YUCK -- Disgusting, Ghastly and Frightening

1.4k · June 1, 2003

Recently in our area, we had a cache that was placed in an area that is frequented by, um, well, let's say, er, it wasn't Adam and Eve sharing a private personal moment, if you know what I mean.

I have read a couple threads in the past about these so called 'pick up' spots but yesterday I had the foul experience of personally interupting and witnessing one of these encounters -- needless to say, I was very thankful that I didn't have any of my kids with me.

I contacted the cache owner and he immediately archived the cache and apologized for the ordeal.

It certainly wasn't the fault of the cache owner -- I know this fellow and am 100% convinced that he wouldn't put a cache in such a spot if he knew that this sort of thing was going on there.

My questions are:

1. Have you run into anything like this, or an area where it is obviously a sicko hangout?

2. Do you think the local authorities should be notified?

3. Should we mark these spots so that others in the future do not put caches there?

*****

June 1, 2003

Finding amourous couples isn't that bad, it could be worse...

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=67199

and

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=50093

Mickey

Max Entropy

More than just a name, a lifestyle.

1.4k · June 1, 2003

quote:
MaxEntropy wrote:
Finding amourous couples isn't that bad, it could be worse...

Well they weren't dead bodies but they were of the same gender -- and in the throws of passion (if that's what you'd call it). I think I would have rather found a dead body.

*****

24.7k · June 1, 2003

I'd leave the cache there and just post a note to be real loud as you crash around. No reason why a perfectly good caching locatino should be ruined by one particular fetish. Actually it would be a shame not to make the area a little more family friendly by re-claiming a public area and sending the people practicing their particular vice into the privacy of their own home.

=====================

Wherever you go there you are.

June 1, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
1. Have you run into anything like this, or an area where it is obviously a sicko hangout?

Yes I have. Was almost approached myself.

quote:
2. Do you think the local authorities should be notified?

I would expect that they already know but even if they are aware, you should contact them. There was a sweepm the previous summer at the park I went to. Things quieted down, police presence became more sparse, and summer 2002 it began again. People complainers, police conducted more sweeps. TELL THEM

quote:
3. Should we mark these spots so that others in the future do not put caches there?

Good idea except for three problems: how do you "mark" them? A forum thread will eventualyl get pushed down out of site. two: things may change and remain changed. How would you unmark it? three: I've seen this type of thread before & (sadly) it usually degenerates into gay-bashing which isn't the point. Going so far as to "mark" it would likely draw out both sides in that "discussion" and it likely wouldn't be pretty.

The cache owner in my case didnt seem overly concerned. My log eventually fell out of sight, and recently there haven't been too many problems. Lately.

Like the tides, these problems occur & receed, occur & receed, so more then likely it will go away. Most of the time they occur in summer because A) it's too cold to do much in winter, and there's little cover for such activity when the trees are bare.

*****

william

I am not smart enough or witty enough to think of anything worthy of a sig line. As a result I've never had a sig, never will.

1.6k · June 1, 2003

Yeah, it was a 'mediocre' REST STOP cache that I placed in a total of 5 minutes; thought I should place one there before someone else did.

Unfortunately, the cache seekers had more time to look around the area while trying to acquire a signal, and one even decided to go night caching with his BFL. (Thankfully it was NOT a DBBFL, though it may have made for a good weapon...)

Ironic that this lame cache was even more lame than I expected it to be. At least we know now to avoid putting caches there, or at other Rest Areas nearby, which according to a trucker I know, are all known to be 'Pickle Parks'.

I appreciated various cachers concerns, and archived the cache immediately, and removed it today. It will get recycled elsewhere.

My $0.02 is that we need to be responsible for our areas, and if a cachers know something another cacher may not, bring it to their attention in private e-mail and hopefully people do the right thing. In this instance, it appears to have worked.

canadazuuk

2.5k · June 1, 2003

There are four caches near Beverly Lake in Illinois, all accessed from the same parking area. One of these caches is the oldest in Illinois. It may not have been a cruising zone back then, but I guess it is now. Funny how it doesn't get shut down with all of the prostitution going on. The logs on this cache have lots of mentions about the activities in the parking lot.

1.6k · June 1, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by cachew nut:
There are four caches near Beverly Lake in Illinois, all accessed from the same parking area. One of these caches is the oldest in Illinois. It may not have been a cruising zone back then, but I guess it is now. Funny how it doesn't get shut down with all of the prostitution going on. The logs on http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=47011 have lots of mentions about the activities in the parking lot.

Ironic cache title you provided a link to. Or was that a Freudian Slip?

Whatever the case, the immediacy of my decsion to archive the cache was based on the quantity of cachers who have children going caching with them. Gay, not gay, whatever, it doesn't belong in a public park, and it isn't something I would willingly risk letting children see. By leaving the cache there, I would have to have a seared conscience.

So it is removed.

canadazuuk

1.4k · June 1, 2003

quote:
canadazuuk wrote:
My $0.02 is that we need to be responsible for our areas, and if a cachers know something another cacher may not, bring it to their attention in private e-mail and hopefully people do the right thing. In this instance, it appears to have worked.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Thank you Zuuk for taking such quick action.

quote:
Gwho wrote:
Good idea except for three problems: how do you "mark" them? A forum thread will eventualyl get pushed down out of site. two: things may change and remain changed. How would you unmark it? three: I've seen this type of thread before & (sadly) it usually degenerates into gay-bashing which isn't the point. Going so far as to "mark" it would likely draw out both sides in that "discussion" and it likely wouldn't be pretty.

This has nothing to do with gay bashing. It's got to do with exposing cachers and their kids to something that quite frankly shouldn't be happening in a public place.

I have a 6 year old, a 9 year old, and an 11 year old -- sometimes they come night caching with me -- I certainly don't want them to be exposed to this sort of lewd behaviour. The question needs to be asked; Would you want your own children to be exposed to this?

I think we can mark these known locations. Perhaps local approvers can take note of the locations and flag them for the future. If a cache is placed at that location maybe they could contact the cache placer and advise them that the area has been know in the past for being used for lurid practices. Perhaps the cache placer could take another look -- maybe the area has been cleaned up, maybe not. Either way, it is the responsible thing to do.

*****

June 1, 2003

Hey everybody it's me GeoChamp,

Leave it to me I'll see to it the problem is solved. I'll call my old buddy Puckerup from Roto Rooter he's used to dealing with dirty a%#holes. In my opinion this sort of disgusting activity should be left for the bedroom not in the public eye. I would definately inform the authorities it sure doesn't do much for tourism especially coming into peak tourist season.

GeoChamp!

June 2, 2003

Not quite the same thing, but...

I did my first cache on Saturday. As it turns out, my initial search area was about 40 feet away from the cache site. I found a good half-dozen condom wrappers.

The area was overrun with bugs and the spot was a little rocky. All I could think of was OUCH!

** The Cacher foremerly known as "Scott / WA4SE." Thanks, Caching In for the inadvertent inspiration!!

June 2, 2003

There are a few caches posted near my home which border a known "crusing area". Needless to say, I will probably never hunt them and I feel it is a shame. I have hiked sections of the Blue Hills Reservation since I was a kid, and know which areas to avoid since it is in "my own back yard", but take me to another area, and I could just as easily stumble upon the same situation.

Here in the liberal Commonwealth of Massachusetts, the State police were taken to task for arresting people for lewd and lacivous conduct in rest areas and known crusing hang outs. It was said it was discrimination. What about my rights to not have to view that type of behavior? What about the innocent people who stopped to enjoy a view, hike the woods, find a cache or use a rest area? Just take it behind closed doors so that the public dosen't have to view it.

When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading.

Henny Youngman (1906 - 1998)

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
This has nothing to do with gay bashing. It's got to do with exposing cachers and their kids to something that quite frankly shouldn't be happening in a public place.

Oh I agree 100% (I wouldn't want my son to see a hetro couple doing it any more then a gay couple cause he's 4 and doesn'ty need to know about that yet) but unfortunately for some people that's exactly what it's all about, and this type of thread draws that crowd out. On the positive side, the bashers are out of their closet & we know what they really are like.

william

I am not smart enough or witty enough to think of anything worthy of a sig line. As a result I've never had a sig, never will.

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
This has nothing to do with gay bashing.

You may not be guilty of “Gay Bashing”, but from your first two posts on this thread it certainly seems to me that your attitude towards the incident would have been significantly different if it were a man and woman that you came across in the “throws of passion”. I doubt that you would have described their albeit inappropriate behavior as “disgusting, ghastly and frightening”

You make it clear that it would not have bothered you as much if it were “Adam and Eve” having a personal moment.

If it were Adam and Eve, instead of Adam and Steve, I really don’t think you would have declared “I think I would have rather found a dead body.” (By the way, I found that statement quite disturbing)

Making out in a public place, particularly one that is accessible to children is not appropriate civil behavior and I concur with your concern. However, I believe that your description of the event (the only real specifics you gave were that the persons were of the same gender), and your reaction to it, was strongly influenced by the fact that you are homophobic. I do not intend to be judgmental when I say that - I am somewhat homophobic myself -my gut reaction to coming across two men making out in the woods would, unfortunately, be more negative than if the two were a man and woman. However, on a higher intellectual level, taking into account today’s realities, I have come to believe that such prejudice is not a good thing, and I need to deal with that. I cannot deal with my prejudices until I recognize and acknowledge them. I suggest you consider doing the same.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

[This message was edited by seneca on June 02, 2003 at 08:41 AM.]

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:

If it were Adam and Eve, instead of Adam and Adam...

Actually, God really did create Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve.

This thread is going so waaaaay off topic, yet everybody has their biases, so what can you expect... except to not have things like this happen in a public place, or to be brought to them unknowingly... These things are contrary to the laws of even this very liberal and degenerating land.

canadazuuk

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:

If it were Adam and Eve, instead of Adam and Adam...

Actually, God really did create Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve.

Correction has been made. Thanks for pointing out my incorrect idiom.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

June 2, 2003

quote:
and in the throws of passion (if that's what you'd call it).

Actually, it's "throes."

What appears to be coming at you is coming from you.

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Seneca wrote:
You may not be guilty of “Gay Bashing”, but from your first two posts on this thread it certainly seems to me that your attitude towards the incident would have been significantly different if it were a man and woman that you came across in the “throws of passion”. I doubt that you would have described their albeit inappropriate behavior as “disgusting, ghastly and frightening”

You make it clear that it would not have bothered you as much if it were “Adam and Eve” having a personal moment.

Made it clear that it bothered me? I guess so. I made it clear that it was inapporopriate for that sort of behaviour in a public place.

quote:
If it were Adam and Eve, instead of Adam and Steve, I really don’t think you would have declared “I think I would have rather found a dead body.” (By the way, I found that statement quite disturbing)

If you found that disturbing then by the same token you need to accept that I find two guys engaging in anal sex in a public place disturbing.

quote:
Making out in a public place, particularly one that is accessible to children is not appropriate civil behavior and I concur with your concern. However, I believe that your description of the event (the only real specifics you gave were that the persons were of the same gender), and your reaction to it, was strongly influenced by the fact that you are homophobic.

Homophobic? -- call it what you like.

I get fed up with statements like this. Who are you to tell me or to label me for thinking a certain way? Get real man. We've become a society that is becoming tolerant of everything because a few people start making labels for those who don't agree with their intrusive and bothersome behaviour. That's crap. Society is becoming far too tolerant of these sorts of things. There has to come a time when we say "enough is enough" and why should I be made to feel that my opinions are wrong because you and a few others say so?

The issue here is that the location is used for sex. And there are those with children (and I'm sure that there are many without children) that don't condone such public displays. And yes, it would make a difference to me if it was hetrosexual activities going on here -- but I still wouldn't think that it was right. It's a public place and therefore it is wrong. That it was two men, does make it a more repulsive display in my books.

quote:
However, on a higher intellectual level, taking into account today’s realities, I have come to believe that such prejudice is not a good thing, and I need to deal with that. I cannot deal with my prejudices until I recognize and acknowledge them. I suggest you consider doing the same.

Just because you've been sucked into believing all that crap doesn't mean that others should. If you can't deal with your prejudices honestly then that's your problem. I'm fine with mine and I don't need you telling me otherwise. As I've mentioned, we have become far too tolerant of this type of behaviour. Man or woman, it's wrong in a public place -- especially one that is only 100 meters from a rest area parking lot.

Let me remind you that the issue here is not about gay bashing -- you've turned it into that. The issues in this discussion are the three questions that I presented in my first post.

*****

2.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by enfanta:

quote:
and in the throws of passion (if that's what you'd call it).

Actually, it's "throes."

What appears to be coming at you is coming from you.

Well, doesn't that depend... maybe it was like midget tossing.

george

Wanna go for a ride?

4.1k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:
I'd leave the cache there and just post a note to be real loud as you crash around. No reason why a perfectly good caching locatino should be ruined by one particular fetish. Actually it would be a shame not to make the area a little more family friendly by re-claiming a public area and sending the people practicing their particular vice into the privacy of their own home.

I think this idea has some merit. The more families visit the area, the less attractive this area becomes for those looking to pick-up.

-- I recognize fun when I see it.

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:
maybe it was like midget tossing.

george

Yor pashonit

No, yor pashonit, the likker shtor is the udder waay

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
Let me remind you that __the issue here is not about gay bashing.. *****

I accept that. But in order to make complete sense of your comments and concerns regarding the issue you have raised, it is important (and fair) to try to understand your prejudices. In my opinion, probing and poking at participants prejudices is valid forum discussion. (I do admit though that it really pushes buttons sometimes, as I apparently have). It has however resulted in you being somewhat more candid in your last post.

There have been past forum threads about geocachers coming across heterosexuals "making out" - the general tenor of those threads has been of titilating humor and uncomfortable embarrassment - not fear and revulsion. You we're obviously very afraid of and completely revulsed by what you saw. Maybe "homophobic" was not the perfect word to use, but it somehow just seemed appropriate.

(Jomarac5, does this mean that I too am now off the "invitee list" of your proposed Geocaching Event )

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.6k · June 2, 2003

Honest ok? How many folks are shadowing posts by specific users? I ended up on the same page as G+M a few minutes ago, and we said the same dadgum thing!!!

2.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:
You may not be guilty of “Gay Bashing”, but from your first two posts on this thread it certainly seems to me that your attitude towards the incident would have been significantly different if it were a man and woman that you came across in the “throws of passion”. I doubt that you would have described their albeit inappropriate behavior as “disgusting, ghastly and frightening”

It it ghastly and freightening. Crusing spots are ghastly and freightening, gay men gather to meet other gay men for annoymous sex. There is a difference between a couple diving into the bushes for a quickly and strangers gathering for bush buggering. And this is generally gay male behavior and it ruins parks.

I don't think I've heard of a public park anywhere where heterosexuals gather for annoymous sex. That's kept in the singles bars and cheap hotels where you're not going to come hiking along and stumble across it.

The crusing park activity is at such a base level that the people involved are not invested enough as to get a room. It's like two dogs going at it, they don't care who stumbles across them. That's what makes it ghastly and frightening, it's a sub level of human activity that deserves to be shuned.

george

Wanna go for a ride?

1.6k · June 2, 2003

amen

and I am sorry that my cache was responsible for this round of discussion, but someone was bound to place one there anyway...

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:
Jomarac5, does this mean that I too am now off the "invitee list" of your proposed Geocaching Event

YEAH SENECA, YOU SURE BLEW IT!!

Now we have to put up with G+M!!!

And I am going to remain on the fence as per usual, just observing the event, and the nearest escape route at 99 degrees magnetic

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:
It it ghastly and freightening. Crusing spots are ghastly and freightening, gay men gather to meet other gay men for annoymous sex. There is a difference between a couple diving into the bushes for a quickly and strangers gathering for bush buggering.

Has Jomarac5 been providing you with details that he hasn't posted here? From his description in this thread it may well have been just "a couple diving into the bushes for a quicky"

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:
Has Jomarac5 been providing you with details that he hasn't posted here?

I have had the most correspondance regarding the cache, and it seems warranted to not post anything more than what you can read on the now archived cache page...

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:

It it ghastly and freightening. Crusing spots are ghastly and freightening, gay men gather to meet other gay men for annoymous sex.

We had a park in south Omaha that was overrun like that. The thing is that this was the closest park for a working class neighborhood full of families who don't have alot. Their kids couldn't go to the park due to the used condoms and dirty underwear that were all over the playground, but they couldn't do much else because their families couldn't afford any alternative activities. Add the worry about people who do that also being possible child molesters and you really have a problem. Of course both groups of sickos get political cover from the gay rights establishment. Since the kids don't vote, and don't belong to a "special group", they don't count. Guess who lost on that one.

As for the idea that we should leave the caches in place, its got a lot of merit.

Perhaps though we should go further, and make publicizing the caches and triggering a mass visit to the cache by local cachers?

If we could develop some means of alerting our fellow local cachers to an infested cache, then over the next 3-6 weeks, concerted efforts could be made to find the cache any day of the week, at any time of the day. Armed with digital cameras (to photo license plates of vehicles) and cell phones (to call 911), we could take back a lot of park land.

Hard for them to argue that they weren't there when they have a photo of them, their car, and a GPS unit with the precise time/date/and location of the event staring back at them in court.

As long as these sick individuals can hide behind the banner of gay rights, and those of us who are sick of this type of behavior ruining parks for other uses are automatically defending ourselves against charges of gay-bashing, then more and more of our parks will be ruined.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nebraskache/

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Seneca wrote:
I accept that. But in order to make complete sense of your comments and concerns regarding the issue you have raised, it is important (and fair) to try to understand your prejudices.

Bull. My prejeducies and opinions have nothing to with what I witnessed, only with the way that I perceived them. And that is not the issue here.

quote:
In my opinion, probing and poking at participants prejudices is valid forum discussion. (I do admit though that it really pushes buttons sometimes, as I apparently have). It has however resulted in you being somewhat more candid in your last post.

Pushed my buttons? I don't think so. It seems that you are looking only to engage in a confrontational argument instead of sticking to the 3 questions at hand and having a rational conversation about those points.

quote:
Seneca wrote:
There have been past forum threads about geocachers coming across heterosexuals "making out" - the general tenor of those threads has been of titilating humor and uncomfortable embarrassment - not fear and revulsion. You we're obviously very afraid of and completely revulsed by what you saw. Maybe "homophobic" was not the perfect word to use, but it somehow just seemed appropriate.

Afraid? I wasn't afraid. Far from it. At no time did I fear for my safety. And at no time did I feel that was in danger or that my morals were in question or threatened. Although I did find the actions frightening from a societal viewpoint. What I also find frightening is that people like yourself defend this type of behaviour.

The repulsive part of this incident is that this is obviously a 'hang out' for this behaviour. The point you are missing here is that this area is obviously not an area where this happens as a sometimes chance encounter. There were condoms and condom wrappers all over the place indicating that this area is used on a regular basis for this activity. There were at least 4 men that I saw milling around the parking lot as I left (apparently looking to 'score' -- although I have no way to substantiate this, it does seem reasonable considering what I witnessed).

Why are you so bent on making this a gay bashing issue? Seems like you are just trying to stir things up for some convoluted reason. As I've explained in my previous thread, the issues of this discussion are the 3 questions that I posed in my first thread.

If you come back again to question my values and morals I will ignore your posts, but I will gladly engage in a discussion with you about the three questions.

*****

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
georgeanmary wrote:
It it ghastly and freightening. Crusing spots are ghastly and freightening, gay men gather to meet other gay men for annoymous sex.

quote:
bigredmed wrote:
We had a park in south Omaha that was overrun like that....

Thank you to georgeandmary and bigredmed for your insightful comments. Obviously I am not the only one who recognizes this situation for what it is.

quote:
Seneca wrote:
Jomarac5, does this mean that I too am now off the "invitee list" of your proposed Geocaching Event

Seneca: you need to go and reread that other thread about inviting others to an event -- I never said that I had an event planned, but yes, you would certainly be welcomed if I were to host one.

*****

June 2, 2003

I can't believe it!

My girlfriend and I were looking for a cache and needless to say we gave up empty handed. hugging turned to kissing turned to full fledged lust right there on the trail. Then this couple with 17 grandkids walked by as if they lived back there. They all had GPS's and just stood there staring at us with jaws dropped. Some people just don't have the decency to leave others to their privacy! Geesh!

(JUST KIDDING! )

The Department of Redundancy Department

5.3k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
Should we mark these spots so that others in the future do not put caches there?

Too bad we don't have locationless caches anymore. Although I don't know if we should be posting the pictures...

"Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand."

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
What I also find frightening is that people like yourself defend this type of behaviour.

*****

I certainly do not defend the type of behaviour that is being described, and if you review my comments, you will note that I concurred with your opinion that the behaviour is inappropriate in a public place. Its just that from my perspective, it would be nowhere near as disturbing, alarming, frightening or tragic, as coming across “a dead body”.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.3k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:
Its just that from my perspective, it would be nowhere near as disturbing, alarming, frightening or tragic, as coming across “a dead body”.

Depends on who's body it is. I'd be thrilled to come across Osama's body. I could drag it to the nearest FBI field office and claim my reward.

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Bull Moose:
Depends on who's body it is. I'd be thrilled to come across Osama's body. I could drag it to the nearest FBI field office and claim my reward.

Alright, I will concede that much. I'd find that pretty satisfying as well.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Seneca wrote:
I certainly do not defend the type of behaviour that is being described...

Point taken. My apologies for the misunderstanding.

Continuing on...

I just returned from visiting the Langley RCMP Community Police office and was told that they are very much aware of the problem. The officer that I spoke with told me that it was the responsibility of the Highway Patrol and that I should take the matter up with them. As I was leaving, the officer said to me "it's just part of our west coast life style". I was shocked at his reply and told him so. It certainly isn't part of MY west coast lifestyle.

Next call was to the RCMP Highway Patrol. Much of the same -- they know that this is happening but it's not their problem -- I need to contact the Abbotsford Police as it is in their jurisdiction.

A call to the Abbotsford City Police confirmed that they are also aware of the problem. They then tried to pass me on to the parks board. I said that I didn't see where the parks board could do anything about it. I explained that this is a police problem and that there must be laws being broken here. She hummed and hawed about this and when I asked her if a man and a woman were having sex in a public place, would they be breaking any laws, she then agreed that it is a police matter.

She also acknowledged that these areas are known to produce more serious crimes and people are less likely to report crimes in these types of areas because they don't want to admit being there.

She continued to say that the police do patrol the area but they obviously can't be there 24 hours a day. I agreed with this and asked what else can be done -- it is a public place where visitors to our area stop for relaxation -- is this what we want visitors to be witnessing as they pass through our community? The answer she gave me was that the best thing to do is to inform others about this incident.

I told her that I would do that and while doing so, would also mention that the police know about the problem but have a very lackadaisical attitude about it. She didn't seem to like that very much.

Overall, I'm appalled at the attitude of the police. This is a pathetic problem and from what I experienced today, the police are doing next to nothing to remedy it.

This is indeed a serious problem and I'm not finished with it yet. There are other avenues that can be persued.

In the meanwhile, it is my opinion that these areas should be 'marked' and recognized as potentially unsafe areas by approvers.

*****

June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
I explained that this is a police problem and that there must be laws being broken here. She hummed and hawed about this and when I asked her if a man and a woman were having sex in a public place, would they be breaking any laws, she then agreed that it is a police matter.

*****

I would certainly complain about that! If the authorities are going to turn a blind eye to people making out at a public rest area, they should at least be giving equal rights to us heteros!

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Seneca wrote:
I would certainly complain about that! If the authorities are going to turn a blind eye to people making out at a public rest area, they should at least be giving equal rights to us heteros!

You need to drop this homosexual/hetrosexual thing. It's not the issue here.

I mentioned this aspect of it only because she wouldn't acknowledge that there is a crime being committed.

*****

June 2, 2003

Long thread.

I'm from a West Coast orientation-tolerant area, but I have to agree that that particular lifestyle expression is family incompatible for a public place: Somehow similar to why pedo is a no-no. It's inappropriate for kids to be exposed to this.

It also makes geocaching 2 stars more difficult, because muggles looking to do that activity have the eye out.

Frankly, geo-logs should warn others of those misadventures, and the sites possibly abandoned for family geocaching. Police already know of these locations; enforcement is likely a very low priority. And if there was a sweep, what if a geocacher got swept up, like Ben Stiller in Something About Mary?

Re the D.B. in the water, ick. I have the third cache in the area.

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
bthomas wrote:
Police already know of these locations; enforcement is likely a very low priority.

Unfortunately, this seems to be true. I was just a bit surprised to see something like this so close to my home -- naievety or whatever, I never would have thought this a problem in rural areas.

I'm wondering if the reason the police don't do anything about it is that if they do, they know the problem will only move to a new location -- I can see it being a difficult problem to completely eliminate.

quote:
Frankly, geo-logs should warn others of those misadventures, and the sites possibly abandoned for family geocaching.

I agree. But an area such as this one being discussed here, and having been identified, is definitely not an appropriate location for a cache as it is obviously well know to authorities. And now to us.

Thanks for your input.

*****

2.3k · June 2, 2003

Whether I agree or disagree (and geez, this thread is waaaaay off topic), I have to admit that "pickle park" is a pretty funny label for the location.

Joel (joefrog)

"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for ye are crunchy and taste good with ketchup!"

1.8k · June 2, 2003

This thread seems to be very one-sided with no one stepping up and taking the side of the supposed decency offenders, so lets ask Jack from "Will and Grace" what he thinks about the incident in question.

Geo: Jack how do you feel about the unappropriate behavior displayed in the park?

Jack: Jennifer Love Hewitt ... that is sooo wrong (where exactly is this park?)

Geo: you do not appear as if this activity bothers you very much...

Jack: oh, I'm bothered alright! I can't believe they didn't invite me.

GEO: don't you think such activity is looked down upon by society as a whole ...

Jack: hehehe, did you say hole?

GEO: well, it is clear you are not taking this topic very serious, surely you have a sense of decency?

Jack: don't call me surely...

GEO: what do you have to say to all the people who think this type of activity in the park is disturbing?

Jack: what's really disturbing is the color of that shirt you are wearing, does it come with a warning label?

GEO: Seriously, what is the best thing that has happened to you and your life style in the last ten years?

Jack: Well, thats a toss-up between the men's thong and Hillary making the Senate party. I love that women she ran our country with diginity for 8 years.

GEO: bye, Jack

Jack: bye, sweet cheeks.

"heck, that scares me and I'm fearless"

June 2, 2003

[realized my story was not really relevant]

[This message was edited by Sugar Kane on June 02, 2003 at 07:48 PM.]

1.6k · June 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:
My prejeducies and opinions have nothing to with what I witnessed, only with the way that I perceived them. And that is not the issue here.

The hammer hit the nail on the head here really really really big time.

Anything more well conceived than this response surely cannot exist.

I'm still under the impression I did the best possible thing by removing the cache, and thus the possibility of future incidents for geocachers and this site, but I'm not 100% sure it was the 'right' thing after reading some of the ideas presented.

canadazuuk

4.7k · June 2, 2003

aside from the gay bashing being debated, the issue really should be that people should not be unwillingly exposed to sexual behaviors.

i think it is unfair to categorize as "sick" behavior that falls very clearly on the spectrum of normal (and i mean normal in the strict sense, not the moral sense) activity. consenting adults apparently do this with some regularity.

i do not care to see it, regardless of the number or gender of the participants. if i happen upon it by accident, i go scrub my occipital lobe and move on. i do not waste my time being outraged.

it doesn't matter if you get to camp at one or at six. dinner is still at six.

1.4k · June 2, 2003

quote:
canadazuuk wrote:
I'm still under the impression I did the best possible thing by removing the cache, and thus the possibility of future incidents for geocachers and this site, but I'm not 100% sure it was the 'right' thing after reading some of the ideas presented.

I think you did do the best thing Zuuk. And after my conversations with 3 police departments today, it only confirms it. There is a well known problem at that area and it would be irresponsible to leave a cache there as the possibility of someone else having a similar encounter to what I experienced is fairly high in my estimation.

BTW: You mentioned in an earlier post that I was night caching -- this was not entirely so -- I was in the area at dusk, approximately 8:30PM to 9:00PM -- it was still daylight and I didn't have or need a flashlight.

*****

June 2, 2003

I think we should take the parks back from these cretins. I had a man hit on me during a cache hunt in a city park a few weeks ago. I just told him to get lost and he left the park.

June 2, 2003

I certainly would not want my children exposed to that indiscrete lewd behaviour, but on the other hand there is a part of me that is angered.

How many of our parks are we going to surrender to the druggies, violent gangs, prostitutes and other undesirables? Are we just going to keep on *****ing that the cops aren't doing their jobs and then turn our backs on these places? These parks belong to us, they are where we play. At what point will all these havens belong to low lifes.

I don't know what the solution is. I sure don't like the idea of restricting access to parks. Nor would I like to see an increased police presence. Perhaps if we went the other way and increased public exposure, that would push the scum out. Imagine if a bus load of BFL toting Geocachers showed up for a nocturnal event. That would sure mess up the freak show.

June 2, 2003

Hey! I've been censored. I used the dreaded B word.

YUCK -- Disgusting, Ghastly and Frightening

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