Replacement parts (Ethics)

[+EraSeek]

I think there should be a strong ethical code in Geocaching where everyone brings along a spare cache (small) to be used as replacement parts for the caches they are visiting!! The original cacher took the time, effort, and money to make something enjoyable for others, They should reciprocate with a little help with maintenence every now and then!

 

Personally, I'd much rather do that then trade.

 

 

"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

[+briansnat]

Maybe if the person who took the time and effort to place the cache was responsible enough to look after what they left behind, this wouldn't be necessary.

 

I'm not saying its a bad idea. I've done it. But rather than asking people to run around maintaining caches for others, how about if the owners maintained them...as they are supposed to. Now THAT's ethical.

 

 

"Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, he'll sit in a boat and drink beer all day" - Dave Barry

[Mushtang]

You betcha! Nothing upsets me more than an owner that sets a cache and then never steps foot near it again. Okay, one thing is worse, when it's reported missing or damaged in a note on the page, and the owner totally ignores even that. Why not at least archive it? If you're not going to play right, don't even play at all.

 

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"A noble spirit embiggins the smallest man." - Jebediah Springfield

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[+Lone Duck]

I think that many cachers do in some degree, at least from what I've been reading in the logs on web pages for the caches that I'm interested in.

 

Probably the biggest problem with a cache other than it becoming junkie from trades, is gettting wet. That is a problem that is either a bad container, or a container not properly closed by a previous finder. Cachers in my area have actually gone to the effort to dry them out.

 

Lone Duck

The Quack Cacher

http://www.netwalk.com/~jporter/BackPage.htm

[+carleenp]

I agree with Brian. Plus, sometimes a little maintenence from a fellow cacher, even for a responsible owner, would be appreciated. But, I'll also add that I find it annoying when I have to maintain a cache from an absent owner. Not that I won't do it!

 

As an example, this cache was placed by people w/ 2 hides in different states and no finds. They haven't visited there since December. Clearly a vacation cache. The cache container broke and someone was nice enough to fix it by donating an ammo can. When I visit soon, I will bring a new log and a geocaching info letter to add to it. I'll also update the coords, since apparently those are off in maybe a dangerous way from reading the logs. But other cachers shouldn't have to do that! I politely emailed the owners to see if they were active and got no response. I figured that when I go back home, I will send out emails to see if any local cachers would ask if they could adopt the cache. I would adopt it, but it would really also be a vacation cache for me since I live a long ways away and between me and my family, we only get out there 2-3 times a year. Anyway, it is a great location for a cache, but needs active owners! My brother, Cameron (who is severly disabled), is actually named after the location! So, you can see why I particularly care about this one!

 

 

[This message was edited by carleenp on July 24, 2003 at 07:41 PM.]

 

[This message was edited by carleenp on July 24, 2003 at 07:44 PM.]

[+Sluggo]

I agree with you, EraSeek.

 

I keep a kit with me that isn’t so much full of trade items, but rather things to “doctor” a cache. (Pens; geocaching.com notice-page in English and Spanish; small, inexpensive log books; tape; and some Zip-Loc bags.) I carry some inexpensive trade items also in case the cache has been raided (an all-to-common problem here in the Tri-Cities).

 

I have only replaced one cache container and I notified the cache owner, because I wasn’t sure that where I found it was where he/she left it and there was a color description on the details page that no longer matched after I had fixed the cache. I try to FIX the cache if it has something fundamentally wrong with it, not RE-DESIGN it to suit me. I have yet to have the cache owner e-mail me back and say; “Darn-it Sluggo… I wanted that cache to be full of water and the contents wet because the Zip-Loc bag had a hole in it. You ruined the whole theme of my “Soggy Logbook Cache”.

 

I have had others “doctor” my caches and let me know about it and I appreciate it. Sure, I could get out and do it myself, but I might not get to it before the next finder.

 

What I hate to see is a log entry that says; “This cache doesn’t have a pen in it.” Or; “The log book is full, you should replace it.” I try to let the cache owner know when the logbook is nearly full, not wait until it is full (the same with cameras).

 

Do I feel that this is my responsibility as a cacher? NO WAY!

 

Do I think I have an ethical obligation to fellow cachers to help make geocaching an enjoyable pastime for all of us? DEFINITELY!

 

This 'flying saucer' situation is not at all imaginary or seeing too much in some natural phenomena. Something is really flying around. The phenomenon is something real and not visionary or fictitious. - Gen. Nathan Twining Chief of Staff, US Air Force, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

[+EraSeek]

Of course the hider should maintain his cache, but it is also a matter of ratio. How often can he visit it/ how often do finders visit it? Seems like common sense to me. The ratio is thus because the only way for a hider to maintain it to a constant degree is to have it in his driveway. Not a real interesting cache, I would think.

 

 

"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

[+TEAM 360]

Not my job to maintain someone else's cache. LOL! I am not gonna go buy cache containers and backup supplies to carry around with me. I will leave a note on the cache page if I come across a problem, though. It is the cache owners responsibility to maintain their own caches, just like I maintain my own.

[+briansnat]

Many of us try to help out cache owners. There is one in my area who has basically abandoned all of his caches. They were in terrible shape, being that he used Gladware and they were out there a couple of years. I've replaced several of the containers and in one case, the entire cache.

 

But how much are we expected to do? I bring ziplocs, pencils, contents, but what if the log book is already soaked? A new Ziploc, or container only holds in the dampness.

 

Should cache hunters help out? Sure. But the ultimate resposibility lies with the cache owner. If they can't get there to maintain the cache in a reasonable amount of time, then they shouldn't hide it in the first place. Period.

 

quote:

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How often can he visit it/ how often do finders visit it?

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He should visit it as soon as a problem is reported.

 

"Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, he'll sit in a boat and drink beer all day" - Dave Barry

[+carleenp]

quote:

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I keep a kit with me that isn’t so much full of trade items, but rather things to “doctor” a cache. (Pens; geocaching.com notice-page in English and Spanish; small, inexpensive log books; tape; and some Zip-Loc bags.)

---

 

I didn't think of the Spanish thing. Good idea! The abandoned Cameron Pass cache that I care SO MUCH about, in part for personal reasons (see previous post), is in a state and area with many Spanish speakers. I'm going to add that as well!

 

Also, I agree with the rest that Sluggo wrote. Well said!

 

[+Logscaler and Red]

EraSeek:

 

I have found that Ethics is not a replaceable or teachable item. Period. You either have it or not.

 

Be it with this game or life.

 

As for cache repairs. That is an old beaten subject in my house.

 

Red and I spent the time and money and effort to replace, not just repair, two caches left by a tourist.

 

Total of about Thirty Buck in parts.

 

It was the 14 plus hours and about 500 plus miles over two days that was the hard part.

 

Why?

 

Because it needed to be done. I was the last one to both of the caches and I did not want to think I had screwed something up that caused the caches to be stolen.

 

As for requiring cachers to repair caches. Do you really think that people will do it? I repair if I have the stuff. I try and stock up items as I come across them. But as Red and I do, we might hit 20-30-40 plus caches in a day or weekend. I am not going to carry enough supplies to repair 10 caches. I can't.

 

But I will report problems as soon as I can. I will restock thin caches as best as I can at the time. I will replace logbooks if I need to and have an extra notebook with me. I have went through hundreds of pens and pencils, and dozens of notebooks, and I don't know how many cache containers, and I don't know how many times I have emptied out my pack to replace everything in a cache.

 

But I do it because I feel I need to, not beacuse I am required to.

 

logscaler.

[+Sluggo]

Well said, logscaler..

 

You 'da man...

 

PS: My ETHICS are bigger than your ethics.

 

This 'flying saucer' situation is not at all imaginary or seeing too much in some natural phenomena. Something is really flying around. The phenomenon is something real and not visionary or fictitious. - Gen. Nathan Twining Chief of Staff, US Air Force, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

[+aztecsearcher]

I recently had two travelers from out of state make me aware of problems with one of my caches. One fellow made a note in the log and the second posted to the page in the meantime. when the first fellow got home he posted to the web also, I am indebted to both of these folks as they proved that ethics is the name of the game in this game as in the game of life! If you want to see their posts visit the Riverside park cache under my name. I may not have known about the problems had it not been for the sporting ethics of these two cachers, the first fellow went to great lengths to preserve what was left of the cache! Kudos to both!

[+EraSeek]

Logscaler! Don't mis quote me. I said nothing about requiring anything. I said an ethical code. That usually suggests voluntary compliance.

 

The rest I agree with. Sounds like more people are already helping out than I thought.. Thanks.

 

Also, I am not talking about replacing ammo cans. I'm talking about temporary fixes for the most part. I've been carrying an applesauce jar with small logbook, baggie, pencil, the like.

 

Gees! Sorry I brought the issue up. As for me, I'll do what I can.

 

 

"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

[+carleenp]

quote:

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Gees! Sorry I brought the issue up. As for me, I'll do what I can.

---

 

Don't apologize. It is a good topic!

 

[+Renegade Knight]

Nothing like a bunch of cache finders complaining about cache placers.

 

Good thing I've got a rant about this ready to go for tomorrow's Friday Edition.

[+carleenp]

quote:

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Nothing like a bunch of cache finders complaining about cache placers.

Good thing I've got a rant about this ready to go for tomorrow's Friday Edition.

---

 

Hmmm... interesting. Hope I see this before I leave town.

 

[+Bilder]

Besides the regular trade goods I carry the following in my pack:

 

Pens

Pencils

Spare notebooks

Duct tape (works wonders)

Zip Locs

 

I dont carry a spare container. Usually the duct tape is enough to make repairs to a container that needs some help.

 

I will toss in a log book if I see that the current one is nearly full.

 

These items dont cost much. It is more for those who come after me than the cache owner. I for one hate to get to a cache and find a full logbook or that the last visitor walked away with the pen in their pocket.

 

I will make a note in the log and hope that the owner is still caching.

 

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I have never been lost. Been awful confused for a few days, but never lost!

N61.12.041 W149.43.734

[+Bloencustoms]

I don't mind helping people out, but I'd hate to have it become a rule. If cachers were required to maintain each other's caches, they sould have the power to archive the ones that need it as well.

 

"Chock full of essential vitamins and waypoints"

[+WildcatRegi]

I try to do a little maintanence if appropriate - nothing elaborate - less is more.

 

quote:

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I keep a kit with me that isn’t so much full of trade items, but rather things to “doctor” a cache. (Pens; geocaching.com notice-page in English and Spanish;

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hmmmm - being in SE Michigan, I wonder if I should put the notice in English and Arabic - I'm not sure if something written in Arabic found in an ammo box would go over very well though if accidentally found.

 

 

"The hardest thing to find is something that's not there!"

[+Logscaler and Red]

EraSeek:

 

Sorry about that. Reading it back, I see where I screwed up. And it is a subject that needs brought forward every once and a while.

 

RK : Where is the line between cache finders complaining about cache placers and cache placers complaining about cachers placers?

That is a tongue twister to say let alone type.

With 820 plus finds and 50 hides, where do I fit into this subject? Finder? Hider?

 

logscaler.

[+RJFerret]

quote:

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Originally posted by EraSeek:

I think there should be a strong ethical code in Geocaching where everyone brings along a spare cache (small) to be used as replacement parts for the caches they are visiting!! The original cacher took the time, effort, and money to make something enjoyable for others, They should reciprocate with a little help with maintenence every now and then!

---

 

Yup, we already do! Doesn't everybody? I've certainly read it often enough in logs... (New log books, new writing implements, new containers, new trashbags, spending time drying out wet containers before replacing them, removing food/smelly/off-limit items, etc...)

 

Enjoy,

 

Randy