+Showcase_Boyz Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 If I've come to read the rules correctly, as a "cache" placer, I have ultimate say in who can log my cache as a find, given the criteria I have set forth in the cache description...Correct? Given the "Game's Rules" itself, am I also allowed to remove "Finds" from folks who did not follow the "cache" instructions, or the spirit of the game instructions...ie, use a GPS...Correct? You see here in Central Massachusetts we have a small group of folks who do nothing but raid TB from nearby caches to place in either a "Hotel", or in caches that they want folks to visit, or make a point that they "found" the cache without a GPS. The problem is, is that the caches belong to them! These same folks even score logs when they visit thier "own" cache for maintenance! Granted, this is a small, "unscrupulous" group, but they intimidate other cachers within the area to comply with thier wishes! The Boyz will "NOT" be intimidated! We will be visiting our cache's over the next few weeks, and viewing the logs. Both the paper and electronic logs had better match, or your find is gone! Mike (The DirtMan) Pellerin aka Badger dirtman@iname.com Jason Dobson aka "Jay" "J" Myth8499@aol.com Quote Link to comment
skydiver Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz: we have a small group of folks who do nothing but raid TB from nearby caches to place in either a "Hotel", or in caches that they want folks to visit, or make a point that they "found" the cache without a GPS. So, they're moving travel bugs to other caches and logging he move to the site? Unless they are moving a bug to a cache that obviously is counter productive of the bugs goals (i.e. moving a bug to a very hard to get to cache so that it is likely to not move again for a long time) I don't see a problem. I think you need to be more specific about what you think is wrong. Maybe give links to bugs logs showing the move you don't approve of? And if someone can find a cache without a GPS, then in my opinion, the cache is either poorly placed, or the searcher is very proficient with a topo map. In either case, the find should stand. quote:Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz:The problem is, is that the caches belong to them! These same folks even score logs when they visit thier "own" cache for maintenance! I agree with this. People should not be able to 'find' their own caches and have it count toward their 'found' count. I also think that the 'found' count should be unique caches, so that multiple finds of the same cache don't count. Hopefully Jeremy will correct this oversite one day soon. --- Two paths diverged in a wood, and my... my GPSr pointed dead center between them. --- Quote Link to comment
+Showcase_Boyz Posted June 9, 2002 Author Share Posted June 9, 2002 The folks in question are gleaning all TB's within thier area to place in either thier own, or other friendly cache's! Mike (The DirtMan) Pellerin aka Badger dirtman@iname.com Jason Dobson aka "Jay" "J" Myth8499@aol.com Quote Link to comment
+Lazyboy & Mitey Mite Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 But the travel bugs are still in caches, right? I mean a geocacher can still go get them? I've seen several users logging their own caches as finds. I've never reported it or do I even know if it's against the rules here. I think it's silly but it isn't my business. Not about numbers, it's about fun. Never Squat With Yer Spurs On Quote Link to comment
skydiver Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz: The folks in question are gleaning all TB's within thier area to place in either thier own, or other friendly cache's! So? I still don't see a problem. It would probably be best to continue this discussion in the Travel Bugs Forum. --- Two paths diverged in a wood, and my... my GPSr pointed dead center between them. --- Quote Link to comment
scooterj Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 quote:Originally posted by skydiver:People should not be able to 'find' their own caches and have it count toward their 'found' count. I also think that the 'found' count should be unique caches, so that multiple finds of the same cache don't count. Hopefully Jeremy will correct this oversite one day soon. I agree that the system shouldn't allow you to log your own cache is a find. However, there are legitimate reasons for allowing duplicate finds. I've seen a few instances where a cache gets plundered and the owner re-hides the cache in a new location and invites those who found it in the former location to hunt it again. Also I have a cache where the container includes coordinates for a separate bonus cache. Rather than listing it as two separate caches I let people log the find twice if they find the bonus cache too. Quote Link to comment
+Renegade Knight Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 There isn't anything wrong with finding travel bugs. it's it's owne form of caching. Once you got one it needs to be moved on. Where better than your own cache since normally you live by one or two of the ones you have placed. On the other hand if your cache is counter to the TB's purpose, it would be bettter to wait and help it along. Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 In all walks of life there will be people who will stretch and break the rules. If they want to log illegit caches, let them. If they want log one of yours and don't follow your requirements, then go ahead and delete them. Quote Link to comment
Syn Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 There is a cache that I have done where I have logged it three times. Each time it is in a different location in the park. The cache owners have said that they will move the cache around from time to time and invites everyone to do the cache again. If I do a cache that has different coordinates than before...then it is a whole new hunt and I have no problem logging the find again. Quote Link to comment
+Jamie Z Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz: We will be visiting our cache's over the next few weeks, and viewing the logs. Both the paper and electronic logs had better match, or your find is gone! I gotta say when I read that above, I pumped my fist in the air and shouted "Go Boyz!" I don't think I'd go to this extreme, but I feel that when I place a cache, I'd like the online log to be legitimate and accurate, just like my own find count. Jamie Quote Link to comment
+Web-ling Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz: Given the "Game's Rules" itself, am I also allowed to remove "Finds" from folks who did not follow the "cache" instructions, or the spirit of the game instructions...ie, use a GPS...Correct? Yes, you have the right to delete logs where you can verify the cacher did not follow the directions as stated on the cache page, such as emailing passwords or posting photos, or not actually visiting the location, whether explicitly stated on the cache page or not. What's wrong with not using a GPSr? I've done well over a hundred simply by following a topo map or aerial photo. And they have certainly NOT all been "Park-And-Grab" caches. I've done as high as 3.5/3 ratings, which is about as hard as most of them get around my immediate area. GPSr-less hunting certainly makes those 1/1 caches a bit more of a challange! Logging one's own cache? Either ignorance or number-boosting. Grabbing all of the TBs and placing them in one's own caches? Rather tacky and poor Geo-Etiquette. Re-logging caches visited a second time in the same location? Either ignorance or number-boosting. Quote Link to comment
+Criminal Posted June 9, 2002 Share Posted June 9, 2002 The best way to keep someone without a GPSr from finding your cache is to not provide the coordinates on the website. Enter the coordinates for the trailhead or somewhere the cache is not. When the geocacher get to the trailhead (or wherever) they look for the cache coordinates there. For example, my son’s cache in Gig Harbor has you going to a certain road sign, the back of which has the real cache coordinates. See: http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=24813 This may make it too much trouble for a non-GPSr using cacher to bother with. You can also put in another intermediate stop to make it even harder for the non-GPSr person while making it more fun for the true cacher. I don’t know if this would be classified as a multi-cache as there are no silly riddles to solve. ><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>< What is the price of experience, do men buy it for a song, Or wisdom for a dance in the street................. Quote Link to comment
+moghedian Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 When we read your original message we felt a sense of anger, outrage, "how dare they!" type of sentiment from it. Is Geocaching a contest to see how many caches/Travel Bugs you can find before the other guy? We would agree that once you find a cache for the 1st time, additional visits should be posted as "notes", not "finds". (We have done this in the past, does not count as a find!). However, we feel too many caches are plundered and too many Travel Bugs lost to complain about people "padding" their finds. If a Bug we place is taken and placed in a "Hotel", great!! Hopefully it has a chance of moving on. This is just our opinion but after reading your post we just don't understand what point you are trying to get across. You are mad because people take Travel Bugs to their own cache? Mad because people log their own caches as finds?... We get mad when our Travel Bugs (or anyones!) go missing... We get mad when our Caches (or anybodys!) get plundered. If Mr.X or Mrs. Y has 10000 finds and all of our (and eveyones!) caches and all of our (or everyones!) Travel Bugs are never plundered/lost then we will all be happy, regardless of how many cache so and so has found. There are better things to complain about. As long as our caches and Bugs are found and not plundered or stolen, whether you have a GPS or not, we think it doesn't matter. "Raid" caches and move a Travel Bug to a new cache? What?............. Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 I don't see your point about not using a GPS. I found one cache without using one, and that added to the adventure. There is one "geocacher" who has over a hundred finds without using a GPS. To me, that's way cool. It shows someone can read a more than a GPSr screen. Try it some time. Quote Link to comment
+DenaliNW Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 As has been stated, it's your cache, and you can do what you wish, but why worry so much about what others are or are not doing. My only concern would be if they are mishandling Travel Bugs, and not helping them in their goals. If they want to grab a bug, and put it in their caches - I don't see a problem. I personally like going after bugs, even at caches I've already hit (I log the visit as a note, but how someone logs their finds is hardly worth feuding over). Many times I have placed those bugs in one of my caches - as it will often promote visitors to my cache - which I enjoy. I like reading their logs, and knowing I helped in their fun. And there's no need for a GPS when a map and compass will work. I've done it only once, my brother has found quite a few this way. I think it's cool. Quote Link to comment
+sbell111 Posted June 11, 2002 Share Posted June 11, 2002 Sometimes, the problem is in 'poor posting'. I think you should email the individual to ask them to correct the post. If the required corrections are not made, or it is still clear that the rules were not followed, delete the post. That being said, never delete the post if the rule were followed and 'spoliers' were not included. Don't make it a personal issue between you and another cacher. Quote Link to comment
+GOT GPS? Posted June 12, 2002 Share Posted June 12, 2002 Here is one example of multiple finds: Oakland Transit (Hidden) With this cache, you are to take it with you when you find it, then rehide it somewhere within the same county as the name of the cache. The container is aways the same, but rehidden by different people.Can you log a find a second time, when you find it hidding somewhere else by another cacher?? It is effectively the same cache each time unless the cacher that took the cache, then put out a new cache container, then somehow got the last container back to the previous owner. Can something like the one in the previous sentence work, and allow multiple finds??? My home page about GPS units and information Quote Link to comment
+GOT GPS? Posted June 12, 2002 Share Posted June 12, 2002 One way is that each cacher that finds the cache, takes it home and redecorates the container then hides it. The cacher then notifies the cache owner of the new coordinates, so that he/she can update the cache page. My home page about GPS units and information Quote Link to comment
+WaldenRun Posted June 12, 2002 Share Posted June 12, 2002 Originally posted by Showcase_Boyz: If I've come to read the rules correctly, as a "cache" placer, I have ultimate say in who can log my cache as a find, given the criteria I have set forth in the cache description...Correct? >> Of course. The cache creator is the God of >> Logs. Given the "Game's Rules" itself, am I also allowed to remove "Finds" from folks who did not follow the "cache" instructions, or the spirit of the game instructions...ie, use a GPS...Correct? >> Why, yes. You are totally within your rights >> to arbitrarily decide who shall go and who >> shall stay. All we ask is that you note your >> reasons on the cache page so the details are >> available when you get flamed in these forums. You see here in Central Massachusetts we have a small group of folks who do nothing but raid TB from nearby caches to place in either a "Hotel", or in caches that they want folks to visit, or make a point that they "found" the cache without a GPS. >> This seems like a personal attack. My list of >> finds is readily available. I'll let others >> decide the validity of your charges. One thing >> they WILL find is that the "nothing but" >> comment is way off the mark. The problem is, is that the caches belong to them! These same folks even score logs when they visit thier "own" cache for maintenance! >> Uh, if see me log a find on my own cache, >> PLEASE let me know. That would be extremely >> BOGUS. I do believe in logging maintenance >> visits via a note. Granted, this is a small, "unscrupulous" group, but they intimidate other cachers within the area to comply with thier wishes! >> I don't understand this. What are our wishes? The Boyz will "NOT" be intimidated! We will be visiting our cache's over the next few weeks, and viewing the logs. Both the paper and electronic logs had better match, or your find is gone! >> Why wouldn't they match? I don't get it. "Why worry when you can obsess?" Quote Link to comment
Snow Angel Posted June 12, 2002 Share Posted June 12, 2002 Would it be possible for a person to log into the physical geocache log book without also posting on line? To be honest sometimes I forget which Caches I have found, and would rather not eltronicly log into one incorrectly. I see that a problem could arise if someone logs into a cache eltronically without having actually logged physically into the book, but not the other way around. I have aslo been deleted from a log book both physically and electronically, though upset at the time, I got over it. If you wish to seek control over a cache the best possible answer seems to place one of your own. However making rules of how it can and cannot be found seems to be stretching it a bit. It also may have the opposite desired effect. Many people when faced with a challenge or a limitation will only try harder to find it. High numbers are fine, but it is still the journey that matters. Quote Link to comment
+Showcase_Boyz Posted June 14, 2002 Author Share Posted June 14, 2002 The original post was made in Anger and Haste. I, we, have spoken to the folks in question, and all is cool now. I ask the powers that be, to "close this thread"! Mike (The DirtMan) Pellerin aka Badger dirtman@iname.com Jason Dobson aka "Jay" "J" Myth8499@aol.com Quote Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.