Jump to content

Censors on the Job


MaxEntropy
Followers 0

Recommended Posts

I am not pro or anti religion, I don't like people trying to convert others. That's just how I feel.

 

That feeling doesn't drive me to remove something from a cache, so my feelings have a net effect, on others, of zero!

 

As I mentioned before (though not in so many words), I consider the people that try to convert others, as people who believe they are doing what their heart tells them is right, and for that I admire them, it is the practice itself I don't like, and I am able to make the distinction.

 

If you can read that and still think I am anti-religion, then I don't know how to make it any more clear. It is the pimping (yes I find that the most descriptive word for the attempt to convert others to think something you think, buzz word or not) that I don't like, not the people or the religion.

 

If somebody with my exact same religious beliefs was leaving literature about those beliefs in caches, I would feel the exact same way about it, and the person doing it. And I would still not remove it from the cache.

 

I'm sorry if I can't make it a simple Black or White, for me, it's a complicated gray.

 

Still, Like Criminal said, the log never really said it was literature, and I did assume it was.

 

___________________________________________________________

If trees could scream, would we still cut them down?

Well, maybe if they screamed all the time, for no reason.

Click here for my Geocaching pictures and Here (newest)

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by hydrashok407:

quote:
Originally posted by Bender:

I do not believe in God. Why do so many people think it is their job to make me believe? The two things people fight about most is religion and politics. I would remove anything concerning either of them that I found in a cache.


 

Why do you feel you have to police caches that you visit? You're forcing your non-belief in God by removing religious items left in caches. There are many agendas, whether it's political, religious, or social. I would like to find a "Vote for Mondale" button in a cache. While it's "political", it's also a collectors item. Would you remove that, too?

 

Evangelism might not be the only motivation to leaving religious items in caches. I'm not a Buddhist, but I wouldn't be opposed to finding a Buddha ornament in a cache... to some people, it's a good luck charm. I also wouldn't remove mystical crystals, or dragon figurines, or pentagrams. I recall finding a book of horoscopes in a recent cache. None of these things are "my thing", but I certainly have no right or responsibility to shelter others who may want these things.

 

I have my beliefs (religious, political, and social). I do not get offended when I stumble across others' beliefs or opinions. Those who do need to get a life. By taking action against the fanatics you oppose merely shows your fanatacism for simply a different cause.

 

By leaving the religious items in the cache, the person merely OFFERED it to another finder. By removing the items, you're denying future finders of picking up something they might enjoy. How dare you. If you don't want the religious items, simply pick something else.

 

I found a cache just last night with baseball cards in it. I don't like baseball. Should I have removed the baseball cards? Hmm.. maybe the next cache finder might enjoy baseball cards. Oh no! I don't like baseball, so NOBODY should have access to these cards!

 

I don't force my views on other cachers, and I expect the same from them. To offer is not force, but to deny is. If you don't like it, just leave it be.


 

Right ON!!!

 

You're gonna fit right in at our event caches if Breaktrack doesn't catch you speeding on his side of town. icon_wink.gif (BTW- Where the heck is Benbrook anyway?)

 

Agnostic here: I don't believe in defining the undefinable. (BTW-Agnostic does NOT mean atheist.) What ever floats everyone else is fine with me. I have at least one of the religious tomes from every major religion and quite a few from esoteric sects. I find it all terribly fascinating.

 

Strangely, I get religious tracts left on my car quite often. My car sports a "Darwin" fish right next to my Nitrofish. I have saved a few of them. The ones that tell me I'm evil and a "Hater of God," for believing in evolution are particularly campy. I don't feel hurt or insulted by the sentiment that placed them there. I wouldn't usually remove them from a cache although, like loose, small change, I think a religious tract is a pretty poor trade item.

 

Was it Karl Marx that said, "Religion is the opiate of the masses." I agree with that completely. Some people get addicted to opium and all hell breaks loose. Some opium farmers sample their product in moderation and live past 100 years. What can we learn from this? icon_wink.gif

 

Snicon_razz.gificon_razz.gifgans

texasgeocaching_sm.gif Sacred cows make the best hamburger....Mark Twain.

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Brian - Team A.I.:

quote:
Originally posted by Romad_Pilot:

quote:
Originally posted by Woodsters Outdoors:

Actually the paper cut that one could get from those tracts would hurt more than the little knives left in caches....lol icon_wink.gif

 

Brian


 

And it hurts like you know what of you get lemon juice in the cut! icon_eek.gif


 

So you're going to start placing religious tracts in caches laced with lemon juice? icon_biggrin.gif

 

Brian

Team A.I.


 

Dang, my sinister plot has been exposed to the light, I'll need to come up with another plan to take over the world! AYPWIP?

 

Frank

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Snoogans:

You're gonna fit right in at our event caches if Breaktrack doesn't catch you speeding on his side of town. icon_wink.gif (BTW- Where the heck is Benbrook anyway?)


 

Having found the cache where the log was signed that started this whole thread, I saw that it was in California. That explains a lot. icon_smile.gif

 

Benbrook is a suburb in SW Fort Worth. I used to live in Alief, and my two dearest friends still live in and close to Alief. I went to Elsik. I was a Ram.

 

-=Jerry A. Goodson=- W5BFF aka hydrashok407 frog.gif KoolAid Drinker frog.gif

texasgeocaching_sm.gif

"Real peace is not just the absence of conflict, it's the presence of justice" - http://www.hydrashok.com

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by martmann:

I am not pro or anti religion, I don't like people trying to convert others. That's just how I feel.

 

That feeling doesn't drive me to remove something from a cache, so my feelings have a net effect, on others, of zero!


Excellent post! All of it.

 

The issue here is not about religion, politics, agendas, etc. It's about censorship. I've seen it posted on this very thread that Jeremy might/should add religious items to the no-no list. Once the censorship starts, there's no sensible way to end it.

 

Let's take this a step further. What if a bumper sticker that said "Kill Whitey" or a Confederate Flag key chain was left in a cache, would someone feel that these racial items should be removed? What about CDs that contain explicit lyrics? What about Pro-Life or Pro-Choice items? A Pro-Lifer might take offense to finding a Gladney Clinic (an abortion clinic) keychain in a cache. I could continue listing many controversial items. My point is, I feel cachers should be able to take and leave whatever they want, as long as it doesn't hurt (physically) anybody. If it hurts them mentally/emotionally, then they have bigger issues and should learn how to deal with life in the first place.

 

Any one person's beliefs do not entitle them to "police" caches. There are fanatics of all types. If these people can't co-exist with other people who may think/believe differently, then they shouldn't participate. They can go be fanatical somewhere else.

 

Here's a novel thought... how about trading something you believe in for something you don't? (TRADING being the key word) If you're atheist, leave an item that says "there is no God", or if you're agnostic, leave something that says "there may be a God", or if you're Christian, leave something that says "there is a God". Do with your traded item as you please. Burn it as a sacrifice or whatever, just don't bother us other cachers about it.

 

Not only was removing the "religious propaganda" from the cache wrong, but they belittled whoever left it by referring to it as such. I would've been more impressed with a log that said "left nothing, took (specific religious item(s))" That, at least, shows a little tact.

 

-=Jerry A. Goodson=- W5BFF aka hydrashok407 frog.gif KoolAid Drinker frog.gif

texasgeocaching_sm.gif

"Real peace is not just the absence of conflict, it's the presence of justice" - http://www.hydrashok.com

Link to comment

Hydroshok - I'm shocked! icon_eek.gif

 

You said

quote:
Let's take this a step further. What if a bumper sticker that said "Kill Whitey" or a Confederate Flag key chain was left in a cache, would someone feel that these racial items should be removed?

 

First off, the Confederate flag IS NOT a racist symbol - if you think it is, then you have to think crosses are also!

 

I know it doesn't matter what is true, only what people believe is true but the Confederate flag to most Southerners is a symbol of their heritage, not racism.

 

It's just a dang shame they weren't more vocal in stopping the flag from being hijacked for a racist cause!

 

"The hardest thing to find is something that's not there!"

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by WildcatRegi:

It's just a dang shame they weren't more vocal in stopping the flag from being hijacked for a racist cause!


 

could have been they were afraid of the racist bastards of the KKK themselves. The KKK made no distinction between black and those who championed blacks.

 

In a free nation you have to sometimes tolerate the intolerable.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by hydrashok407:

It's about censorship.


 

I don't see it that way.

 

I'm not so sure people are talking about rosaries, crosses, or other forms of religion-based items. I'm thinking it's more of the evangelical items like tracts and pamphlets. I know I view things like that the same as spam in my inbox, junkmail in mailbox, and telemarketers. I don't like it.

 

Something else I don't like is people who trade decent items for a pinecone, a stick, a common bottle cap, or a seashell they found at the site. When I find obvious junk in a cache most of the time we clean it out. How is a pinecone a trade item when you were tromping all over them looking for the cache?

 

But is that censorship? That person may think it a proper trade item. Should I--as a finder or an owner--"censor" a trade because I don't think it worthy? If not, then how would you keep up the quality of the trade items?

 

So here is how I see it, if the item has some intrinsic value beyond the message itself, then it's in. If the item has very little value, i.e. nothing more that a folded piece of paper with words on it, then it's out. A message on a keychain can still be a keychain without ever looking at the message. However, a tract without a message is just a piece of paper.

 

I think there is a distinct difference between the two.

 

I think Jeremy made it quite clear that caches are not the venue for advertising. If the item has no value beyond the advertising, it doesn't belong in the cache.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

Link to comment

Just one last thought on this, and then I'm moving on to other issues that perhaps actually affect Geocaching, perhaps not.

 

The mere presence of these *tracts* or *pamphlets* seems to be what is so offensive to people. I, on the other hand, could not be offended by them unless I actually read them and found offensive material inside. Just seeing them would not send me into paranoid delusions of grandeur thus transforming me into the cache police with the mission of *protecting* all other cachers from the evil of *religious propaganda.*

 

So, to avoid turning into the creature from the black lagoon, I just don't read them. I also find it works with television programs, radio, magazine articles, etc, etc. If there is something there that offends me, I turn them off, change the channel, turn the page, or avoid a type of media altogether that regularly offends me or my beliefs. I have seen this so called *religious propaganda* many times in caches yet hardly noticed their presence as they were nothing i needed or was interested in as my beliefs are already firmly in place.

 

This seems a tempest in a teapot, but, what's new around here....LOL.

 

icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

texasgeocaching_sm.gif

"Afghanistan was a battle. Iraq was a battle. The war goes on."

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox:

I take it you mean "monetary value", for surely that's the only thing that matters.


 

Well, yes. It's worth something to trade for. Exactly my point.

 

But a pamphlet without the message is just a used piece of paper. I guess it could be worth something to somebody somewhere, but is it really a trade item? I think not.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

Link to comment

Can anyone tell me why we created a fat guy with a beard from the north pole to give gifts, on the jesus's birthday and a bunny that gives eggs on his death day?

 

I mean surposivley he "Jesus" had a beard, but he was far from fat and lived where it doesn't snow?

 

OH and this Santa guy that slides down chimneys, how does he get in houses where it averages 120 degrees with no chimney, does he have a key?

 

NOSEEUMS--High Protein Low Calorie unpacked trail snacks!!!!

See You In the Woods!!!

Natureboy1376

Link to comment

This history of Santa will get you started there. As you will see, the santa we know today is much different from the Santa of old.

 

The history of Easter is here.

 

As you will see, some of the Christians biggest holidays started out as pagan holidays. As the pagans converted, they adapted their holidays to reflect their new found faith. Some of the old symbols of the pagan festivals survived and have evolved into such things as the easter bunny.

 

Jesus was not born on December 25th. We use that day to celebrate his birth because the converted pagans used to have a winter solstice festival on that day. They changed the meaning of the holiday to match their new faith.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have never been lost. Been awful confused for a few days, but never lost!

N61.12.041 W149.43.734

Link to comment

Oh my....just breathe! This seems pretty ridiculous to me. I am of the opinion that people leave signature items that in some way define them. A Christian may well consider themselves defined by a cross or bible or religious artifact, just as a person of a different faith may feel defined by a symbol of their religion. It's okay with me if someone's signature item or trade item relates to that which they feel passionate about.

 

Who are we to regulate which passion is acceptable? Good grief!

 

I am a mother of three. (teens, ugh!) My kids and whatever tagalongs we have at any given time go caching with us. We've taking young'uns from 3 to 18 on hikes with us. The thing is, however, while we try to keep this game kid friendly, it's not really a child's game, is it?

 

Kids accompany their parents on this jaunt, but not many 12 year olds are heading into the forest looking for caches and even if they do, it should be with parental approval. I do not expect anyone else to keep my children 'safe' from things they shouldn't see. I expect that every situation we encounter is an opportunity to discuss our value system.

 

I am not easily offended by anything, as I find that it takes entirely too much energy on my part to lived in the mindset of the offended.

 

I have found business cards offering a discount (didn't take because I didn't need the product but if I had needed or wanted the product, I would have taken it). What a concept....I am capable as an adult of choosing what I allow to influence me and what I don't. SHOCKER.

 

Dang it...I haven't had enough coffee to even determine why I felt the need to have this early morning rant. Move along folks, nothing to see here...and if the sight of a coffee deprived woman in Mr. Potato Head pajama pants with bed hair on a morning forum rant offends you, simply avert your eyes. icon_razz.gif

 

Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you react to it.

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by jarja_grl:

...and if the sight of a coffee deprived woman in Mr. Potato Head pajama pants with bed hair on a morning forum rant offends you, simply avert your eyes. icon_razz.gif


 

Heh heh heh. That sounds interesting jarja_grl. Not the slight bit offensive. icon_wink.gif

 

----------------------------------------------------------------

What's the Frequency, Jeremy?

----------------------------------------------------------------

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Pantalaimon:

quote:
Originally posted by mckee:

Who here has performed a sex act at a cache site?


 

With someone else? Or just by yourself?

 

Pan

 

ROFLMAO...oh oh...my sides hurt icon_biggrin.gif

 

_Here there be tigers._ - My response when asked by a fellow Geocacher to describe the attitude of the forums.


Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by mckee:

 

Who here has performed a sex act at a cache site?

 

--------------------


 

Sounds like it's time for someone to create a Geocaching Purity Test.

 

(Sorry, I can't seem to find a link to a copy of the 100 point Fannish Purity Test anymore, and the 400 point version is a little too generic to be as fun...)

 

Ron/yumitori

 

---

 

Remember what the dormouse said...

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by yumitori:

I hear this argument regularly, and I always wonder where you folks live that such an environment exists.


 

U.S.A.

 

You mentioned some of the very things you deny exist.

 

America is not totally hostile to Christianity, but there is undoubtedly a "double standard" when it comes to Christianity and secular humanism or other organized religions. The public schools are a prime example. As you said, "children are taught as fact things that are actually religious belief". And Christian staff are constantly harassed or threatened if they publicly display accoutriments of their faith.

 

It is a fact in public schools that a teacher can get in trouble and lose hisher job by displaying Christian faith while heshe may with impugnity espouse hatred for America and all that America stands for or teach New Age or eastern religious beliefs.

 

Open your eyes and look around.

 

"Freedom is a two-way street."

GDAE, Dave

Link to comment

I agree with a number of the posters here. I think advertising of all kinds (e.g. plumbers, mechanics, and others business cards, religious pamphlets, etc.) should be left out of caches. Still, as drat19 mentions, if someone wants to put it in and someone else wants to take it out, it's fine by me as long as they leave the cache.

Link to comment

I find it interesting that so many folks don’t want anyone forcing their beliefs, religions, ideas on them. I’m curious as to where they got their current beliefs. Perhaps they just thought them up all by themselves, with no input from anywhere else? Don’t discuss religion or politics? Sounds like a comment from someone who is afraid to have their ideas challenged. I believe that politics and religion are two major factors in a person’s quality of life and to be admonished not to talk about them is foolishness. Arguing about them is not OK, but talking about them should be fine. Now, that being said, this is a geocaching site. In the limited number of caches I have found I have run into items that I’m not particularly fond of. I’ve left them alone. They mean something to someone. Sounds like a simple rule. Please leave my items alone. They mean something to me.

 

___________________________________

All weal drive, the only way to go!

Link to comment

Actually, I think the admonishment of talking about religion and politics was for gatherings were you want the conversation to be light. It'll be a party pooping experience to get into a heated debate over religion or politics. For one thing, you rarely can change someone's mind. Even with the most well thought out arguments on either topic it doesn't do any good.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

 

[This message was edited by Sissy-n-CR on September 17, 2003 at 04:50 AM.]

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by ChurchCampDave:

 

America is not totally hostile to Christianity, but there is undoubtedly a "double standard" when it comes to Christianity and secular humanism or other organized religions. The public schools are a prime example. As you said, "children are taught as fact things that are actually religious belief". And Christian staff are constantly harassed or threatened if they publicly display accoutriments of their faith.

 


 

Dave, I'm currently broadcasting a program in which a church day care gave prescription medication to a child (not the one it was prescribed to) solely to drug them and quiet them down. The responsible parties were eventually charged with child endangerment.

 

Should I judge all Christian churches by the actions of a few people? Certainly not. Should you judge all school administrations by the misguided decisions of a few? I'd also say no.

 

Examples such as you bring up get reported over and over and expanded upon, until they are blown all out of proportion. I'd suggest that if there have actually been situations as extreme as you claim, there's ample grounds for a lawsuit charging wrongful firing. I'm by far not a legal expert, though.

 

We can continue to trade examples of religious repression all day. For example, a group of military wiccan faced a number of attempts to deny them the use of base facilities to worship, the same base that has Christian services every Sunday. Even one of the Congressional representatives from the area where the base is located attempted to have their worship banned. So much for supporting our folks fighting to uphold the Constitution.

 

But what does any of this have to do with geocaching? I guess the best answer might be that whenever we remove anything from a cache, we should trade for it. I'll just be sure to leave something of an value equivalent to what I perceive the worth of the item I'm taking has...

 

Ron/yumitori

 

---

 

Remember what the dormouse said...

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Sissy-n-CR:

Actually, I think the admonishment of talking about religion and politics was for gatherings were you want the conversation to be light. It'll be a party pooping experience to get into a heated debate over religion or politics. For one thing, you rarely can change someone's mind. Even with the most well thought out arguments on either topic it doesn't do any good.

 

CR

 

http://img.Groundspeak.com/user/72057_2000.gif

 

[This message was edited by Sissy-n-CR on September 17, 2003 at 04:50 AM.]


 

Oh yeah, as I mentioned, discuss, not argue. I guess I would consider a heated discussion an argument. And someone must be changing someones mind with something, else all elections would always come out the same and church membership would never change.

 

___________________________________

All weal drive, the only way to go!

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Titus2_13:

And someone must be changing someones mind with something, else all elections would always come out the same and church membership would never change.


 

I doubt many people's minds are changed through debate regarding their core belief system. That's not to say minds are never changed, but it's done through self reflection and thought, not confrontation.

 

If you want to talk about my deep thoughts and revelations on religion, fine, but these forums and caches are not the proper venue.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

Link to comment

I also doubt I will change any minds in the forums but this discussion started because someone removed something from a cache as religious propaganda when someone else actually placed a value on it. I'll stand by my previous post. As much as I enjoy a good give and take, I have no desire to try to get into any deep discussions on religion or politics in these forums or with what I leave in a cache. Just asking for equal consideration on what I consider of value.

 

___________________________________

All weal drive, the only way to go!

Link to comment

quote:
Examples such as you bring up get reported over and over and expanded upon, until they are blown all out of proportion. I'd suggest that if there have actually been situations as extreme as you claim, there's ample grounds for a lawsuit charging wrongful firing. I'm by far not a legal expert, though.


 

One religion that has been taught in schools for years is evolution. Like it or not evolution is a vital part of a belief system and hence,the cornerstone of a religion. It has been taught in schools for many years while differing beliefs on the origin of man have been banned.

 

Another that is taught in school is extreme enviornmentalism. I have read some of the enviornmantalist textbooks out there. Simply take the phrase "the earth" and replace it with the phrase "God" and it will sound all to familiar. I am all for taking care of the land, but too much of anything can be harmful.

 

School assemblies are notorious for stepping over the bounds in the school system. My niece tells me of the assemblies that are held at her school. They have had Muslims, physics, homosexuals, Wiccans, and other such speakers. Local pastors have not been allowed. Lawsuits have been proposed, but no one in the area has the money to fund such a suit. So, yes it does happen.

 

Christians are not burned at the stake or anything like that obviously. But as a Christian, I am surrounded constantly by things that challenge my faith. Turn on the TV. How many programs glorify sex outside of marriage? How many times in primetime do you hear foul language, murder, drug use? This is just what you see on TV. Turn on the radio and listen to the lyrics of the most popular songs your kids listen to. You may be shocked by what the singer is saying to your children.

 

Just a couple examples of what Church Camp Dave is talking about. Hope I dont come across as preaching. Just wanted to show a little on how life has become more difficult for Chirstian types than it was even 15-25 years ago.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have never been lost. Been awful confused for a few days, but never lost!

N61.12.041 W149.43.734

Link to comment

quote:
Originally posted by Titus2_13:

Bilder - all I can add is AMEN!

 

BTW - I have been lost.

 

___________________________________

All weal drive, the only way to go!


 

I once was lost also. Thank God somebody thought religion was of enough value to share with me.

 

Value, in anything, is determined solely by the CONSUMER. Any particular item, concept, etc, is worth EXACTLY what a person who is eager to have it is willing to give for it.

 

A soul is priceless. A piece of paper is worthless. Or is it?

 

"Freedom is a two-way street."

GDAE, Dave

Link to comment

Not to wage war on the religious side or on the non-religious side, but as individuals, you have the right, responsibility and expectation to make decisions for yourself. I will digress and recount a situation that happened to me at a LIBERAL ARTS UNIVERSITY (yes caps are used to make a point).

 

I had a professor in English who was also the GALA faculty advisor. The two of us butted heads enough times for both of us to realize that neither of us were going to change our viewpoints on homosexuality. I do not condemn homosexuality, it is that person’s choice on who they want to have intimate contact with, however, I do not want another person to tell me that I have to accept it. The professor, in my opinion, would not accept my right to have a different opinion than theirs. That was the beef that I had. Accept my opinions and beliefs and move on.

 

The point of this soapbox is to express the fact that as individuals, we all have the right, responsibility and expectation to make our own decisions. If I found literature about Neo-Nazi movement in my area, I would probably get the information regarding the event, notify the cache owner, notify the local authorities (most of these turn into bad situations for all) and leave the material there. No matter how offensive I might find someone’s viewpoint, I must accept that they have made a decision on what their belief is and respect them for making a decision. I do not half to accept their belief, but I half to accept that they have one different than mine. As long as no physical or economic harm is done, the message must be accepted.

 

Our forefathers thought long and hard, granted over sever pints, that “We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” Maybe we need to look back several hundred years and listen instead of talk.

 

See the happy moron

He doesn't give a da**

I wish I were a moron

My God, perhaps I am

Author Unknown

Link to comment

I think many are missing the point. It's not about Christian-bashing or evangelism. It's about advertising. You want to sign your name with a little cross or something, fine. You want to leave a tradable item that is useful beyond any message it may have, fine. But tracts are no different than "Eat at Moe's" brochures. Neither belong in a cache.

 

quote:
Quoted by bilder

One religion that has been taught in schools for years is evolution. Like it or not evolution is a vital part of a belief system and hence,the cornerstone of a religion. It has been taught in schools for many years while differing beliefs on the origin of man have been banned.


 

Dude, that view/arguement has always been whacked.

  • Religion - definition - religions are based on belief in the supernatural. A belief system doesn't make a religion.
  • Evolution is taught in science class. Evolution is science. It is a theory based on real-world observable facts. No, we don't have all of the answers, but so far we've proven the timeline of Genesis 1 is incorrect. Even some religions have recogized that Genesis 1 can't be factual, therefore must be allegory.

 

Sorry to hear that your niece's school is biased. I've always thought that schools should be completely secular with neutral views, not atheist. (Yes, there is a difference.) Not allowing faith-based groups using facilities while allowing others is as wrong as school prayer in my eyes.

 

You got a better venue to discuss this, I'd be happy to join you.

 

CR

 

72057_2000.gif

Link to comment

A friendly whisper from Bubbles, your shy forum moderator: Talk all you want about putting religious materials in geocaches, or anything else having to do with geocaching. But when the discussion starts to stray towards a pure debate on different religious beliefs, then find another forum as CR suggests. You're welcome to create a private topic here, too.

 

As for me, I'll just kneel before the almighty frog.

 

Thanks folks.

 

--------------------

smile.gif Signal says, "Drink the Kool-Aid!" smile.gif

Link to comment

I been debating evolution for many years. We can talk till we are blue in the face. Doubt we will change our minds.

 

But like Keystone said, this is not the place.

 

I like to paint my ammo cans, how about you? icon_smile.gif

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have never been lost. Been awful confused for a few days, but never lost!

N61.12.041 W149.43.734

Link to comment

Well the other day I went to find a cache site. Realized I was knee deep in poison ivy. Thought to myself.."Oh God! if I make it out of here...

OOPS! Mixed religion with geocaching. Kind of like the only way to get prayer out of school is to stop giving tests!

Link to comment

quote:
Cooter13 said:

As long as no physical or economic harm is done, the message must be accepted.


 

Man does THAT open a cache of worms!

 

Is there anything anyone does that someone can't show does physical or economic harm?

 

Perhaps the cache owner could sue the person who placed the tract in the cache for hisher expenses in "cleaning it up".

 

and OBTW: evolution is PSEUDO-science. It does not follow the scientific method. It is purely speculative and all the "evidence" is subject to several interpretations. Evolutionists use their own slant exclusively and debate, at least in public schools and geocaching forums is forbidden.

 

"Freedom is a two-way street."

GDAE, Dave

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Followers 0
×
×
  • Create New...