GEOCACHING DOESN'T CARE ABOUT CHINLDREN

April 8, 2003

When it comes to a child with a Disability, Geocaching.com does not care.

I posted the game after my son (Red Leader) and I finshed it. We spent how long now working on this game (2 months) as you all know. We were so happy how may people liked SI:1. Well, Eric over at Goecaching will not approve it!!!! Like the first Sith Impossible this is a Muticache, Eric said I had to place it as 1 cache or he would not approve it.

Myself and a few other cachers have looked over a few other caches on the Site and

found that there is over 1000 LISTED caches just like ours!!!! This goes back to the Team Jedi's Christmas cache. Eric was tomahawked by E-Mails from other cachers because he was not going to approve that cache because of it's Christmas theme. "When in fact" he had approved a few other theme caches before ours. After all of the cool cachers in the area who came forward and sent him letters, It was Appoved (With a note at the bottom by him of course)

Back in October 2002, We put together a game called Movie Maddness, This was what

" Is it in you my young Apprentice" caches started out as. After Geocaching the summer I found that 95% of the cache placers did not think of Handicapped children like mine or children who were small, Even though most of the cachers out their were taking there children caching with them. So we set out to make Caches that had very easy access.

(It's okay that no one was thinking of them, We were happy that we thought of it and now had a idea to place caches just for them) )

First thing we did was came up with Movie Maddess. Movie maddness used

2 Inch PVC pipe about 7 inches long. Inside we placed a picture from a movie. You then came to our website and viewed a list of movies. Beside the movies was a letter and a number. there were a few movies with (Let's say A) after the A was a number. SO there may have been 3 moves with A BUT each of those movies had a different number after the A. after you found the 10 caches, you would then have the waypoint for the final cache. The cool thing about this game was the fact that you could keep building on it (I.E. one of the caches was Bug Life (G4). You could use that cache in another cache

without reloging it on Geocaching.com as you have already been their.

N39 AB CDE

W84 FG HIJ

Eric did not like it as he said it could take you onto private land if you got the clues wrong. I told him that we thought of that already and that the whole game was in

East Fork State park. Even if you guessed wrong, You were STILL in East Fork State Park. Needless to say, Eric still would not let us post it. This was after we spent over $100 on the PVC Pipe and the Laminater for the pictures. PLUS the 35 hours to build them and hide them. We at that time told him this whole idea was geared at smaller and Handicapped Children. Did he care? Nope! Still would not post it.

Eric and Geocaching.com has been told that about these caches and the fact my

Handicapped child is part of these caches. My Efferts at including the Handicapped

in geocaching has not been shared by Geocaching.com nor Eric. and this is sad.

(Later this same day I got this from Eric)

A little update to this story, Eric went and tried to change my posting by adding a

note (Note: Do not post yet) Then wanted me to show everyone his NICE note. If

anyone wish me to send this so called NICE note, Just ask. This NICE note archived

all of mine and my sons work and said to combine them into one cache. He NEVER asked anything about the cache before he archived it, Never ask about the work that went into it, Just did it the way HE wanted to do it! SO sad what people will do to save their own asses. Then Again, anyone who would put a slap in the face of a Handicapped child,,, Go Figure.

I know some of you may think this is a petty issue BUT I can tell you, You don;t know how the world really is until you have a child who has needs. I hope none of you ever have to find out.

Dave Kilgore

TEam Jedi

April 8, 2003

Feel better now?

From your long description I have no idea of how your multi worked or why Erik didn't approve it.

As for he & Geocaching.com not caring about children - I say pshaw. I know they do very much, so don't go there.

Now that you've blown off that steam, how about explaining your cache idea a little better?

Have a Dixie Day!

38.2k · April 8, 2003

Can you run that by me again?

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

April 8, 2003

No Buddy, I WILL go their!! I am not BLOWING OFF STEAM. This is be going on for awhile. They don't, Sorry to hurt your feeling but truth hurts.

If you read the message (The WHOLE message, You will find that I do talk about the caches in question.

Dave

38.2k · April 8, 2003

You're right. Eric and geocaching.com hate handicapped chinldren.

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

April 8, 2003

I've heard complaints about Erik before and all I can suggest is to try to work with him. Don't let all of your efforts go to waste..see what you need to do to get it approved.

The dude's probably got something tied to tight down there, but he is an approver and has the power.

Good luck

-pizzachef

6.4k · April 8, 2003

I read that 3 times and I have no idea what it said or what the cache is or why it wasn't approved either. If the actual cache page makes as much sense as that post does, Erik probably just can't understand your special form of english. Neither can I.

Tae-Kwon-Leap is not a path to a door, but a road leading forever towards the horizon.

April 8, 2003

It sounds like you've set up a really good multi-cache. Why do you expect special treatment in having it approved as separate cache when the guidelines specifically state "If you want to create a series of caches, create a multicache"?

I like the idea of your multi - if you're in my area, I'll definitely seek it. I think you're being unfair to Eric, though. All he's doing is following the rules. If you had done the same, this wouldn't be an issue.

Why not just create it as a multi, like Eric suggested?

--

Random fortune:

sigimage.php

April 8, 2003

I agree with Team Jedi. I have talked with

other Cachers in the City at gatherings and just about everyone thinks Highly of Team JEdi and their committment to Children. If Doc says

there's I problem then I will have to vote that there is a problem.

After reading the message, I sent a letter to Admin and they said (WHAT, I don't know what your talking about, Can you help me) I sent a link to the letter on a website for them to read and I have not heard nothing back as of yet.

We are with you Team Jedi

The Sandi Beach Team

April 8, 2003

Let me take a crack at explaining this - as I live in the same hometown and have talked with Team Jedi about this a bit. Last summer, Team Jedi made a series of caches called Sith Impossible. You can read more about it at

http://home.fuse.net/Docman/sithimpossible.html

It was quite possibly one of the best cache series done here in Cincinnati. The basic gist of it was that there were 10 different caches around town. Each one could be sought via GPS lat/lon coordinates, or there were also letterboxing-type clues that you could do it with. Each cache had 4 or 5 word stamps in it, along with a logbook. There was a final cache printout, and you stamped each of the word stamps on your printout. When you got all 10 caches and 53 (I think) stamps, that spelled out the location of the final cache.

Again, this was and is one of the best cache series in Cincinnati.

So the issue if I understand it is that now Team Jedi wants to make Sith Impossible 2. As I understand it from Team Jedi, the approver (Erik) will not approve them, as he says that it is a multi cache and wants it to be one cache (instead of 1 per stage). My understanding of multi-caches is something that is all in the same park, that can usually be done in one day. My Mario's Tower is a good example, as well as many others. This IMHO is different. It's 10 caches that can act as stand-alone, but are also part of an ongoing series. I feel they should be qualified as separate caches.

Is there a way we can petition someone about this? I thought I remembered from back in the day being able to submit a poll like "Should this cache be approved", mainly for virtual and locationless. Is this still a valid option?

The other cache series he is talking about was called Movie Madness. This was the same kind of thing, but instead of clues to the final cache, each stage would have a Movie still in it. You would then go to his website and match up what movie it was from, and use that to get the final cache coordinates. I think what Erik was saying there was that if a cacher guessed wrong they could end up on Private Property. Team Jedi's response was that they had already thought of that and the entire cache was on east Fork State Lake property. But it was still not approved.

Again, I have not talked with Erik, my only info comes from having talked with Team Jedi, so I don't presume to speak for the actual reasons these caches were not approved, if they differ from the above.

Anyway, thanks for listening.

April 8, 2003

My 4 yr. old enjoys geocaching - but I don't let him drive the car to the cache sites.

Sounds like you're just angry your cache didn't get approved (and I'd bet the dis-approval has nothing to do whatsoever with your kids or any handicaps). Probably best to take it up privately with the (dis)approver and see if you can get things worked out amicably.

Just my two cents. I'm still not letting the 4 yr. old drive the car

April 8, 2003

>> HART climbs

Answers like that are WhY laws had to be made for children with disabilitys.

Sandi Beach Team

April 8, 2003

>Sounds like you're just angry your cache >didn't get approved (and I'd bet the dis->approval has nothing to do whatsoever with >your kids or any handicaps

Dude, You are SICK!!!! and so wrong!

Dave

5.3k · April 8, 2003

It does not sound like a regular Multi in that each photo is listed as it's own cache, But I

know of another cache that is in my area that sounds like the same type of idea. It was

approved, The problem may be that the approvers do not have a set of guide lines that are

very clear. As far as children's caches, I have two. both are multi caches made up of

Easter plastic Easter eggs leading to a final cache. I made them very easy to find, maybe

too easy as two of the eggs for one of them came up missing within a week. There are

urban caches that may be handicap accessible, but if they are to easy to spot, they may be

found by non Cachers an then be destroyed.

[This message was edited by Johnnyvegas on April 08, 2003 at 07:38 AM.]

6.4k · April 8, 2003

I gotta agree with Hartclimbs. This is a problem with why your cache didn't get approved. WTF does that have to do with disliking children or handicapped people? There are 10s of thousands of caches out there that kids and handicapped people can do (I myself have one specifically made for handicapped people, approved by Erik if I remember right), so it's plainly obvious that the very title of this thread is untrue and has absolutely NOTHING to do with your problem.

Now, the way Dan explained your idea, it does sound like it SHOULD be approved, but I don't have all the facts, so I could very well be wrong. I do know if the cache page was as rambling, disjointed and incoherent as your first post, it's quite possible it was disapproved simply because Erik didn't understand your intentions.

Tae-Kwon-Leap is not a path to a door, but a road leading forever towards the horizon.

38.2k · April 8, 2003

Thanks for the translation Regoarrarr! The cache as you describe it sounds fine to me, but Eric doesn't seem to think so. The merits of the cache are debatable, but it's quite a stretch to say that Eric and geocaching.com don't care about handicapped children because they won't approve the cache in its present form.

As to Team Jedi's initial post, it seems to me that he expects the cache to be approved simply because a handicapped child worked on it, regardless of its merits.

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

1.7k · April 8, 2003

By way of clarification... does each subcache have, in addition to the picture, a logbook and some trade items? If so, then it seems to me that the final cache is really a bonus cache, and bonus caches have a long history on geocaching.com. If the individual stages don't have logbooks, then they're not really caches.

I don't understand why Erik would deny it based on the fact that you could get incorrect coordinates. There are hundreds of caches out there where you could get incorrect coordinates that might put you on private property. Just about every puzzle cache, if you haven't really solved it but think you have, can be coerced into giving you the wrong coordinates. This cache, for example, contains at least one log from someone (coughmecough) who solved the puzzle wrong but consistently and got bad coordinates. The coords turned out to be on city park land, but they were miles from the actual cache and it was just a coincidence that they were in another park.

I can't say that I'd personally be excited about hunting a cache that required me to access a web page to get the final location, but that doesn't make it a bad cache.

Finally, I don't want to start yet another off-topic flamewar, but I'd like to point out that unless you have some kind of evidence that there's unfair discrimination taking place here, your claims of discrimination are only doing a disservice to the millions of people who really have been and are being discriminated against. Fact is, Erik has a reputation - deserved or not - for being a bit prickly about approvals. He is, as far as I know, an equal opportunity offender, and you shouldn't take his gruffness personally.

April 8, 2003

Okay, My 2 cents

Mopor, Da Rebel, BrainSnat: I think you need to step away from the buttocks of the Website.

HART CLIMBS: Yes, You are a Sick SOB with that posting BUT everyone has 2 cents to give.

After reading everything a few times, I read that it's been told to Eric that this cache WAS went for easyt access. I went back and read Team Jedi's other caches and found that they have touch an issue.

I have lost 2 children in my life time and I have another that is in a wheelchair, I do agree with Team Jedi on one thing and that's you have to been in these shoes to understand.

If Team Jedi told Eric that these where for

children of lesser, Then I think Eric needs to

find a new line of work, and everyone sspeaking bad of Team Jedi need to say they are sorry! If Team Jedi is pushing this because a cahce did not get approved, Then Team JEdi needs to find a new hobby and needs a srink.

I E-Mail the Team and am waiting for a Reply.

-GTT

Also, in my life time, I have found that 80% of the people do not have a concept it a child with needs. I wish there was a way to get threw to everyone about that. (As Spoken above about Rules) Rule apply for people on the same playing field. Some Children are not and DO need lesser rules. I know what Team JEdi has gone threw by having a lesser Child, Maybe Erik or a few of you do not!.

Just my 2 Cents

-GTT

April 8, 2003

Team Jedi, you need to cool off a little.... I don't think you're endaring yourself to everyone by launching a verbal attack at an approver. Geocaching doescare about kids, that's why we try to keep caches and the boards 'clean'. And I bet there are plenty of us who try to place accessable caches. As well as those who like to place more physically challenging ones. There's enough diversity in caches for everyone. Just take a few deep breathes....

After translation, I do think your new series of caches sounds like a cool idea- does each 'picture' cache have it's own logbook? I couldn't tell from the explanations. Maybe that's Eric's hangup. Shouldn't be too hard to fix that, thou.

I walk the Maze of Moments, but everywhere I turn to, begins a new beginning, but never finds a finish... -Enya, Anywhere Is

April 8, 2003

Another 2 Cents )

Is it Eric or Erik?

Was looking for his E-Mail

-gtt

April 8, 2003

I moved the discussion about whether it's appropriate for these caches to be approved as several in a series (or only as one multi) over

here

And to answer the questions - yes, each of the individual caches have their own logbook. I don't remember if there were things to trade, but they were in GladWare containers and certainly big enough to contain things to trade, should that be the issue (which I don't think it is)

April 8, 2003

Looks like the Geo Tracking Team and Team Jedi went to the same school or at least skipped english together.

38.2k · April 8, 2003

Looks like the Geo Tracking Team and Team Jedi also took the same logic course.

I still don't get how failing to approve a cache shows an insensitivity to children with handicaps.

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

2.3k · April 8, 2003

Your claim that Geocaching doesn't care about children is ridiculous. It appears that you are having an issue with one of the approvers, that's all. Don't put a handicapped child into the picture to hide behind and scream "UNFAIR TO HANDICAPPED CHILDREN!" just because your cache didn't get first-time approval. That's as off-base as me saying the "man" in holding me down and not approving my caches because I am white trash. This issue seems to have nothing to do with your handicapped CHILD, just your handicapped-accessible CACHE. If you ARE making a handicapped-accessible cache, that's great, we need more of them. Any special type of cache that allows more people to enjoy this sport should be welcomed. I wish you luck in straightening things out in order for your idea to work.

38.2k · April 8, 2003

Careful Team 360, I think you need to step away from the buttocks of the Website .

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

2.3k · April 8, 2003

Oooh oooh that smell, can't ya smell that smell?

6.4k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Geo Tracking Team:
Okay, My 2 cents

Mopor, Da Rebel, BrainSnat: I think you need to step away from the buttocks of the Website.

HART CLIMBS: Yes, You are a Sick SOB with that posting BUT everyone has 2 cents to give.

After reading everything a few times, I read that it's been told to Eric that this cache WAS went for easyt access. I went back and read Team Jedi's other caches and found that they have touch an issue.

I have lost 2 children in my life time and I have another that is in a wheelchair, I do agree with Team Jedi on one thing and that's you have to been in these shoes to understand.

If Team Jedi told Eric that these where for

children of lesser, Then I think Eric needs to

find a new line of work, and everyone sspeaking bad of Team Jedi need to say they are sorry! If Team Jedi is pushing this because a cahce did not get approved, Then Team JEdi needs to find a new hobby and needs a srink.

I E-Mail the Team and am waiting for a Reply.

-GTT

Also, in my life time, I have found that 80% of the people do not have a concept it a child with needs. I wish there was a way to get threw to everyone about that. (As Spoken above about Rules) Rule apply for people on the same playing field. Some Children are not and DO need lesser rules. I know what Team JEdi has gone threw by having a lesser Child, Maybe Erik or a few of you do not!.

Just my 2 Cents

-GTT

It must be the water in Ohio, I had to ask someone else that lives near there to translate your post for me too.

You are entitled to your 2cents, as is everyone here, but maybe you shouldn't assume people who you don't know don't understand.

I have spent a good portion of my life pushing someone in a wheelchair. I also have a niece with severe cerebral palsy. One of my best friends is blind. Several cachers in my area have handicapped family members. To say people are @sskissers because they don't agree with you is showing the same lack of understanding you are accusing others of. This has nothing to do with children, handicapped or other. This is a cache that wasn't approved. You and TJ seem to be saying because a handicapped child worked on the cache, it should automatically get approved. Maybe I should get my niece to help me place a cache in a National Park and throw a temper tantrum when it gets declined.

I have one handicap oriented cache out there, and i have a multi I have worked 2 months on almost ready to go. I understand what it takes to do a good handicapped acessible cache.

Now drop the BS about this being some sort of discimination, and try and contibute to helping make the cache approvable like the rest of us are.

Tae-Kwon-Leap is not a path to a door, but a road leading forever towards the horizon.

1.7k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by regoarrarr:
And to answer the questions - yes, each of the individual caches have their own logbook. I don't remember if there were things to trade, but they were in GladWare containers and certainly big enough to contain things to trade, should that be the issue (which I don't think it is)

Well, in that case, I think we should wait and see whether the approvers have some input on why the caches weren't approved before going much further.

I just reread Team Jedi's original post, though, and I have to say something: if you think the amount of money you spent on the cache, the fact that your disabled child helped place it, or your goal in placing the cache are valid refutations to the concerns Erik had about the cache, you're part of the problem. Why aren't you telling us what Erik said about the cache? ("Needless to say, Eric still would not let us post it." Why is that obvious, and what reason did he give for not approving it?) Why do you want us to ask you what his note said instead of just posting it here? You have his permission to do so, after all. What exactly are you trying to accomplish here?

April 8, 2003

Hey, ANother 2 Cents, I will soon be upto a Dime LOL

I just got my Reply fomr team Jedi.

From : Teamjedi@hotamil.com

To :

Geotrackingteam@hotmail.com

Subject :

Re: Geocache

Okay , Eric and I have gone over this (Not just this Issue) but others twice before.

This makes the 3rd. I have read the rules and it does not say "SET IN STONE"

that a Muti-Cache has to be listed as one. It comes arcoss to me as a way to not

have so many Icon pop up on the map where you are searching.

Eric does not care (And the Fact that someone whould say he does because they

approved their Handicapped Cache, Well He has nitched 3 of mine.) I have even gone

as far as to change the cache in question.

If you go and look, We have caches call (Is it in you my young Apprentace) Nine

so far, I had a spat with Eric over the first one of those.

I said Geocaching.com does not care BECAUSE I sent them a letter TWICE that

I would like someone other than Eric to approve me caches. I DID NOT HEAR A THING!!!!

Okay, Let me ask you a Question, What would you Do?

Doc

Okay I am upto 8 Cents LOL

From his terms I agree with him. I did go and read the rules and I get that same feeling to that type of cache. If he did ask then I think it should be noted.

I also think that if he did ask for someone other than (eric/Erik) I think he has a very good point. By the letter, I think he has done what he needed to do and someone at this Website my have dropped the ball.

I hope that this issue can be fixed that easy as someone picking up the ball.

As for his question to me, What would I do?

I told him I would quit as I have been through too much with my children to go on, And I thanked him for his efferts.

Just my 2 cents Guys

-GTT

2.6k · April 8, 2003

I still don't see the connection between not approving this cache an not caring about handicapped children.

george

Pedal until your legs cramp up and then pedal some more.

2.3k · April 8, 2003

You won't, either.

1.7k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:
I still don't see the connection between not approving this cache an not caring about handicapped children.

Pay attention, George, it's all right there in the first post.

Erik didn't approve the cache. Team Jedi said "but my handicapped kid helped place it." Erik still didn't approve the cache. Obviously, Erik hates handicapped children.

Geez, some people just have to have everything explained to them.

April 8, 2003

I guess it must be in the water LOL

As far as helping everyone come up with a

answer to the cache problem, Like like a few of you are just bent on bashing!

Go back and look what you wrote about me!

Step away form the BUTT-OCKS was a joke, And

as for grammer, Go back and read your messages, It looks like alot of people can't spell.

What can we all do to get along LOL

-GTT

9.4k · April 8, 2003

I can't believe how deeply offended I am of this post. I'm both offended by the title and I'm also offended of your abuse of the disabled to get your own personal agenda approved through the web site.

Until I read this post I had no idea what was going on. At this point I'm still confused, but it looks by your rant that you have a multicache listed as many caches, and Erik was making the attempt for you to adjust your caches so they fit within one. I don't believe he was outright banning them, and considering the option of coming to the forums to do a rational vote was definitely in the cards.

Why the heck would we hate handicapped people? What, are you on crack? You may want to look up libel in the dictionary, Team Jedi, along with the words rational.

Now I guess you expect us to dismiss your defamation of Erik and the site's character by getting your way, right? Let me know how a rational person may want to respond to this one.

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

6.4k · April 8, 2003

quote:
I said Geocaching.com does not care BECAUSE I sent them a letter TWICE that

I would like someone other than Eric to approve me caches. I DID NOT HEAR A THING!!!!

I would like to know the time frame here. I know when it's something you are passionate about, a few hours seems like a long time, but how long? Last night? today? It's only a little after 8am now where GC.com is based, and they get 1000's of emails a day. It usually takes several days to get a reply to a question.

[EDIT] Look at that, your answer right above this!

Tae-Kwon-Leap is not a path to a door, but a road leading forever towards the horizon.

[This message was edited by Mopar on April 08, 2003 at 08:40 AM.]

April 8, 2003

To answer a question, I am not sure why they did not post eric/erik's reply in the letter BUT I asked and the message was, READ THE RULES and a link to the Muticache rule page.

After teamjedis reply to that, Eric replyed he was going on a trip.

-GTT

3.1k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Geo Tracking Team:
As far as helping everyone come up with a

answer to the cache problem, Like like a few of you are just bent on bashing!

When and where did Team Jedi ask for help with the cache problem? This is nothing but a misguided rant. Fortunately, regoarrarr understands how approval issues should be handled. I think that poll will bear out that TJ would have had a lot more people on his side if he had approached this rationally.

"Winter's just the curtain. Spring will take the bow"

-- Richard Shindell, Spring

April 8, 2003

Hey Mopar, Don't put my name as the Quote, I just referred to Team Jedis post.

-GTT

2.3k · April 8, 2003

Looks like this thread is getting hotter than a west Texas wind....

9.4k · April 8, 2003

I believe my response to the email was to give me the caches and their examples of a specific approver targeting a user's caches. I sent the response yesterday along with the other 300 or so emails I responded to. Unfortunately I can't hover over the keyboard all day long to respond to posts. "My email wasn't responded to so I was ignored" is hogwash. We answer every email that comes in. Sometimes we get an enormous backlog, however, and it takes time to respond.

I certainly have faith that Erik is doing a good job. Until I have specific proof otherwise that you are a "target" than there really isn't much that will sway my opinion of this. It seems that everyone who has a virtual/physical cache denied tends to feel like they have been singled out as the victim.

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

3k · April 8, 2003

I am so confused. I do not understand some of these posts. Please read your post through before you hit send and make sure it makes sense. It seems like there are words missing, or something. I don't understand how the cache is supposed to work.

Now, saying that GC.com is prejudiced against the handicapped is outrageous! Instead of getting all mad and ranting here, please try to form a coherent explanation that can be understood. From your post, I have no clue what it is you are trying to say. So I can't help you in deciding if this cache should be approved or not. Cool off, calm down, no one hates handicapped children here, and then when you are calm, state it in a way we can understand. Then I, or we, might be able to take a stand on this issue.

Thank you.

Cache you later,

Planet

If it snows one more time I'm gonna scream!

4.8k · April 8, 2003

quote:
My understanding of multi-caches is something that is all in the same park, that can usually be done in one day. My Mario's Tower is a good example, as well as many others. This IMHO is different. It's 10 caches that can act as stand-alone, but are also part of an ongoing series. I feel they should be qualified as separate caches.

I agree. Approve them as individual caches with a bonus cache at the end.

Unless concrete reasons are given, I don't buy the argument for non-approval that people could end up on private land. Certainly if the caches were in a narrow public area, I could see the issue, but here they are in a State park and the placer has already considered that problem.

As for Geocaching disliking handicapped children or not approving caches because handicapped children are involved, that is ridiculous. Nor does the amount of money spent on a cache entitle it to be approved. But I can see why Team Jedi was frustrated and perhaps went a little overboard in venting and didn't explain the situation as well as he could. I say give the guy a break there! Regardless, I think the caches should be approved.

April 8, 2003

posted April 08, 2003 08:21 AM

I can't believe how deeply offended I am of this post. I'm both offended by the title and I'm also offended of your abuse of the disabled to get your own personal agenda approved through the web site.

The Feeling is the same Jeremy. This is not something that happened one night, It's not a sper of the day thing. GEOCACHING HAS BEEN notified about my problems with Eric. You just wrote that Eric does a good job, baa Baa Baa, Okay, If no one is going to respond to concerns (Well Before this last cache problem came about) about eric, and the fact that I ask 4 TIMES that i can use another person to approve or dis-approve my caches, Then what does it take.

I posted this here because I need a Responce from admin, What is really sad is the fact after I sent Admin message about this problem

(AND I STRESS THIS WAS DONE BEFORE THIS LAST CACHE POSTING, BACK WHEN I DIDN'T HAVE A CAHCE IN LIMBO AND I KNOW THERE WOULD BE ANOTHER PROBLEM WHICH I WANTED TO AVOID)

that the only way someone from admin to reply to me is to post a message tread like this and get dribble.

No, I don;t feel you care or someone from Admin would have reply to me over the past 3 MONTHS not days, Not hours BUT MONTHS.

Dave

PS abuse of the disabled as you wrote, You need to talk with Eric on that one.

38.2k · April 8, 2003

Team Jedi, can you put us in touch with your translator? You may have a point, but a lot of us can't figure out what it is.

By the way, I didn't realize we could choose our approvers. Can I have Mtn-Man for all my caches?

"You can only protect your liberties in this world, by protecting the other man's freedom. "You can only be free if I am" -Clarence Darrow

5.3k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Irish:
What, are you on crack?

Geocaching doesn't care about people with addictions.

"Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand."

4.8k · April 8, 2003

quote:
But I can see why Team Jedi was frustrated and perhaps went a little overboard in venting and didn't explain the situation as well as he could. I say give the guy a break there!

Hmmm... well... I'm going to take back a little of what I said there. Team Jedi, I do think your caches should be approved, but I think you need to calm down. I can see why Jeremy is offended. You have not shown me a concrete reason why geocaching.com is singling you out or acting out against disabled children. It sounds to me like you just needed to work with Erik a little more on the issue. I would suggest doing so in a calmer manner than you are asserting here.

Now, since I hate conflict, I'm going to try to stay out of this one after this post!!!!!

2.6k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Stunod:

quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Irish:
What, are you on crack?

Geocaching doesn't care about people with addictions.

They even encourage them - I'm totally addicted to this sport!

- All you need is a sick mind and a healthy body. -

9.4k · April 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Team Jedi:
that the only way someone from admin to reply to me is to post a message tread like this and get dribble.

So this justifies a personal attack? Let me stress my deep emotional distress over your defamation of the character of an approver and of my company and of my web site.

Sorry we can't get back to you in the timeframe that suits you. The world doesn't revolve around you. This NEVER justifies AT ANY TIME that you can post libelous comments in the forums to attack my or anyone else's character. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? DO YOU GET THE POINT? I've never been so offended by a post since the inception of the site being created.

I've taken a lot of flak in the forums, but this really takes the cake. Your post to the forums has resulted in emails to me indicating that I am sick for picking on handicapped children. Do you know in any way how this makes me feel? Do you care?

Fine, you didn't get a cache approved. There are other ways to go about getting your point across. But this post infuriates me. I want an apology and I want it NOW.

At this point I just checked my email after getting up an hour ago and realized that you threatened Erik with legal action if he didn't approve your cache by 9:00am today. Since you feel that legal action is appropriate, I suggest that we close this thread so the courts can continue this.

As for your caches which I have yet to see, at this point I'm too upset to review them. I'll check them out once I take a break from this.

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

24.7k · April 8, 2003

Some free advice.

Cut to the chase. Your cache is either approvable or not. It's as simple as that. When 20 people all write down their variatons of scratching their head perhaps you should listen, and clarify.

As for the cache, what I did gather is that if you posted coordinates as the parking space for the cache and said "The cache is within the public lands around here" or something more specific, it seems you would have solved the probelm, or at least what I figured out as the problem.

I have had creative differences with Eric in the past. We worked them out.

==============================

Wherever you go there you are.

April 8, 2003

You make my point Jeremy!

you know my E-Mail address, We could do this in Private BUT you will spend time here on an open Fourm and not in Private with me.

(Jer wrote)

I've taken a lot of flak in the forums, but this really takes the cake. Your post to the forums has resulted in emails to me indicating that I am sick for picking on handicapped children. Do you know in any way how this makes me feel? Do you care?

I care alot! ALot more than you do!, I don;t have YOUR E-Mail, You have MINE!!! maybe you should use it and but this message to rest!

It's up to you, Do YOU! care

GEOCACHING DOESN'T CARE ABOUT CHINLDREN

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