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Abuse of the forums by excessive posting


pipedreamer

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I've been pretty good. I saw this thread this morning and ignored it all day. In a moment of weakness, I opened it a few minutes ago - knowing full well exactly what would be hashed and rehashed.

 

Maybe I'm biased because I have been called a forum junkie. I do get off topic sometimes. I also rant occasionally. I've even been known to whine. I like to believe that I've also contributed favorably to some of the threads.

 

When I am wandering about on the forums, I read the threads that I think may interest me. I make an attempt to help newbies. I give my opinions on issues that I feel strongly about.

 

If I open a thread that doesn't interest me, I push the back button and move on to something I care about.

 

I'm a little confused about why I'm even posting to this thread since it seems to be alot about nothing.

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quote:
Originally posted by pipedreamer:

Thanks, but it's not really. I have them after school since their parents work till 6. I'd rather they get outdoors in the fresh air rather than play videogames all afternoon. But thank you for saying that anyway.


 

Exactly. You could just let them sit there and play videogames...

They will remember your time with them much better doing what you are doing.

 

Women are like guns, keep one around long enough and you're going to want to shoot it.

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I haven't had any trouble with the posts or posters in this forum. I've read almost every thread on here since I found this place. Sometimes I might get irritated by what someone writes, but they're entitled to their opinion. Somtimes I think some people must spend their every waking moment in here, but I'm pretty bad about it, too. I just don't have much to say.

 

I've come to regard forums like this as exactly what they are - social situations - just not in person. Think about when you go to work, church, school, shopping, virtually anywhere. You're bound to run into someone who won't quit talking to you, or who talks too loud, or tells lame stories, or makes bad jokes...... In other words you just don't like them in general.

Does that mean this person should be banned from work, the mall, school, church? Of course not. YOU just avoid them. Don't listen to their stories, hide when they're walking your direction, whatever. Unless they are being hateful, rude, obscene, overly argumentative, etc. there is really nothing you can do about them but ignore them. Accept the fact that you will run into people like that no matter where you go in this world.

 

I've had a great time reading this forum and "getting to know" the people here. I do feel I know them, even though we'll never speak in person (and most times not even here). I take in stride what I read. If I don't like it, I go read something else.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------

I sincerely feel that the facts are completely irrelevant in this case.

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I think we need a 'chat' forum. I think the intent of the 'general' forum was a catchall for stuff directly associated with geocaching that wasn't clearly under any of the other categories.

 

If we had a 'chat' page where people could post off-topic or stuff only remotely associated with geocaching, that would leave 'general' back to pure caching-relevant stuff. And maybe clear out all those 'testing' posts on the Newbie forum. Every now and then there's something good there, but in the interest of time I find myself avoiding that one more and more.

 

And did I miss something, this doesn't seem like a flame war 'out to get' umc. I think pipedreamer was expressing a valid concern regarding posting for the sake of posting. Some of umc's relevant posts are mostly just comments that don't add a new perspective or any real info, but some of us tend toward the 'yeah, me too' posts every now and then anyway. I try not to post unless I think what I have to say hasn't been said before (at least on the same thread) and contributes to the discussion.

 

I think in general umc is a bit overzealous about posting, and geocaching in general. I know that I was all gung-ho to go on day-long caching expeditions when I first started, but luckily I have Beersnob to drive some sence into me. When I did 3 in 1 day on top of work in Lansing recently, I discovered why I'm gald to have him to bring me back to earth! (legs hurt for DAYS!)

 

Maybe we should to add to the faq for newbies... relax, take it easy, you don't have to (and shouldn't!) dive in the deep end! Do 1 or 2 a weekend here and there, check out the good advice available on the boards.... ease yourself into the sport! Just like pro sports, it's better to plan and 'workout' before you play!

and I will admit, at only 15 finds, that I'm still pretty new, too.... Will add a few locationless to 'pad' that # a bit once I get the vacation photos scanned... icon_wink.gif And maybe I'll be able to bag a few more this weekend....

 

I walk the Maze of Moments, but everywhere I turn to, begins a new beginning, but never finds a finish..

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I think we need a 'chat' forum. I think the intent of the 'general' forum was a catchall for stuff directly associated with geocaching that wasn't clearly under any of the other categories.

 

If we had a 'chat' page where people could post off-topic or stuff only remotely associated with geocaching, that would leave 'general' back to pure caching-relevant stuff. And maybe clear out all those 'testing' posts on the Newbie forum. Every now and then there's something good there, but in the interest of time I find myself avoiding that one more and more.

 

And did I miss something, this doesn't seem like a flame war 'out to get' umc. I think pipedreamer was expressing a valid concern regarding posting for the sake of posting. Some of umc's relevant posts are mostly just comments that don't add a new perspective or any real info, but some of us tend toward the 'yeah, me too' posts every now and then anyway. I try not to post unless I think what I have to say hasn't been said before (at least on the same thread) and contributes to the discussion.

 

I think in general umc is a bit overzealous about posting, and geocaching in general. I know that I was all gung-ho to go on day-long caching expeditions when I first started, but luckily I have Beersnob to drive some sence into me. When I did 3 in 1 day on top of work in Lansing recently, I discovered why I'm gald to have him to bring me back to earth! (legs hurt for DAYS!)

 

Maybe we should to add to the faq for newbies... relax, take it easy, you don't have to (and shouldn't!) dive in the deep end! Do 1 or 2 a weekend here and there, check out the good advice available on the boards.... ease yourself into the sport! Just like pro sports, it's better to plan and 'workout' before you play!

and I will admit, at only 15 finds, that I'm still pretty new, too.... Will add a few locationless to 'pad' that # a bit once I get the vacation photos scanned... icon_wink.gif And maybe I'll be able to bag a few more this weekend....

 

I walk the Maze of Moments, but everywhere I turn to, begins a new beginning, but never finds a finish..

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Is it possible to limit the number of posts for non-paying members? Before the yelling starts from the non-paying members, let me finish. I am not talking any serious limit, but maybe 20 post per day for non members, unlimited for members. I have not had a problem with UMCs posts, but I don't know what the cost structure is for these forums. If excessive posting is costing Jeremy money, then these costs should be passed on to those who are over-using the forums.

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quote:
Originally posted by GoldKey:

Is it possible to limit the number of posts for non-paying members? Before the yelling starts from the non-paying members, let me finish. I am not talking any serious limit, but maybe 20 post per day for non members, unlimited for members. I have not had a problem with UMCs posts, but I don't know what the cost structure is for these forums. If excessive posting is costing Jeremy money, then these costs should be passed on to those who are over-using the forums.


 

Be careful what you wish for.. I'm in the process of becoming a full fleged (sp?) member as we speak (or type for that matter) Its just a matter of getting the paypal id number so that I can sign in here as a charter member.

 

Make note that the reason I am signing on is because I love this community and will support it in any way possible. Even if that means posting a bit less than I like. icon_wink.gif

 

At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off and as far as the newbie comment about taking it easy I know how to regulate without advice. To each is own and that should be that.

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quote:
Originally posted by GoldKey:

Is it possible to limit the number of posts for non-paying members? Before the yelling starts from the non-paying members, let me finish. I am not talking any serious limit, but maybe 20 post per day for non members, unlimited for members. I have not had a problem with UMCs posts, but I don't know what the cost structure is for these forums. If excessive posting is costing Jeremy money, then these costs should be passed on to those who are over-using the forums.


 

Be careful what you wish for.. I'm in the process of becoming a full fleged (sp?) member as we speak (or type for that matter) Its just a matter of getting the paypal id number so that I can sign in here as a charter member.

 

Make note that the reason I am signing on is because I love this community and will support it in any way possible. Even if that means posting a bit less than I like. icon_wink.gif

 

At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off and as far as the newbie comment about taking it easy I know how to regulate without advice. To each is own and that should be that.

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I am, like UMC, new to Geocaching. This is what I see. A newbie that is excited as a kid in a candy store. Anxious to talk to anyone who will listen to his chatter. I personally know this feeling and I don't see it as a big problem. Once the new wears off, I believe UMC will be a valuable contributor to this sport. This is my personal opinion. Pipedreamer has some legitimacy to his complaint, but maybe understanding is the rule of the day. Yes some of the posts may seem inane but remember, we have all been considered an annoyance to someone at some time in our lives. UMC has been informed of this and I personally am satisified at this point with open & free speech and self policing on this forum. More rules imply more beauracracy and ultimately a loss of some personal freedom. Let this thing run it's course and see what happens. Remember, if it is offensive to you the delete key is your best defense.

 

Lane Smith

 

Be verry verry quiet we're hunting caches

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quote:
Originally posted by cachercarry:

I am, like UMC, new to Geocaching. This is what I see. A newbie that is excited as a kid in a candy store. Anxious to talk to anyone who will listen to his chatter. I personally know this feeling and I don't see it as a big problem. Once the new wears off I believe UMC will be a valuable contributor to this sport. This is my personal opinion. Pipedreamer has some legitimacy to his complaint but maybe understanding is the rule of the day. Yes some of the posts may seem inane but remember. we have all been considered an annoyance to someone at some time in our lives. UMC has been informed of this and I personally am satisified at this point with free speech and self policing on this forum. More rules imply more beauracracy and ultimately a loss of some personal freedom. Let this thing run it's course and see what happens.

 

Lane Smith

 

Be verry verry quiet we're hunting caches


 

Wow Lane,

 

Thank you very much. I think you hit the nail on the head quite well. I couldn't be more excited about GeoCaching as a whole and the thing is that nobody around me gives two poops about it so I feel very fortunate to have a whole community to chat with about a passion of ours.

 

One thing I do is look for those threads which have a big fat goose egg by them and see if I can lend a hand or not. I think thats what its all about. If I can't help I will say so but at least try and point someone in the right direction. When I'm not doing that I am trying to have fun perfecting my typing skills. icon_wink.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by cachercarry:

I am, like UMC, new to Geocaching. This is what I see. A newbie that is excited as a kid in a candy store. Anxious to talk to anyone who will listen to his chatter. I personally know this feeling and I don't see it as a big problem. Once the new wears off I believe UMC will be a valuable contributor to this sport. This is my personal opinion. Pipedreamer has some legitimacy to his complaint but maybe understanding is the rule of the day. Yes some of the posts may seem inane but remember. we have all been considered an annoyance to someone at some time in our lives. UMC has been informed of this and I personally am satisified at this point with free speech and self policing on this forum. More rules imply more beauracracy and ultimately a loss of some personal freedom. Let this thing run it's course and see what happens.

 

Lane Smith

 

Be verry verry quiet we're hunting caches


 

Wow Lane,

 

Thank you very much. I think you hit the nail on the head quite well. I couldn't be more excited about GeoCaching as a whole and the thing is that nobody around me gives two poops about it so I feel very fortunate to have a whole community to chat with about a passion of ours.

 

One thing I do is look for those threads which have a big fat goose egg by them and see if I can lend a hand or not. I think thats what its all about. If I can't help I will say so but at least try and point someone in the right direction. When I'm not doing that I am trying to have fun perfecting my typing skills. icon_wink.gif

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quote:
Anyway, I think we all know full WELL who has the most posts. wink

 

I take that personally! Well with 700 plus posts I'm getting there icon_wink.gif

 

Hey, who the F cares how many posts someone has. If you have something to contribute, then go ahead. If somebody doesn't want to read a post, there is something called a scroll bar.

 

For those of you who want a killfile option, it's on the right hand side of your screen. If you see a post that you don't want to bother with, simply left click on your mouse, hold the button down and move the mouse towards you. You'll then see the next post in the thread.

 

As far as umc is concerned, most of his posts have been on topic, so what the heck is the problem? Get a freakin' life man!

 

"Life is a daring adventure, or it is nothing" - Helen Keller

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quote:
Anyway, I think we all know full WELL who has the most posts. wink

 

I take that personally! Well with 700 plus posts I'm getting there icon_wink.gif

 

Hey, who the F cares how many posts someone has. If you have something to contribute, then go ahead. If somebody doesn't want to read a post, there is something called a scroll bar.

 

For those of you who want a killfile option, it's on the right hand side of your screen. If you see a post that you don't want to bother with, simply left click on your mouse, hold the button down and move the mouse towards you. You'll then see the next post in the thread.

 

As far as umc is concerned, most of his posts have been on topic, so what the heck is the problem? Get a freakin' life man!

 

"Life is a daring adventure, or it is nothing" - Helen Keller

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Hmm, a chatroom might be nice but I could imagine some folks that might never leave the chatroom! Maybe that's why the official chat is only once a week icon_smile.gif

 

Anyway, I'm not sure the board should impose any limits on the number of posts, I think if there's a problem, then we should be able to fix it ourselves.

 

Has anyone tried asking UMC nicely to just tone it down a bit, perhaps collect his thoughts over the day and then make one or two long posts instead of a handful of short ones? After all, like the saying goes...you can catch more flies with a flyswatter dipped in honey than in vinegar... or something like that icon_smile.gif

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Hmm, a chatroom might be nice but I could imagine some folks that might never leave the chatroom! Maybe that's why the official chat is only once a week icon_smile.gif

 

Anyway, I'm not sure the board should impose any limits on the number of posts, I think if there's a problem, then we should be able to fix it ourselves.

 

Has anyone tried asking UMC nicely to just tone it down a bit, perhaps collect his thoughts over the day and then make one or two long posts instead of a handful of short ones? After all, like the saying goes...you can catch more flies with a flyswatter dipped in honey than in vinegar... or something like that icon_smile.gif

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I think thats where my beef started, nobody asked to tone it down, I was just blind sided by name calling.

 

I will tone it down a bit, no problem with that. icon_smile.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

Whatever makes the community happy is what I say. icon_biggrin.gif

 

The reason for that saying is because I want to be a part of it for as long as I can.

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________

The 'idiot' who should be banned because he likes to spend all day annoying people while drinking beer.

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I think thats where my beef started, nobody asked to tone it down, I was just blind sided by name calling.

 

I will tone it down a bit, no problem with that. icon_smile.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

Whatever makes the community happy is what I say. icon_biggrin.gif

 

The reason for that saying is because I want to be a part of it for as long as I can.

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________

The 'idiot' who should be banned because he likes to spend all day annoying people while drinking beer.

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I've been watching this thread all day and refraining comment. I happen to enjoy UMC's posts most times. He can get off topic but the goodly share of his posts are well within the topic of the tread. And I'll admit some times he can be annoying. Its the nature of the beast. most of the regular forum users can get way off topic at times including myself. There is a circle of users that add a litle levity to the forums as well. This levity can make the forums much easier and more enjoyable. I'm not goign to mention any names because no one needs to be flamed.

 

This matter is in Jeremy's hands now and I'm sure he is going to do what he can to help everyone and he will probably soon have some sort of resolution. (The guy is really on the ball.)

I intend to wait and see what comes of this but I'm sure what ever it is will be fair.

 

PS: OT- brdad that new avatar is really disturbing!!! lol icon_eek.gif

 

Eeyore

 

It took a GPS to get me away from technology.

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I've been watching this thread all day and refraining comment. I happen to enjoy UMC's posts most times. He can get off topic but the goodly share of his posts are well within the topic of the tread. And I'll admit some times he can be annoying. Its the nature of the beast. most of the regular forum users can get way off topic at times including myself. There is a circle of users that add a litle levity to the forums as well. This levity can make the forums much easier and more enjoyable. I'm not goign to mention any names because no one needs to be flamed.

 

This matter is in Jeremy's hands now and I'm sure he is going to do what he can to help everyone and he will probably soon have some sort of resolution. (The guy is really on the ball.)

I intend to wait and see what comes of this but I'm sure what ever it is will be fair.

 

PS: OT- brdad that new avatar is really disturbing!!! lol icon_eek.gif

 

Eeyore

 

It took a GPS to get me away from technology.

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I do not care about the little "war" going on here. What I DO care about is language like this...

 

At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off and as far as the newbie comment about taking it easy I know how to regulate without advice.

 

I was at 294 posts or something when I started the thread about going for three. I wanted to hit the 300 mark. Not in one night but total.

 

Geeez

 

But sorry crackpipe keep whining.

 

 

Now, there are cachers out here that are under 18 years of age or YOUNGER. And I do not think that their parents would want them reading things of this sort. NOR would I think Jeremy would want a flood of mail comming to his box about "colorfull" language in a place that is to be FAMILY ORIENTED (sp).

 

And for the "CRACKPIPE" comment, it just shows that the person who wrote this has NO respect for others or wants to deal with issues on a serious note......

 

"My gps say's it RIGHT HERE".

http://www.geogadgets.com

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quote:
Originally posted by Eeyore/Shadow:

 

I've been watching this thread all day and refraining comment. I happen to enjoy UMC's posts most times. He can get off topic but the goodly share of his posts are well within the topic of the tread.

 

PS: OT- brdad that new avatar is really disturbing!!! lol icon_eek.gif

 

Eeyore

 

It took a GPS to get me away from technology.


 

UMC does have some valid ppoint at times, and at others we ALL post one liners. No one is at fault.

 

That avatar IS a little different......

 

"My gps say's it RIGHT HERE".

http://www.geogadgets.com

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Eeyore/Shadow:

 

I've been watching this thread all day and refraining comment. I happen to enjoy UMC's posts most times. He can get off topic but the goodly share of his posts are well within the topic of the tread.

 

PS: OT- brdad that new avatar is really disturbing!!! lol icon_eek.gif

 

Eeyore

 

It took a GPS to get me away from technology.


 

UMC does have some valid ppoint at times, and at others we ALL post one liners. No one is at fault.

 

That avatar IS a little different......

 

"My gps say's it RIGHT HERE".

http://www.geogadgets.com

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quote:
Originally posted by Steak N Eggs:

Now, there are cachers out here that are under 18 years of age or YOUNGER. And I do not think that their parents would want them reading things of this sort. NOR would I think Jeremy would want a flood of mail comming to his box about "colorfull" language in a place that is to be FAMILY ORIENTED (sp).


Let's hope that parents are monitoring their kids online habits. While I'd like to think of this place as family oriented, the fact is that Jeremy has no clue as to who is logging into his site, with the possible exception of paying members and personal friends. Like any other internet site, kids should use caution.

quote:

"My gps say's it RIGHT HERE".

http://www.geogadgets.com


Your URL say it's not.

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quote:
Originally posted by Steak N Eggs:

I do not care about the little "war" going on here. What I DO care about is language like this...

 

"At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off... [snip] But sorry crackpipe keep whining."

 

And for the "CRACKPIPE" comment, it just shows that the person who wrote this has NO respect for others or wants to deal with issues on a serious note......


Well, normally the filters will catch potty mouth and edit it accordingly. Apparently the word "piss" wasn't bad enough to make the cut. But, ya know - if that is the dirtiest word your kids have seen, you are still ahead of the game. Kids are rotten these days, ya know. icon_wink.gif And, the "crackpipe" comment is understandable to me...

 

If someone came in here with only a handful of posts themselves, and started demanding that I be banned from posting here - I'd probably take a shot at them, and with that other person's name being "pipedreams" or whatever - it is easy to make the transition to crackpipe. icon_smile.gif Why SHOULD umc respect someone who is demanding his removal? The guy didn't even bother to read his posts - he just decided that they were all worthless. And as for "serious issues" - well, you might not enjoy hanging around the forum if you are only interested in serious issues.

 

toe.gif

Click the Toe...  and please stop confusing your opinion with fact, ok?
Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Steak N Eggs:

I do not care about the little "war" going on here. What I DO care about is language like this...

 

"At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off... [snip] But sorry crackpipe keep whining."

 

And for the "CRACKPIPE" comment, it just shows that the person who wrote this has NO respect for others or wants to deal with issues on a serious note......


Well, normally the filters will catch potty mouth and edit it accordingly. Apparently the word "piss" wasn't bad enough to make the cut. But, ya know - if that is the dirtiest word your kids have seen, you are still ahead of the game. Kids are rotten these days, ya know. icon_wink.gif And, the "crackpipe" comment is understandable to me...

 

If someone came in here with only a handful of posts themselves, and started demanding that I be banned from posting here - I'd probably take a shot at them, and with that other person's name being "pipedreams" or whatever - it is easy to make the transition to crackpipe. icon_smile.gif Why SHOULD umc respect someone who is demanding his removal? The guy didn't even bother to read his posts - he just decided that they were all worthless. And as for "serious issues" - well, you might not enjoy hanging around the forum if you are only interested in serious issues.

 

toe.gif

Click the Toe...  and please stop confusing your opinion with fact, ok?
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Steak N Eggs,

 

I hear where you are coming from and if you check out the bottom of this thread you will see that I contained myself quite well even while being called sorts of names. When this thread came about I lost a bit of my control but gained it back at some point I think. I understand there are younger of us here and that is why I kept things as nice as I did but we all know that even the dullest of 11 year olds can be more vulgar than most of us. As far as the crackpipe thing and working things out it became quite apparent to me that there would be no working things out when Pipedreamer attacked me right from the get with no other reason than I post too much for his liking.

 

Like I said earlier I have never flamed anyone or said bad words toward them until today and I hope that is the end of it because this is not a community I want to be forced to leave because of one persons actions and anger.

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________

The 'idiot' who should be banned because he likes to spend all day annoying people while drinking beer.

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by umc:

quote:
Originally posted by GoldKey:

Is it possible to limit the number of posts for non-paying members? Before the yelling starts from the non-paying members, let me finish. I am not talking any serious limit, but maybe 20 post per day for non members, unlimited for members. I have not had a problem with UMCs posts, but I don't know what the cost structure is for these forums. If excessive posting is costing Jeremy money, then these costs should be passed on to those who are over-using the forums.


 

Be careful what you wish for.. I'm in the process of becoming a full fleged (sp?) member as we speak (or type for that matter) Its just a matter of getting the paypal id number so that I can sign in here as a charter member.

 

Make note that the reason I am signing on is because I love this community and will support it in any way possible. Even if that means posting a bit less than I like. icon_wink.gif

 

At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off and as far as the newbie comment about taking it easy I know how to regulate without advice. To each is own and that should be that.


 

I stand by my wish icon_biggrin.gif . I am glad you decided to become a charter member. You don't need paypal to join, you can just mail a check, so if getting a paypal account is a problem, you could just mail in a check. As I said in my original message, I have no problem with your posts. Some of them, I think icon_wink.gif , were even on topic. While I think that it is great the geocaching can be enjoyed free of charge, if you are heavily using the resources of the site, you should chip in to pay the bills. As I said, I don't know the cost structure, your 300 + posts probably did not cost much if anything to the site, but if it did, it would be fair to place reasonable limits on the use of that resource.

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by umc:

quote:
Originally posted by GoldKey:

Is it possible to limit the number of posts for non-paying members? Before the yelling starts from the non-paying members, let me finish. I am not talking any serious limit, but maybe 20 post per day for non members, unlimited for members. I have not had a problem with UMCs posts, but I don't know what the cost structure is for these forums. If excessive posting is costing Jeremy money, then these costs should be passed on to those who are over-using the forums.


 

Be careful what you wish for.. I'm in the process of becoming a full fleged (sp?) member as we speak (or type for that matter) Its just a matter of getting the paypal id number so that I can sign in here as a charter member.

 

Make note that the reason I am signing on is because I love this community and will support it in any way possible. Even if that means posting a bit less than I like. icon_wink.gif

 

At anyrate I'm not here to piss people off and as far as the newbie comment about taking it easy I know how to regulate without advice. To each is own and that should be that.


 

I stand by my wish icon_biggrin.gif . I am glad you decided to become a charter member. You don't need paypal to join, you can just mail a check, so if getting a paypal account is a problem, you could just mail in a check. As I said in my original message, I have no problem with your posts. Some of them, I think icon_wink.gif , were even on topic. While I think that it is great the geocaching can be enjoyed free of charge, if you are heavily using the resources of the site, you should chip in to pay the bills. As I said, I don't know the cost structure, your 300 + posts probably did not cost much if anything to the site, but if it did, it would be fair to place reasonable limits on the use of that resource.

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I agree Goldkey and not that this makes any difference but I also contributed by picking up a couple GeoCaching Log books, an eight pack of travel bugs, and a geocaching T shirt and I wanted to get some Official Geocache stickers but as I'm sure you know they are out until the 15th of October.

 

So, to summarize, I have no problem contributing to the community via hard cold cache, putting nice trade items in the caches, my soon to be placed 'best cache of all time' and ofcourse all of my wonderful advice here in the forums. icon_wink.gif

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________

The 'idiot' who should be banned because he likes to spend all day annoying people while drinking beer.

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