t_bonewolf Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Is it just me or does anyone else feel it is just irresponsible to place caches in the middle of busy parking lots or in the middle of truck staging areas of superstores like Walmart? t_bonewolf Quote Link to comment
umc Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I've done a few caches like this and I don't think its irresponsible. A parking lot is just as safe of a place as any IMO. I say that because I travel the metro area day to day with work and am in a lot of parking lots. Parking lots are a fact of life and we all live with it. Even people that have kids use parking lots and walk their kids through them. I don't know that they would think it was irresponsible. Are you refering to a saftey issue or is it more of the publicness of the cache that bothers you? If thats the case then don't do those caches if you feel uncomfortable. I don't do caches that I am uncomfortable with because of that feeling of 10,000 people watching you. As a matter of fact there is a cache that I was working on where the final cache was in the middle of a very busy place. I will wait until the off season to retrieve it. I wasn't too happy with that but oh well, its my choice to do it or not. MiGO __________________________ Caching with a clue.... Quote Link to comment
martmann Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 My first find was in a parking lot I thought it was a hoot. ___________________________________________________________ If trees could scream, would we still cut them down? Well, maybe if they screamed all the time, for no reason. Click here for my Geocaching pictures and Here (newest) Quote Link to comment
+jollybgood Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Personally I like variety. Sometimes a nice parking lot cache is the perfect diversion while I'm waiting for the wife to pick up a prescription or finish some shopping. Besides you always the option NOT to log a cache if you arrive in the area and feel uncomfortable. I've done this many times -- usually with caches that are bit too close to someone's residence for my taste. I recently decided not to search for a cache when I realized it was hidden in the shrubbery in front of the window of small buisness. Being early on a Sunday morning and closed I did't want to have to explain to the police what I was doing. Jolly R. Blackburn http://kenzerco.com "I'd like to buy the world a coke, but I only have fifty cents" Quote Link to comment
+Ashandes Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 At least you're less likely to get eaten by a bear I think it would be irresponsible if the description of the cache didn't contain enough information about the environment for a person to make up there own mind as to whether or not it was too dangerous. Although it could be argued that researching the location of the cache and any dangers inherent in that location is part of the game. Beyond that I have no problem with it though. ________________________ What is caches precious? Quote Link to comment
pdumas Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 (Besides you always have the option NOT to log a cache if you arrive in the area and feel uncomfortable.) I've done this many times, just because a cache is there does't mean I must do it. This is a game and I like playing it Mike Quote Link to comment
+ScottJ Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Well, if it's on private property such as a Wal-Mart parking lot, we are supposed to assume that the placer had permission from the property owner. Otherwise, the approver would have denied it -- of all the reasons for which I've seen caches denied, this is one of the more clear-cut ones. Define "irresponsible". -- Scott Johnson (ScottJ) Quote Link to comment
+Scoobie10 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 One of my favorite caches is hidden in a mall parking lot. You can actually pull up, log the cache and drive away without getting of your car. How cool is that. :-) <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Scoobie A day without sunshine is like.....NIGHT! Quote Link to comment
+Renegade Knight Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 We have the ability to wander the world with or without caches. We already have to use our judgement to navigate the daily travails of life. We are responsible for our own limits and crossing streets by ourselvs and brushing our teeth. A cache in a new location doesn't expose us to more danger than we already have the ability to get into on our own. However since the placer isn't their to hold our hand, we are rather limited to our own judgement. There are caches that made me uncomfortable (though I wasn't in danger) and some I have flat out refused to do because they were beyond my skills. That is my choice to make. Quote Link to comment
Keystone Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I am the regional approver responsible for the area where t_bonewolf lives. Recently there have been a lot of micros hidden in his area in urban environments such as parking lots. When the submission meets our listing standards, I approve it. When it does not, I archive the cache or question the owner to work through the concerns. The approvers ordinarily do NOT quiz cache hiders about whether they received permission from Wal-Mart or Target to hide a cache in the parking lot. Obtaining permission is the responsibility of the cache owner. An exception is made for certain states that have permit systems for their state parks; since the approvers know about the permit requirement we will ask about it if the permit is not mentioned on the cache page. To my knowledge, Wal-Mart and Target do not have geocaching policies. t-bonewolf, if you have a concern about any particular cache, please feel free to report it to geocaching.com. I have a feeling that you wouldn't very much enjoy geocaching in Los Angeles, Nashville or other cities where urban micros are both popular and ubiquitous. As others have said, if you don't like a particular type of cache, don't hunt for it. |x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x| Keystone Approver, Geocaching.com Admin "Eschewing Entropy and Ensuring Enthalpy in the Groundspeak Forums" Quote Link to comment
gm100guy Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Never thought of that mall parking lots..... Wife and daughter could go shopping and my son and I could bag a find or 2. We need more of these caches. gm100guy http://members.rogers.com/gm100guy/cachepage.htm Ontario geocachers http://groups.msn.com/GeocachinginOntario/homepage Quote Link to comment
+ScottJ Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Keystone Approver:The approvers ordinarily do NOT quiz cache hiders about whether they received permission from Wal-Mart or Target to hide a cache in the parking lot. Obtaining permission is the responsibility of the cache owner. Interesting. I would have thought "Did you get permission?" would be the first question when an approver learned a cache was on private property. In fact: quote:Note to Reviewer In order to expedite your new cache approval, please provide any details for the cache listing, such as final coordinates for a MultiCache, whether you received permission, or a description of the item for a virtual cache. The reviewer will delete this note before approving your listing. I'm not being argumentative, just pointing out that it's not a bad thing to ask, since we're assuming it already ... not everyone reads the guidelines so carefully, and by asking, you might remind someone who hadn't thought of getting permission. When one property owner gets hacked off about a cache on his property that he didn't know about, it reflects on all of us. Which brings us back to the topic at hand -- I'd say that if the cache was placed in a supermarket parking lot or on otherwise private property, without the property owner or manager's permission, then yes, that's irresponsible. -- Scott Johnson (ScottJ) Quote Link to comment
umc Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 quote:Originally posted by ScottJ: Interesting. I would have thought "Did you get permission?" would be the first question when an approver learned a cache was on private property. In fact: It is but I think its more so when its personal private property. A walmart parking lot is open to the public right? MiGO __________________________ Caching with a clue.... Quote Link to comment
+SomewhereInND Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 If people walk by it all day long, it cant be that irresponsible. I agree with not having a cache on a railroad track, but what is more dangerous, a gravel road or a railroad track? Lots of people die on railroad tracks, but its not the track that causes the problem, it is the gravel road that crosses it. What is more dangerous having a cache 100 feet from a track, or having one 100 feet from a road? Somewhere In ND South of the hill North of the tree Quote Link to comment
+ScottJ Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 quote:Originally posted by umc:It is but I think its more so when its personal private property. A walmart parking lot is open to the public right? We really shouldn't, in my opinion, ASSUME that our activities are OK with the property owner. A lot of store parking lots now have signs up, describing the exact legal circumstances under which you're allowed to be there, quoting local ordinances chapter and verse. Some have video surveillance, too. I'd say better safe than sorry. -- Scott Johnson (ScottJ) Quote Link to comment
Keystone Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 umc has it right, we question personal private property but not property that's open to the general public, like a park or a mall (except, as noted above, if there is a known permit policy). For a place like Wal-Mart, as a listing service we assume that the hider has the common sense to read any applicable signs and to seek the appropriate permission. That is quite different from a railroad, where the law tells us that a person shouldn't be near the tracks. Imagine the delays in cache approval if permission had to be proven for each and every cache placement of this type! |x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x|x*x-x| Keystone Approver, Geocaching.com Admin "Eschewing Entropy and Ensuring Enthalpy in the Groundspeak Forums" Quote Link to comment
+Team GPSaxophone Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 It's nice to find a cache hidden in the city where people walk by it all the time. Urban micros are just the thing for this area. We have lots of room outside the city for ammo cans. They have their place, too. Took sun from sky, left world in eternal darkness Quote Link to comment
+shawhh Posted October 24, 2003 Share Posted October 24, 2003 in my opinion it isn't irresponsible to place a cache anywhere at all, as long as the guidelines for listing a cache are followed. it is each individual geocacher's responsibility to assess the risks for any cache and to proceed according to his or her limits. -harry Quote Link to comment
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