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Copies CD's/Software Etc...


Vertigo

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Take one or two. Everyone burns CDs these days, legal or not, whether you want to admit it or not. The person who left the CDs in the cache probably wants someone to take them, CD-ROMs don't like enclosed spaces icon_biggrin.gif Also, it costs almost nothing in cash value to burn one. React: Be Happy. Good Expensive software for free. For you. icon_cool.gif I'd do it too in one of the caches I made, but I'm afraid Jeremy will freak if he finds out. Meanwhile, don't worry about it. Someone wanted to make a a good cache and to make you happy. Do them a favor and be happy.

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Take one or two. Everyone burns CDs these days, legal or not, whether you want to admit it or not. The person who left the CDs in the cache probably wants someone to take them, CD-ROMs don't like enclosed spaces icon_biggrin.gif Also, it costs almost nothing in cash value to burn one. React: Be Happy. Good Expensive software for free. For you. icon_cool.gif I'd do it too in one of the caches I made, but I'm afraid Jeremy will freak if he finds out. Meanwhile, don't worry about it. Someone wanted to make a a good cache and to make you happy. Do them a favor and be happy.

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i have two caches out with music and somebody else followed my lead and placed a third. it cost less than $1 to make a commercial cd and the record companies get you for aprox $15 on a new release. they dont have any shame in charging you all that markup so i dont have any shame in spending about the same ($1) to give it away.

 

the music industry got really ugly with the whole napster thing and what they got out of it was a proliferation of peer to peer file sharing that they will never catch up with.

 

remember concerts before ticket master? you could actually afford to go.

 

i have no pity for the music industry.

 

enjoy the music. thats what it was meant for.

 

URBO

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quote:
Originally posted by Vertigo:

Has anyone ever found a cache with coppied CD's or software in it? If so how did this make you feel? I recently found a cache with some fairly expensive coppied software in it, and I didn't quite know how to react.


 

It's easy. React the same way you'd react if you found something valuable you knew was stolen from someone you know.

 

Sure, there are people who feel this sort of theft is ok. Then again, there are people who feel that armed robbery and homicide are ok, too. If I find illegal copies of intellectual

property in a cache, I'm going to destroy them,

just as I'd destroy other illegal stuff in a cache. That goes for music, software - I don't care. Illegal copying is wrong. Period.

 

If you don't think the music is worth the price, vote with your wallet and don't buy it. Likewise software.

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Take the CD's and leave a copy of "The Book of Virtues" or "The Moral Compass"...

 

Gosh, the record companys make lots of money...

 

Everyone does it...

 

Funny how those rationalizations sound so stupid and hollow when you are on the receiving end of the shaft.

 

-jjf

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quote:
Originally posted by Kodak's4:

Blah, blah, blah.....Period.

 

If you don't think the music is worth the price, vote with your wallet and don't buy it. Likewise software.


 

You sound so official with that period at the end. Anyways, I think you need to calm down a little bit there. I own all the cd's(and a lot of the actual vinyl records) of the music that you can find in my cache. So what if I want to share that music with other people. I give them a basic sample of the music that I enjoy. Take the Zeppelin CD that's in my cache. That's got a compilation of a select few tracks from albums: I, II, III, IV, Coda, Presence, and Physical Graffiti. I own the Led Zeppelin Complete Studio Recording 10-disc box set that my girlfriend so nicely went down to the store and paid around $130 for (plus I have II, IV, Coda, Presence on vinyl). Now, let's say that someone likes the tunes they hear, let's take '10 Years Gone' for example. Then they might just go to the music store and buy "Led Zeppelin - Physical Graffiti". Now it's a double album, which means it's going to sell for at least $28. Now, let's see here. Of that $28 about $4 of those dollars MIGHT actually get into the creative minds and artists (Led Zeppelin) wallets. Now, there's 4 member's of Zeppelin, but remember, poor old John Bohnam is dead (RIP). So, that means each of the living member's of Zeppelin will receive $1 and the wife of Bohnam will also receive $1 (though she had nothing to do with the writing or genious behind the song). The record company (the one's who actually care about sharing music) probably get around $18 and Fred Meyer's would get around $6. If you think that music sharing hurts artists because it takes away from them, you should maybe think twice. Most music artists nowadays make thier money from their $60 concerts anyways(plus Ticketmaster somehow ends up with $8).

 

I've already bought the albums and stuff once. I don't think I have to do it again just so I can share the music I love with others.

 

As for the Dreamcast games that are found in my cache, I don't really want to get into that, but first off how ticked off would you be if you spent over $250 on a brand new gaming system. Only to find out that after only about 2 years (less it seemed) they shut thier doors and quit making things for their system. ONLY to go over to their competitors and start making their games for them, which makes YOU have to buy another new system if you want to play those games. icon_rolleyes.gif

 

That's just my views on the subject, but other people's are different, because other people aren't me and have their own views. Just because you think your views are 'correct' that doesn't mean you have to go and ruin things that don't belong to you.

 

Sorry for the rant

 

buneatg.gifI am the Rabbit King, I can do anything

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quote:
Originally posted by White Rabbit:

 

That's just my views on the subject, but other people's are different, because other people aren't me and have their own views. Just because you think your views are 'correct' that doesn't mean you have to go and ruin things that don't belong to you.


 

Which copyrights of the music copied "belong to you?"

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If I see stolen intellectual property in a cache I will remove it and destroy it (not the cache, the CD's). If I fail to do so I am an accomplice to your illegal act. Your moral bankruptcy is your problem, not mine. Copy the universe and give it away when I'm not around (nevermind for the moment that my cost on those items goes up to cover your theft) if it makes you happy. But don't get me involved. I won't turn you over to ASP or ASCAP (or whoever does music) unless you're trying to sell it to me.

 

AtP

 

PS Not everybody does it. I don't do it.

Thank you have have a nice life.

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RANT

 

It is because of actions like the ones you promote that the DMCA has been passed. This law directly infringes on my (and yours, if you care) 1st Amendment rights. Or do you believe the myth that your actions do not effect me? To maintain our personal freedoms from an ever more meddlesome government we must make sure that we act with integrity.

 

Besides, as G'Kar put it in Babylon5, "Are you willing to give up all that you are, so you can keep all that you have?"

 

/RANT

Respectfully submitted for your consideration,

 

AtP

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There is a Quikie Mart about 4 minutes from my house that I go to a lot. One of the things that they sell in that store are Cheese Puff Cheetos. Now a bag of these things cost next to nothing to make, mainly due to the massive quantity that they produce. I routinely walk out of there with a handful of them without paying the clerk. There is a gas station at this Quikie Mart and we all know how evil the "big oil companies" are, so when I grab the cheetos, I toss them in the passenger seat and fill up my car with Premium gas. Hell its the same gas as the other but they make so much moeny off the premium I figure they dont need the money. So I fill'er up and take off down the road. Now while driving in a full car and eating cheetos, I start to get thirsty so I will run into McDonalds and ask for a glass of water, its free you know. I will empty the water and walk over to the Soda Fountain and fill up my cup. I usually drink the first glass quickly, and fill up a second one and then head off to the car.

I would love to know where all of you guys work, I KNOW that the place you work makes too much money and I need some more free stuff, so please let me know.

 

46113_400.jpg

The KGB

guy.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by White Rabbit:

I've already bought the albums and stuff once. I don't think I have to do it again just so I can share the music I love with others.

 

As for the Dreamcast games that are found in my cache, I don't really want to get into that, but first off how ticked off would you be if you spent over $250 on a brand new gaming system. Only to find out that after only about 2 years (less it seemed) they shut thier doors and quit making things for their system. ONLY to go over to their competitors and start making their games for them, which makes YOU have to buy another new system if you want to play those games. icon_rolleyes.gif

 

That's just my views on the subject, but other people's are different, because other people aren't me and have their own views. Just because you think your views are 'correct' that doesn't mean you have to go and ruin things that don't belong to you.

 

Sorry for the rant

 

http://www.iinet.net.au/~rabbit/rabpics/buneatg.gif _I am the Rabbit King, I can do anything_


 

1. You bought the right to use them yourself. You did not buy the right to give them away for free to the world at large. You are free to negotiate that right with the owners of the copyright. If you don't do that, you are a criminal. If you're unclear about your rights as a purchaser, go read the Berne copyright convention.

 

2. You spent $250 on a gaming system, only to find that it's not supported anymore. Somehow you think this justifies violating every copyright on the planet. You are completely clueless. Your making a stupid decision does not justify your ripping off everyone on the planet.

 

3. Oh, that's simply too sweet. "Just because you think your views are 'correct' that doesn't mean you have to go and ruin things that don't belong to you." Do you have even a clue of what sort of irony there is in your insisting that I shouldn't "go and ruin things that don't belong t o me" when I'm defending the intellectual property rights of the creators of the work, and you're defending your right to copy it and give it away.

 

Grow up. Stop being a peurile moron with a six year old intellect.

 

And if I find illegal copies of protected works in a cache, I *will* destroy the copies. If that pisses you off, well, that's just too dadgum bad for you, isn't it?

 

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Okay, how does this fit into this discussion?

 

Geocaching music thread

http://opentopic.Groundspeak.com/0/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=1750973553&f=3000917383&m=8760902583

 

Is it okay if you burn a CD with a collection of songs to make your own mix? Is that what dj's do?

 

And what about Markwell's much-sought-after "classical geocaching" CD? is it public domain because the music is from another century? or is the fact that it's performed by people who are alive today make it a copyright issue?

 

I understand the legal issues, and I've heard the "offsite backup" theory, and I know that most folks who are letter-of-the-law about one issue usually have other weaknesses perhaps not so apparent. But a lot of people in this community enjoy these compilations -- it seems harsh to say that the caching community is comprised of criminals, when most certainly don't act criminal in most other ways we see them behave. But perhaps that's just rationalizing, too ...

 

I don't have the answers on this one, but it sounded like some folks here might ... just stirring the pot

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I think I can handle the verbal assault I will probably recieve, so here goes,

I assume that most of us are in their mid 30's or older, and can remember the days of vinyl LPs and cassette tapes. You or one of your buds would buy the latest greatest album by whatever artist was hot at the time. I'm sure no one had a problem with lending/borrowing said LP to make a cassette of a few of the tracks or even the entire album. It was called sharing, and I don't recall that the music companies really paid much attention. Maybe because the quality of a cassette recording wasn't very good as compared to the NEAR CD quality you get from todays MP3's.

 

Another way to look at it could be that you are providing "FREE" advertising for the recording industry. Think about it, I take the time to "produce" and "arrange" a compilation of various artists music. Maybe these artists are not getting any radio airplay, and by introducing you to their music, I've created a desire in you to find more music by said artist. At this point I've "marketed" this unknown artist, and received NOTHING in return for my effort. So how am I hurting the music industry by doing their job for them.

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quote:
3. Oh, that's simply too sweet. "Just because you think your views are 'correct' that doesn't mean you have to go and ruin things that don't belong to you."

 

Grow up. Stop being a peurile moron with a six year old intellect.


 

take your own advice man...dont ruin it for others just because u think your right...so dont destroy the material and ruin it for others...

 

thats like saying...maybe i should destroy all log books because there on paper from trees, and killing trees is wrong...its unreasinoable..see how childish that is

 

and the whole peurile moron....what?¿? who needs this... this is a discussion not a ***** at each other place...dont attack people that have differnet views...listen!!!! and maybe youll learn something

 

MAX

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Just because you find a burned music CD in a cache it doesn't mean it's stollen. There are many many many many bands that allow trading of their music just as long as it is not sold. I have a small collection of live concerts that I've traded to build up. I started with two shows and slowly added more.

 

Remember the Greatful Dead, they had a tapers section at their concert where the shared the love. You can get just about any dead show ever performed if you look hard enough. Here's my trade page.

 

http://www.cs.csustan.edu/~gcrawfor/tape.html

 

The only thing is these guys don't deal in .mp3 caca. To much audio loss. You'd be amazed at the concerts and bands you could listen too.

 

george

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quote:
Originally posted by JMaxamillion:

 

take your own advice man...dont ruin it for others just because u think your right...so dont destroy the material and ruin it for others...


 

You've already ruined it for me, or did you conviently ignore my previous post?

 

quote:
thats like saying...maybe i should destroy all log books because there on paper from trees, and killing trees is wrong...

 

Is it illegal to kill the trees? The paper companies own them (those particular trees).

 

quote:
and the whole peurile moron....what?¿? who needs this... this is a discussion not a ***** at each other place...dont attack people that have differnet views...listen!!!! and maybe youll learn something

MAX


 

At least we agree on something! icon_cool.gif

 

AtP

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quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:

Just because you find a burned music CD in a cache it doesn't mean it's stollen. There are many many many many bands that allow trading of their music just as long as it is not sold. I have a small collection of live concerts that I've traded to build up. I started with two shows and slowly added more.

george


 

Thats a good point to remember. And I have no problems with people putting PD stuff in caches. Or even (as a friend of mine does) bargin bin originals. He got some $10 PC games and puts one in a cache every so often, you know,when they fit. icon_smile.gif

 

AtP

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quote:
Originally posted by georgeandmary:

Just because you find a burned music CD in a cache it doesn't mean it's stollen. There are many many many many bands that allow trading of their music just as long as it is not sold. I have a small collection of live concerts that I've traded to build up. I started with two shows and slowly added more.

george


 

Thats a good point to remember. And I have no problems with people putting PD stuff in caches. Or even (as a friend of mine does) bargin bin originals. He got some $10 PC games and puts one in a cache every so often, you know,when they fit. icon_smile.gif

 

AtP

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Look, if you gotta steal, steal. If you need to spread guilt by including others (as in sticking your slime bag habits in a cache), I suppose we all have to stomach that.

 

But pleeeeeeease, quit with the moral indignation. It is not the record companies or game companies that 'make' you steal. You are not taking a stance for social justice or political change. You are stealing because you are lacking as a person, and because you can.

 

Now, most of the arguments here basically say, 'put yourself in the place of the people you are stealing from'. Hogwash. We already know you are morally defective. What are the chances that you posess the will power to improve your conduct in response to cognitive thought?

 

Face it, you are most likely the result of a bad breeding pair, or spent your formulative years at the hands of self absorbed, incompetent adult supervision. Well, to be fair, you might not have barnyard animals in your branch of the family tree, and your parents might not have locked you in a closet, but they were exposed to a LOT of DDT and synthetic fabrics in the middle of the last century.

 

It's not your fault! You can't help being a slimey dirt weasel! It is your parent's fault! Blame them, and be proud. When people complain about your conduct, don't try to hide behind moronic moral justifications. Instead, stand tall - "Hey, I am ethically-challenged - the result of my Mom's poor choice of a mate. Instead of bagging on me, you should be thankful that I keep my condition enough in check to limit it to petty theft!"

 

You would, of course, still be a sleazeball. But at least people couldn't call you a stupid, hypocritical sleazeball. And, who knows, if you get enough of your fellow sleazeballs to stand proud, you might lower the possible consequences if you get caught. 'Uh, they make a big profit...' isn't going to fly in court. But, 'Hey, I'm not a criminal, I'm just defective!' might...

 

Of course, instead of a book on morals, I could have recommended replacing computer CD's with virus infected blanks, and coating audio CDs with a clear, drive destroying industrial adhesive... But, I always see that sort of thing as wrong, while you would only see it as 'right' when you were doing it to someone else.

 

-jjf

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Normally I wouldn't even jump into a conversation like this due to the fact that you're all bickering like little kids, but I felt this might be appropriate.

 

First,

 

Calm down.

 

People are different. That's right. We're not all the same, not everyone has the same values and morals as everyone else. If you think yelling at each other, and making fun of others parents or upbringings is going help anything, please step away from the keyboard and go relax.

 

People are different. So you don't agree with someone elses views. So technically they might be stealing, and technically you might be trespassing. What about the "night-cachers" in parks that close when the sun goes down? No one is completely innocent, we all make choices, and sometimes, even though we think they're all right, they may not be. Have an open mind.

 

People are different. We think different, we act different. Does that mean we're bad people? Sometimes.. but for the most part, no. This argument will never end, until we all just agree to disagree. Takes a big man (or woman) to do that.

 

Are you big enough?

 

It's just a hobby guys.. relax. We're all here for the same reason, just to have a little bit of fun.

 

That's my .02. Take it or leave it.

 

Brandon

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quote:
Originally posted by Kodak's4:

1. You bought the right to use them yourself.

 

I'm sorry, since when is it up to you to tell me how I choose to use the things that I paid for. So what, I have the technology to turn the cd I already overpaid for into one cd that I enjoy much more. Big freakin' deal. If you don't like it, don't listen to them. Nobody is forcing you to listen to them.

 

buneatg.gifI am the Rabbit King, I can do anything

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I'm sorry this has gotten out of hand, I didn't want people to start *****ing at each other about right and wrong. I simply wanted to know how someone would react if they discovered something I did. I think it's clear that it is stealing, but the object of the post was not to condone it or to encourage it, only to see how others would react.

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First, let me say that I have a Garmin Venture so I can't upload and download maps.

 

Anyways, I recently found a cache with a Mapsource Canada copy in it. I was very happy because it gave me a chance to try the software out.

 

Boy was I glad because it's terrible software compared to anything else I've seen. The interface is clunky and amature and it is definatly NOT very good for Canadian users unless you live in the 3 or 4 major centres. I uninstalled it and threw the CD to a friend who also had a similar negative opinion.

 

I want to say thanks to the person who put it in the cache because they saved me $200!!! I don't mind using a pirate copy of softare to evaluate it and decide to buy it. I have purchased legitimate copies of software that I have tried this way in the past. I realize a lot of people just use the pirate copy. To me it's sort of like shareware, I try it out and if I find I'm using it all the time I buy it!

 

Cheers,

 

Rob

Mobile Cache Command

4525_1300.gif

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There is a lot of talk about the right and wrong of bootlegged material. I say, he who is without sin cast the first stone. I am not a saint, I have used copied software. I admit it...lock me up and throw away the key. Personally, I wouldnt make copies, I wouldnt distribute copies, and I certainly would never make a profit from copies. That being said, I also dont plan on calling the FBI the next time I come across a CD the someone burnt, in a cache. My advice, if it bothers you, dont take it...if it bothers you so much that you have to react, take it and destroy it. The log might sound something like this.....

 

Found it! Took the opportunity to right a wrong, left application for copyrights and patents (photocopied of course)

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So would somebody who knows please explain what qualifies as being in the public domain?

 

I did ask a question, you know. Maybe some of us who read these posts DO want to try to do better. It would help if a little information was passed around along with all the opinions icon_smile.gif

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Go ahead and take them. It's not stealing UNLESS YOU USE THEM. If they never make it into a CD player of some kind they are just plastic discs. They make great Targets for BB and Pelet guns. or a nice Mobile or an intresting way to decorate your daughters room. Where did I put that picture??

 

Just because sombody wrote Windows XP on the disc doesn't mean it is or is even usable. Heck it could be loaded with Viruses.

 

James

"Big Dog"

-Clan Ferguson

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quote:
Originally posted by JMaxamillion:

No one needs a geocacher on a vigilante misssion


Well put. There seems to be a multitude of people who are very righteous here. This issue is not black and white. The Grateful Dead example is a good one. They've always encouraged the boot-legging of their music. Many MP3s that we burn are freely downloaded from sites that are designed to help fledgling artists spread their sounds. Shel's question about public domain makes this even more difficult to be so sure of one's self. I'm planning on adding a compilation of songs related to the civil war in my cache of the same theme. Is Johnny going to come marching to sue me if I include that song (or the Navy Band)? I think people should think twice before trying to be the judge and jury on this. It might make them feel better about themselves to offset other things they're doing wrong but I'd advise that they either leave it alone or write a letter to someone authorized to take action (that is if they really mean what they say).

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Public Domain Info Page

quote:
Music and lyrics written by an American author and published in 1922 or earlier are in the Public Domain in the United States.
and
quote:
There is no such thing as an "international copyright". If you wish to use a song outside of the United States, you must check the copyright laws for each individual country where you use the song.

 

But the most pertinent finding on that site comes from the Sound Recordings page:

quote:
Sound Recordings

Records, cassettes, CD's, and other music recordings come under a general category called Sound Recordings or Phonorecords. Before 1978, sound recordings were not protected by copyright law, but by a hodge-podge tangle of state laws. This problem was fixed with the 1978 copyright act and extended by the 1998 twenty year copyright extension. Different copyright experts have offered very different complicated explanations, but all agree that all sound recordings essentially are under copyright protection until the year 2067. So here is the one sentence you need to remember: Sound Recording Rule of Thumb: There are NO sound recordings in the Public Domain. There are, of course, exceptions to everything, and there really are some PD sound recordings.


 

Markwell

My Geocaching Page

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1. Is it OK for me to copy my CD-ROM onto a cassette for my own use only in my car's cassette player?

 

2. Is it OK for me to creating a compilations of songs onto a cassette again for my own use taking one or two songs from a bunch of different CD's?

 

Alan

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quote:
Originally posted by Pote:

 

I find it interesting that they place a cache and spell out in highlighted text exactly what the finder should and shouldn't do. I find it interesting that they should expect others to abide by their rules and desires, but they won't abide by those of others. After all, since when is it up to the rabbit king to tell me how I choose to handle the things that I find hidden in public?


 

Well, if you knew anything about music, you'd just know that the whole 'Rabbit King' is just refering to Jim Morrison ("I am the Lizard King, I can do anything"--stated at end of 'Run With Me'). That doesn't mean that I think I'm above the law or anything, it's just a saying I use because I like Morrison. I replaced Lizard King with Rabbit King because I also like Floater and they have a song called The Rabbit King (aka King Rabbit).

 

As for my cache, hell, you can do what you want with it. If you can tell, 3 of the first 4 steps that we included were warning for peoples safety (by all means, you don't have to listen to those, feel free to ignore the main rule and run around on the slippery rocks if you want). Since the cache was a little different than a lot of caches, we decided to make it in steps. I've seen many pirate maps that include directions you have to follow before you can reach the actual treasure itself (have an imagination would you?).

 

As for the music stuff again. I'm going to point out the fact that these are NOT copied CD's. They are a compilation of a select number of tracks on off of different albums. I think that Zeppelin would be happy to hear that someone else might of picked up a compilation album of thiers, really enjoyed their music and possibly went out to buy it. There's plenty of artists now and back then who support sharing music because they now that it's just a way to get thier music and names out among the masses.

 

Hell, let's say that I was walking through the mall and someone gave me a pretzel that they got on a buy 1 get one free deal over at The Pretzel Factory. Let's say I really liked that pretzel. Now I'm going to remember about that place and probably stop by there next time I'm at the mall and get me a pretzel. It's free advertising basically. I never burn any 'actual cds' (song for song, the entire album). I just pick some songs that I think

show the artists many capabilities and place them on a sampler disc for others to listen to.

 

buneatg.gifI am the Rabbit King, I can do anything

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After reading about 30% of this post I've got a few points.

 

1) Burned CD's can be legit.

2) Vigilantes who take and break the copied CD's they find, may be destroying a perfectly legit CD. You don't KNOW it's pirated even if you have a STRONG suspicion It is. Thus this too is immoral. Whack your friend up side the head when you but him making a copy if that will make you feel better.

3) You shouldn't put copies in a cache you don't have permission to make.

 

We have other laws in this country to protect the interestes of Musicians and Software Companies. The geopolice should stick to figuring out what to do with bullets and food since those directly impact the safety and integrity of a geocache. A CD-ROM annoying as it is to some, is a lesser priorty, and I'm not qualified to determine if they have permission or not when I come across them. But I can pretty much tell a pack of gum or ordinace, not to mention a chewed up former geocache with gum wrappers all around.

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quote:
Originally posted by Shel:

So would somebody who knows please explain what qualifies as being in the public domain?

 

I did ask a question, you know. Maybe some of us who read these posts DO want to try to do better. It would help if a little information was passed around along with all the opinions icon_smile.gif


 

Public Domain pretty much means anyone can use it without restrictions and that no one person really has any control over it. Some software is written for the public doman and anyone can modify it. Some words have crossed into the public domain that were once trademarks. Such as Kleenex. Government documents etc. are normally considered public domain and are not protected by copyrights, trademarks etc.

 

I supect this limeric is public domain.

 

"There once was a man from Nantucket..."

 

Our national anthem is public domain.

 

If the public uses a pathway long enough to gain access to a beach or trail or someting else of interest, without permission. Then through the beauty of adverse posession an easment has been created for the public. That easement would be belong to the public domain. (more or less).

 

When patents expire they cross into the public domain. Thus we get generic drugs.

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1. Illegal CDs in caches are just like alcohol, ammo, fireworks, etc. They are illegal. Plain and simple. That's why they call them pirated. And Napsterish ideas regarding music is illegal. Until the law is changed, there is no use debating this issue.

 

2. If you see an illegal item in a cache and you morally object to it, remove it or destroy it. We get enough grief from anti-geocachers that one more issue of illegal trading doesn't bode well for the pasttime. When I personally see something I object to, I "trade" it for an item I was planning to trade anyway.

 

3. Geocaching (and Geocaching.com) is not run as a platform for issues. It is a leisure and "light fun" activity. If you would like to take up an issue on your digital rights, take it up elsewhere.

 

This discussion has gone way off-topic. Let's stick with the black and white issue of the law. Illegal is illegal.

 

Jeremy

 

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

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