would require at least 3 9-volt batteries to detonate, and thus the case that was used could NEVER hold a detonator because it couldn't hold that many batteries. Unless, of course, the terrorist is using solar cells to increase the charge. If I was there I would have dismantled it first to make sure there wasn't a logbook, and checked for solar cells. THEN I would have called the cops."

 

Whatever. :blink:

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I think the best thing to do is look at this as a learning experience. Be careful how and where you place your caches, keep in mind what a muggle might think if they find it. Mark your containers clearly with contact info and GEOCACHE.

 

I'm just glad that the report quoted didn't mention that it was a geocache.

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...Actually, the groundskeepers (on the Dinsey property) have a highly respected job, and many of them have worked there for years. It's their Park, and they know every inch of it. If something is out of the ordinary, they are usually the first ones to find it. And a cell phone, hidden in a place where no cell phone could have "just been dropped", will raise a few eyebrows...

 

This is truely an unfortunate incident. Something just doesn't jive, though. The cache had been there since 9-27-02 (well after the first heightened awareness of terrorist threats). Unless the cache was extremely well hidden, you would expect that it should have been noticed long ago by the park workers. Or discovered long ago by muggles.

 

Is it possible that the location of the cache had changed to a more blatantly obvious "threat?" Is it possible that a muggle might have tampered with it?

 

Is it possible that someone holding a grudge against Groundspeak could have manipulated this disgusting scenario? :blink::D

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I can see most sides of this argument. While I think Disney reacted in the only fashion they could (they followed their own, and the local law enforcement guidelines and policies), I agree with RK that they should see this for what it is and let it go away.

 

With that said....

 

Disneyland is private property. Caches placed on private property should have permission, especially large populated commercial spots.

 

If I found a plastic fake cellphone, attached via a magnet, to my electric meter in the back yard...I'd probably freak...then I'd plunder the sucker.

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Phone Home was my cache, but I have permanently archived it. I have phoned back the detective from Anaheim PD but apparently he was gone for the weekend because he has not returned my call. I did not ever seek Disneys approval to place the cache and am sorry that my cache caused problems for the police, Disneyland, and any park guests. I am very glad that this story wasn't blown out of proportion by the media and that it hasn't given Geocaching a bad name. It was my mistake for not gaining permission or labeling the newly replaced cache on the outside with www.geocaching.com like I have with most other caches. The cache was there for 1 1/2 years without any problems. I am against anyone boycotting Disney because they had problems with the cache. Apparently they thought it could be a bomb and responded in the safest way possible for all guests/employees of the park. Time will tell what happens. I will place updates here in case you want to follow the story to the end.

4forfun

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Back during the Sarin gas scare, we were instructed to search poeple's bags upon entry. We weren't told what we were looking for, but we suspected it was a bomb scare.

 

I'm sorry, but I'm not a bomb expert. There are only 2 kinds of bombs I can recognize: a bundle of red sticks with a bunch of wires and an alarm clock attached, or a black ball with a fuse sticking out.

 

Granted the cache was not discovered by landscapers right away. But not every inch of the Park is inspected on a daily basis. Some of the plants need virtually no care whatsoever above the timed watering system. I was merely sating that the fact that it was ultimately discovered by a landscaper doesn't surprise me.

 

But the fact that the cache was there as long as it was, just proves how easy it is to hide something in the Park virtually undetected. The Park's administrators need to be more vigilant these days to protect the general public.

 

I do not blame 4forfun for placing this cache. Apparently it was quite successful. No malicious intent was shown, and I believe nothing more than a reprimand may be in order. Let's hope for the best.

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