Re-hash on trading...

July 21, 2003

I know this is an old subject... tired and worn... but, I just gotta vent! I take alot of time picking out perfect things to put in caches and that they are in good shape and people will like them, if batteries the batteries work. Lately I am coming across caches with nothing but garbage in them. One had a lighter with about an eigth of the fluid left, another took three really nice things from the cache and left three cheap 10 cent plastic vending machine rings, another took something I put in and left a cheapo brochure. We are finding alot of free stuff in the caches while that person took out the good stuff. Are geocachers all so cheap? I am becoming disillusioned. I know it is just for the hunt.. but, it is still nice to find something decent in the caches. Alot of times I just take about 5 of my things and put in and dont take anything out... but, this is becoming costly to do that. Don't the people who own the cache monitor thier caches and refill and check them out?

Disillusioned in Wisconsin

July 21, 2003

human nature. It's very likely you'll continue to run into this sort of behavior. Venting is a good thing. I'm sure you'll find a lot of others will post similar feelings.

And who knows? Maybe someone will read your words and rethink their thoughtless trading habits. But don't hold your breath.

Don't become disillusioned. Enjoy the sport. Set the example and don't let a few thoughtless individuals ruin the fun.

I find it's easier to keep my peace of mind by not closely monitoring or tracking what's been traded in my caches. As long as folks enjoy the hunt and don't complain I figure all is well.

Jolly R. Blackburn

http://kenzerco.com

"Never declare war on a man who buys his ink by the gallon."

July 21, 2003

If it were 'just for the hunt' then there would only be a log book. I share your pain. In truth, I am not really looking for neat stuff, but it is a bit disgusting to constantly rummage through a bunch of junk. One thing that would help, is that all items in a cache should be wrapped in plastic or a Ziploc bag. Perhaps, the junkie items were in good shape when they were placed in the cache.

Not until we are lost do we begin to understand ourselves.

Henry David Thoreau

3k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SkreeminWeezul:
Are geocachers all so cheap

Dear,

Disillusioned in Wisconsin

To answer your above question I have to say, YES for the most part they are, maybe 80-95% of them. Why, well becuase its a cheap to free sport to participate in. Its a poor mans way to have fun with technology and the outdoors. I'm sorry that this upsets you but like mentioned above, take care of any caches you place and try to set an example. Soon you will find that taking care of your caches and doing the TNLN on caches you visit will be the norm because of the 'cheap0s'.

Take care and good luck there in WI

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

July 21, 2003

A few points here:

I cache with my kids - The 7, 4 and 2 yr olds find delight in the simplest (cheapest things) ie super balls, dinosaurs, bubbles, matchbox cars, origami, cheap rings etc. When we buy stuff to leave in caches we think of things our kids would appreciate finding. I guess some would call them cheap. "one person's junk is another's treasure".

It seems to me that the most junk is in the 1/1 caches - I usually don't expect too much from these. I try to leave nicer than I found.

One thing that I like but has no value at all is one team's signature item - it is a small wooden block with the team's name on it. Of no value at all, but kind of a neat idea.

Lastly, some of the caches are just not well maintained by the owner and so a little "spring cleaning" would go a long way in clearing out the junk.

Just some thoughts.

=========

"The Road goes ever on and on, out form the door where it began. Now far ahead the Road has gone, Let others follow it who can!"

1.6k · July 21, 2003

The issue is not a box full of toys when you were hoping for a box full of hunting tools. The issue is a box full of junk and the goobers who leave this kind of stuff. I have had better luck with signature items, but this is not the total answer.

Kids do like superballs, etc. I don't, but then I am not a kid. I recognize their role in the game and look for other things. I don't recognize the role of a broken piece of plastic from a inkjet printer case. I also don't recognize the role of taking a $2 item and replacing it with 20 cents in loose change.

Perhaps this represents a larger role to play for local geocaching groups who are capable of exerting peer pressure on new cachers to learn good habits?

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nebraskache/

24.7k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SkreeminWeezul:
Don't the people who own the cache monitor thier caches and refill and check them out?

Disillusioned in Wisconsin

Not at all. I let my caches trade up or down at the whims of those who find them. Over time I've wached them trade up and down and all around. It's interesting to see that on occasion I do get upwardly mobile caches.

If I had to keep buying stuff to stock the cache so people would come to find it, that would get old real fast. It wouldn't be long before I had one cache with a broken McToy theme just for spite.

Now for my sister in law the part of geocaching she enjoys the most is the hunt for the pefect trade items. She's taken that to an art and my brother in law is always well stocked for his expiditions. While she doesn't like to see the junk in caches more than anyone else she enjoys the shopping hunt so much that she still gets some use out of this hobby. She also gets some satisfaction out of not being part of the 'problem'.

July 21, 2003

I wonder if we (the geocaching community) are a little to blame for this phoenomena? Seems like when I was just getting started, I remember several references to "nothing valuable" and "stuff you find around the house" being used as trade items.

Nah, on second thought, people will be people. (*sigh*) It is, however, refreshing to find a cache that's been visited by someone who belives that "It's more blessed to give than to receive."

3.8k · July 21, 2003

Maybe I'm just too new to the sport. Maybe I'm just lucky. Maybe Indiana geocachers are different.

In 50+ finds, I have found only a few caches to be "junky."

I have 4 caches of my own and I have monitered the trading closly. With few exceptions, the trading has been fair.

There is a $5 bill in my oldest cache. I put it in when I placed it 3 months ago. Several people noted in their logs that they thought about taking it, but it's still there.

Maybe I'm just lucky!

==============?If it feels good...do it?===============

(the other 9 out of 10 voices in my head say: Don't do it.)

.

3.8k · July 21, 2003

Double post

[This message was edited by sept1c_tank on July 21, 2003 at 09:45 AM.]

3k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:

If I had to keep buying stuff to stock the cache so people would come to find it, that would get old real fast.

Its not "so people come to find it" Its to have a cache people want to find. Part of the problem is that people put out a ton of caches then don't have the time to maintain them. I'm of the theory of having a few well maintained and planned out caches that RULE.

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

July 21, 2003

This has been debated before as well, but I've pretty much settled on unopened dollar store items (carefully selected). Toys, pocket screwdriver sets, stationary items, CDs, etc. I do have a few "pricier" items in case a cache has something good.

I try to avoid McToys (although I have two or three unopened Sega game Happy Meal toys in my trade bag) or anything used (caches are damp -- I might want a sealed deck of playing cards, but I don't want a damp used pack).

The main thing people fail to remember is that just about anything is going to look like crap after sitting in a damp box in the woods for 3 months to a year. Putting an item in a separate Ziploc bag is a good idea, even for dollar store stuff.

We also have a surplus store here in Huntsville (like Big Lots, but much junkier/warehouse like). I picked up a lot of trade items there, almost all of them worth owning (I usually buy two or three and keep one) and all under $3. Again, it is mostly tools, gadgets, fridge magnets, etc.

The most usable thing I have retrieved from a cache is a New Mexico shot glass :-)

--

stream of did I lock the front door? consciousness

July 21, 2003

I get so sick of people complaining that other people don't trade fair so I came up with an idea. I don't trade at all. Doing this makes it oh so easy and you don't have to worry about trading even.

Don't Drink And Park: Accidents Cause People.

July 21, 2003

I'm looking at my case of cache items taken from the 60+ caches I've found. There are items ranging from a toy that came free in a box of Cheerios (I know because I got one just like it out of a new box of Cheerios just two days after the cache) up to what is probably the most expensive item -- a Beanie Baby. Each one is representative of the cache it came from. I don't intend to sell any of these items to make my house payment. They are there only as remembrances. I value each as much as the next. Now sure -- when I find a cache, I try to find something nice in it. I also try to trade even or up. And yes, I'm a bit disappointed when there are only three things in there and they're all McToys. But still -- it doesn't bother me long enough to take note of. When I placed my caches, I put in a selection of things ranging in value from a few cents up to a buck or so. In each of the caches, one of the first things taken was basically free. It was a plain plastic poker chip with the name of the cache written on it in magic marker. Obviously, a very cheap item -- but valued by someone. Basically, if you are hunting for caches because you're looking for valuable trades, then maybe you need to re-think why you're doing this. As more and more caches are put out, and more people get into this, it's probably only going to get 'worse'. Try to enjoy the activity -- not the physical "payoff" of the trade. Try to think of each trade as a postcard from that cache. A postcard only costs a few cents, but it reminds us of the fun we had there. Treat the trades the same. Remember the fun you had finding that cache -- or the challenge -- or whatever. Just my 2 cents worth!

July 21, 2003

Funny, I found a damp cache recently that had a mildewed business card, a piece of hotel stationary, several crumpled children's drawings torn from the log book, and some other trash. I politely noted on the cache site that it needed a bit of a clean up. The next person who logged it said the cache was in good shape! I'd hate to see their idea of one in bad shape.

3.8k · July 21, 2003

Perception is reality!

==============?If it feels good...do it?===============

(the other 9 out of 10 voices in my head say: Don't do it.)

.

1.6k · July 21, 2003

Its not about toys versus non toys or how much an item is worth. Its about stuff that is worth taking with you versus stuff that belongs in a dumpster.

I can trade for anything that is worth carrying back to the car, but I hate to go hike 2 miles each way just to find some ammo box full of junk.

As I said in the earlier post, the forums are not used by even most geocachers, the local groups are used by more of them, and perhaps using our local groups to develop the sport where we live, might make learning good habits easier when you have a known person teaching you.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nebraskache/

24.7k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by umc:

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:

If I had to keep buying stuff to stock the cache so people would come to find it, that would get old real fast.

Its not "so people come to find it" Its to have a cache people want to find. Part of the problem is that people put out a ton of caches then don't have the time to maintain them. I'm of the theory of having a few well maintained and planned out caches that RULE.

http://www.mi-geocaching.org/

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

Well hell. Move over to my neck of the woods. You can audit my caches and post your RULE rating. However (don't you just love that word) it's not the junk in the cahce that makes for a good cache. It's everything else. I tend to archive all my mundane caches just to open up the field.

Now if you put the keys to a new Avalance (yes I like em) in a cache I'd have to admit the would be the exception that proves the rule.

3k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade Knight:
I tend to archive all my mundane caches just to open up the field.

Hopefully you know I'm not picking on you but, out of those 32 trad caches, how many are mundane or maybe park and grabs? The reason I ask is because it would be extremely hard to keep up with 32 or more caches which was my orginal point and yes buying things for them all would be expensive. If you had just a few it becomes a non issue.

Yes, however is a good word

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

July 21, 2003

This too will pass... I had a similar rant when I came upon the cache that broke the camel's back, but since then I have passed 150 caches and found weighs out to the good. At 100 finds, I looked at my shelf loaded with the trade items I'd taken out of caches and traded my signature ladybug magnet for most of them. There were some pretty cool toys there, and I took a dozen of them and made a new geocache, McToys, with the loot.

I revisited the "trash cache" a half dozen times since bringing new toys, and I contacted the owner to let him know the cache needed maintainance, and now it is the best cache in that park.

What I'm trying to tell you is that you'll get over it and the better aspects of geocaching will outweigh this little discouragement.

July 21, 2003

I'm in the process of planning my first cache. It's gonna be a multi-cache (3-4) clue caches before the prize cache. I plan on making fellow cachers think and work hard to finish my cache. I haven't figured out all the contents of what the cache will have but so far I have an 1873 Large Cent, an antigue indian head radiator cap (I think that's what it is. Verry cool), $10.00 wg bill, and a gold wedding band. So far everything but the wg bill is from my days of metal detecting. The way I figure is that if I'm gonna make people work hard at finding this cache, I can at least stock it with some treasure like stuff to make it a little more fun for them. Kinda like a treasure hunt type thing I guess. The coolest thing in cache's IMHO is reading the past logs in the log book.

1k · July 21, 2003

Here's a plug for the letterbox hybrid caches. I really enjoy them, and they don't collect junk. The prize is the stamp, so they always maintain their value.

Someone mentioned that the cache owners should restock their caches to keep people interested. While I agree with maintaining your caches, I don't think that means replenishing it with new items every few months - that could get very expensive.

When I check on my caches, I make sure that everything is dry, and if it needs new pens, log books, camera, etc. I will remove anything that I feel shouldn't be in there, and will usually add one or two new items.

I don't normally trade items, but if I find a cache that looks sparse, I will add a couple of new items.

-Junglehair

I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken.

24.7k · July 21, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by umc:
Hopefully you know I'm not picking on you but, out of those 32 trad caches, how many are mundane or maybe park and grabs?

Without actually looking...

About 1/3 are park n bags at rest stops. These are more of a public service.

Another 1/3 are kick starts for the local area which was in dire need of geocaching CPR. The fate of these is to be archived if the are takes off.

The last third are keepers. They would rate on your scale.

2.6k · July 21, 2003

There must be a way to solve this problem.

george

Wanna go for a ride?

July 26, 2003

quote:
Now for my sister in law the part of geocaching she enjoys the most is the hunt for the pefect trade items. She's taken that to an art and my brother in law is always well stocked for his expiditions. While she doesn't like to see the junk in caches more than anyone else she enjoys the shopping hunt so much that she still gets some use out of this hobby. She also gets some satisfaction out of not being part of the 'problem'.

This is what I do also, which I guess is why I get ticked off at the cheapo's. But, it is the same as Christmas and birthdays... I take a lot of thought and search to find the perfect thing for someone while I in return get things grabbed off the quickest shelf closest to the cash register on the day of or the day before the event... or from clearance sales... mymother-in-law will buy from clearance sales, stock up, then try to figure out who she can give it to. I guess I just have to adjust my thinking!

July 26, 2003

Sheesh!

I know exactly what's wrong with this sport/game and how to fix it, and if people would just play the way I play, and live up to MY expectations, and make this game fun for MY kids, as well as MYself, and always trade exactly what I want and include stuff in the cache that's valuable and interesting to ME, and...please only hide things in certain areas where I like to go, and hide the caches only in the ways I like to find them, because anything else and any other kind of cache is crap... If you do all these things, then everything will be cool. why can't everyone understand this?

Sarcastically (in case there's any doubt),

Me!

Happy Caching to all!

July 26, 2003

heck I just say spray paint all your cache stuff metallic gold. That way people can't argue about what you put in there. If someone was angry at you for putting a piece of crap happy meal toy in their cache you can easily reply... "Ahh! you must be mistaken! Mine was the gold inspector gadget arm"

...and they lived happily ever after the end

The Department of Redundancy Department

A geocache a day keeps the debtors away (cause your never home to take the call...)

Re-hash on trading...

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