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Magellan Contest Rigged?


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quote:
As for the "hacker's" story, I DON'T BELIEVE EVERY PART OF YOUR STORY. The North Fayette police did mention about someone being on the property two days ago. However, the officer did not tell us if a report was filed following the trespass or not. He did point out that North Fayette was unaware of the scavenger hunt. So I really wonder if the North Fayette police received a visit after the encounter with the landowner two days ago.

 

I can assure you I went straight to the police with this information. My first stop was an Exxon station at the intersection of Route 978 at Route 30, where I saw a state police officer. He suggested I ask the clerk for the address of the local station, since his duty was only to patrol Route 30.

 

The clerk gave me directions to the local station, and off I went. It is only about 2 miles from this couples' home in part of a municipal center.

 

When I explained everything to the officer, he went to the back of the building to try to load their GPS program to verify the coordinates. He said it was going to take as long as 20 minutes just to get the program loaded!

 

While I was waiting, I overheard the dispatcher talking to the captian on the radio, and she mentioned that the incident was "part of an Internet contest" and that I was sitting there.

 

I ultimately left before he got the station's GPS program loaded, but I left him a copy of the map, and he asked for my home address & phone, which I also provided. They obviously blew me off as being a lone misplaced geek or something, and they obviously disregarded my repeated comments that this would be happening again.

 

I did the right things; if you can't believe that... well... I guess that ain't my problem!

 

I probably still have the GPS data that shows my tracks of that morning if it's that important to you...

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Alright you all just sound too funny.

it was too easy....

it was rigged....

hackers!!!!!!!

 

This was a contest. plain and simple. there is going to be compitition in a contest. some of the trials will be easy and the winners show early.

I got a hat coupon. i was in houston. i do not consider i lost i just figured Good Game but not the grand prize. you all can cry a river and talk all the smack about Magellan but the truth is they had a contest they had some easy clues. You did not get the grand prize thats what happens. the complaining is makeing you losers. not the hat.

 

As for the garage incident hey to err is human they were human and sent you to private property. you all knew that was not right but you went anyways. you made the same mistake too then. why cry foul??? if you whiners had been winners you would not say a thing at all.

 

quote:

It's my therapy that is keeping you alive. Now give me back my meds.


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quote:
Originally posted by magellan315:

This is a marketing campaign, albiet a very badly planned and executed one, intended to get people to buy a GPS.


Yes it was. I will surely stick with Garmin in the Future.

 

I was fifth or so to our Atlanta cache (who could tell since Magellan does not include any kind of logbook), but I don't think I will send in my coupon for my hat. It would be an embarrasement to wear it at this point.

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A few notes about the comments.

 

About the "hack". Well since I was planning on using a Palm web browser to get the co-ords on the road, I was planning on sitting with my Handspring Visor and SprintPCS module to update the web page. Since Blazer won't do the popup windows I was going to see if I could figure out what the link would be and bookmark that in Blazer so that I could load the map the second it popped up. In the end I figured I would be much better off turning off graphics so the page would load faster. So I was about 2 secs from stumbling across the Denver map myself and if Wireless internet were faster I would haveicon_rolleyes.gif What would I have done if I had found it... Probably told no-one and went to look for the cache. Or I would have told Magellan, but most likely I would have went to look for the cache.

 

About the contest in general. I think it was a great idea. It has a lot of people excited. Considering its a very different contest then most they are doing ok. The web link hole is a huge blunder. Depends on how they handle the mistakes. Any company can make mistakes, but the true colors will come out in how they handle them. One of my proudest moments when I worked for Hewlett-Packard was when they discovered a drive roller problem with DeskJets and activly sought out a fix before most people knew there was problem. Then making it really easy to get that fix by taking out ads telling people about the problem and how they could get a free kit to fix it. It's easy to fault everything that went wrong with the contest, but I was amazed with what they got right.

 

They got the fact that people love to tell the story of the adventure they had finding the cache and made that part of the contest.

 

Using you brains as much as your GPS. Posting clues so that you could be in right place when the coords were posted.

 

Putting up some pretty cool prizes. Nothing gets people excited like the chance to win something, but not just by luck. It's part luck and part skill.

 

I think Magellans heart is in the right place. They were really trying to run a cool contest and have done great work in the past supporting Cache-In Trash-Out. They also support more then just the Geocaching.com website. The execution could have been better, but this is pretty new ground and I would have been shocked if mistakes had not been made. I give them big points for trying something like this. Most companies would not have even tried something as adventurous as a Geocaching contest, to much that could go wrong. Most would have done something bland but safe. I am tired of bland and safe!

 

Will it affect my GPS purchases... Not much. I have only owned Magellans in the past, but that had to do with the fact they offered products that I felt were the best for what I wanted. I started with a Handspring add on. When I went to a handheld I almost got Garmin Rhino, but when I tested that clickstick with my snowshoe gloves I found it less then useless. So I went with a Magellan Meridian because with the big buttons I could easily use it with my gloves on. I have very little brand loyality.

 

One of the biggest problems I find is that few outdoor store carry Magellan products and I think this will get people talkling about Magellan in the stores and will lead to choice. Which is a good thing.

 

While I really wish the execution were better I still think this is a great idea and very adventurous for a corporation. Wish more were this brave.

 

A = A

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Wow, interesting thread...

 

First of all, kudos to Magellan for trying to arrange something like this. Obviously the fact that so many people are so up in arms about it means that the excitement of doing it was quite high.

 

Second, thumbs down to Magellan for not being a little more careful. They should have had an internal dry run for ALL of these caches to make sure other people could find them. Maybe they did and something else went wrong. It's a really complicated thing to pull off, and they only got one shot. Unfortunately, it didn't work out for them, and although they've probably learned from their mistakes, they may not get the chance to do it again, what with all the bad press they're getting on this one. A bummer, to say the least.

 

Regarding Allensfreed cracking the site... I understand the thinking that led to this discovery, but regardless of your personal circumstances (and you certainly seem like an intelligent and honest individual), using information you weren't supposed to have when competing against others would by definition make it cheating, and thus make you a cheater. Would I have done the same thing? I'd like to think I wouldn't, but who knows. I definitely don't agree with the "if I didn't do it, someone else would have" aspect of it. This same reasoning could just as easily be applied to stealing an unlocked bicycle. Or taking advantage of the drunken girl at the party. You get the idea.

 

Rather than ripping Magellan to pieces for trying to do something cool and failing, how about a little more discussion on what they might have done differently in the future. How about some "Gee, wouldn't it be neat if..." kind of posts?

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I agree with Dan Edwards and Indiana Cojones on this. Good on Magellan for trying to do this at all. It's a shame there have been screw-ups, but accidents do happen. I doubt they're doing it on purpose to be evil and waste a cacher's time or make people get tresspassing fines.

 

As for suggestions: What would be cool is if they consulted with real Geocachers about how to place a cache and make up clues. It would also behoove all Magellan staff working on this contest to read the rules of Geocaching (so there are no more repeats of planting caches on private property, NPS lands, buried in a hole or any of that stuff). I'm dumbfounded that a company that wants to be associated with Geocaching doesn't understand the rules of how it supposed to work.

 

Team Kender - "The Sun is coming up!" "No, the horizon is going down."

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quote:
Originally posted by Team Kender:

It would also behoove all Magellan staff working on this contest to read the rules of Geocaching (so there are no more repeats of planting caches on private property, NPS lands, buried in a hole or any of that stuff). I'm dumbfounded that a company that wants to be associated with Geocaching doesn't understand the rules of how it supposed to work.


 

I agree in general, except why should a company holding its own contest be held accountable to the rules and guidelines specific to this website? Perhaps I missed something, but did Magellan post information in these forums about their contests, or did members post the information after having read it in a paid advertisement? Does any advertising agreement Groundspeak have with advertisers include a clause that says the advertiser must abide by "Jeremy's Rules" in order to advertise on the site?

 

Call this post a gentle reminder that Groundspeak, Inc. and Geocaching.com do not own the game.

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How much bad press did Magellan really get in the news media? I haven't heard anything on the news channels about the Great Magellan Cache Snafu and Contest. How many people got introduced to caching from this contest?

 

Personally on my last geocache hunt my Meridian Platinum put me with-in TWO (2) feet of the cache. I don't think I'll change brands just because someone had problems with a free contest!

IMHO

 

John

 

There's only two rules to life.

1st - don't sweat the small stuff.

2nd - It's all small stuff...

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Reminds me of the "scam" on Press Your Luck.

The guy figured out a pattern on their "random" board and made alot of money.

If you saw the show on the Game Show Network you saw that his life did not work out all that good. I guess it's easier to feel like one of those cachers are hackers/cheaters/scammers since I didn't notice a way to do it.

 

Oh well. This whole event could have been better, but a least it was interesting.

 

As the Soup Nazi on Seifeld said "NEXT!".

 

Kenneth

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I had already used the same crack on the Boston cache that Alansfreed later used. I can assured you that it didn't work for the Boston one.

 

If it worked for him (and I have no reason not to believe him) it was just another screw up by Magellan.

 

Screw ups? Sure, but admit it, it sure has been great fun.

 

Next time, Magellan, work with local cachers.

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Here was the problem with the Denver cache, incorrect coordinates again...

 

quote:

Originally posted by DiffDude on the Magellan Contest page.

 

Now I understand the problem and how the first people found it. It's not that the coordinates are wrong, they were just posted in the wrong format. If the cache really had N 39 28' 29" and W 104 55' 22" (and no decimals on the seconds), as people have said, then converting them to the posted coordinates gives the correct values of N 39 28.483' W 104 22.366 (actually the lon should have been rounded up to 22.367).

 

The problem is they are displaying more significant digits than they had. The posting of the coordinates in 1000ths minute implys an accuracy of about 6 ft (6071 ft per minute of latitude). But, the original coordinates were to the nearest second of lat/lon, which is only accurate to about 100ft N/S and 60ft E/W. They should have posted in the original Deg Min Sec, or only displayed the decimal minutes to 100th of a minute (N 39 28.48 W 104 55.37). This would have told me of the uncertanty of the position, and might have looked farther away. Of course, what they should have done is record the actual lat/lon to the 10ths of second, or 1000ths of minute, to give the most accurate coordinates.

 

Now, the people that found the cache stated they used a GPS displaying 100ths of minute. That means it was only accurate to about 60ft N/S, and 40ft E/W. So, when they were within 60ft of the cache location, the GPS would show them dead on. This probably made them search a wider radius than people with GPS showing 1000ths minute, and hence why they found the cache first.

 

It's funny how having a less precise GPS actually allowed them to find the cache. I don't think this was Magellan's intentions.

 

So, the posted coordinates are WRONG. The cache is not there. If you take the actual coordinates in 1000ths of minute from someone who found it (N 39 28.475 W 104 55.370), and convert that back to seconds, you get N 39 28 28.5 and W 104 55 22.2, which is about 50ft south and 20 ft west of the posted coordinates. The 0.5" and 0.2" are the error.

 

Diffdude


 

[This message was edited by CacheInColorado on August 03, 2003 at 01:26 PM.]

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My grandpa's double third cousin in law on his momma's side just sent me this. Maybe it helps explain things. icon_wink.gif

 

Hey Ya'll. Me and my wife Ethel Mae just found the dangedest thang out in our garden in Mississippi and we're trying to figure out what to do with it. Ethel Mae was out picking some green tomatoes (that woman just loves a fried green mater sammitch) and spotted this funny looking brown box through the corn under one of the pea plants. She goes over there and picks up what looks to be some kinda little toy chest. I tell her I figure one of the grand youngun's musta left it out there. Dang kids all the time leavin' stuff scattered all over the place. She tells me, "Rufus Lee, I ain't never seen em playin with nothin like this". So I says, "well open it up and see what it is." So she opens it up and it's mostly all kinds of junk. But there's a note at the top that says its supposed to be in some park in Pennsylvania as part of some gee-o-catchin contest. Well heck, I guess they got a mite confused there cause we ain't nowhere close to there. I didn't get much geograffy back in my 11 years of schooling on account we only went through the 8th grade but I'm purty shore we're somewhat to the South. Next she says, "There's a coupon in here that says we may of done won ourselves a G-P-S." I says "The heck you say! A Jeep ES? That must be one of the new ones. Reckon it's a four-wheel drive?" Ethel Mae says "It don't say. Just says here it's a color one." Anyhows we go thumbin through the rest of the box and Ethel Mae spots this right purty pearl necklace in there. I tell her that's a nicer one than the one she's got that I won her at the carnival a few years back so she oughtta just swap out. So that's what she done. Now we don't wanna mess up y'alls contest so we done put the box back in the pea patch. The directions say something about I believe they called it latatude an' longatude. Well, our garden spot's purty narrow on acount it's right beside tha barn so I reckon you better pay most attention to that longatude. Mind you, be careful where you step cause the squash is just now comin up. And for God's sake, don't open that gate at the north end. That's where the bull stays and he don't cotton to no yankee strangers. That there bull can cover 100 yards in 10 seconds. Can you?

 

Visit the Mississippi Geocaching Forum at

http://pub98.ezboard.com/bgeocachingms

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quote:
Originally posted by pater47:

But there's a note at the top that says its supposed to be in some park in Pennsylvania as part of some gee-o-catchin contest.


 

I don't think this story is true at all!!!

 

First, Magellan has assured us that the cache is not on private property! Second, no Mississipian would say Pennsylvania...they say Pennsylvanie...

 

PS - Duh, I know it's a joke. icon_rolleyes.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by BassoonPilot:

quote:
Originally posted by Team Kender:

It would also behoove all Magellan staff working on this contest to read the rules of Geocaching (so there are no more repeats of planting caches on private property, NPS lands, buried in a hole or any of that stuff). I'm dumbfounded that a company that wants to be associated with Geocaching doesn't understand the rules of how it supposed to work.


 

I agree in general, except why should a company holding its own contest be held accountable to the rules and guidelines specific to this website? Perhaps I missed something, but did Magellan post information in these forums about their contests, or did members post the information after having read it in a paid advertisement? Does any advertising agreement Groundspeak have with advertisers include a clause that says the advertiser must abide by "Jeremy's Rules" in order to advertise on the site?

 

Call this post a gentle reminder that Groundspeak, Inc. and Geocaching.com do not own the game.


 

Actually they did advertise the contest on this web site, on the left side of several pages in fact. I agree that the contest isn't beholding to the rules on this web site, but most of the rules they 'broke' were of the common sense variety (except for the national park placing, and in that case, I doubt the national park sees any difference between the contest, and geocaching).

 

If you are going to have a (contiguous) nation-wide contest that so closely approximates geocaching, you may want to know how geocaching is done, and reviewing the rules posted on this web site, is as good a source of reference as any.

 

_________________________________________________________

If trees could scream, would we still cut them down?

Well, maybe if they screamed all the time, for no reason.

Click here for my Geocaching pictures and Here (newest)

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Ever look a gift horse in the mouth?

Seriously folks.

To those who applaud Magellan for what they did? Kudos to you. For those of you are angry at the way they tried to give away FREE GPSrs and trips to great spots, lighten up! If these same 'newbie' mistakes had been done by a newbie on this site, you all would have thanked them up and down for leaving such a great prize and then suggested how to correct the errors, wouldn't you? Just because they made the product doesn't mean they are going to be experts in the game. Yes, they could have done a better job (this has been discussed at length), and I'm sure they will next time they try something like this. You were all 'newbies' at one point too, try to remember that.

I've seen numerous posts about people calling the Magellan/Thales marketing department about issues they've had with cracks in units, etc. but noone here has said they contacted the marketing department and offered their help for the rest of this contest or any upcoming contests they may run.

As for it being a "marketing ploy with the intent to sell units....." - um....do you know what Marketing is supposed to do?

Granted I took part in the San Jose treasure hunt which tunred out to be a 'rat race' when the coords were up since the clues did not help, and then people complained about THAT! They wanted the clues to be more helpful in finding out where it is BEFORE the coords were up....can't please everyone (or in this case ANYONE).

Hindsight is 20/20 and I think with all the resources here we should be trying to help them instead of sitting back and bashing them.

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quote:
Originally posted by Dorkus&Co.:

And when exactly is Garmin going to embrace the Geocaching community?


 

They ALREADY have! At the Geo Jamboree event last spring they provided multiple prizes, including big-time software (I won a hat). (It seems to me they give away as much promo/product regionally as Magellan is trying to do nationally!)

 

Not that I care about icons, but they have 'em (I use '$' personally)..

 

They specifically designed an entire product line around Geocaching.

 

Just to clear the record,

 

Randy

 

PS: I'm not a Garmin spokesman, bought one 'cause of price on eBay and 'networkability' to my Palm device! (Prior to that had only experienced an old borrowed Magellan years ago...)

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I've always said I love my Garmin Legend! And, I'm happy to own a Garmin hat which I got at the GeoJamboree Event, and another cacher got the Garmin Software. Others got hats and T-shirts. All you have to do is call Garmin, tell them you're having an event and ask if they'd like to participate in some way.

 

Cache you later,

Planet

 

So many caches, so little time.

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quote:
Originally posted by magellan315:

I have to agree with Verboten and Keystone Approver, Magellan is not helping/supporting Geocaching. This is a marketing campaign, albiet a very badly planned and executed one, intended to get people to buy a GPS.

 

If Magellan was interested in supporting Geoaching they would be working with local Geocaching groups to help them get Geocaching to be considered acceptable land use activity. Or better yet, offer to loan GPS's to local parks that allow Geocaching and want to teach a class. So the newbies who don't own a GPS have a way to try it for themselves.


 

I think Magellan had good intentions. I think they let the marketing department do what the support department probably could have handled better. It's not uncommon in ANY corporation to have people in the marketing and even sales groups that really don't know jack about the products they have. Sad but true.

 

Of course it's not like we have ever seen any gocaches blown up by the bomb squad or placed with bad coordinates on this site.

 

To set the record straight, Magellan is working with local geocaching groups. They have given the two geocaching groups here in Oklahoma several thousand dollars worth of equipment to use as event prizes. They have been very supportive of our group. Garmin has not been too interested. Although they have given us a few T-shirts to give as prizes which I am more than thankful for.

 

A local naturalist for the City of Tulsa is also a geocacher. Magellan sent an instructor from California to give a class on using a GPS at their women's weekend event this spring. They then gave the nature center 14 GPS units to use for training sessions and other activities. I think that is pretty generous. They are now conducting geocaching classes and promoting working with the land owners.

 

Acting as if Magellan is the evil empire because of this is all a little ridiculous IMO. I get just as much enjoyment out of my Sportrak as I did my GPS12.

 

Maybe later we can start a Coke/Pepsi thread or a Ford/Chevy thread. Better yet a PC/MAC thread. icon_rolleyes.gif

 

-beatnik-

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quote:
Originally posted by Kealia:

For those of you are angry at the way they tried to give away FREE GPSrs and trips to great spots, lighten up! If these same 'newbie' mistakes had been done by a newbie on this site, you all would have thanked them up and down for leaving such a great prize and then suggested how to correct the errors, wouldn't you?


 

I own both a Magellan and Garmin, so I am not 'partisan.' The first thing I thought after reading about this fiasco is that the newer Magellan units must not be very "user friendly" if even the employees of the manufacturers can't figure out how to use them. Gee, where can I buy two or three? icon_wink.gif

 

quote:
As for it being a "marketing ploy with the intent to sell units....." - um....do you know what Marketing is supposed to do?

Yeah. See above comment.

 

quote:
Hindsight is 20/20 and I think with all the resources here we should be trying to help them instead of sitting back and bashing them.

 

Help them do what? As you mentioned, the motivation for placing those units was to increase market awareness and ultimately sell more units. Why should we act as "volunteer employees" of Thales Navigation?

 

Are you suggesting that we should encourage and assist Thales in creating more "rat races?" No thanks; as the current fiasco has demonstrated, that type of activity is detrimental to geocaching.

 

Or are you suggesting that we should help a multi-billion dollar manufacturer of navigation units figure out which way is up? Fuggetaboutit.

 

[This message was edited by BassoonPilot on August 04, 2003 at 06:15 AM.]

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The difference is, newbie mistakes on this site are usually because someone doesn't know how to use a GPS. If this wasn't a GPS company running the contest, I'm sure the reaction wouldn't be as hostile.

 

Flat_MiGeo_B88.gif

Well the mountain was so beautiful that this guy built a mall and a pizza shack

Yeah he built an ugly city because he wanted the mountain to love him back -- Dar Williams

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I'm going out on a limb here, but ... I'm guessing that the Magellan GPS told the user the correct coordinates, but the problem came when it was relayed via phone, email, or whatever. I seriously doubt the GPS was sent back to HQ to have it's waypoint downloaded by Mapsend or EasyGPS and then have those downloaded coordinates "cut-n-pasted" into the HTML file ... but I could be wrong.

 

C'mon guys, don't tell me you've never transposed numbers before. Let's not blame the GPS.

 

JetSkier

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This is one heck of an interesting thread... and about these caches?? Wow man, that's really faar out!

 

Where are TEAM KFWB GPS when you need them? Another cacher an I blew about 50 hours on one of their caches that had bad coords and instructions, and even had to hike 20 miles out of nowhere to get within cell phone range to get picked up (my car was locked behind a gate)... we laugh about it now.

 

Anyway, great story (maybe, unless you got a ticket), and I look forward to reading more.

 

Magellan rocks!!

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Magellan did not do this to catch hackers or anything like that. They plain and simply screwed up. They either had a typo or had someone place the cache that did not have a clue of what they were doing. I am so glad I had to work on Saturday because I would have been in that mess with everyone else. Hopefully Magellan will do the right thing. First apologize to the couple, pay all fines involved, finish this hunt, and as to make up for their mistake give Pittsburgh a new hunt or how about putting in some more Magellans as prizes in this hunt. Just a thought.

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quote:
Originally posted by BassoonPilot:

quote:
Originally posted by Kealia:

For those of you are angry at the way they tried to give away FREE GPSrs and trips to great spots, lighten up! If these same 'newbie' mistakes had been done by a newbie on this site, you all would have thanked them up and down for leaving such a great prize and then suggested how to correct the errors, wouldn't you?


 

I own both a Magellan and Garmin, so I am not 'partisan.' The first thing I thought after reading about this fiasco is that the newer Magellan units must not be very "user friendly" if even the employees of the manufacturers can't figure out how to use them. Gee, where can I buy two or three? icon_wink.gif


I just bought a SporTrak Pro and it's pretty easy to use - of course that doesn't mean that they can.

 

quote:
Hindsight is 20/20 and I think with all the resources here we should be trying to help them instead of sitting back and bashing them.

 

quote:
Help them do what? As you mentioned, the motivation for placing those units was to increase market awareness and ultimately sell more units. Why should we act as "volunteer employees" of Thales Navigation?

 

Are you suggesting that we should encourage and assist Thales in creating more "rat races?" No thanks; as the current fiasco has demonstrated, that type of activity is detrimental to geocaching.

 

Or are you suggesting that we should help a multi-billion dollar manufacturer of navigation units figure out which way is up? Fuggetaboutit.


 

The reason everybody is so mad is becuase everybody was SO excited in the first place. Everybody is mad becuase they feel let down, angry at the mistakes, etc. and wouldn't feel this way if they were amped up to start with. The fact that they would place these prizes in teh first place says that they are STRATING to embrace the sport - I never said they did it right.

 

If you're not interested in the 'rat race' don't play. There are obviously plenty of people who are interested....thus the race and enusing anger.

 

I'm not suggesting that anybody devote thier life to become a lacky for Magellan. What I'm saying is that as experienced players you DO (like it or not) have a responsibility to help out the new folks. That's how they are going to learn. It's very easy to sit back and criticize but it takes a hell of a lot more character to get involved.

Let's be clear - I don't agree with the way they have deleted logs and handled many erros, but they did make good for the error they had is S. Cal with the wrong coords by placing another cache. Maybe they will do the same.

 

They have a lot to learn and hopefully they will. Like anything else, it only grows and expands when new blood/ideas are brought in. I say let's take advantage and educate them instead of sitting back and bashing them.

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In Michigan at least the contest went pretty well. I had a lot of fun losing sleep to the refresh button.

 

Their execution in some areas has been less than optimal. To be kind. It doesn't take long to mark your coords, drive two miles away and try to get back using your coords. If /you/ end up in the wrong place... so will everyone else.

 

But honestly... who knows what happened. I have a solid understanding of how to use my GPS and when I don't load the coords via my upload cable, I end up transposing coords and find myself in some pretty cosmic places vs. where I'm supposed to be icon_smile.gif It could have been a simple transposition error on some assisstant's part. Who knows? Wish they'd just tell us what happened.

 

I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt on why the coords were wrong. I'm not sure I like the deletion of logs, though. It's their site and this IS a PR stunt gone awry... but I think erasing the logs (so long as they are not littered with unmentionables) is in bad taste. Having heard the stories of how well people are treated when their GPS units go south, I would have expected them to respond with equal measure when their contest goes awry.

 

Not sure if anyone knows it or not, but Magellan itself is not running the contest. It's an advertising company hired by Thales. Wonder how this bodes for them icon_smile.gif

 

BTW... I'm a die-hard Garmin owner.

 

--------

trippy1976 - Team KKF2A

Saving geocaches - one golf ball at a time.

Flat_MiGeo_A88.gif

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I have to print this message thread and read it through (I'm only about 1/4 through it so far) so forgive me if this has been answered, but, Magellan uses "GeoCaching" in the description, and even in the URL of their contest (URL Below),

 

Does anyone own rights to the term "GeoCaching"?

Can they freely use it w/o copyright infringement?

 

Here's the URL:

https://www.magellangps.com/en/gpsAdventures/geocaching/

 

BTW, I just bought a SporTrak Pro for $129 w/ free shipping (online).

 

(If you want the link I'll post it)

 

Hukt un fonix werkt fur mee

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I have a Garmin GPS38, which is too old for me to compare with the Magellan SporTrak Pro that I just ordered (once I receive it), but I noticed at the URL below it didn't speak highly of the Etrex.

 

(Dodging rotten tomatoes) It made me wonder about the website's accuracy, since so many here seem to like it.

 

http://gpsinformation.net/main/gpshiking.htm

 

BTW, I would love to meet with some of Y'all, and maybe spend some time cpmoaring units (GPS!) and maybe have a BBQ (I'll bring the BBQ & charcoal).

 

I could meet & bring a BBQ to Banner Forest (It's across the Sound from Seattle). Maybe we can determine if Banner Nanner is still there...

 

Hukt un fonix werkt fur mee

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quote:
Originally posted by MaxEntropy:

Well, now that this thread had degraded to the Garmin vs. Magellan quibble, reminiscent of the PC/Mac quarrel, somebody please call someone else a Nazi and kill it off completely.

Thank You.


Only a Nazi like you would want to kill a thread on purpose, Dr. Max "Mengele" Entropy.

 

pirate.cgi.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by Kealia:

What I'm saying is that as experienced players you DO (like it or not) have a responsibility to help out the new folks. That's how they are going to learn. It's very easy to sit back and criticize but it takes a hell of a lot more character to get involved.


 

I would agree with you totally if we were discussing helping other individuals ... I do not agree that it is up to the participants of an activity to impart to companies hoping to make a buck from those participants information the company should have acquired while devising their marketing strategy.

 

quote:
I say let's take advantage and educate them instead of sitting back and bashing them.

 

You are responding to my post, so let's first make it clear that I have not "bashed" any individual or company. I have seen quite a bit of criticism aimed at Thales in this and other threads regarding this issue, and that criticism is entirely warranted. Let them digest it and learn from it.

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quote:
Well I haven't had a chance to participate in any of this madness yet, but reading thru all the treasure hunts has become my new summer soap opera/reality show.

 

Yeah, I just read this whole thread. Very interesting. I figure I'll never have a shot at this contest where I live, so I'll just read about it.

 

pokeanim3.gif

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Pulled this quote off the Brazillian Treasure page,

 

With the help of geocachers across the country, the caches in Magellan's GPS Treasure Hunt are placed in good faith on public property, not at a residence or on residential property. Please help us ensure the good name of geocaching by remaining on public property and alerting us if coordinates seem to be leading you to a private residence.

 

Now Magellan is trying to claim that Geocachers are involved in this. Like any of us would have allowed a Geocache to placed on NPS land (Atlanta), or the one in Philadelphia that was hidden in a flower bed 25' from the parking lot(I've seen 1/1's with more effort put into the location). To say nothing of the repeated errors of incorrect coordinates.

 

When I called Magellan about the Atlanta cache that was on NPS land they were unaware of the NPS ban. Oh I'm sure they have Geocahers working with them on this project(sarcasm).

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quote:
Originally posted by magellan315:

Pulled this quote off the Brazillian Treasure page,

 

With the help of geocachers across the country...

 

When I called Magellan about the Atlanta cache that was on NPS land they were unaware of the NPS ban. Oh I'm sure they have Geocahers working with them on this project(sarcasm).


 

If I had been their Boston contact, I could have easily put it on NPS property and not even known about the ban until the Atlanta one brought it to my attention. I also wouldn't have wanted to make this a 5 mile hike up the side of Mt Greylock or Mt Washington just to win a hat (or the lucky one who wins a trip). This is a low-impact, no bug-spray, we want you to be in total comfort when things go right, cache experience.

 

Not all geocachers are versed on all of the rules, especially if the geocacher in question has never placed a cache before. The ad agency/Thales might even *tell* them where they want it and it's just a matter of putting it as close to there as possible and sending the coordinates in by e-mail (of which some people might not type well...and lead to problems like that of Pittsburgh, etc).

 

I could easily see them saying "find public land with lots of parking near where I-93 and I-95 meet" and we ended up on the backside of the stop-and-go in the N Suburbs of Boston.

 

It sounds like Philly's was equally as simple.

 

I'm glad there was no sour grapes in Boston...it's too bad they can't give us another one.

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quote:
Originally posted by MaxEntropy:

Well, now that this thread had degraded to the Garmin vs. Magellan quibble, reminiscent of the PC/Mac quarrel, somebody please call someone else a Nazi and kill it off completely.

Thank You.


 

The difference being, the debate here is not about the products these companies produce but the way they handle themselves in the public eye. (Ok, so there's a bit of that in the PC/Mac debate, too.)

 

While Thales may have had their heart in the right place, their head was decidedly not.

 

The fact that they announced nothing on their web site today about this whole ordeal makes the point far better than I could.

 

-Vb

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With no other post on magellan site tells me that the problems that they have are just a little deeper than they want to admit to or that it will take a little longer to come up with a solution to the problem that they came a cross. I think that we to have a responsiblity to help make any caching safe for us to find and be responsible cachers as well when meeting the public and not to ofend them when the cords are off like they were. Big companies get more advertisement then we do as a group of cachers and can cause us more grief than we need and it is to our advantage to help them do it the way we have set up our caches, responsibly. In that sense we should be involved in helping them get it right, if not for our sport of geacaching.

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I vas only following orders!

 

quote:
Originally posted by Warm Fuzzies - Fuzzy:

quote:
Originally posted by MaxEntropy:

Well, now that this thread had degraded to the Garmin vs. Magellan quibble, reminiscent of the PC/Mac quarrel, somebody please call someone else a Nazi and kill it off completely.

Thank You.


Only a Nazi like you would want to kill a thread on purpose, Dr. Max "Mengele" Entropy.

 

http://parkrrrr.com/pirate.cgi.gif


 

Mickey

Max Entropy

More than just a name, a lifestyle.

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quote:
(Ok, so there's a bit of that in the PC/Mac debate, too.)

 

I read the thread, but missed the Pc/Mac debate?!?! Anyway, I use a Mac and Magellan 315. Does that mean I'm doomed? Actually, I got really annoyed with my Magellan recently when it lost signal in the mountains and trees. It doesn't tell you that and just freezes the coords. Very annoying if you are not watching to see if it is still averaging! It caused me to look all around the wrong area for a 1/2 hour for a cache! I'm told that Garmin tells you when the signal is lost. I am about to upgrade and am now looking at Garmin!

 

pokeanim3.gif

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Speaking of Mac/PC: anyone with a Mac noticed that you can no longer post to the Magellan Treasure Hunt website? Using Safari 1.0 or Internet Explorer 5.2.2 I haven't been able to post a log since 7/11/2003 - right after the coordinates to "Treasure of Victoria's Voyage" were posted. In order to post a log entry I have to fire up Virtual PC. Anyone else with a Mac experiencing this or just me? I've written to them a couple times and not gotten a reply.

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quote:
Originally posted by carleenp:

 

Actually, I got really annoyed with my Magellan recently when it lost signal in the mountains and trees. It doesn't tell you that and just freezes the coords. Very annoying if you are not watching to see if it is still averaging! It caused me to look all around the wrong area for a 1/2 hour for a cache! I'm told that Garmin tells you when the signal is lost. I am about to upgrade and am now looking at Garmin!

 


 

Good luck then.

 

When your Garmin etrex loses signal more often than your Magellan did under moderate tree cover, you'll have even more time to read these three beautiful words:

 

'Lost Satellite Reception'

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To all those who are asking what has Garmin done to support GeoCaching?

 

Check any of the GPSGoldrush caches that were put on the GeoCaching website. There is also a GPSGoldrush website that is currenty not active, but it can still be viewed. Garmin is was and still is (the last I heard) the key sponsor to these events. I believe that they have been help in several regions throughout the country. Mostly coastal.

 

Magellan has really put out a poor effort in this promotion. I really believe that those involved are NOT cachers and need to get a clue. One or two mistakes are allowable. But, after the latest fiasco, they are showing us that they truly do not care and only want our money. If someone recevied this type of service at a restaurant or any other service typeindustry, would they patronize the establishment ever agian? Most likely not. I tried to participate in the Boston contest, but prior commitments kept me away from the area that weekend. I will not participate if another comes to the northeast because of the last few problems.

 

I own a Garmin. It has treated me very well.

 

Earthling TF

 

Earthling

Team Hide & Seek

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quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:

Good luck then.

 

When your Garmin etrex loses signal more often than your Magellan did under moderate tree cover


 

As the owner of both a Magellan and Garmin, I consider statements like that to be nothing more than "urban legend."

 

Over the past two years, my Magellan (with its "superior antenna") has lost signal much more often than my Garmin with "the patch." The only advantage my Magellan offers over my Garmin is five-fold battery life.

 

(We now return you to the "was the contest rigged or how stupid was Magellan's Marketing Dept." debate.)

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quote:
I definitely don't agree with the "if I didn't do it, someone else would have" aspect of it. This same reasoning could just as easily be applied to stealing an unlocked bicycle. Or taking advantage of the drunken girl at the party. You get the idea.


 

Well, not exactly. Stealing and sexual assault are against the law and affect the person that you’re stealing or assaulting. Messing around with a website URL isn't.

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quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:

Urban legend? Well, try going into the rural area, with lots of trees around.


 

You mean so many trees that the sunlight doesn't reach the ground? Where one can't see even a hint of blue up above? Been there, done too many times to count ... my experience has been precisely the opposite of yours. And as I stated, I'm not partisan ... I like both units.

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