Ghost Geocachers, Fakes Or Shy People???

February 11, 2004

My wife and I went on a out of town Geocaching trip a few days ago & met a "Geocacher" in the field for our very first time. It all started when we arrived to a parking lot @ (of a park near the cache we were looking for) about the same time a woman arrived. I noticed that when she got out of her vehicle that she had a GPS unit in hand & was looking at which direction to begin her search. I was excited to see this as we do not have a GPS unit yet (we were up to 29 finds so far), so I walked over to her & introduced myself. She was happy to meet my wife & I. We joined forces & went looking for the cache together. Even though a lot of time was saved with her $200 Magellan, I still spotted the cache first. She logged her visit in the log of the micro cache like she knew what she was doing. Being curious, I asked a few questions like what her user ID was with Geocaching.com. Then she also told me that she had only been Geocaching for a couple of weeks & she still didn't know how to enter waypoints into her unit. She referred us to another Cache that was a little further North than we had intended to go, but we asked more about it & she gave us all of the details & told us right where to look. Later in the day we checked out the cache that she referred us to & it was right where she said it would be. The funny thing was that I never saw any indication that she had ever logged a visit there(it is an active cache to this day) I didn't think much of it until we got back home & the next day started logging all of our visits from our trip. I began to really wonder when she hadn't even logged any visits (on the website) @ any of the two caches mentioned above, or any others in the area in the last month. I even checked for a likeness in user names and time frames & still came up with nothing. So, at this time I am starting to believe that there is a ghost going around the Redding, CA area logging into caches & meeting unsuspecting visitors. Let me know if you are in the Redding, CA area, maybe you too have seen her. :lol:

Please share any odd encounters that you have had with supposed "GHOST" Geocachers.

Thanks!

Edited February 11, 2004 by Team Spirit of '76

38.2k · February 11, 2004

There are a small percentage of geocachers who find caches, but don't log them online. When I do maint trips, I'll sometimes find unfamilair names in the log books and no corresponding log online.

Personally, I'm not in favor of this practice. As a cache owner, I eagerly look forward to the "xxxx found your cache" notifications and enjoy reading the logs of finders. As a cache finder, I feel that if someone takes the time, money and effort to place a cache, the least I can do is let them know that I enjoyed it. Since cache owners can't always get out to their cache frequently, the online logs are the best way to do this. Also, the online logs are permanent. The paper logbooks can and do go missing, or get ruined by water.

Edited February 11, 2004 by briansnat

1.3k · February 11, 2004

There are caches I won't bother to log online. A lot of virtuals for example involve playing 20 questions and passing tests in order to log them and quite honestly, I'm not willing to waste my time exchanging e-mails with someone who may or may not be active just so I can log something I can keep track of myself. I may visit the site, but I doubt I'll ever log it.

There there's the monthly discussion of "so-and-so deleted my cache logs because of this fight were having" and I can see why other people stop logging finds online.

Then there's the people who don't want an account and don't want thier activities being watched by someone else.

Then add the people who are sick of the "you've only got X finds, go away" arguments.

Then add the people who are sick of all the accusations of fraudulent online logging.

It doesn't surprise me that most log books for old caches that I've seen seem to have more paper logs than online logs.

38.2k · February 11, 2004

There there's the monthly discussion of "so-and-so deleted my cache logs because of this fight were having" and I can see why other people stop logging finds online.

I wouldn't let a dispute with one cache owner keep me from providing feedback to others. It isn't their fault that one guy is a jerk.

Then there's the people who don't want an account and don't want thier activities being watched by someone else.

I never understood this rationale. Most of us are here anonymously. Who the heck are bons, or Team Spirit of 76? Nobody will know if you don't want them to know.

Then add the people who are sick of the "you've only got X finds, go away" arguments.

Then add the people who are sick of all the accusations of fraudulent online logging.

Again, I won't let a few jerks spoil the game for me and prevent me from telling the cache owner "thanks for the hunt, I enjoyed it" in my online log.

Edited February 11, 2004 by briansnat

1.3k · February 11, 2004

I never understood this rationale. Most of us are here anonomously. Who the heck are bons, or Team Spirit of 76? Nobody will know if you don't want them to know.

I think the problem is that many people don't know how easy or how hard it is to trace an account back to a real person. And if you don't know, then it's probably safest to assume that it can be traced back to you.

Anyone with a half hour to spare can trace my account back to a name, street address, phone number, etc. It's not hard. If someone values their privacy, the safest thing they can do is leave no online traces, and, unfortunately, that means no geocaching.com account.

Edited February 11, 2004 by bons

38.2k · February 11, 2004

People can easily hide their tracks if they want to. OK, the government can subpoena your ISP for the info, out outside that if you want to remain anonymous, you can. Personally, I don't care to. Google Briansnat on the web, or in groups and there are literally thousands of entries....many of which have my real name.

February 11, 2004

Anyone with a half hour to spare can trace my account back to a name, street address, phone number, etc. It's not hard.

I'm not worried about it. One thing is, I think that it would take me a lot longer than a half of an hour to track you down on the internet. Second of all, I'd like to see you track me down in less than an hour. And if you did, what would you have to gain? I'm flat broke. Besides, don't we have something better to do, like going out and finding caches? :lol: All in all I think that the people that make up the Geocaching population are good people for the most part. I probably have a greater chance of making another motorists mad at me while I'm out driving and them follow me home to do me harm. Or I guess I might be attacked by a mountain lion or bitten by a rattle snake, scorpion or black widow. I'm not going to pigeon hole myself just because so many other people are afraid to do anything now days. Yes, I do take lots of security precautions, but I'm going to get out and have some fun to! All in all, what I'm saying is lets go have some fun, but provide for safety first.

February 11, 2004

Interesting responses to this post -- but you have overlooked the most obvious answer -- it was a real ghost ! :lol:

5k · February 11, 2004

I think a lot of people don't log online, but I'm not sure why.

I met a cacher at an event who had never even seen GC.com. After we'd been on several cache hunts together, I remarked about something that I wanted to say in my online log--this was the first she'd heard of it. I had the unusual pleasure of explaining to a fellow cacher about how each cache has it's own page with a description of the cache and a series of logs from people who have found it.

She'd been getting her coordinates from a friend who visits GC.com and had thought that GC.com consisted of little more than a list of coordinates.

Jamie

February 11, 2004

Interesting responses to this post -- but you have overlooked the most obvious answer -- it was a real ghost !

Yes, very true. Thank-yoou for keeping us on track.

38.2k · February 11, 2004

There are also people who wait for a while to log their finds. Maybe they are on vacation, or don't always have access to a computer, or are just plain lazy (see Mopar . :lol: ).

6.4k · February 11, 2004

There are also people who wait for a while to log their finds. Maybe they are on vacation, or don't always have access to a computer, or are just plain lazy (see Mopar . ).

HEY! I resemble that remark! I'm only 20-30 logs behind! :lol:

6.4k · February 11, 2004

Anyone with a half hour to spare can trace my account back to a name, street address, phone number, etc. It's not hard.

30 minutes? Try 30 seconds, Ken! :lol:

February 11, 2004

I think a lot of people don't log online, but I'm not sure why.

I met a cacher at an event who had never even seen GC.com. After we'd been on several cache hunts together, I remarked about something that I wanted to say in my online log--this was the first she'd heard of it. I had the unusual pleasure of explaining to a fellow cacher about how each cache has it's own page with a description of the cache and a series of logs from people who have found it.

She'd been getting her coordinates from a friend who visits GC.com and had thought that GC.com consisted of little more than a list of coordinates.

Jamie

Very interesting! Now that you mention this, I recall asking this lady if she had seen or been to Buxley's ( http://www.brillig.com/geocaching/ ) and she said she hadn't. When we were exchanging info I showed her our print-outs of local Geocaches in the area and see didn't seem surprised to see the print. She was interested in writing down some of the cord's that we had. We saw how she had hand written notes and cord's written down on paper. Maybe she was getting her info 2nd hand from a friend. It is kind of odd that she didn't seem to know about all of the caches in her own area. After all, there isn't much up there in Redding. It's funny, but I thought that women loved to write. We went over to the Shasta dam after wards and went on a tour inside of it (it's been back open for tours for 7 months now). The first thing my wife did when we got inside the dam was go straight for the visitors guest book and sign it. :lol:

February 11, 2004

We don't have many cachers in this area and yet there are a few that don't log online at all. I prefer to see finds, DNFs and notes on my caches but just as there are some that read the forums but don't post there are some that don't log online. There are also some that don't log online or in the log book, this is evident in the winter when you see footprints in the snow but no log in the logbook or trade items don't match up to logs. To each his own.

3.1k · February 11, 2004

Not long ago I convinced a non logger to start logging his finds and DNFs as a service to the cache owner. I told him I felt it was rude not to log them as the guy gets an email which helps him know the status of the cache.

38.2k · February 11, 2004

The on line logs are important to cache owners, not just for the entertainment value. They also let them know about the condition of the cache AND that it is being found.

I've seen posts here from frustrated cache owners (usually new ones) who complain that nobody is finding their cache and because of this, they were considering archiving it. If the practice of not logging online became a common one, there will be a lot of disappointed cache owners out there and I venture to say, fewer people placing caches.

February 11, 2004

I was one of those cachers who don't log their finds online.

For the first eight and a half months that I was geocaching I did not have a computer and was not online, so I didn't have an e-mail address. I found out where the caches were by using an internet-access computer in the library. Yes, I know that I could have gotten an e-mail address even under those circumstances, but I was uncomfortable with my ignorance of the computer world so I would go in, look up and print the nearest caches, and leave. Quickly.

Then I got a computer, some training in how to use it, and time to practice. Two weeks later I signed up with GC.com and started catching up on my logs. Luckily I had kept the printouts for every cache that I found, with notes about when I found the cache, etc. For the next few days the cachers who were watching the local caches kept getting "Just catching up on my logs" logs. I had found 68 caches that I had to log! By the way, the day after I signed up I had my first First-To-Find, so my first "real time" log was also my first FTF.

So now you know at least one reason why some cachers don't log their finds on the site.

RichardMoore

February 11, 2004

If someone values their privacy, the safest thing they can do is leave no online traces...

Some may be worried about their privacy not only on a 'some psycho-killer's gonna find me' level, but also on a personal level.

For example, you tell your mom about geocaching and give her your username. The next totally mom thing to do will be her going through and reading all of your online logs, right? What happens when she sees that you went geocaching on the day of your grandma's birthday party? Your excuse for not going to the party was that you had to work!!! It may not seem like such a good idea to some people to leave an online log for any number of reasons.

By the way, the above example is not related to any personal experience!

2.3k · February 12, 2004

Do the 'guidelines' say you HAVE to log a find online?

24.7k · February 12, 2004

Do the 'guidelines' say you HAVE to log a find online?

They don't even say you have to log it in the physical log.

1.6k · February 12, 2004

Do the 'guidelines' say you HAVE to log a find online?

They don't even say you have to log it in the physical log.

But that just defeats the whole purpose doesn't it?

I think it's odd that there was no trace of this cacher in any of the logs, but maybe on the one where she told you where it was, she signed the log with just her real name before she had a geocaching username or something...

If that theory isn't right, then she's obviously just a very tech saavy ghost...

20.7k · February 12, 2004

Is it possible that she is a member of a group which owns the cache that she told you about?

This is an interesting issue, but without knowing which two caches are being discussed, we really are just guessing.

1.1k · February 12, 2004

If you want a real "ghost" story at a cache hunt, Read This cache page.

Scroll down to the Homerz log for January 18th, 2004 and read up from there.

logscaler.

Edited February 12, 2004 by logscaler

38.2k · February 12, 2004

Do the 'guidelines' say you HAVE to log a find online?

No, they don't, but I see it as a courtesy to the cache owner.

February 12, 2004

No, they don't, but I see it as a courtesy to the cache owner.

I find that some caches are just so forgettable that it becomes a case of, 'If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all,' so they don't get logged. In a way, that's a coutesy to the cache owner, I haven't insulted his/her cache.

February 12, 2004

My wife is a "ghost."

Really.

She will sign the logbook, but will not log the find on GC.com.

I have been posting her Find / DNF and T/L so that the cache owners and cachers know she has been there.

It drives me a little nuts (er.. more nuts) to find the logbook and online log do not match.

(Not that it really matters, just an order in the universe thing)

20.7k · February 12, 2004

I find that some caches are just so forgettable that it becomes a case of, 'If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all,' so they don't get logged. In a way, that's a coutesy to the cache owner, I haven't insulted his/her cache.

Generally, the way these caches are logged is 'TNLN Thanks'.

February 13, 2004

I really enjoy reading the online logs for my caches. It is a courtesy to the cache owner as well as to others who enjoy reading the logs. Still, if someone finds one of my caches and doesn't want to log it online that is fine with me too. To each his/her own.

2.2k · February 13, 2004

i log every find, note, dnf, travel bug find, drop off, and transfer. i want TPTB to know every move i make. :unsure: that way i am a non cheating, clean cacher, that will be the first to be watched by big brother when he comes on line. what the heck, i'm not doing anything illegal on the net. so, what me worry?

2.3k · February 14, 2004

I will resume logging online when my numbers aren't being tracked. It would be very easy for GC.com to offer an "opt-out" preference so that total numbers aren't recorded. I don't want to be in a "forced" competition" of any sort. Any list of caches that I hit also provide a record of where I was on a given day. No thanks. Let me add a "found" log to a cache page and that's it.

1.6k · February 14, 2004

That story about Madjack and Homerz is really quite strange...

38.2k · February 14, 2004

Any list of caches that I hit also provide a record of where I was on a given day.

Could come in handy if you are falsely charged with murder.

2.3k · February 14, 2004

Any list of caches that I hit also provide a record of where I was on a given day.

Could come in handy if you are falsely charged with murder.

Or a good alibi if you did it.

February 14, 2004

Is the cache in question also available on navicache.com? Maybe she's one of THOSE people .

2.3k · February 14, 2004

Any list of caches that I hit also provide a record of where I was on a given day.

Could come in handy if you are falsely charged with murder.

In that case, I would refer to my own geocaching book and be glad that I still sign the logbooks at the cache sites.

2.3k · February 14, 2004

But what does it matter that geocaching.com displays your total number of finds?

Because I don't want to be ranked (or rank, that's why I shower every day too ). I just don't want people to judge me by my number of finds, and we see that happen every day in this "game".

Just in these past few days, someone asked about what it would take to be a moderator, and cachers replied "Oh, look, you only have ___ finds. Go out and practice some more, and then come back when you are a real cacher". They judged the value of his question on the amount of caches they had found, and that isn't right. Until they act otherwise, everyone has the right to be treated with equal respect in here.

I don't want to be on any state "lists" or in any kind of "competition" with the numbers game, and there seems to be a lot of preoccupation with statistics. By practicing "Underground Geocaching", I have taken myself out of "the race".

I guess there used to be a time when "found" numbers didn't even post on GC.com here, but TPTB changed that to appease a few who wanted to keep stats. They should have made it optional for each cacher, not mandatory.

As much as I would like to write an online entry for every cache I have found, I don't want my numbers tracked either. So I don't log online.

February 15, 2004

<_< We're new here and to Geoing. We log our finds because we enjoy sharing our experiences. We currently have 3 caches out and plans for several more, and love to see fellow cachers log their opinions of our hide, but....I thought the purpose of this sport is for everyone to enjoy it in his or her own way. Log or don't log.. to each his own.

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts. Cache on!!!

February 18, 2004

We've met people in the field who tell us they don't log online for various and sundry reasons. It would be nice if they did because we enjoy looking at where others have been and what they thought of caches. It's fun. We especially like looking at photos that folks put in their logs. But... to each their own.

<_<

February 20, 2004

I have only been caching for a few months and have a little over 100 finds...I have no idea where that puts me in the caching pecking order...not that it matters I guess. <_< I have hidden 12 caches and generally I am having a blast.

Most times I read through the logs left by previous cachers before I go on a hunt.

Sometimes there are clues, sometimes there is good advice on what routes to avoid, etc. I can tell if a cache has been found successfully over a period of time or if it has been plundered. The most important thing I have seen is the folks who DO log their "no-finds".

My neighbor took his family hunting a cache but he didn't read any of the logs. No one had found that cache...ever. It was gone...taken by a park ranger in the wildlife refuge. There were at least 6 or 7 "no-finds" posted that would have helped him decide whether to attempt the hunt.

He and his family got lost, spent way too much time looking for the cache and almost put themselves in a dangerous situation.

As the owner of a few caches, it does make me feel good to know that folks enjoyed hunting them. And when a DNF gets logged, it does encourage me to make sure the cache is still there and that my coordinates and clues are appropriate.

I have found some rather bland caches and I still logged a TNLNSL just to let the owner know that I was there. I have also had a cacher email me for a clue when they couldn't find the cache and they never logged their "no-find". Is that a stats thing?

Maybe I never thought or worried about someone using the caching logs, statistics, etc for harmful reasons.

I guess I understand both sides of the discussion.

Stay safe out there, y'all Maybe I'll see you on the trail. I promise not to follow you home!

March 12, 2004

I am new to Geocaching, but I feel that all Finds/Not Founds should be posted on the web site. This not only lets the owner know that his/her cache is being hunted, but also what condition it is in.

Also, anyone planning on looking for a particular cache can check the recent logs to be sure it is still there before they waste time looking for something that has disappeared.

In other words, the logs help everyone!

March 17, 2004

I think this one boils down to...it's a game and the rules are as yet not too stringent...and guess what, we get to do as we choose...ghost or no ghost...it's on the net and people from all walks of life will check it out...I choose to keep it enjoyable and not taxing...have fun...

6.5k · March 18, 2004

Maybe it was this gh0zst? <_<

March 20, 2004

Then of course there is at least another reason for not logging, to play grimlin and make sure the cache can not be found again. hate to think that way, but I have already lost the contents to one cache, and there are severak in my area that have come up "missing"

March 20, 2004

Maybe it was this gh0zst?

Hey Mom, come look... I'm famous!

whimmzieguiy, you must write for a newspaper.

March 22, 2004

I am new to the whole caching scene, but I would like to add my two cents nonetheless.

For those of you who think it is rude not to log a cache or track your finds, you are simply thinking of how you feel about it. Not everyone thinks the way you do or shares the same set of values or cirminstances as you. There can one million reasons why not to log a find. The same can be said for logging a find. But as it stands an individual can do as they please.

I am not as paranoid as some but I would not have a problem logging my finds. But I know people who will never leave a record or account of where they have been or where they are going. They are law abiding citizens who just dont like people knowing their buisness.

I know individuals who are current and ex military types, whom have or work in military Intel, and they will tell you; you may not think about it now now but in the future for what ever reason every item logged into public record or any record can be used to locate or paint profiles of you. This may all seem a little far fetched but people do think about these kind of things. Personally it is a little extereme for me, but I have that option.

Yes it does seem like a lot of drama but it is true.

March 22, 2004

you may not think about it now now but in the future for what ever reason every item logged into public record or any record can be used to locate or paint profiles of you. This may all seem a little far fetched but people do think about these kind of things. Personally it is a little extereme for me, but I have that option.

This is sadly, very true. I with you tho- a bit more than I tend to worry about-

Besides - I think they'd find so much other stuff first, that geocaching would probably only make me look better

Ghost Geocachers, Fakes Or Shy People???

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