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Are The Forums A Hostile Place?


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Once upon a time I dropped out of the forums due to the hostility. The names changed and eventually I came back and racked up a post or two. The forums now are better than then. That includes the worst they got in the Mod wars of 2003.

 

This isn't scientific but if some of the regulars are not bashing the usual suspects (who are also regulars) or defending the site from attack, they seem to turn to newbiews and chew some newby a**.

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2. "This cache is at an elevation of 2100 feet" sounds so funny to me. Only in California would someone have to worry about posting such a low elevation on a cache page. When we have a cache at a high elevation, we mean at 6000 feet or higher! :blink:

Heck, I live at 1967feet and one of the three caches I have placed (which is only 2 miles from my place) is higher than that. I don't live in the moutains but rather the desert. High elevation for me is like 10000feet, I can do a 10k run at 7500feet without any extra problem than at home.

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It's gonna be with comments like this from CO admin.

 

"Are you intentionally trying to get modded?"

 

I asked him if he could explain what he meant, but he hasn't responded.

 

All this comment did is light the fuse. I even made a comment on Navicache that I was sure he is a nice person and that Casey and I would like to meet him. After all, the spring meeting is coming up and I feel we are an asset to geocaching.

 

So maybe if he has a problem with me, don't you think he could email me in a mature manner?

 

I think I will now do a new topic now. :blink:

 

D

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I have on occasion, taken an issue to PM or e-mail. Sometimes someone says something so mind numbingly stupid or offensive my head explodes. When this happens my comments are better handled privately. This doesn't mean I can't defend my position. I simply feel the forums would not be a proper place to discuss it.

I have occasionally tried to diffuse a situation through PM's, though I will rarely ever go to email. Problem with email, is that when the offending party can't conduct themselves in a proper manner and use proper language, I tend to accidently forward the emails. Yeah, call me a tattle-tale, I can handle it. That's why I would much rather deal with personal attacks through PM and keep them out of the forums. Some folks who constantly profess to be all high and mighty in the forums just won't do it that way, and insist on calling me a troll, big mouth, over-poster, or the like. I've calmed down quite a bit since starting here, oh, so many weeks ago. If I can't deal with the situation in a PM, I will attempt to deal with it in the forum, but that often gets ugly, and I don't like to do that because I feel it is rude and disrespectful to the other forum members and the topic starter.

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(Sparky-Watts @ Jan 23 2004, 09:38 PM)

 

QUOTE (Spzzmoose @ Jan 23 2004, 10:27 PM)

 

Yes, I have a life. I'm a cat. I have 9 of them. Would you like to borrow one?"

 

I gotta be honest, I was pretty proud of that line!

_______________________

 

Still have 9 left?! Doubtful; I read your webpage.

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I waited until I had almost 100 caches before I started posting. Why? I had decided going into this forum with 5 cache finds would be like jumping into the shark tank wearing London Broil after shave. Lately things have been better but people are still a little harsh on noobs who post outside the getting started area. 

 

:blink: That really friggin sucks. Anyone should feel comfortable to post in here regardless of their find count. I have yet to understand why someone with several hundred finds holds more intelligent integrity than someone with less finds. More isn't always better. :D

Edited by Ce'Nedra
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2. "This cache is at an elevation of 2100 feet" sounds so funny to me. Only in California would someone have to worry about posting such a low elevation on a cache page. When we have a cache at a high elevation, we mean at 6000 feet or higher! :blink:

Heck, I live at 1967feet and one of the three caches I have placed (which is only 2 miles from my place) is higher than that. I don't live in the moutains but rather the desert. High elevation for me is like 10000feet, I can do a 10k run at 7500feet without any extra problem than at home.

I live at 5437 feet (give or take a few for accuracy) That's why 2100 doesn't sound too terribly important. Now if the cache description said "There is an elevation gain of 1100 feet on this cache", then it would look right.

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I waited until I had almost 100 caches before I started posting. Why? I had decided going into this forum with 5 cache finds would be like jumping into the shark tank wearing London Broil after shave. Lately things have been better but people are still a little harsh on noobs who post outside the getting started area. 

 

:blink: That really friggin sucks. Anyone should feel comfortable to post in here regardless of their find count. I have yet to understand why someone with several hundred finds holds more intelligent integrity than someone with less finds. More isn't always better. :D

I'm in total agreement. Tghe forums are for everyone. The idea that people "need to grow a thick skin" is repugnant. That may be the way it is, but that doesn't mean it should be that way. Rather than have the forums full of thick-skinned insensitive users, why not tone it down a notch so new users who come here for help and inspiration can ask their questions without fear of ridicule?

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2. "This cache is at an elevation of 2100 feet" sounds so funny to me. Only in California would someone have to worry about posting such a low elevation on a cache page. When we have a cache at a high elevation, we mean at 6000 feet or higher! :blink:

Heck, I live at 1967feet and one of the three caches I have placed (which is only 2 miles from my place) is higher than that. I don't live in the moutains but rather the desert. High elevation for me is like 10000feet, I can do a 10k run at 7500feet without any extra problem than at home.

I live at 5437 feet (give or take a few for accuracy) That's why 2100 doesn't sound too terribly important. Now if the cache description said "There is an elevation gain of 1100 feet on this cache", then it would look right.

Thanks Sax. I made the change on the Cache page and like it much more.

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I just watched "Battle Royale" last night. THAT was hostile.

 

Definitely yes. I couldn't watch it all! When things get too hostile I quit watching. Occasionally I do that with a thread here. Quit watching. Not very often though.

Oddly enough, that DVD is sitting on my shelf waiting for the right moment. I may watch it tonight. Or just go to sleep. One of the two.

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Over here in this thread the topic starter made this comment:
This forum has really become a hostile place.

 

Moderator, may I suggest closing this topic since I have not received any bit of sympathetic advice I may use! Only ANGER!!

Wow! That's quite a statement, considering the topic began with this:

I got a stubborn reviewer (Hemlock) who after accepting a bunch of my caches, all of sudden, decided that he doesn't like the new virtual I've left.

(If you read the other thread now, you'll see that the topic starter added a new line to the beginning to make it appear less-confrontational)

 

I've been on these forums for quite some time and have posted a few times here and there (ok, everywhere, all the time). The most dividing topic I've seen here is virtual cache approval. Someone submits a virtual, it is denied by the approver with comments on how to get it approved, the virtual-owner then comes to the forums and slams the approver for not approving it. 9 times out of 10 that owner has not replied to the cache approver's comments through email.

 

In this particular case, the virtual owner is so dead set on placing a virtual instead of a traditional or multicache that he comes to the forums looking for people to rally to his cause and get the virtual approved.

I find nothing wrong with soliciting opinions from others in this forum. You will usually get either a few "yes" replies and a bunch of "no's" or a few "no's" and a bunch of "yes" replies. That's how public opinion works. Not everyone agrees with everything you say.

When you begin a thread in a hostile manner and continue in that fashion, don't expect anyone to join your cause. Those people have already left the building.

 

Several attempts were made by other members to show that it would be possible to place a traditional cache near the location of the plaque. Since the plaque is at the top of a mountain at a ski area, it could be used to start a multi where you ski to the bottom to find the container. It would be much easier to maintain a physical cache this way, and much easier for cachers to sign the logbook at the bottom of the mountain than at the top.

 

My question is this, there are guidelines that have developed over the few short years that Geocaching has been in existence. Those guidelines are easily available to read through (there's even a link from the "hide a cache" page). You check a box saying you have read the guidelines before you are allowed to submit a cache. Why then, would you submit a cache that is clearly against the guidelines? Are you hoping the approver won't notice? They have a job to do. You can make it easy by following the guidelines, or make it hard by doing it your own way. When others try and point out what the guidelines are, why would you say that they are being hostile? Why should they be sympathetic of your plight when you weren't following directions in the first place?

 

I know, that's more than one question. Some people like giving lots of answers, asked for or not :blink:

I even got an email from the guy wanting me to join his cause. Am I mistaken, or is 2004 the year of the geocachers meltdown????

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I waited until I had almost 100 caches before I started posting. Why? I had decided going into this forum with 5 cache finds would be like jumping into the shark tank wearing London Broil after shave. Lately things have been better but people are still a little harsh on noobs who post outside the getting started area. 

 

:blink: That really friggin sucks. Anyone should feel comfortable to post in here regardless of their find count. I have yet to understand why someone with several hundred finds holds more intelligent integrity than someone with less finds. More isn't always better. :D

I'm in total agreement. Tghe forums are for everyone. The idea that people "need to grow a thick skin" is repugnant. That may be the way it is, but that doesn't mean it should be that way. Rather than have the forums full of thick-skinned insensitive users, why not tone it down a notch so new users who come here for help and inspiration can ask their questions without fear of ridicule?

I have a suggestion, call out people who slam noobs. "Hey that wasn't a nice way to say that!" might work.

 

Probably way to simple of a soultion, naaah it would never work. Just forget I was ever here. :D

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My question is this, there are guidelines that have developed over the few short years that Geocaching has been in existence. Those guidelines are easily available to read through (there's even a link from the "hide a cache" page). You check a box saying you have read the guidelines before you are allowed to submit a cache. Why then, would you submit a cache that is clearly against the guidelines?

I can think of a variety of reasons. First, you seem a little unclear about the whole concept of "guidelines," but that's beside the point.

 

Maybe they think that rigid enforcement of the guidelines is stupid.

 

Maybe they object to some of the guidelines themselves.

 

Maybe they aren't sycophants.

 

Lots of possibilities.

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My question is this, there are guidelines that have developed over the few short years that Geocaching has been in existence. Those guidelines are easily available to read through (there's even a link from the "hide a cache" page). You check a box saying you have read the guidelines before you are allowed to submit a cache. Why then, would you submit a cache that is clearly against the guidelines?

I can think of a variety of reasons. First, you seem a little unclear about the whole concept of "guidelines," but that's beside the point.

 

Maybe they think that rigid enforcement of the guidelines is stupid.

 

Maybe they object to some of the guidelines themselves.

 

Maybe they aren't sycophants.

 

Lots of possibilities.

I think I'll bring that up next time I go bowling. I mean rigid enforcement of the guidelines is stupid, right?

 

And maybe I object to some of the guidelines.

 

It shouldn't bother anybody if I dont follow the rules, after all I don't want to be a sycophant.

 

It's a game! It has rules! Follow them or find another Game. Not to tough to understand.

 

This is not intended to be any more inflamitory than the quoted post.

I have seen fizzymagic make some intelligent informed arguments, I just don't think this is one of them. BTW I find the guidelines pretty clear, what's the problem?

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Whats the topic again? Oh, never mind. :D

 

There seems to be a lot of discussion about sensitivity for noobs. Other than an inherent suspicion of sock puppets, which is difficult to peg about 20% of the time, I think the forum community does an outstanding job embracing them. (that means hug not shame.)

 

I was weary of the forums at first, anyone with a sense of self should be when entering a new environment. I must admit, as if anyone has a doubt, that I am not at all shy about expressing my own ideas. (this doesn't stop when I am not behind the PC curtain of protection BTW) However, walking into a new environment can be tough. Sometimes it takes thick skin to find out that you never needed it.

 

We have inside jokes. We have bonds, friendships, grudges and issues. It takes some lurking and balls to figure it out at first. You wouldn't be reading this if you didn't have the chops to be here. If this is the first thing you have EVER read on the forums then good for you, the worst is over, welcome to our community (your gonna fit right in). Be yourself and have a great time. It is a pleasure to meet you. :blink:

 

The forums have an amazing variety. Some of you people bug the heck out of me. This adds flavor. Some of you ramble forever, (I'm guilty) it adds weight. Some of you think to much, it adds content. Some of you speak your minds, it adds heart and sincerity. Mix it up and you have US. I kinda like it.

 

This is what it is, you either get it or you don't. It is sometimes hostile, but the community does not tolerate jerks. The system is working. Thank you all for playing. Cache on.

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To paraphrase Hunter S. Thompson:

 

The Forums are uglier than most things. They are normally perceived as some kind of cruel and shallow trench through the heart of the caching pastime, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs, for no good reason. :D

 

his original quote:

 

The TV business is uglier than most things. It is normally perceived as some kind of cruel and shallow money trench through the heart of the journalism industry, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs, for no good reason. :blink:

 

actually, the forums are kind of warm and fuzzy when you get to know them.

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There seems to be a lot of discussion about sensitivity for noobs.

 

I don't see much insensitivity towards the noobs who come here and are earnestly looking for information, or to participate in the give and take. Its the people with a handful of finds (or sometimes none) who come here and tell us how our caches are destroying the environment, or how we should be playing the game, or complain about guidelines, who get blasted. I reallly don't blame those who jump on these types.

 

People are more likely to accept criticism from someone who has a clue as to what they are talking about.

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Hostility is in the eye of the beholder. I just ignore the ranting threads. I have enough stress in my life without worrying about Mods closing threads, virtuals not being approved or who's account is a sock puppet.

 

Cache,post , do whatever makes you happy.

 

Live and let live.

 

Turn the other cheek.

 

:blink:

Exactly. I've even been known to quit visiting the forum for a week or so to let the silliness simmer down. To me, this is a family sport, and my family doesn't care about the inane babble, who has how many finds, etc.

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My question is this, there are guidelines that have developed over the few short years that Geocaching has been in existence. Those guidelines are easily available to read through (there's even a link from the "hide a cache" page). You check a box saying you have read the guidelines before you are allowed to submit a cache. Why then, would you submit a cache that is clearly against the guidelines?

I can think of a variety of reasons. First, you seem a little unclear about the whole concept of "guidelines," but that's beside the point.

I'm not unclear about the guidelines. What ever gave you that idea?

 

I recall seeing something in the guidelines about "If you aren't sure if you cache meets the guidelines, ask the approver before placing it"

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The forums can seem like a pretty unfriendly place, sometimes, but one can't take it personally.

 

The real meaning of printed words is subject to alot of interpretation. If I get an e-mail that says "I saw you in a club the other night. NICE HAT!" I might interpret "NICE HAT!" in any number of ways even though the e-mailer really meant to compliment my hat.

 

Complicated concepts can be verbally explored only with a long typed message. The brevity of messages might make messages seem more terse or short than intended and leave alot of room for speculation.

 

But, then, there are many blantantly hoistile responses to posts. I think that these result from the anonymous nature of Internet interaction which leads to people taking risks with language and confrontation that they wouldn't take in a face to face social situation.

 

Some people don't care how they come off or how they will make someone feel when they are hidden behind a screen name, an avatar and a monitor and making a comment to someone who could very well be around the world and whom they might (probably) never meet.

 

Better to not take the forums too seriously being mindful that there are some people out there for whom the forums represent a significant aspect of life. For me, there are alot of other things to worry about or from which to derive satisfaction.

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