I Have Noticed In A Few Months Time That...

November 30, 2003

When people place new caches that they seem to log in their own cache as a find..i think that is just padding up the numbers as you dont have to work very hard to find yoru own...you are placing it for the good of the game...

Also noticed in reading about previous people finding caches that they log in that this is their 2nd or 3rd time around on a cache but they never logged in a Not Found as far as i can tell..unless they are deleting the not found after they eventually find it...

Isnt this a game of fun and not padding the numbers....i might be a newbie but looking for others' thoughts on these issues....

BTW..my whole family is hooked..when i come home from work..wife always seems to have a few set aside to go looking for and kids love it too...im sorry we didnt get started in this when there was more light after dinner....

Thanks for all that everyone does to make geocaching great...

1.2k · November 30, 2003

When people place new caches that they seem to log in their own cache as a find..i think that is just padding up the numbers as you dont have to work very hard to find yoru own...you are placing it for the good of the game...
Also noticed in reading about previous people finding caches that they log in that this is their 2nd or 3rd time around on a cache but they never logged in a Not Found as far as i can tell..unless they are deleting the not found after they eventually find it...

Isnt this a game of fun and not padding the numbers....i might be a newbie but looking for others' thoughts on these issues....

BTW..my whole family is hooked..when i come home from work..wife always seems to have a few set aside to go looking for and kids love it too...im sorry we didnt get started in this when there was more light after dinner....

Thanks for all that everyone does to make geocaching great...

Thats a pretty harsh thing to say without examples. Since As of today, there are 75664 active caches in 190 countries. Your post implys that a lot of people do this.

Please list examples of people posting finds on their own cache. lets start with 20 examples. shouldnt be hard to do it that many people are doing this.

Also there is no guideline that requires someone to list a DNF. If they find it on the 5th attempt then guess what??? They found it!!! no need for a DNF

24.7k · November 30, 2003

...Also there is no guideline that requires someone to list a DNF. If they find it on the 5th attempt then guess what??? They found it!!! no need for a DNF

If it took 5 tries to find a cache the owner thought was a 2 in difficulty there was a need for a DNF.

Logging a DNF is every bit as much a courtesy as logging a find.

November 30, 2003

"Finding" your own cache isn't exactly kosher, but it's usually because someone hit the wrong button when they made their log, or don't realize the different type of logs.

Many people don't log a DNF until they've truly given up. I know I don't. Sometimes something happens the first time you search (like the kids are whining) and you don't get to do a decent search. Or maybe it gets dark too quickly. Or maybe you need to go back to the website to re-check your coordinates, decode a hint, re-read the logs, or beg a hint from the hider.

A few others will log a DNF way too soon. I'm not sure if that's really such a good thing, as it might discourage others from looking for the cache.

Then there's the people who might log a DNF or just a note to say they're still looking, but change it to a find later.

It's no big deal, really. Find counts really don't mean anything, and sometimes they get screwed up. For example, I found a cache once, but the owner decided to make some changes, and for some reason deleted all the previous logs. That took my find count down by one. Sometimes that happens and you won't even notice it.

George

November 30, 2003

I wasnt meaning to be harsh or flaming at others.....i was just asking for ettiquette regarding how this should or should not be logged....im not going to put other peoples names on here as examples...i dont think that is fair..if i am being disrespectful..then im sorry...just learning how things should be done....

1.3k · November 30, 2003

I've seen a few examples of this but I see it as a rare thing. Perhaps they hit the wrong button, perhaps not. I've also seen a person (well a family group) make deals with other cachers to boost their caches hidden totals by listing them as a co-owner but putting their name first in order to receive credit for hiding a cache they obviously didn't place.

But these exceptions of padding totals are far and few between in my opinion, I would guess over 99 percent of geocachers don't pad their totals. But even if someone does pad their total, they are really only cheating themselves. Don't allow them to take away from your fun of geocaching. Remember it is what you make of it.

Cheers,

Blake

1.3k · November 30, 2003

Many people don't log a DNF until they've truly given up. I know I don't.

I log a DNF if I spend more than an hour looking for the stash or really put a serious effort into locating it. In my humble opinion think it is important for two reasons to log a DNF if you really spent the time looking for the cache. First of all, it verifies to the owner if the cache is really well hidden and second, it notifies the owner of a potential missing cache if several log a DNF on a low difficult level cache. In fact, if the owner verifies it is there despite sevearl DNF's only encourages the others to come back and try harder.

Cheers,

Blake

9.4k · November 30, 2003

Sometimes two or more cachers will hide a cache together. There can only be one 'owner' for the cache, no matter how many names are listed as hiding the cache. The only option for those who helped hide it is to claim a find in order to move it off of their nearest caches list. Other than that, I can't think of a good reason for logging your own cache as a find.

38.2k · November 30, 2003

I've seen people who log finds on their own cache, but they are extremely rare. Some do it out of ignorance, and others do it to pad their numbers.

People not logging DNF's is much more common. I wish everyone would, but some people seem to think there is some shame in a DNF. There isn't, because if there was, I'd have a lot to be ashamed of!

November 30, 2003

I didn't log my cache as a find. Since I already know where it is I didn't find it.

I did log my first DNF today.

3.9k · November 30, 2003

I wasnt meaning to be harsh or flaming at others.....i was just asking for ettiquette regarding how this should or should not be logged....im not going to put other peoples names on here as examples...i dont think that is fair..if i am being disrespectful..then im sorry...just learning how things should be done....

Your not being harsh or disrespectful...a bad choice of words perhaps, but your O.K in what you said basically. There are SOME pepole that log their own caches, but it is rare overall. I also don't believe in logging a DNF log unless I have given up on the cache.

Welcome to Geocaching!

El Diablo

1.3k · December 1, 2003

Sometimes two or more cachers will hide a cache together.

In most cases you are correct. But in the case I was citing, this was not the case. It was four different states 1,000's of miles apart, all posted on the same exact day by a family-group in Pennsylvania who is infamous for various things, just to pad up their "caches hidden" totals. However again, people like this are the exception in geocaching, not the norm. 99% plus are honest and don't pad their totals.

Cheers,

The Blake

9.4k · December 1, 2003

Sometimes two or more cachers will hide a cache together.

In most cases you are correct. But in the case I was citing, this was not the case...

The case you cited is one appropriate way of owning a 'vacation cache'. Your name would go first, the cacher (or family member) maintaining it for you would be second. That way, you still own the cache. I think it would be appropriate for the maintainer to log it as a find since they can't claim it as a hide.

December 1, 2003

I had logged my first hide as a find because my kids found it and wanted to log it. I had actually hidden it without them. Later on I decided this didn't seem right so I deleted the find. I let them create their own id's to log it if they wanted to. I also deleted a find on my account that my son made with his cousin and without me. We moved it to his above mentioned account. So at this rate is it possible to have a negative number of finds?

3.8k · December 1, 2003

I wasnt meaning to be harsh or flaming at others.....i was just asking for ettiquette regarding how this should or should not be logged....im not going to put other peoples names on here as examples...i dont think that is fair..if i am being disrespectful..then im sorry...just learning how things should be done....

Not being disrespectful, just making an observation.

While it wasn't handled properly, the original responder to your question made a valid point. You may have noticed a few people doing this sort of thing you're inquiring about, but it is not the norm. Some are "all about the numbers" while others are "all about the find". Different strokes for different folks, ya know? There are all sorts of arguments all around for a variety of different variables, but the end result is the game/sport/hobby is fun.

Enjoy 'caching!

3.8k · December 1, 2003

I've seen people who log finds on their own cache, but they are extremely rare. Some do it out of ignorance, and others do it to pad their numbers.

People not logging DNF's is much more common. I wish everyone would, but some people seem to think there is some shame in a DNF. There isn't, because if there was, I'd have a lot to be ashamed of!

Brian,

DNFs are a badge of honor! Just ask "the other kablooey"!* At his latest admittal, he's:

"Candidate for most inept geocacher, based total cache hunt failures (over 100 as of January 2003)."

That's almost a year ago, I wouldn't be surprised if he's doubled that total by now!

*If anyone is wondering there is no relation between kablooey and myself, it's pure coincidence. He lives in CA, I live in MD.

Edited December 1, 2003 by mrkablooey

December 1, 2003

"Candidate for most inept geocacher, based total cache hunt failures (over 100 as of January 2003)."

Now thats funny!!

3.8k · December 1, 2003

"Candidate for most inept geocacher, based total cache hunt failures (over 100 as of January 2003)."

Now thats funny!!

Go easy on the poor guy.

December 1, 2003

Go easy on the poor guy.

I was laughing with him. It's cool that he would write that and he must have a great sense of humor.

3.8k · December 1, 2003

It's been well documented in these forums that he stinks.

1.4k · December 1, 2003

docdesi wrote:
I'm not going to put other peoples names on here as examples...

Nor should you feel obligated to just because some clown says that you should. Good for you.

*****

1.5k · December 1, 2003

Placing a cache under a sock puppet name, then finding it under your actual team name is something that does indeed happen, and I know about specific instances where it has. However, I will not air that 'dirty laundry' in this arena, as I feel it to be unnecessary.

3.5k · December 1, 2003

I've seen people who log finds on their own cache, but they are extremely rare. Some do it out of ignorance, and others do it to pad their numbers.

I've never understood padding numbers, but beyond that I don't understand why anyone would bother padding their numbers by adding ONE. C'mon, find your own cache 6 or 8 times...get some REAL padding in there!

I've seen it a few times around here and I think it's probably just a matter of hitting the wrong button.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I love my DNF's. I know one guy who, when he finally finds the cache, goes back and changes his DNF to a Find. To me that's like altering history. Those Did Not Finds add character!

And remember: "Every time you log a Did Not Find, an angel gets his wings!"

Bret

3.9k · December 1, 2003

docdesi wrote:
I'm not going to put other peoples names on here as examples...

Nor should you feel obligated to just because some clown says that you should. Good for you.

*****

The clown had a valid point. He put it more agressively than he should have maybe, but it was a point. However I think we have reached a general consenus here.

The topic was a good one and the responses provided the answers. but thanks for your input J5.

El Diablo

Edited December 1, 2003 by El Diablo

December 1, 2003

If I have looked for a cache and could not find it, I have posted a DNF. Since I rarely get back to the same locale, especially if eroyd has already been there and found it (sometimes right after I have looked), it only makes sense to admit to a not found and move on. Besides, to me finding the tupperware is secondary to finding the spot, so if I have already admired the view/landmark/whatever, I really don't care if I find the cache.

December 1, 2003

I logged a find on one cache that I later "inherited". So my name is (second) on the list of owners (and I maintain the cache), but I wasn't the one to hide it originally, and I did find it. So, some of those logs you mentioned could be something like that.

As for DNFs, I always try to log one. It gives me more incentive to go out and try again; I hate having a DNF on my list hehe. Sometimes I delete the old DNFs once I find the cache. Other times I leave them if I think the post was interesting or might help someone else. Some of my best logs are DNFs

I may change them from a DNF to a "Note" if that makes sense. I've even logged multiple DNFs on the same cache. Still haven't found that one (but I will!)

Edited December 1, 2003 by BeachBuddies

December 1, 2003

I have only not found one cache I went looking for, not alot at 50 finds lol, but I felt it only right to log it as a dnf. I also went to a cache twice and logged a note that I went back instead of a find because I wanted the owner to know I liked it enough to go back twice. At the start it was about the numbers now I plan one or two a week so that it gives me time to explore the area and just enjoy being outside in the woods. As to the orginal point about others padding their numbers, don't worry about it just go out and have fun with the ones your with.

Edited December 1, 2003 by Xitron

1.2k · December 1, 2003

You know, I find it SOOOOO much easier to worry about what I'm doing when I geocache, rather than worry about what everyone else is doing.... it just makes my life so much simpler....

However, your results may vary... mine are not neccessarily typical.

(Anyone who is out there padding your numbers, listen up ........ WHO CARES!!!)

December 1, 2003

LOL yep I agree totally with BK for a change

1.2k · December 1, 2003

LOL yep I agree totally with BK for a change

Now THAT'S cool....hehehe.

On a totally off-topic, er, topic:

The letters BK make me think of where we were stationed when I was in the 5th, 6th, and 7th grade, Bad Kreuznack, Germany. Whenever we were at some kind of activity that took us out of town, to say, Landstuhl, or Kaiserslautern, and someone asked us where we had come from, well, we said, "BK" and everyone knew what we meant.

Unfortunately, I found out recently that Rose Barracks, the Army base we were at in BK, was closed. It's like a piece of your home town being torn down or something. Oh well.

December 1, 2003

Ahh sorry breakltrack, I know the feeling I found out the school I went to as a kid overseas was closed.

December 1, 2003

I logged a find on one cache that I later "inherited".

This could happen fairly often - I've got one of these myself - exactly the same situation.

2.2k · December 1, 2003

when i first started geocaching i found caches my brother had hidden where he lives about 150 miles north of me. i didn't have a gps yet so i used his. he went with me on the finds but he gave me no hints or help. i had to tell him which direction to go in. i have also hidden a cache in the memory of a deceased brother, that this brother doesn't know where it is. i logged the ones up north as finds, and i think he should be able to log the one i hid as a find. i am loving caching too much to let anyone ruin it for me. not even my muggle, but cute, husband. i spend a lot of time reading the forums so i can learn as much as possible so i can find more difficult caches. happy caching everyone. now if hunting season will end soon so i can get out in the woods again.

6.4k · December 1, 2003

I'm gonna side with Breaktrack here too. I'm also gonna point out that the " family-group in Pennsylvania who is infamous for various things, just to pad up their "caches hidden" totals" that hid caches in " four different states 1,000's of miles apart, all posted on the same exact day" had to work with the local cache co-hiders and the admins to place those caches, so the date hidden is actually probably just the date they finally got all the logistics and approvals for those caches worked out. You can set the hide date to anything you want, so I could spend weeks hiding caches all over the place, and then submit them all at one time, and they would all have the same hide date. Doesn't mean I physically placed the caches there on that date. In my case, many of my caches have been in place for weeks or even months before the "hide date" while I avg readings, make sure the location is secure, and create the cache page.

December 1, 2003

"Finding" your own cache isn't exactly kosher, but it's usually because someone hit the wrong button when they made their log, or don't realize the different type of logs.

How true -- with the new report format I did this the other day without realizing it when trying to post a NOTE to one of my caches indicating I had did a maintenance check.

I only realized my mistake when I recieved an email saying, "JollyBGOOD found your cache!"

So I deleted the find and replaced it with a note.

I imagine this happens a lot because the DEFAULT setting seems to be "FOUND IT" when you click on LOG YOUR VISIT. If you're not paying attention it's easy to post your note as a find.

December 1, 2003

I'm gonna side with Breaktrack here too. I'm also gonna point out that the " family-group in Pennsylvania who is infamous for various things, just to pad up their "caches hidden" totals" that hid caches in " four different states 1,000's of miles apart, all posted on the same exact day" had to work with the local cache co-hiders and the admins to place those caches, so the date hidden is actually probably just the date they finally got all the logistics and approvals for those caches worked out. You can set the hide date to anything you want, so I could spend weeks hiding caches all over the place, and then submit them all at one time, and they would all have the same hide date. Doesn't mean I physically placed the caches there on that date. In my case, many of my caches have been in place for weeks or even months before the "hide date" while I avg readings, make sure the location is secure, and create the cache page.

And the reverse is true. I have a buddy who caches almost every day but only logs his finds every two weeks or so.

So if you read a list of his finds on a given day they may be spread out over several states and hundreds of miles. He's simply too lazy to change the date to the actual date he found a particular cache. So his FIND dates actually reflect the day he logged the find, not the day he actually visited the cache.

He actually had me wondering how he managed to log 42 caches in one day until I figured out what he was doing. ;D

December 1, 2003

You know, I find it SOOOOO much easier to worry about what I'm doing when I geocache, rather than worry about what everyone else is doing.... it just makes my life so much simpler....

However, your results may vary... mine are not neccessarily typical.

(Anyone who is out there padding your numbers, listen up ........ WHO CARES!!!)

Here! Here!

6.4k · December 1, 2003

I imagine this happens a lot because the DEFAULT setting seems to be "FOUND IT" when you click on LOG YOUR VISIT. If you're not paying attention it's easy to post your note as a find.

Actually, the "default" log is nothing.

There is no default, and if you don't select a log type from the drop down, you can't post a log.

And the reverse is true. I have a buddy who caches almost every day but only logs his finds every two weeks or so.

So if you read a list of his finds on a given day they may be spread out over several states and hundreds of miles. He's simply too lazy to change the date to the actual date he found a particular cache. So his FIND dates actually reflect the day he logged the find, not the day he actually visited the cache

I'm almost that bad. I often fall weeks (months?) behind logging my caches online, but when I eventually do log them, I log them with the correct date.

December 1, 2003

As for logging one's own cache. I think that's just about padding the numbers. I don't do it, and never have considered doing it, because like you said, it's a game. But for those who DO log their own caches, whatever, it doesn't really bother me. They are the one who has to live with the fact that they can't enjoy a game w/o cheating.

With not posting not founds, that bothers me a little. As a cache owner I would like to know when people are unable to find it. That provides me with info as to the condition of the cache. It could have been taken, moved, etc. It also lets other cachers know that there might be a problem so they can skip on it for now, or go out and try to find it, knowing it could be gone.

2.6k · December 1, 2003

We have approvers around here that are editing found logs from new hiders.(tad poles)

I Have Noticed In A Few Months Time That...

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