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Guest cjdoyle

Virtual Cache

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Guest cjdoyle

I was contemplating virtual caches. I was thinking of puting coordinates at the website of an historical marker (or in the case I was considering, a grave stone in the middle of nowhere along a trail), the cache hunter writes down the specified information I request at the website and needs to enter it as a secondary password to make a log entry on the website as visting it. For instance, the dead person's middle name and year of birth combined to be used as a password.

 

If a kid went a long I could email a certificate of accomplishment to the parent.

 

Any thoughts?

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Guest Markwell

Nice idea! But you might even consider e-mailing the certificate in PDF format. If the cache becomes a popular one to find, you may spend all your time and money using up print cartridges and stamps.

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Guest Markwell

Duh. The first time I read the original post, I thought you said "I could mail a certificate of accomplishment". My tired brains didn't see the "e" in front of mail.

 

Still a good idea.

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Guest lynnwoods

What a great idea cjdoyle! If you do it that way you would be totally unregulated and you could enjoy this activity anywhere.

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Guest Cape Cod Cache

This has been given thought in the Organized Cache location. There are some great potentials here ! I'll post my answer there

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Guest Ron Streeter

are in the

exact spot when they see the same misformed cactus I include in a picture

clue.

 

Neither of these have a real logbook. Only the log on the net will be used to

verify a find.

 

I think there is a future for "virtual" and "view" caches.

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Guest WrongWay

quote:
Originally posted by cjdoyle:

This is what I came up with:


 

Great idea !!!

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Guest Moun10Bike

Awesome idea, cjdoyle! This is a great way to create urban caches or caches in extremely sensitive areas. Well done!

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Guest garyc

I will be looking for it this weekend. Great Idea!!!!!!

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Guest Alex

There is a virtual stash in Dublin, Ireland which was posted last September. I haven't made it to Ireland (yet) but far as I can tell from the description it is a word written on the road. It seemed like a great idea but I note that no one has logged it yet.

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Guest kbraband

I too have been thinking about creating virtual caches, in light of local park officials "studying" the potential impact of real caches. Virtual caches seem like the next step in the evolution of Geocaching. I think they would appeal more to those who have already found some real caches. There will always be appeal of real caches, especially for kids, but vitual caches appeal to me for several reasons: I don't need permission to create them, there's no talk about "littering", they're easier to create for high traffic areas such as city parks and residential areas.

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Guest cjdoyle

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=1286

 

I asked Jeremy to update this cache so that instead of going to a Yahoo briefcase to download the certificate of accomplishment, it can be downloaded directly from the cache website.

 

Below is a new virtual multi-stage cache I posted. This is about as inventive as I can get.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=1428

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Guest leaper64

good job cjdoyle. this is a great way to have fun in sensitive areas which could not support or allow a physical stash.

larry

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Guest Moun10Bike

cjdoyle, I liked your idea and implementation of it so well that I created my own virtual cache this past weekend -- "The Map Maker Virtual Cache" in Idaho. Thanks again for the great ideas!

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Guest Scout

The virtual caches that I have read about seem to rely on man-made objects like tombstones or signs. The cache-seeker is directed to note the year of death or the seventh word or some such to "prove" he found the cache.

 

This is all well and good, but limits you to sites with man-made objects. What kinds of natural objects or characteristics of natural objects could be used instead?

 

If no one can suggest anything, then how about a compromise? Not a traditional cache, not a virtual cache, but, say, a biodegradable cache with some distinguishing mark that would "prove" identity? Would, say, a stick with a carved number on it pass muster with the NPS or other authorities who object to man-made caches "littering" the parks?

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Guest Markwell

out finding natural objects such as counting mountain peaks or info on existing natural or historical features? What about taking a GPS reading inside a Nat'l Park, finding a nice piece of history or interesting trival piece of information that would only be found by asking a park ranger? All it takes is a little creativity.

 

Although - all things said and done, I like the real cache better.

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Guest Quinnow

Thats why I came up with the idea for logging famous or well known grave sites.

Lets say you were logging dean martins grave or something like that, dont give the name, just the long/lats and when someone finds it they have to log what was written on it or better yet take a digital pix of themselves next to it.

 

------------------

Quinn Stone

Rochester, NY.14616

www.Navicache.com

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Guest bob_renner

I just created a cache page for a real cache in Grand Canyon National Park (GC5F1). There is a box containing a logbook. It's at the bottom of the canyon and it's THEIR box and THEIR logbook. Granted it's not a geocacher-only logbook, but it is a way to create a real cache that they should not complain about. Check it out.

 

Perhaps this is a way to create caches with NPS implicit approval. If there are other such NPS registers in out-of-the-way locations they could be used as geocache sites. We just have to find them and document them on the web site. After all, the main goal is to have a location defined by gps coordinates that might not otherwise be visited by the average gps user.

 

It doesn't have the usual "goodies", just pens and pencils. If you take one, leave a better one in it's place, and sign the logbook.

 

Bob

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Guest WrongWay

Bob, that was a great idea and actually kind of funny. In addition, how about the thousands of USGS benchmarks that must be out there. I found two on top of Vulture Peak in AZ and one on top of that lousy butte you fooled me into climbing on one of your caches...you know which %#@!# one...

 

Jim ;))

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Guest jeremy

I'm in the process of acquiring the full list of NGS benchmarks. Once I get the list I'll be adding it as a separate game outside of Geocaching, I suppose under Groundspeak. There are a couple of other games I've been thinking of that have no caches.

 

I like geocaching though. It will still be my favorite.

 

Jeremy

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Guest bob_renner

quote:
Originally posted by WrongWay:

Bob ... I found two on top of Vulture Peak in AZ and one on top of that lousy butte you fooled me into climbing ...

Jim ;))


 

Jim, You're going to have to back to that peak again. There's three on top, not just one.

 

Bob

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Guest WrongWay

quote:
Originally posted by bob_renner:

Jim, You're going to have to back to that peak again. There's three on top, not just one.

 

Bob


 

Yeah, right ! I'm not falling for that again... Ha !

 

Another option is BLM lands, there are mining claims all over AZ. Each claim is suppose to be marked on the corners and a document must be present, most times a copy of the filed claim. I've run into these all over the Bradshaw's and if you research them there is some neat history.

 

Jim

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Guest easom1
eek.gif I personally dont like virtual caches. There is one posted in Idaho but the virtual cache is in Canada. There is only 9 caches in Idaho anyway, I was excited to find a new cache posted but let down to find it was in another country. If you read what geocaching is it states that you place a cache someplace with a logbook etc in it and a virtual cache is not that. Its just my opinion and wish they were listed seperately on the site. EASOM eek.gif

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Guest Moun10Bike

quote:
Originally posted by easom1:

I personally dont like virtual caches. There is one posted in Idaho but the virtual cache is in Canada


 

Actually, the only virtual cache I know of in the state is in Hope (Idaho), not Canada. And I count 13 caches in Idaho right now. See http://www.geocaching.com/seek/nearest_cache.asp?state_id=13&submit2=GO .

 

[This message has been edited by Moun10Bike (edited 04-05-2001).]

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Guest cjdoyle

It sounds like geocaching to me.

 

Just because there are no buckets or cans filled with trinkets seems you feel like its a fake? That just makes no sense to me.

 

I've created two virtual caches because they were in places that I (and the park service in one instance) didn't feel like a cache could be placed appropriately. But they are in very pretty locations. In both cases, 'virtual' is in the name of the cache. As in the one in Idaho.

 

[This message has been edited by cjdoyle (edited 04-06-2001).]

 

[This message has been edited by cjdoyle (edited 04-06-2001).]

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Guest jeremy

I will start segmenting caches into different types soon, however, since there have been some distinct types created. Offset caches, virtual caches, multi-caches are three variations. Most can fit under these categories.

 

Jeremy

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Guest Scout

I've been tossing around in my head how you could set up a competitive geocache. What I'd like to do is setup a timing system whereby cache seekers can have their times recorded, with satisfaction going to the cache seeker who finds a cache in the shortest time.

 

So far, what I've come up with is a two-stage cache, where the location of the second cache is known only by visiting the first cache. The time tracked is the time between the first and second cache.

 

I've been toying with the idea of using cell phone calls to document the start and end times to make it a little more official, but haven't figured out a way to totally eliminate cheating (e.g., by doing the hunt twice under different names).

 

Has this idea already been done? I don't want to reinvent the wheel.

 

quote:
Originally posted by jeremy:

I will start segmenting caches into different types soon, however, since there have been some distinct types created. Offset caches, virtual caches, multi-caches are three variations. Most can fit under these categories.

 

Jeremy


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Guest jeremy

A timed cache. Very interesting. Perhaps something WAP enabled? You get on the WAP site and note that you found the first cache (using a code of some sorts). Then visit the second cache and do the same with the phone.

 

Big issue would be signal strength, but otherwise not bad. I can even see some kind of timer where you can log back into the site and find out how much time you have left. Perhaps you could then show high scores on how fast people got from point A to B.

 

Unfortunately codes would be easy to email to a friend and cheat.

 

Jeremy

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Guest Scout

Plain old cellular service is more deployed than WAP and would do the trick. Here's how it would work. Hunter emails for an identifying password before starting hunt. With password in hand, hunter goes to cache A, which is published on www.geocaching.com. At cache A, hunter finds phone number. Hunter calls phone number, identifies himself with his password, and gets the coordinates of cache B in return. Hunter moves quickly to cache B. Hunter finds some unique identifier in cache B, calls original phone number again, giving his password and cache identifier to prove he found it. Phone call times establish the start and end times for his hunt.

 

Of course, cheating is possible. Hunter could do the course all over again with a new identity, making both calls only seconds apart from cache B. But this can probably be controlled somewhat by not issuing passwords to brand new, anonymous geocachers. Some accountability could be required. Maybe with WAP and PGP signatures and such we could close even this loophole.

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Guest unequalman

I'm not all that into the virtual concept. For me the biggest thrill comes from those last few feet of reaching a tangible object. Reading a log book in the field is the most romantic aspect of this game. And besides, being stealthy in a populated area is a very important skill in this sport. At least in urban areas. I signed a log and took/left treasure out of an altoids box found at 42nd st. and 5th ave. in New York City. Possibly one of the busiest intersections in the U.S. With a creative mind and a little discretion I think what seems like an impossible challenge can offer the biggest rewards.*

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Guest Mike_Teague

Im with the anti-virtual folks personally...

 

As a matter of history, this topic was the reason the founder of the game quit participating.. I wouldn't post one of his "virtual" caches on the original website, only "real" ones...

 

I think until lack of interest, or the law intervenes, we should keep doing what we're doing...

 

As was said last June during the original debate "if it aint broke, dont fix it"

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Guest Markwell

Isn't there room enough for virtual caches and tangible caches? If Jeremy is willing to sub-divide them based on whether or not there's a tangible stash, why not just limit your search to the real ones, rather than banning the creativity of creating a virtual cache and its verification.

 

I see the "pro-virtuals" as trying to lead people to some area of great import, either historical significance or vistal grandeur. If the cache hider wants to leave a virtual cache to leave the land undisturbed, and the seekers know full well in advance that this is a virtual cache, the only harm that could come out having both is a limitation on Jeremy's disk space.

 

Just my 2¢.

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Guest IronHelix

hink the virtual cache should have some significance. Spending alot of effort finding to find nothing is a letdown. It should be at least a monument or vista or something.

 

However, vCaches (hmmm... I like the name) can lead to some interesting possibilities. For example, vCache1 and vCache2 are historical landmarks. Using some information from caches 1-2 (numbers/words on a plaque, etc) one finds GeoCache 3. One way is to give a partial coordinate with one of the numbers being on a plaque, or have a passworded website with the location of GC3. Then one finds GC3. This could be a whole new game. By finding info from several small caches, one finds the real cache and some prize.

 

With (pick one) a love of the road or some interstate friends, it would be pretty easy to set up a unofficial 'cache competition'. The final site could be a CDr with a PGP crypted message, this would be decrypted with a password made up of words from the various caches along the way. The message could point to a hidden URL here to log the visit and possibly a website to download a certificate.

 

Any ideas/comments?

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Guest fiser

I've thought a lot about recent raids, environmental criticisms, and the future of our game. After hiding ten tangible caches I've decided I need to go virtual.

 

No permission required, no cranky "coordinate your visit with raptor breeding schedules" criticisms, it fits nicely with "leave no trace", and it de-emphasizes the jar-jar-binks-taco-bell-toy-in-the-woods aspect of the game.

 

My only problem is I don't know much about HTML, getting webspace, etc.

 

Where do I start?

 

[This message has been edited by fiser (edited 04-10-2001).]

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Guest dave f

Earlier in this thread, mention was made that a virtual cache "author" might spend a lot of time and money mailing actual "certificates" to people who found the virtual cache. One solution is, of course, the electronic document.

 

Another might be borrowed from the world of short wave radio listening. Require the cache finder to send, by mail, the cache founder a SASE (self-addressed, stamped envelope), along with whatever proof there is of finding the cache. If reproduction of certificates or whatever is onerous, require an extra stamp or two. For privacy, have the requests directed to post office box.

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Guest kbraband

After creating 3 "real" caches" I created a virtual cache. See: http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=1552. No certificate involved. All you do is read the clues on a historical marker and send me an email. Then I write back to tell you if you solved it. (I can't think of anyone who would want to hang a virtual cache certificate for all to see, but to each his own.)

 

[This message has been edited by kbraband (edited 04-13-2001).]

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Guest BooKat

One idea that I have come up with is having a one day virtual geocache competition. A group of geocachers could get together at a location i.e. park, city, etc. Each participant would get a list of coordinates that would lead to a city or park landmark. The geocachers would have to get the info required at the landmark, such as a name or date. The first one back with the correct answers would win the competition. This has been done sucessfully by people who organize treasure hunts in urban areas and I see no reason why it couldn't work for geocaching. I guess the hard part would be organizing this whole thing.

 

[This message has been edited by BooKat (edited 04-15-2001).]

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Guest cjdoyle

quote:
Originally posted by kbraband:

I can't think of anyone who would want to hang a virtual cache certificate for all to see, but to each his own.


 

I provided a certificate essentially so kids could get something tangible. I can't think anyone (other than kids) who would want a trinket from a physical cache, but it appears there are lots of adults who need to have some sort of tangible evidence they've succeeded.

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Guest kbraband

quote:
Originally posted by cjdoyle:

I provided a certificate essentially so kids could get something tangible. I can't think anyone (other than kids) who would want a trinket from a physical cache, but it appears there are lots of adults who need to have some sort of tangible evidence they've succeeded.


Good point, CJ. Kids probably would like the certficate. I didn't think about that. (I didn't mean to offend.) Regarding the adults who like trinkets, I'm in that crowd. I don't always take something, but the Herbie Hancock CD I got this weekend is pretty cool.

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quote:
Originally posted by jeremy:

I'm in the process of acquiring the full list of NGS benchmarks. Once I get the list I'll be adding it as a separate game outside of Geocaching, I suppose under Groundspeak. There are a couple of other games I've been thinking of that have no caches.

 

I like geocaching though. It will still be my favorite.

 

Jeremy


 

Hey J-Man - Any chance of getting the NGS Benchmark game up and running?

 

25021_1200.gif

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