Opinions on my disapproved cache

[+GoldKey]

I posted this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=40937

 

and it was denied. The reasons are in the following e-mail:

 

From: "General Inquiries" Save Address | Headers

To:

CC:

Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 19:02:48 -0700

Subject: RE: [GEN-021025.37350] Re: [LOG] Archived: Trick or Treat

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

The answer is no. Feel free to bring it up in the forums for a vote if

you like.

 

Jeremy

 

-----Original Message-----

From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 6:44 PM

To: General Inquiries

Subject: RE: [GEN-021025.37350] Re: [LOG] Archived: Trick or Treat

 

I can't find anything in the guidelines that says that it has to be

permanent to semi-permanent. Even so, I would define this as

semi-permanant because it will be at a fixed position for a fixed amount

of time. This is a physical cache, the coordinates point to the cache.

Only someone with a GPS would get access to the cache, so it is not open

to all individuals. The only difference is that it is that the time is

limited. This is really a hybrid of an event and traditional cache. It

has aspects of both and I think it is completely within the spirit of

geocaching.

 

Regarding the rules for it being called a geocaching event, Erik said

geocaching had to be conducted to call it an event. Since the cache is

hidden and can only be found using the coordinates, I would say

geocaching is being conducted.

 

Please reconcider

 

Chris

 

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------

From: "General Inquiries"

Reply-To: "General Inquiries"

Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 18:01:31 -0700

 

>It is not a permanent to semi-permanent cache.

>

>Jeremy

>

>-----Original Message-----

>From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

>Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 2:32 PM

>To: Geocaching.com Automated Bot

>Subject: [GEN-021025.37350] Re: [LOG] Archived: Trick or Treat

>

>

>I was planning to put a physical cache box at my doorstep. I only

>chose the event cache type to make it clear that it was only for a

>specific day/time. If you like, change it to a traditional cache.

>

>Thanks

>

>Chris

>

>

>---------- Original Message ----------------------------------

>From: "Geocaching.com Automated Bot"

>Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 14:10:01 -0700

>

>>Greetings from Geocaching.com.

>>

>>This is an automated message letting you know that the cache has been

>>archived. In case you plan to unarchive the cache in the future, keep

>>this link for your records:

>>

>>http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=40937

>>

>>Message:

>>I'm sorry, but a geocaching event has to be an event for geocachers

>>devoted to geocaching at which geocaching is conducted or discussed.

>>It cannot be an event open to the general public or an occasion that

>>has nothing to do with geocaching to which geocachers are invited.

>>Regretfully, erik - geocaching.com admin

>>

>>If this is in error, simply respond to this message.

>>

>>Cheers,

>>Geocaching.com Team

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+GoldKey]

If you do vote, yes or no, I would appreciate your reasoning.

 

Thanks

 

Chris

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+welch]

is that link correct? i cant seem to get it to connect....

 

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by welch:

is that link correct? i cant seem to get it to connect....

 

http://www.scubaboard.com/images/smilies/whack.gif

 

---

 

Works fine for me. Can only the poster see an archived cache?

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+welch]

thats what im wondering, since this was never "approved" maybe not??

 

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by GoldKey:

quote:

---

Originally posted by welch:

is that link correct? i cant seem to get it to connect....

 

http://www.scubaboard.com/images/smilies/whack.gif

 

---

 

Works fine for me. Can only the poster see an archived cache?

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

---

 

If so, wonder what the two people who already voted no looked at.

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[k2dave]

that link didn't work for me - it just goes to

http://www.geocaching.com/hideseek/ page.

 

w/o seeing it, I really don't know what this cache is about and can't vote on it (well I can vote on it but it wouldn't meen much)

 

----(sig line)---> Did you ever do any trail maintainence? - if so you will know that all but the most worn trails need continuous maintenance to prevent mother nature from reclaiming it. herd paths are quickly reclaimed - k2dave

[+GoldKey]

Here are the details:

 

Trick or Treat

[Click to temporarily disable]

by Chris and Cheryl [profile]

 

This cache has not been approved yet. Once it is approved, it will be listed on the site.

 

In Florida, United States [state map]

Hidden: 10/31/2002

Use waypoint: GC9FE9 (what's this?)

Make this page print-friendly (no logs)

 

Note:To use the services of geocaching.com, you must agree to the terms and conditions in our disclaimer.

 

(ratings out of 5 stars. 1 is easiest, 5 is hardest)

Difficulty: Terrain:

 

Happy Halloween!

 

THIS CACHE WILL ONLY BE AVAILABLE FROM 6-8 PM ON 10/31/2002!

 

Go to the stated coordinates, knock on the door, say "Trick or Treat" with GPS in hand and get access to a special cache. You can sign the logbook and trade for a special geo-treat. I have a limited number of Geo-chips (poker chips printed with the geocaching logo). Everyone else will get candy. Hours are limited from 6pm to 8 pm.

 

Additional Hints (No hints available)

 

 

Find...

...other caches hidden or found by this user

...nearby caches

...nearby placenames

...nearby benchmarks

 

 

For online maps...

MapQuest Maps (BEST)

Topo Zone - topographical maps

(Site uses a different datum so coordinates may be off)

Microsoft Terra Server - satellite photos

Yahoo! Maps

 

 

Logged Visits (2 total.)

Warning. Spoilers may be included in the descriptions or links.

Cache find counts are based on the last time the page generated.

 

October 25 by GoldKey (51 found)

You can [edit], [delete] or [permanently encrypt] this log entry.

I have changed it to a traditional cache. It meets the criteria for that since I will have a physical cache. I will disable it after the specified day/time. I only chose an event cache to emphasize the limited time period for this cache.

 

Chris

 

[last edit: 10/25/2002 2:44:30 PM PST]

 

[last edit: 10/26/2002 4:18:55 PM PST]

[upload an image for this log]

 

October 25 by ~erik~ (erik88l-r) (440 found)

You can [delete] or [permanently encrypt] this log entry.

I'm sorry, but a geocaching event has to be an event for geocachers devoted to geocaching at which geocaching is conducted or discussed. It cannot be an event open to the general public or an occasion that has nothing to do with geocaching to which geocachers are invited.

Regretfully,

erik - geocaching.com admin

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+welch]

quote:

---

Originally posted by GoldKey:

If so, wonder what the two people who already voted no looked at.

---

either im stupid or they were voting blind??

(cross fingers its not me!!! )

 

[+welch]

that helps,

but it getts sticky when you try to apply this cache into the rules.

 

wheres the location? your house??

 

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by welch:

that helps,

but it getts sticky when you try to apply this cache into the rules.

 

wheres the location? your house??

 

http://www.scubaboard.com/images/smilies/whack.gif

 

---

 

Yes, none of the local cachers have ever been to my home, so they would have to use the coordinates to find it.

 

Chris

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+300mag]

I also had the exact same thing happen. This was the first time I posted a virtual cache. I was very disapointed in this refusal. I didn't know there was a new list of approval criteria's. I don't feel like posting the cache for it here and having you vote on it. This is not a court.I will simply remove it.

 

[k2dave]

Ok after reading it my 1st impressing would be no, but after thinking about it I will give it a maybe since you will be giving out the waypoint of the house and the cachers must get the correct one (which should be easy enough).

 

I didn't vote because there wasn't a maybe choice - well now I'm in the 'I don't know' catagory - no that isn't a choice either, hmmmm I guess I will just abstain.

 

----(sig line)---> Did you ever do any trail maintainence? - if so you will know that all but the most worn trails need continuous maintenance to prevent mother nature from reclaiming it. herd paths are quickly reclaimed - k2dave

[+welch]

i can see why this wouldnt pass for a Traditional. the admins stated a couple weeks ago a cache thats being listed for just a short time wont be posted,(too much admin time being wasted i guess).

 

but why cant it be an event??

"Erik said geocaching had to be conducted to call it an event"

but the have to use a gps to find it(you your house) isnt that geocaching???, but it would be Traditional.... which isnt allowed when its temapory, which 2 hours would be.

 

ok why dont you just give out your actual address, inviting cachers to your event/haloween party, and put the cache in the back yard. then you would have an event, which CAN be for a short time, and still have the geocaching to qualify it? right?

 

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by welch:

i can see why this wouldnt pass for a Traditional. the admins stated a couple weeks ago a cache thats being listed for just a short time wont be posted,(too much admin time being wasted i guess).

 

but why cant it be an event??

 

http://www.scubaboard.com/images/smilies/whack.gif

 

---

 

I originally posted this as an event and was told

 

Message:

I'm sorry, but a geocaching event has to be an event for geocachers devoted to geocaching at which geocaching is conducted or discussed.

It cannot be an event open to the general public or an occasion that has nothing to do with geocaching to which geocachers are invited.

Regretfully, erik - geocaching.com admin

 

Since you are using the GPS and finding a cache, the first criteria is fulfilled. The event is not open to the public as only those with a GPS would have access to it. So second criteria is fullfilled. I only changed it to a traditional cache because the event was not allowed.

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[umc]

I don't know if this has anything to do with the subject but could it have something to do with the 'geocaching logo' going on your items to hand out?

 

______________________________________________________________________________________

Coming Around, New Owner Of a Garmin GPS V Received on 10-03-02

[+welch]

quote:

---

Originally posted by GoldKey:

 

I originally posted this as an event and was told

 

Message:

I'm sorry, but a geocaching event has to be an event for geocachers devoted to geocaching at which geocaching is conducted or discussed.

It cannot be an event open to the general public or an occasion that has nothing to do with geocaching to which geocachers are invited.

Regretfully, erik - geocaching.com admin

---

yea i looked back, and edited my last post. but cant you get around "for cachers only" restriction if its a public thing, but geocaching is represented with say a booth??

 

im not saying set up a booth, but just pointing out you can get around it. i think this cache/event could be changed enough to qualify.

 

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by umc:

I don't know if this has anything to do with the subject but could it have something to do with the 'geocaching logo' going on your items to hand out?

 

______________________________________________________________________________________

Coming Around, New Owner Of a Garmin GPS V Received on 10-03-02

---

 

This is the thread regarding the chips. http://opentopic.Groundspeak.com/0/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=1750973553&f=1640962783&m=4290996594

 

Short version, these are an approved logo product.

 

Chris

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by welch:

yea i looked back, and edited my last post. but cant you get around "for cachers only" restriction if its a public thing, but geocaching is represented with say a booth??

 

im not saying set up a booth, but just pointing out you can get around it. i think this cache/event could be changed enough to qualify.

 

http://www.scubaboard.com/images/smilies/whack.gif

---

 

I could actually hide the box in my yard if that would make it acceptable. If Jeremy or Erik are watching this, would this be acceptable?

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+welch]

quote:

---

Originally posted by GoldKey:

I could actually hide the box in my yard if that would make it acceptable. If Jeremy or Erik are watching this, would this be acceptable?

---

 

if you need more than one, make it a multipart cache. find cache a for the clue to cache b, which has the exact coords for the ammo box in the garage?? or something like that, maybe?

 

[+W8TVI]

I like the idea...

I dont go trick or treating (never did) but it sounds kinda like an event... (you should have them say cache or treat)

I voted yes.

 

Noel

 

GeoX Geocaching gear!

[+GoldKey]

Cache has been approved with the caveat that I have to move it to a permanent location after Halloween. No problem here, thanks for all of your opinions.

 

Chris

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+welch]

congrats on your newest cache.

 

but does this mean it dont matter how i vote??

 

[umc]

congratulations,

 

Way to make it happen.

 

______________________________________________________________________________________

Coming Around, New Owner Of a Garmin GPS V Received on 10-03-02

[The Champions]

Glad to hear it was accepted

 

Niall

The Champions

[+Jamie Z]

Hmmm,

 

I guess I missed the discussion. My opinion was that it sure was a cool idea... but not a geocache.

 

It got approved? Great. Have a good time.

 

Jamie

[+Planet]

Too short a time period. You aren't the only person who wanted to do that, someone in my town tried it also and was denied on the basis that it wasn't a geocaching them, but a Halloween theme. And 2 hours one night, in one town, how many people could your really expect? I like the idea, but only 2 hours? On a night when people have to drag their kids around first, or go to a party, I just don't think it's enough time for a cache. And I can't get there to do it either!

 

Cache you later,

Planet

[azog]

When I first read the subject line, I thought it had to do with a cache that didn't go over too well. You know, like "they disapproved of my recent behaviour".

 

----------

Do not answer a fool according to his folly, lest you be also be like him.

[+infosponge]

It's a neat idea, but I would say "no".

If everyone did this, we'd have a billion 3-hour geocaches for Halloweeen, Easter, National Nude Recreation Week, etc.

[+JaimeeG]

I don't see how this is any different than "one-time only" caches. These are rather popular where we live. They are always member's only caches, and once the cache is found, that is it. The cache in question sounds as if it's the exact same thing.

 

Jaimee

 

Before criticizing others, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you do the criticizing, you will have their shoes AND be a mile away!

[dave and jaime]

for what its worth i like your idea. maybe it doesnt fit the criteria, i didnt look, but it sounds like a good idea to help parents introduce children to the game and for adults to give it a try.

[Rubbertoe]

I've not read all the replies yet - but I'm pretty sure that Erik reviewed and approved some "single use" caches not too long ago... can probably still be seen in the other forum where they ask for opinions on that sort of thing. And, iirc, there wasn't a question of approving them because they were "single use" but for some other reason... as if being a one-time-only cache wasn't even a consideration as a problem.

 

The Toe Pages

[Rubbertoe]

~erik~ said:

 

"The first finder would be the only finder. Despite some reservations about this going against the grain of much of what geocaching should be about, the reality is that they are there and need to be removed or made into permanent caches ... Something has to be done with these caches - we can't just archive them, but is what's posted enough? Should there be a policy against one-time-caches?"

 

To me, it sounds as if he thinks they should be allowed, although at the end of that paragraph he mentions a possible policy banning single-use caches. So, perhaps this has been done... I don't make it a habit to read the rules each week.

[+GoldKey]

It is not a single use cache. 100 people could find it as long as they came during the time aloted. It is really a cache event where the event is the cache.

 

Chris

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."

[+Criminal]

My personal opinion is YES, it sounds like a cool idea. If it fails to be approved, take the end run around. Call it a regular cache and then archive it after halloween. Too many rules............

 

Here's one one in WA.

[+TeamBullivant]

Hey.....I say "GREAT 4 U!!!!!"

sounded like a neat idea to me and I voted yes.

[+Wild Rover]

Yawn - who cares?

[+JaimeeG]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild Rover:

Yawn - who cares?

---

 

Looks like you care, Wild Rover, or you most likely wouldn't have posted a response!

 

After posting earlier, I then read in our local forum where an approver had not allowed a one-time only cache. There have been about 10 of these in my area in the last several months, but now they are not going to approve them anymore. I believe the reason given was that there were not enough cache approvers to give time to short-lived caches.

 

Jaimee

 

Before criticizing others, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you do the criticizing, you will have their shoes AND be a mile away!

[BassoonPilot]

Of course, you know that everytime a geocacher visits Florida now, they'll be ringing your bell looking for a place to stay.

[+GoldKey]

quote:

---

Originally posted by BassoonPilot:

Of course, you know that everytime a geocacher visits Florida now, they'll be ringing your bell looking for a place to stay.

---

 

I will of course be changing the coordinates after the event is over.

 

Goldkey

 

"We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg."