Pin Map Link Disappeared !!

[Guest Peanuthead]

Crud, I sat down to plan 3 days of Geocaching, and the pin map link has disappeared from the link page at geocaching.com. Anyone have the URL bookmarked ?? Aaaargh !! If you have it, please email it to mjbraz@juno.com

 

Thanks,

 

Peanuthead

[Guest Scout]

Is it Ed Hall's map page you are looking for? It's at http://www.brillig.com/geocaching/

[Guest Buxley]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Peanuthead:

Crud, I sat down to plan 3 days of Geocaching, and the pin map link has disappeared from the link page at geocaching.com. Anyone have the URL bookmarked ?? Aaaargh !! If you have it, please email it to mjbraz@juno.com

 

Thanks,

 

Peanuthead

---

 

Unfortunately, it appears that Jeremy has decided to remove the link to my maps page from his web site. This is too bad, as I think the maps are a resource all geocachers should be able to use.

 

You can still use the maps by bookmarking http://www.brillig.com/geocaching/ and going there directly.

 

-Ed (Buxley)

[Guest jeremy]

I will re-add the links to the Buxley maps as soon as he complies with my requests.

 

Cheers,

 

Jeremy

[Guest Buxley]

Since a number of people have asked, here is Jeremy's request:

 

From: "Jeremy"

To:

Subject: Remove Lost Caches link.

Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 11:33:39 -0700

 

Ed,

 

Please remove the lost caches page from your web site.

 

In addition, I need to have you provide an addtional copyright message on

your maps and web pages as follows -

 

"Geocaching Data Copyright 2001 Grounded, Inc."

 

Thanks,

 

Jeremy

 

[This message has been edited by Buxley (edited 26 May 2001).]

[Guest Quinnow]

I am at a complete loss as to why Ed Buxley has been banned from the Geocaching site.

This man has spent countless hours doing nothing but adding a great way to see a cache location based on map form. He never asked for money, he never asked for favors in return for this service. Anytime someone wanted a zoom in feature for their area he was more than happy to add that function. I had assumed that these forums were here to speak openly as long as it was within good taste doing so. I did not realize that we had to worry about being banned from the site and or forums if we spoke of what we believed in. I have read in several posts and mailings that Geocaching.com was made a free site as to help others and to enhance the sport. But if someone else does that its considered unethical or a no-no.

So I am at a loss here, is this a sport or business?

And are there any Intentions of letting Mr. Buxley back into Geocaching?

About 75% of the people that come here use those maps he made and it would be a shame to just drop him like that after all he has done for us.

I hope I don't get booted for my comments here, but I suppose you have to do what you have to do.

Things like this is what will tear the sport apart and push it into multi sites doing submissions, which would be bad due to an un-uniformed listing of caches.

My 2 cents and nothing more. I also mean no disrespect or sarcasm.

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

[Guest Scout]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Quinnow:

I am at a complete loss as to why Ed Buxley has been banned from the Geocaching site.

---

 

Give it a rest. Ed Hall has not been "banned." Jeremy is under no obligation to link to either Ed's site or yours, for that matter. If he wants to, fine. If not, fine, too. Don't try to make Jeremy look like the bad guy, here. Your exaggerated description of the difference of opinion is not helpful. Let the two of them work it out. Back off, he explained.

[Guest Cape Cod Cache]

I'm a bit curious why this happened. I wanted to go to the Fort Hill cache in MA, but was taken off before I got there. I personally feel that 'lost caches' are part of the demographics of geocaching. To have that information would help others as to not place a cache in that area.

my $0.02

[Guest Quinnow]

scout, Once again I see you are speaking for other people, but thats what I expect from you. And if not being able to see any coordinates or cache listings isn't being banned, then what is it? I got this Info in a e-mail from Ed. We communicate back and forth about diff cache types and setups, thus this is how I keep in touch.

And like I mentioned above I was not being rude I was simply asking a question. "Give it a rest" ? I mentioned it once bud, not over and over. But I am not going to get into this with you again, you seem to look for this sort of thing.

By the way, it was never before and is not now my Intention to make Jeremy look like a bad guy. I think and believe Jeremy has done and continues to do a great job on his sit, as well as puts in alot of hard work and time with it. Scout just seems to read things into the way he wants, so I hope I make this clear. And Yes it might be a good idea to wait and see what happens in the run, but I myself didn't think it right for restrictions to be put on someone who has done so much, but then again it's not my site. So I'll respect the views of Jeremy and Ed and wait for an outcome.

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

 

[This message has been edited by Quinnow (edited 26 May 2001).]

[Guest Nemesis]

a cache in that area...

---

 

I agree, but I think Ed should concentrate on the maps that he does so well and avoid stepping on Jeremy's toes by duplicating a proposed part of geocaching.com.

 

I trust that Jeremy will find a way of adding the retired stashes to his web site when he gets time (soon?).

 

I don't think Jeremy's request for a stronger copyright notice is unreasonable.

 

I hope Ed quickly makes the changes so that we may all benifit from the great service that he provides .

 

Cheers,

Donovan Govan.

[Guest Nemesis]

a cache in that area...

---

 

I agree, but I think Ed should concentrate on the maps that he does so well and avoid stepping on Jeremy's toes by duplicating a proposed part of geocaching.com.

 

I trust that Jeremy will find a way of adding the retired stashes to his web site when he gets time (soon?).

 

I don't think Jeremy's request for a stronger copyright notice is unreasonable.

 

I hope Ed quickly makes the changes so that we may all benifit from the great service that he provides .

 

Cheers,

Donovan Govan.

[Guest Scout]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Quinnow:

I think and believe Jeremy has done and continues to do a great job on his site

 

And Yes it might be a good idea to wait and see what happens in the run

 

So I'll respect the views of Jeremy and Ed and wait for an outcome.

---

 

Well said.

[Guest Cobalt]

I am a very new Geocacher so perhaps my 2 cents may be informative. So far the maps have been a great asset to me in my experience using the site. Losing the map feels as if geocaching.com just lost a kidney. It can still function without it but it's going to take some time to recover and be as powerful as before. I agree completely with the fact that Jeremy should be able to run the site as he desires. Even though geocaching.com may be more fun than business it is necessary to acknowledge intellectual property as property, whose owner can control and maintain it as he wishes. This goes for both sites. I sincerely hope that all parties involved are considering what is best for the users of their individual services. It seems to me that that is why both these great sites were created, to provide a great opportunity for those who desire to utilize them. While it is true that Jeremy's site created the need for Buxley's maps, the maps truly enhanced the site and helped the machine work smoother. I am sure I speak for many when I say that I hope there is a compromise achieved soon. Y'all Rock!!!

 

Smiles, Cobalt

[Guest kimbeattie]

My two cents: I liked the maps and found them useful. I'd like to see them back. On the other hand, Jeremy's request seemed perfectly reasonable to me.

[Guest jeremy]

Spent some time today working on a mapping system for the site. It is zoomable for US only at the moment. Once it's fully tested I'll add the other countries as well as more detailed US maps.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/map/us.asp

 

Whatever happens we will have maps, and I'm adding some cool capabilities to them. You can identify a cache icon (once you're zoomed in) by clicking the identify radio button and clicking on the cache.

 

Use it sparingly as I'm still testing it.

 

Jeremy

[Guest Rocky]

Gave the new map page a try, in our area where we have caches close together it leaves a little to be desired. Hope you can improve it.

[Guest Quinnow]

Rocky,

 

I noticed that too, but then I figured it out that all you need do is click on it a few times with the "Zoom" feature picked. This will bring you right in so that you can see the caches spread out. Test all the features on top of the map page so that you can also see which caches they are.

Good Luck!

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

[Guest cleenjeep]

I was rather dissapointed with the new map as well. I sure hope it is improved upon, I preferred the mouse-over identifying of caches, and having to zoom in ten times to find caches seemed a bit much for me. I wouldnt use the feature at all if it stays that way. I think also that the highways should have truncated names, such as "I-94", as opposed to "Interstate 94". It would be less work, and it wouldnt hide so many caches that are close to highways. Headed in the right direction though...

Michael

 

 

------------------

Webmaster and List Admin for Southern Michigan Rockcrawlers

Personal Site is Cleenjeep's Site

[Guest jeremy]

Unfortunately Ed Hall is apparently too stubborn to respond to my two requests. I do understand that the mapping isn't at the same level as Ed's, but that is because he has had many weeks and I only worked on it a few hours. I'll be adding more to the pages in the next day or so. Unfortunately that breaks in to my own Memorial Day Weekend.

 

You think I like doing this? If Ed simply complied to my two requests this wouldn't be an issue. If this is any indication to further issues with Ed Hall I'd rather sacrifice the maps than have to deal with his rogue actions.

 

Don't paint me out to be the bad guy here.

 

Jeremy

[Guest 300mag]

ay.I am happy to see that the sport is getting more and more popular.It was still nice to have a Canadian map for once My .2cents

 

[This message has been edited by 300mag (edited 27 May 2001).]

 

[This message has been edited by 300mag (edited 27 May 2001).]

[Guest 300mag]

ay.I am happy to see that the sport is getting more and more popular.It was still nice to have a Canadian map for once My .2cents

 

[This message has been edited by 300mag (edited 27 May 2001).]

 

[This message has been edited by 300mag (edited 27 May 2001).]

[Guest Quinnow]

Jeremy,

 

Though I am sure it must have seemed like it, I do not think anyone has painted as or considers you to be a bad guy when it pertains to this subject. However, Ed on his own free will has removed all mapping from his site. So as long as this is done is there any other reason to keep him banned?

I am asking as I am sure others would too that he be allowed to continue the use of Geocaching.com. You have to admit he has done his share for the sport to make it fun for everyone out there. He has worked hard for the benefit of others not himself, as you have with your own site.

Anyone that has been in contact with Ed knows he is a very nice Gentleman and it seems a shame that even though he has removed all mapping that he is still not allowed to use the site. Ed has placed some nice caches in his area so that others may enjoy, now he can't even see who has logged them as finds. I think that until things get worked out and as long as his maps are removed that there is no reason why he should not be permitted to return to full functions. If there are other points I am not aware of I am sorry. This post should be taken as respect to both parts.

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

 

[This message has been edited by Quinnow (edited 27 May 2001).]

[Guest jeremy]

Here's Canada -

http://www.geocaching.com/map/canada.asp

 

I'm using shapefiles, so I'll need to find better ones for each region in order to add more roads and features. I'm also working on making the site more efficient so the pages load faster.

 

I never banned him from the site. Apparently his personal machine is the same as his web server. I shut off access to his web server, so as a result he lost access to the site.

 

I also opened up the site to access when he shut off the maps. If he starts building the maps again I'll have to shut off access again.

 

Jeremy

[Guest Markwell]

Having just found this thread, I'm amazed at how hot this topic has gotten, and that so many people have taken such a firm stance on the issues without knowing all of the dynamics of the conversations.

 

My observations: First, I don't think that Jeremy's two requests are extreme. A copyright notice protects Jeremy's hard work, and removing lost caches saves us the time from accidentally trying to find them. The addition of the copyright seems easy enough, but I don't know how hard it would be to remove "archived" caches. I do believe that Ed should have complied with these requests. I have used Ed's maps in the past and found them helpful, and would like to see them reinstated with those provisos.

 

However, while I haven't been involved enough to know all of the reasons, to this outsider, Jeremy's "ban" seems harsh. Jeremy and Ed are both obviously intelligent individuals who wish nothing more but the furtherance of the sport. I'm surprised that a compromise or agreement hasn't been reached (black icons for archived caches?).

 

While I'm not completely happy with the look and feel of the new maps, as Jeremy has indicated, they are in development, and software "by committee" doesn't really work. I'll add my 2¢ about the maps when Jeremy asks for an opinion.

 

I would trust that the dialog between these two individuals will continue until a mutually beneficial arrangement can be made, and we can all benefit by getting back to enjoying the sport. It would be unfortunate to have this argument turn into something even more divisive than it already has.

[Guest Iron Chef]

Not much new that I can say, but that I miss Buxley's maps. I also hope that Mr. Irish contines to work on the development of his version of the geocaching maps. Either way this thing goes, I hope you two work out your issues in a manner that is beneficial to all (but especially the Irish and Hall).

 

------------------

-Iron Chef

_ _____________________ _

agefive.com/geocache/

"But a big booming voice from the sky is exactly what you have found..."

-Contact

[Guest echosgold]

Regardless of who is right or wrong, I would like to see the Buxley maps returned. The layout and design is much more effecient then these "new" geocaching maps. I frequented the Buxley maps as often as the geocaching site and find them extremely useful.

 

------------------

Echosgold

www.outdoor-dog.com

www.outdoor-dog.com/Geocache

[Guest rusty]

I totally agree with echosgold. The old maps worked fine, the new ones don't. The time creating them would have been better spent on diplomacy. Politics will kill this sport faster than the NPS.

 

My 2cents....Rusty

[Guest Exocet]

accept more outside support (volunteer help). It *seems* like he likes to do most stuff hisself. I would think that would have to change eventually.

[Guest Anton]

No Buxley maps? Sheesh-Louise! What's next?

 

1. I miss the Buxley maps - so easy to use.

 

2. I'm a visual thinker, which is why I have always like looking at maps, and still do.

 

3. Honoring a copyright isn't just a good idea; it's the law.

 

4. I really liked how the maps had totals in the lower lefthand corner for each country, state & locality - love those stats!

 

5. All this hub-bub on the forums makes me wonder how many geocachers are going back to using personal homepages, mailing lists and newsgroups to communicate the coordinates of new caches, and to record logs. We can still play this game without ANY websites, if it comes to that.

 

6. I sure hope it doesn't.

 

Free the Maps! Save the Copyrights!

 

Stand Up & Geocache for Whirled Peas!

 

Anton, 8H/9F

 

------------------

Anton Ninno - N2RUD

Syracuse, NY 13210

[Guest bjbest]

Okay, I understand the copyright issues, but could someone please explain why the "Lost Caches" link is a point of contention? I just want to know the rationale behind wanting to remove it. Thanks, B.J.

[Guest Road Kill]

Normally I stay out of such conflicts but I think you all should take a look at yourselves. I mean take a step back and imagine what a bystander is seeing here. Being a bystander for the last 2 days I saw a conflict on a playground ball field. One player, who provided all the bases, is having ?DISCUSSIONS? with another player who brought the best bat in the neighborhood. I don?t think the picture needs to be painted any further to get my point across. Bottom line is that everyone has lost. When I say lost it?s not the maps I?m referring to. It?s the friendship and cooperation that once was. Paint a coach into the picture above and the players would shake hands and continue the game. Also a coach would instruct all others to keep to themselves and not to pick sides that entrench battle lines. As we grow up we?re expected to do such things on are own. I?ll applaud the first who swallows some pride and finds middle ground. To the rest of you (including myself) lets applaud what they?ve done before the ?DISCUSSION? and not reinforce either individuals point/counter point unless asked.

 

I?m not a coach but I did stay at a Holiday Inn.

[Guest A Guest]

I'm confused. What portion of Buxley's maps, if developed by Buxley, are part of a copyright belonging to Jeremy? Is Jeremy asking for a copyright of all of Buxley's work, or just the aspects he provides?

[Guest Nemesis]

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Guest:

Is Jeremy asking for a copyright of all of Buxley's work, or just the aspects he provides?

---

 

As far as I know, Jeremy asked Ed to add the statement "Geocaching Data Copyright 2001 Grounded, Inc." to his site.

 

This was simply to protect Jeremy's (our) geocaching data (there is no implied claim on Ed's intellectual property (i.e., the code to generate Ed's specific style of maps from geocaching data)), it was not an unreasonable request.

 

Cheers,

Donovan Govan.

[Guest erik88L-R]

I've gotta agree with what others have stated - Buxley's maps were a valuable tool that are greatly missed. I have them bookmarked and refered to them as often as I did to the geocaching.com main page. It was great for planning a day of geocaching. From what I've seen so far of Jeremy's maps they are not nearly as user friendly as Ed Hall's, 'though I'd always wished Ed had shown the interstates for visual reference.

Having said all that I also agree that Jeremy's two requests seem minor. For a while the Buxley maps were showing lost or achived caches as black pin heads. Wouldn't going back to that and posting Jeremy's copyright notice be a good compromise that would get us back to business? Then if Ed would show the interstates I'd be as happy as a pig in slop!

[Guest edwardbynum]

S caches) without complying with what (once again) seem like perfectly reasonable requests to me, then I must say that I agree with Jeremy.

 

A lot more than $0.02,

God Bless

 

Edward Bynum, a concerned geocacher

[Guest skyboy]

Maybe someone has asked this and I missed the anwser BUT

 

"Why not make those little changes the Jeremy asked Buxley?"

 

I cannot think of a reason NOT to do it.

p.s. This question is for Buxley, although I am sure I will get everyone elses anwser also

[Guest skyboy]

Maybe someone has asked this and I missed the anwser BUT

 

"Why not make those little changes the Jeremy asked Buxley?"

 

I cannot think of a reason NOT to do it.

p.s. This question is for Buxley, although I am sure I will get everyone elses anwser also

[Guest Iron Chef]

quote:

---

Originally posted by edwardbynum:

First, I reiterate BJ's question: "Okay, I understand the copyright issues, but could someone please explain why the "Lost Caches" link is a point of contention? I just want to know the rationale behind wanting to remove it." As I understand it, the lost caches page was merely a way to go and view sites of old caches, which could have gotten washed away, stolen, plundered, etc. However, if caches that were removed by the NPS or other governing organization, or that were placed on private property are also included, I can see where this would cause a problem.

---

 

The way that I look at the lost caches is that they are a part of our history as geocachers. Even though they have been lost/plundered/stolen/eaten/hijacked/etc. etc. it is important to consider that somepeople may have found those cache and that their logs should still be around for other people to read. Wheather they found the cache or not, I think that sharing the adventure is half the fun of geocaching and it may be a bit unfair to these people who may have still had fun going to the cache site, even if it wasn't there. Also it might be argued that even if the geocache isn't there anymore, that someone placed it there for a reason. Perhaps it is the destination that counts in this case even though the cache is missing. The coordinates may still be worth visiting even though the cache has vanished from its cozy little spot. I happen to know a cache placer in my area that won't archive two caches that have dissapeared because there are extensive logs tied to those caches, about 15 each from different people that detail their adventures. Things like this should not necessarily be lost just because the cache is gone. If you visit the geocaching.com site for one of those lost caches there is a line of text at the top in red that reads: "This cache is no longer here by act of man or god or fuzzy critter" (or at least something to that effect). This warning should be enough in my opinion. Maybe it should be added to another place on the page, but any geocacher/adventurer who doesn't read and plan ahead of time is asking for trouble.

 

I miss Buxley's maps a lot. I am glad to see that Mr. Irish is working on his own version, but it does need a lot of work and it's current accuracy has little to be desired (I know it's in alpha/beta stage right now). I don't know how many times I used Buxley's maps to explain geocaching to family and friends that just didn't understand what it is that we do with our spare time. I've even used the maps in a lesson plan to teach maps and navigation to 3rd graders (gps included *grins* got to start them young) at the elementary school that I teach at.

 

Well, to wrap everything up... thank you for all the hard work that both Mr. Irish and Mr. Hall have put into geocaching. Without the two of you geocaching wouldn't be as great as it is today. Sorry if my little post didn't make much sense, it's still early in the morning here :~)

 

------------------

-Iron Chef

_ _____________________ _

agefive.com/geocache/

"But a big booming voice from the sky is exactly what you have found..."

-Contact

[Guest Peanuthead]

Holy Smokes! I started this thread and I have created a monster !!

 

The only issue I have with the new maps is that when you hover over the cache you want it doesn't give you the name of the cache and when you click on the cache it doesn't send you to Jeremy's cache page. I would guess that Jeremy will add these features.

 

- Peanuthead

[Guest Sun_tzu]

quote:

---

Originally posted by jeremy:

I will re-add the links to the Buxley maps as soon as he complies with my requests.

 

Cheers,

 

Jeremy

---

Cheers whatever, BRING BACK THE MAPS!!! I for one would like to have some specific explanation.

[Guest Farqhuarson]

nership of, and do with as they will.

 

but granted this is where everything does take place so i guess that does count for something. and my one question at the moment is i've seen that this mr. buxley person won't comply, but is there any publicy stated reason as to why not?

 

so anyways, maybe a step back by both parties, a deep breath and realize that instead of a hardline by either a nice little compromise cant be reached?

 

[This message has been edited by Farqhuarson (edited 28 May 2001).]

[Guest Florian]

Originally posted by Farqhuarson:

ok actually i found in the disclaimer:

 

"This website is for personal and non-commercial use. You may not modify, copy, excerpt, distribute, transmit, publish, license, create derivative works from, or sell any information, or services obtained from this website. "

/QUOTE]

 

Okay... I'm puzzling about this too. If by placing a cache and filling out a form on Geocaching.com somehow gives Geocaching.com the rights to that cache, then i have a problem with that.

 

------------------

http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/

[Guest Florian]

>Originally posted by Exocet:

>The copyright notice for the data (not the maps/images) is reasonable and fair (IMO).

 

But the data is provided by the people placing the caches. It's not generated by Geocaching.com. I don't really see how Geocaching.com can claim ownership.

 

-Florian

 

 

------------------

http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/

[Guest Iron Chef]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Florian:

Originally posted by Farqhuarson:

ok actually i found in the disclaimer:

 

"This website is for personal and non-commercial use. You may not modify, copy, excerpt, distribute, transmit, publish, license, create derivative works from, or sell any information, or services obtained from this website. "

 

Okay... I'm puzzling about this too. If by placing a cache and filling out a form on Geocaching.com somehow gives Geocaching.com the rights to that cache, then i have a problem with that.

---

 

Sorry about all the quotes, but this whole thing is getting very complicated. By the terms of that one sentence then one has to wonder about the Project APE thingy which is commercial use. And then who owns the copyright to that information? Geocaching.com, 21st Century Fox, the random guy in back of you at Safeway while your standing in the que to get checked out? Granted, if Buxley was making money off the info then I would be pissed, I'll admit that, but he isn't and so it seems a bit unfair. Then I begin to wonder about my own little geocaching site. What information can be there and what information can't? I consider my caches public domain because I put it out there for the general public use. I only maintain the caches and continually make sure that they are there and stocked with goodies.

 

------------------

-Iron Chef

_ _ _________________ _ _

agefive.com/geocache/

"But a big booming voice from the sky is exactly what you have found..."

-Contact

 

[This message has been edited by Iron Chef (edited 28 May 2001).]

[Guest Florian]

For example... I have a map of caches i've placed and/or caches i've found. The map is here...

 

http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/cachemap.gif

 

Does Geocaching.com _require_ me to provide a copyright notice for this map?

 

-Florian

 

------------------

http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/

[Guest jeremy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Florian:

I don't really see how Geocaching.com can claim ownership.

---

 

Geocaching.com owns the collection of data. The data entered by individuals who place caches on the web site also own their own data.

 

So basically, you can't go to the geocaching.com web site and suck down via a program or type in the information on to another web site, publication, etc, or attempt to profit from that info. An example would be publishing a book on Geocaching that contained a list of coordinates and sell it to the public. Another way would be to take the data from the web site and create another web site with that information.

 

This not only protects the original cache owner that entered the data, but protects the game from other sites cropping up with information from the web site that may be inaccurate or just plain wrong. In addition it protects your personal data on the site from someone attempting to take and sell it to someone.

 

If you owned a cache and wanted to list it on your web site, another web site, or whatever, it's your deal. Having a copyright on the data does not mean that you no longer have rights to what you entered.

 

If you want to use the data for your own personal use, that's fine too as long as you don't redistribute the data (i.e. on another web site).

 

I don't own your physical cache, nor would I want to. It relates to "information and services" obtained from this web site.

 

Jeremy

[Guest c.mathis]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Florian:

For example... I have a map of caches i've placed and/or caches i've found. The map is here...

 

http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/cachemap.gif

 

Does Geocaching.com _require_ me to provide a copyright notice for this map?

 

---

 

Where did you get the map you used?

[Guest Quinnow]

well actually I think that what his intent is, is that he does not want anyone taking something he has worked hard to make, and then getting profit for.

In other words lets say I was to come along and copy all the things he has done here for free, then went back and made money off of it on my site or by other means, that would be unfair, and I agree with that. I do not however see what harm Buxley would, could, or did by having his maps on Geocaching. If anything at all it only pulled more people to the site. Using the map installed now is awkward and not user friendly (though I realize it is new and under work) And yes...you are correct that "Geocaching" is considered a sport and is also considered public domain. It's no differant than two people owning baseball teams and one telling the other he can't use the word "Baseball" in anything he does. I own my own site, though a bit dwarfed by Jeremy's, I would never want to see someone else profit from something I made or did, but that is not what Buxley did. he was doing what others wanted.One can't live without the other, take topozone for instance... it's linked and part of the site and is also a main feature. But who made topozone?

though many things I disagree with as far as whats going on, I also know that none of us would be Geocaching if not for this site.

Up to now I have not offered or entertained the idea of submitting caches on my site because I respect the work of others and toe stepping is beyond me. Not to mention what confusion it would make having multi sites with cache listings running amok.

Will this bring other sites into submitting caches for listings?...maybe. But I think given time most of this will get worked out and with hope return to normal.

 

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Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

[Guest Florian]

Jeremy wrote:

>If you want to use the data for your own personal use, that's fine too as long as you don't redistribute the data (i.e. on another web site).

 

Jeremy, what about my cachemap?

 

See... http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/cachemap.gif

 

-Florian

 

 

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http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/

[Guest Florian]

Originally posted by Quinnow:

>well actually I think that what his intent is, is that he does not want anyone taking something he has worked hard to make, and then getting profit for.

 

But Geocaching.com didn't make the data. Geocaching.com offers a website that allows people to share their geocaches with anyone on the internet.

 

-Florian

 

 

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http://www.stargazer.org/geocaching/