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Some thoughts for new cachers.


Tim & June

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This thread was started in order to continue the useful discussion about guidance for new cachers (I hate that term "newbies") which was started HERE.

 

There have been a number of contributions in that thread and all have their merits and are based upon experience. Thanks for your input you guys. icon_smile.gif

 

As admin, we have seen our workload go up tremendously from new cachers who place caches before they have found many. This usualy results in us sending fairly long emails to the placers of caches trying to get things in order. I hate to think what it would be like if caches didn't have to be approved. Hey, don't think we are complaining, we're not. We are very glad to be able to help, honestly. icon_smile.gif

 

We think the most important thing about placing a cache is "go out and find some first". If you are in an area well populated by caches, find 15, or even 20 and then start planting a few. I know this is more difficult if you live in or near a cache desert, but please try to find a number first.

 

We are in danger of the quality of caches going way down. Take the example of a cache which is an old tin, thrown in a hedge accessed after climbing over a fly tip 10 yards from the parking place. The cache contains a few sheets of paper stapled together as a log book, and the swaps are no better than the content of cheap Christmas crackers and there is no stash note (no cache in particular in mind here). icon_mad.gif

 

If a new cacher finds this as their first find, they are likely to think that this is the standard and dash off planting caches which follow that example. So the moral has to be "find a variety first". icon_wink.gif

 

Quality is the name of the game, place your caches at your favorite spots so people leave thinking, "that was interesting/beautiful" etc. icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

The container is most important. It must be waterproof, and resilient. Old margerine or ice cream tubs are rarely effective, they leak, break easily and are generally way too flimsy. We use ammo boxes which are much easier to conceal because they blend in with the background and are 100% watertight. Others prefer to use tupperware type containers. Whichever way you go, get some zip-loc bags (freezer dept local supermarket) to put your treasures in. Always carry a few spare for when you visit a cache or your own swaps if nothing else.

 

If your chosen location is a monument on a hill, for example, never place your cache actually at the monument, (or other point of interest), walk a couple of hundred yards away and plant it there. You have still brought someone to your favourite spot, but they will be able to hunt for, and rehide your cache without having to worry so much about onlookers. icon_cool.gif

 

It is a good idea to avoid wrapping your cache up in a polythene bag. Critters will chew it and once the hole is large enough, poke their head in and possibly get trapped. Carrier bags could be a problem for larger critters if they get the handle wrapped around their neck.

 

Never put foodstuffs in a cache, critters will smell it and try to get to it and chew the container. If a dog walker is walking his dog, and the dog is forraging around in the roots of a tree, the owner is likely to go investigate. At the very least the dog/other critter is going to expose your carefully hidden cache. The exception concerning foodstuffs is tinned goods, we often leave little tins (ring pull) of fruit (Fruitini) in caches because it's very refreshing (for the finder) on a hot day. I dont think there is a risk of animals smellig canned goods.

 

On the subject of content, generally if a young kiddie should not have it, it should not be in a cache.

 

For the new cachers, I guess it is easy to feel isolated here, but it takes time for a dialogue to build up, please give it time. We really are not being aloof or eliteist, you are all very welcome.

 

If you need some help or clarification, ask and it will be freely and warmly given. You can ask here in the forum but if you have emailed us directly, please be patient, we occasionally get inundated and it takes time to get around to replying to all. If you have not recieved a reply, please try again in case we have stumbled. icon_confused.gif

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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quote:
It is a good idea to avoid wrapping your cache up in a polythene bag. Critters will chew it and once the hole is large enough, poke their head in and possibly get trapped. Carrier bags could be a problem for larger critters if they get the handle wrapped around their neck.

 

Is this anecdotal, or has anybody actually found a cache with a dead animal attached? I'm a little concerned, because the majority of caches in our part of the world seem to have a plastic bag layer icon_eek.gif

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Yep, it's pretty much de rigour up here as well.

I've had a critter chew through my plastic bag, through the tupperware lid, through the inner sandwich bag and chew up the logbook to make a cosy little nest - Ah!. But no sign of him when I got there. I guess that I stole his nesting hole for my hidy hole

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Just want to say thanks to those that took the time to explain my possibly poorly worded and harsh-sounding comments. I didn't mean to attack newbies in particular, but did want to make the point that cachers ought to find at least 10, 15 or even 20 caches before placing any of their own, as there is a wealth of information to be garnered from finding other people's caches.

 

The 'nuances' to which I referred are things such as good hiding places, good container and good contents. I've found a lot of caches recently in low-quality plastic containers, stuffed randomly in a tree, with utter rubbish in them. I personally feel that a cacher who has found a sensible number of caches will feel a lot more respect for the game and place a better cache than someone who sees Inside Out and then decides to hide a box in a forest...which frankly isn't a geocache.

 

On another note, PLEASE don't wrap caches in plastic bags. The bags tear quickly, defeating their puspose, and if a cache container isn't waterporrof enough to start with, it shouldn't be used. I, like many others, use ammo boxes, as they are designed to be waterproof in the outside world. They are strong, sturdy and essentially unbreakable. They are also easy to know whether they have been sealed properly.

 

The main problem I have found with wrapping in plastic bags is that the inside of the bag condensates, and the outside of the cache gets very wet, even when it's dry weather. This means the lid etc is wet, and slowly, over many openings, the cache contents get damp, as the moisture drips in on opening. even if you think there's a really good reason for using a bag, don't. If the cache needs more camoflague, it's not hidden well enough.

 

Well, that's another rant over. Hoe I haven't offended anyone this time.

 

Sorry 'bout last time, Team Tommy. Seek, enjoy, then hide.

 

--

**Mother is the name of God on the lips of all children**

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Tim and June, thanks so much for your detailed explanation about placing a cache. We found it extremely useful. We are planning to do around 20 caches before placing our own and we have already seen a great diversity of places and types of cache.

 

One of the things we find frustrating and will bear in mind when placing ours is that there is often very little or no space left in the container to place our goodies.

 

The whole of Team Tommy is already benefitting from this new hobby that we are doing. We have seen some beautiful places on our own doorstep that we did not know existed, John has lost over a stone in weight - yes he is dieting as well - and the dogs think that it is doggy heaven each weekend when the "kit bag" comes out. And.... we have this forum to read and digest and well.

 

So... thanks once again for you advice and making us feel welcome, not that we had felt unwelcome before, just a bit like standing on the edge needing a push to join the crowd!

 

Huga, we were not offended at all by your post but it did bring it home to us how little we knew about procedure.

 

Debbi

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Dear Tim & June.

As newcomers to Geocaching we would just like to thank you for the words of wisdom & welcome!

We fell in love with the sport right from the word go but, must admit that having read some of the other posts directed at us "newbies," we'd started to feel a little apprehensive.

We have just hidden our first cache (which you approved - hopefully it's OK, as we received no mail to the contrary!) after only finding six. Perhaps, after reading this post, we appreciate we should have gained more experience first. However, at the time, the first thought was to "Give something back." As we were benefiting from others efforts to provide caches to go out there and find. We learnt a very hard lesson when after we logged our very first find, the cache then disappeared, even though we did our best to be discreet & replace it back exactly where & the way we had found it.

Thanks again - education & constructive critisism helps us with our initation but "Newbies" need to be loved too!!

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quote:
Originally posted by The Good Shepherds:

Is this anecdotal, or has anybody actually found a cache with a dead animal attached? I'm a little concerned, because the majority of caches in our part of the world seem to have a plastic bag layer icon_eek.gif


 

I understand that your comment was not questioning as to whether poly bags are safe to use, but merely exploring the details.

 

I have not heard of anybody finding a dead animal in a cache, but thak goodness for that, the first time that is reported in the press will be a black day for geocaching.

 

A quick search for "+rubbish +animals +injuries" on Google returns hundreds of websites detailing how animals are injured by rubbish. I have no idea of how many animals might suffocate in polythene bags in the UK or how many might suffer from digestive tract congestion from eating polythene bags.

 

I wonder if is at all possible that any of the missing caches are wrapped around a foxes neck by the carrier bag which contained it.

 

Sorry if this seems to be a little terse, it's not meant to be, I just thought the dangers were fairly obvious and the sort of thing you see in adverts and magazines over and over, things like cutting the plastic rings which hold beer cans in pack of 4 or 6. I saw a dolphin Florida which almost died because he/she played with one of those and got it stuck over his/her beak. It was not pretty !

 

I suggest that wherever possible, go to extreeme lengths to avoid poly bags.

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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Oh dear, I'm feeling a little guilty now. We placed our first cache yesterday which was actually approved. We had found around 20 caches so we felt we had a good idea what we were supposed to do.

 

However, we did try to buy an ammo box from the Army Surplus shop in Southampton but they didn't have any in stock. The sandwich box we had wasn't big enough to fit all the items in so we opted for an ice cream tub in a thick black plastic bag, similar to those used at Quantum Leap Parts 1 and 2.

 

Rest assured as soon as we can obtain an ammo box, we will be transferring the items to this.

 

Anyway, thank you for your words of wisdom.

 

Debbie

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Team Tommy, The Bennett Family (if you think I'm typing all that ...) and all those newly afflicted with cacheritis.

 

Your'e welcome to any help we can offer.

 

The Bennett Family, We don't send emails to let you know your cache is approved, only if there is a problem (we send so many emails it's not true).

 

June and I are also sorry it's a little difficult to make you feel really one of the bunch, but you are, honestly. icon_biggrin.gif And you are loved too. icon_biggrin.gif

 

I wonder if we can ban the use of the word "Newbies".I hate it. icon_mad.gif

 

Oh! and by the way, chains are dangerous for bears, just look at "Warwick Bear's" avatar. icon_biggrin.gif

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by THE BRAMBLERS:

Oh dear, I'm feeling a little guilty now. We placed our first cache yesterday which was actually approved. We had found around 20 caches so we felt we had a good idea what we were supposed to do.

 

However, we did try to buy an ammo box from the Army Surplus shop in Southampton but they didn't have any in stock. The sandwich box we had wasn't big enough to fit all the items in so we opted for an ice cream tub in a thick black plastic bag, similar to those used at Quantum Leap Parts 1 and 2.

 

Rest assured as soon as we can obtain an ammo box, we will be transferring the items to this.

 

Anyway, thank you for your words of wisdom.

 

Debbie


 

No need to feel guilty.

 

We have found two places to get ammo boxes around here, the best seems to be the surplus stores in Winchester Street, Salisbury (who always seem to have a good supply of various sizes), and another in Romsey, but those are not as good quality.

 

We had to use tupperware type containers for quantum leap (particularly QL2) because of the number of containers. QL2 needed 6 boxes and ammo boxes would have cost too much. It has to be said that finding watertight plastic containers is near impossible without paying a fortune for them (which would have made ammo boxes cheaper).

 

When we placed those caches (a year ago ?) we were not so aware of the dangers but now it has been pointed out to us, we need to readdress the situation.

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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I haven't used plastic bags to wrap any of our caches in, and appreciate there dangers. However I did procure from an Army Surplus shop some Camoflage pattern bags, approx 30x20CM (12"x8" in old money icon_wink.gif). These are made from good quality material, with a drawstring top. They were very cheap, and should be safe, provided the string is slipped back in the top after closure. They seem to work well, and help to camoflage the cache nicely.

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quote:
Originally posted by THE BRAMBLERS:

Rest assured as soon as we can obtain an ammo box, we will be transferring the items to this.


 

Why oh why didn't I read the forums before going to do that cache, i could have done something then...oh well!

 

Mike

 

This forum post is copyright 2003 to Michael Blitz and may not be re-produced in part or full without prior written consent.

 

Copyright 2003 All rights reserved

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quote:
Originally posted by Huga:

I didn't mean to attack newbies in particular, but did want to make the point that cachers ought to find at least 10, 15 or even 20 caches before placing any of their own, as there is a wealth of information to be garnered from finding other people's caches.

 


There are loads of caches around now so it is well worth taking the time to learn what YOU like about playing the game, what makes a good cache and even better what makes a great cache (IMHO Location, Location, Location).

 

We found over 20 before planting our first and I think our placements were better for it. It was 15 or so caches before we found an ammo box and we were so impressed we decided to use them wherever possible - though we thought Northern Ireland might have been pushing it a bit!

 

We would agree with T&J on all there points and well done for taking the time to point out the advice.

 

Contents: Cache contents tend not to be that important except when you have kids. We try to load our boxes with as much child friendly stuff as possible. Though Ammo boxes seem to be huge when we fill them up so we tend to include Books and Videos in order to make them not look so empty (and to provide Hornet with plenty of reading matterial - perhaps we should start buying large print books for the old fella icon_wink.gif)

 

Chris

 

Bear rescues a speciality!

London & UK Geocaching Resources: http://www.sheps.clara.net

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When I started geocaching, back in August the midlands was a bit of a cache desert. I'm ashamed to say that I actually placed a cache before I found any but after a few finds I have withdrew it. But still due to the lack of caches in my area I have the (some would say...) shocking ratio of 22 caches found and 8 hidden. But on the upside the 8 I have hidden have had very good reviews and a considerable amount of people who have visited them have been new cachers- people who, if I hadn't planted them, may have been put of the sport.

What's your view on high cache found/hidden ratios?

MarcB

 

"We searched for hours in the cache area but all we could find was an ammo box in a little hollow. Suggest you archive the cache..."

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I have hidden 5 caches and I have only found 8 so far. Actually I had hidden 6 but went back and removed one before I even submitted a page for it as I had decided myself it was not going to be a very good location.

In my defence when I got my GPS there was only one cache in my county (July2002). Now there are a few more and now instead of just me there are 2 active cachers in the area. I hope the locations I have used are good. I certainly enjoy visiting the areas myself. I hope come summer when the travelling cacher heads north to find all the new caches they too enjoy the caches, the locations and area in general.

I know of at least one cacher that has contacted me is heading north specially for the new caches in the area. So fingers crossed they are up to standard. I have some ammo boxes (cost more for postage than it did for the boxes) now so am planning to hide a few more in the next couple of months. Some easy and some a bit more difficult to cater for all tastes

 

Hear about the 2 blondes that walked into a bar?

You would of thought at least one of them would of seen it!!

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Fairplay to Tim and June for taking the time to point out to new cachers what is the best way to go about caching.

 

I don't see the problem with planting before finding - so long as you have the knowledge of what Geocaching is all about its all good. If you read T+Js post and adhere to it there isnt really a need to find before you hide, is there?? :-S

 

If you havent found and want to hide I would say read through the site thurilly and make sure you are adhering to all wants and dislikes as well as T+Js suggestions.

 

Although I find extremly pants caches funny, newbies may not find them so...

 

A Mound in the middle of a tip by a poublic footpath would make for alaugh! and thats what i like bout caching....but a new cacher may be put off by having to trapze through knee high cack.

 

Pick yer location - even if it isnt great hide it well and make the page great so people go there and find out why you picked it.

 

Safe

 

Pidster

 

--------------------------------------------------------

One ring to rule them all, One ring to find them, One ring to bring them all and in the Darkness bind them!

 

www.buckscaching.co.uk

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Hi there Time and June

Thnx for the helpfull hints and tips you have placed in the forum. We have only been doing GoeC for about 2 weeks now and have found 4. We are waiting to reach about 15-12 before we place a cache.

We are receying a posible cache site now to see where people tend to trek and where the dogs go etc. Is this a good idea ?

 

As to this forum and a new cacher feeling out of place. I have found the forum very friendly indeed. icon_biggrin.gif

 

It's the friendlyness of everyone that attracted us to persue Geocaching. As we joined before we went acaching.

 

Thanx Tim & June again, gr8 thread

 

The Targett Family

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quote:
The Targett Family wrote:

We are receying a posible cache site now to see where people tend to trek and where the dogs go etc. Is this a good idea ?


 

Yes, I think it is. The caches I've placed so far have all been in locations which I already knew pretty well, so I felt I had a reasonable idea of how many people go there and so on.

 

Bill

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MarcB raises an good point I would like to expand on. He says that his reviews were good. I think that is important. I placed my first cache after taking Huga's advice and waiting until I had about 20 under my belt. But then I waited to see how well it went down. I watched the logs that people made, and counted how regularly the cache was found. I had already taken account of the effect of changing seasons on the local area, and only when I saw it was a popular cache and people were finding it fairly easily (it's a 1/1) did I then even consider looking for an second cache location. I am now up to 64 caches found, and only now, with a goodly string of positive logs on both caches, am I starting to plan my third. My object is to devise caches that are popular and successful. I would recommend that you plant your first cache after a few finds, then *wait* for the brickbats and bouquets to come in.

 

No trees were harmed during the production of this posting, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced....

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I appreciate the sentiment here but as a complete newbie ie still learning how to operate the GPS only had it a short while....and want to be able to work it properly prior to taking the kids out.

 

A brief search on the site shows I am in one of the cache deserts which are dotted around the UK.

 

When I do start I would imagine it would be of benefit to the local caching community if I started leaving them after logging only a couple of finds.

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quote:
Originally posted by Mudplugger:

When I do start I would imagine it would be of benefit to the local caching community if I started leaving them after logging only a couple of finds.


I think the sentiments previously posted still apply;

Broadly... if you feel confident that the caches you're considering planting comply with the generally accepted criteria, then go for it. If you get a lot of negative logs then think again icon_smile.gif

 

John

 

Age and treachery will always triumph over youth and ability.

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quote:
Originally posted by Mudplugger:

I appreciate the sentiment here but as a complete newbie ie still learning how to operate the GPS only had it a short while....and want to be able to work it properly prior to taking the kids out.

 

A brief search on the site shows I am in one of the cache deserts which are dotted around the UK.

 

When I do start I would imagine it would be of benefit to the local caching community if I started leaving them after logging only a couple of finds.


 

Welcome to the fold Mudplugger, time to abandon all hope, for once ye cross that threashold ... icon_biggrin.gif

 

We fully understand what you mean, when we started in August 2001 there were only 28 caches in the whole of the UK. The closest was 45.8 miles away, but we still found 10 caches before we placed our first. Ahhh! Those were the days! icon_biggrin.gif That kinda reminds me of one of those sketches you see on TV, "when I were a lad ...." icon_biggrin.gif

 

But if you really cannot find more than a few caches, then so be it, any is better than none.

 

Incidentally, which is the nearest town to where you live ?

 

 

quote:
Originally posted by Pharisee :

If you get a lot of negative logs then think again


 

Hi John, Not wishing to take issue with you here, but on the surface, this sounds very reasonable, if only we were all brutally honest in our cache logs. Unfortunately, few people will log "This is a lame cache, but we found it anyway". We are possibly the worst at being brutal when logging a cache as we always try to find something nice to say, (though it is sometimes difficult) especially if the cache placer is new to the game. icon_frown.gif

 

Perhaps it's time to start really telling the truth when we visit a cache.

 

From our point of view, unsurprisingly it is usually with new cachers that we have to spend a lot of time sending and recieving emails in order to correct the numerous problems before we can approve their caches.

 

Have to say to the new cachers, don't worry about it, cos that's what we are here for and we are very happy to help. icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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I live in the SW of Scotland in a nice town by the sea called Irvine.

 

There are four caches within 15mls then it jumps to 20mls + for the rest and from the feedback on some of these I don't think they are suitable for kids.

I will take on bord the comments by Pharisee etc about ensuring the quality of container/goods in any cache I post and look forward to joining in the fun.

Incidentally I have a Garmin GPS 3 so any tips on usuage much appreciatted....

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quote:
Originally posted by Chris n Maria:

[

There are loads of caches around now so it is well worth taking the time to learn what YOU like about playing the game, what makes a good cache and even better what makes a great cache (IMHO Location, Location, Location).


 

Just to show that we do not all want the same thing.

 

to us the location is far less important.

We like a challenge, often a multi-cache.

 

IOHO every cache should have something, but it does not have to be Location.

 

.

 

Tech-no notice

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quote:
Originally posted by Tim & June:

We are possibly the worst at being brutal when logging a cache as we always try to find __something__ nice to say, (though it is sometimes difficult) especially if the cache placer is new to the game. icon_frown.gif

 

Tim & June (Winchester)


This is one of our very recent cache logs.

 

This one finished our day on a sour note. The location of this cache is not nice. It is quite obvious from the discarded debris in the area what goes on here. We both thought is was pretty gross and not the kind of place that we felt comfortable being at. Couldn't get out quick enough.

 

We did get an email from the cache owner who is going to re-locate the cache to a different part of the park. So it does work. I thought a long time before posting this kind of log, but the cache was in such an awful place, that it was about time that someone said so.

 

Alex.

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quote:
This is one of our very recent cache logs.

 

_This one finished our day on a sour note. The location of this cache is not nice. It is quite obvious from the discarded debris in the area what goes on here. We both thought is was pretty gross and not the kind of place that we felt comfortable being at. Couldn't get out quick enough._


 

One problem, that can happen to anyone, is that they got to a place, like a park, and whilst they may even have been there a few times, have not been to the "hidden corners" where you hide caches.

 

And so you find that hidden corner for the cache, and the day you go, it's clean (probably just been cleared up, or the "users" are using another corner this week) and quiet.... so you think you've found a good place for the cache.

 

Of course things change, people use different areas, or you went originally at "off peak time"..... and you then find your idylic corner is no longer QUITE as nice as it was :-(

 

The same thing can happen with undergrowth....

 

As an example, I just placed another cache in Newbury. Last summer the area was FULL of undergrowth, an excellent place for a cache. But someone has been having a MAJOR tidy up, and there is absolutely NO undergrowth...luckily I never placed a cache back then!

 

On top of that, it seems that as some times of day (eg lunchtime) it is a very quiet corner, but at other times, it seems a few homeless hang around nearby... in this case, I'm leaving it where it is, and will keep a close watch.

 

Paul

 

Team Blitz

 

Noone in their right mind would place a cache THERE....

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quote:
Originally posted by Warwick Bear:

Plastic bags are bad news for wild life. Horses & Cows can choke on the bags. Smaller animals also. Round these parts a number of animals have been in difficulties due to a careless person dropping poly bags.

 

Out & About? Must be Monday


 

You're absolutely right! Last year, whilst walking the dog after midnight I heard a rustling sound in someones garden. It was a hedgehog with its head trapped in the handle of a supermarket carrier bag. It was dragging this bag around with it. I nipped into the garden and tried to get it off but the handle of the bag was embedded around the 'hogs spines and neck and of course it rolled into a ball. I wasn't far from home so I picked it up (fleas and all probably), went home and my wife and I cut the bag free with some scissors. We then set the 'hog free near where it was found. It didn't appear too upset and toddled off on it's travels. I dread to think what might have happened had the rest of the bag got caught on something - one trapped and possibly starved to death hedgehog.

 

motley. adj. varied in appearance or character.

crew. n. group of people.

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quote:
Originally posted by Team Blitz:

One problem, that can happen to anyone, is that they got to a place, like a park, and whilst they may even have been there a few times, have not been to the "hidden corners" where you hide caches.

 

And so you find that hidden corner for the cache, and the day you go, it's clean (probably just been cleared up, or the "users" are using another corner this week) and quiet.... so you think you've found a good place for the cache.

 

Of course things change, people use different areas, or you went originally at "off peak time"..... and you then find your idylic corner is no longer QUITE as nice as it was :-(


 

I am probably as guilty as any about first cache placements. The thrill of finding the sport was too much and I planted a cache out the back of my house so I could watch people finding it. Great for me but probably the only cache of mine I really dislike although its very sentimental. (Oh what a thrill watching Richard of Richard and Beth wondering round in circles for 20 minutes icon_wink.gif )Anyway, It has now changed location 3 times after the first spot which was originally a fallen tree by a stream, gradually became a youth club, got totally ransacked then burnt out!

 

I agree with the post by team blitz about locations changing. We shouldn't always judge things too quickly. My spot, although not brilliant was nice to start with and I was as shocked as anyone to see what happened, in a place which is constantly renound for its tranquility.

 

I would encourage newcomers to plant. Just choose locations wisely. After finding 130 I have planted over 40 and am very proud of almost all of them. There are great places everywhere with a variety of great things awaiting the visitor. Like team nia said not just that, caches can be great in other ways too, challenging or difficult. Just think 'what would I enjoy doing in a cache' and you are bound to please the majority. Happy caching to the lot of you icon_smile.gif

 

Its just a hunt for a lunch box, why be so serious!?! badgerslayer.gif

 

Dan Wilson - www.Buckscaching.co.uk

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quote:
Originally posted by Dan Wilson:

(Oh what a thrill watching Richard of Richard and Beth wondering round in circles for 20 minutes icon_wink.gif )Anyway, It has now changed location 3 times after the first spot which was originally a fallen tree by a stream, gradually became a youth club, got totally ransacked then burnt out!


 

I seem to remember that part of the wandering about was trying to avoid falling into the stream!

 

Having said that there is a certain satisfaction in watching someone doing a cache or a puzzle that someone has set. Beth and I did a wide game for a bunch of 60 kids last weekend, involved 6 teams looking for 6 pieces of their jigsaw (so 36 pieces in total) all hidden in and around a field of several acres. The kids enjoyed it, and it was great fun watching them going back and forth trying to find their pieces.

 

I would say that you should really know a place well before you leave a cache there. As has been mentioned, places are very different at different times. Visit it several times at different times of day, and different points in the week. You also need to bear in mind that what may be the perfect spot might not be at other times of the year. For example you might find your great hiding spot found during the summer becomes rather obvious during the winter, or the opposite that you can't even retrive the cache due to summer growth.

 

Regards,

 

Richard

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This topic is giving me something of a conscience when I think back to some of the caches I have hidden and what rubbish they were and how many rules I have broken.

I have been grumbled at because the contents were sparse and for being devious and a few other things.

On the other hand several logs and emails have been complimentary - in one case at least where one finder grumbled and the next said thank you.

 

I think it all goes to show that we all have different objectives. Personally I think location is the main thing - to take someone to somewhere they might not otherwise go or give a little added point to a visit. That is why I favour virtuals in some cases.

But I fully accept that some prefer a challenge and also that some, especially those with kids, expect to be able to make a reasonable swop which is why if for some reason I have only hidden a smallish box I try to warn that there may not be much there to find.

We should remember that we are setting out to give enjoyment to others, and that some have different ways of finding that enjoyment. So perhaps we should be more explicit in our descriptions as to what sort of cache it is - and more careful in our reading of the descriptions.

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quote:
Originally posted by Tim & June:

We think the most important thing about placing a cache is "go out and find some first".


Not sure I can add anything to the debate that hasn't been said already. Oh, except of course for some numbers... icon_biggrin.gif

 

Average number of finds before first hide: 7

Number of cachers hiding after just one find: 61

Number of caches placed by people with no finds at all: 149

 

The last figure is (hopefully!) skewed by people who find and hide under different identities, or perhaps experienced foreign cachers who place a UK cache before finding any.

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quote:
Originally posted by Tim & June:

This thread was started in order to continue the useful discussion about guidance for new cachers

------------------------------------------------------


 

I have to disagree with a couple of comments here. Specifically:

 

>

 

quote:

_Never_ put foodstuffs in a cache,


 

I have placed cartons of fruit juice in quite a few caches as they can be 'lifesavers' on a hot day. I have also left (and found) sweets on numerous occasions. I have never had ANYONE complain to me about problems caused by this practice.

 

---------------------------------------------

quote:

On the subject of content, generally if a young kiddie should not have it, it should not be in a cache.


 

Why should adults not be able to find 'fun' things as well? In the past I have found such things as a very nice penknife, miniature drinks, adult books (no, not pornography but no not kiddies' books), sharp tools. All good 'stuff' but definitely not for kids. Yes, of course children should be encouraged but not to the exclusion of adults. I don't wany hair bands (not enough hair for that icon_wink.gif), plastic toys, teddy bears (well maybe teddy bears icon_smile.gif) etc. but children do. So I always carry such items with me to add to caches for children to take. By the same token I appreciate more 'adult' goods.

 

Surely no young children go caching on their own do they? What happened to parental supervision?

 

I have thought about placing a cache or two SPECIFICALLY for adults only. The description would make it absolutely clear that this is what it was and the contents would be all adult orientated material (not illegal, not tasteless, just aimed at grown ups.) Would this be allowed I wonder? Would anyone be interested in such a cache?

 

To anyone who has managed to get through my ranting icon_wink.gificon_wink.gif remember - there are as many reasons for geocaching as there are geocachers.

 

Let's not try to limit ourselves to the 'one size fits all', lowest common denominator, politically correct, totally bland way that the worLd outside is developing. Let's be a bit adventurous, let's be a bit daring from time to time. Let's keep a diversity going. Let's try new things from time to time.

 

Yes some will fail, but unless we keep pushing at the boundaries this great game will be in danger of stagnating. I'd hate to see that happen.

 

>

 

My message to any newcomers reading this is: Get out there and ENJOY yourselves in the great outdoors. It's much more fun getting out there in the mud, rain, brambles, nettles etc than sitting in the warm writing about it.

 

Really! icon_smile.gificon_smile.gificon_smile.gif

 

_________________________________________________________

 

It is better to regret something you did, rather than to regret something you didn't do.

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I cannot agree more with what the Hornet has written (we have discussed this privately between ourselves).

Over the past few months we have been inundated with posts on this forum about what we shouldn't put into caches because kids/animals or whatever MAY come across it.

As in all things, sensibility is the key, but we should not be deterred from putting "stuff" into caches because something or somebody MAY come across it. I personally have really appreciated coming across a miniature gin/whisky on a cold winters day..

 

Let's have more caches for "Grumpy Old Men"......

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(This should probably be continued in a new thread sorry) I like the idea of this kind of cache, it would make a nice change from the usual plastic figures and mcdonalds toys (which are great for some! just not all) The only problem would be what if kids did stumble accross it. Before anything like that went ahead we would have to think up ways to ensure that children didn't get their hands on stuff that isn't suitable for them, perhap a set of locks, just an idea?. I would really enjoy finding a couple of minatures don't get me wrong, I would just like to see it done the right way as I'm sure the hornet intended.

 

Its just a hunt for a lunch box, why be so serious!?! badgerslayer.gif

 

Dan Wilson - www.Buckscaching.co.uk

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Yep, I can see your point of view here and agree with you both that is is great to find some really nice goodies in a cache especially when it comes to things like alkifrol. Hic !

 

However, (don't you just hate it when a sentence starts with that ?) There are guidelines/rules which we all agree to when we use the services of GC.com. From virtually all pages within GC.com there is a link to "About Geocaching". In that page there are some interesting facts and figures and then a link to "Guide to Hiding a Geocache" where it says :

 

quote:

Do not put food in a cache! Critters have better noses than we do, and will bite, nibble or swallow your cache in an attempt to get to the goodies. Bottled water is a good alternative (and refreshing to geocachers).

 

Please! No alcohol, tobacco, firearms, prescription or illicit drugs. Let's keep this safe and legal.


 

I guess that in the same way that we sometimes put small tins of fruit in a cache, the small cartons of fruit drink probably do not smell enough to attract animals, and you're right, they really do refresh on a hot day's caching.

 

The reason I generalised was to make it simpler, I was not saying that if an item only had adult appeal it should not be in a cache.

 

Being a little silly now, (those who know me would say "what's new"), Imagine a packet of condoms in a cache, little "Jhonny" is with dad at at the time they open the cache, "Dad, Dad, Dad, Can I have that pack of chewing gum ?" icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

Or even sillier:

 

The headline of the Mirror reads

quote:

"Windsor Great Forest Burnt to the Ground".


followed by the byline :

quote:

"Child goes off to play in the ancient woodland and discovers a box of goodies, drinks two miniatures of whisky, cuts his wrist on a penknife, eats a packet of asparin and then sets fire to the woodland in a drunken stupor".


 

Well, I did say it was silly, and it's been a bad week for us so we are entitled to be silly.

 

On a more serious note, We have been working with "Forest Enterprise" and "English Nature" to try to establish a corporate type of decision on caching, Both have said they do not want foodstuffs or the list of other things we have given, left in caches on the land they manage.

 

On the subject of sweets, apart from possibly attracting animals, sweets often become damp and eventually end up a gooey mess in the bottom of the cache ruining the other contents.

 

Sorry to take issue with you guys, but from where I stand the above seems to make sense.

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by Tim & June:

Do not put food in a cache! Critters have better noses than we do, and will bite, nibble or swallow your cache in an attempt to get to the goodies. Bottled water is a good alternative (and refreshing to geocachers).

 

Please! No alcohol, tobacco, firearms, prescription or illicit drugs. Let's keep this safe and legal.

_


 

Thanks for the reasoned response, I would have expected nothing less.

 

However (that word again icon_wink.gif) - I cannot agree totally with the above two points.

 

1) Given a good container I see nothing wrong with placing 'foodstuffs' in a cache. I think we are going overboard just a bit when we imagine all these dear little critters (rats maybe) attacking our lunch boxes (or steel ammo boxes) in a vain attempt to get at packets of tic-tacs, chewing gum, minstrels and maltesers, all of which I have found in caches. Sure they might eventually get soggy, in which case I replace them with something else and throw the soggy mess away.

 

2) Alcohol?? I see nothing wrong with a small bottle of something 'reviving'. After all it is perfectly legal and IN MODERATION has been proved to actually benefit your health. Tobacco, not so sure - legal yes but no discernable benefits. Firearms & Illicit drugs - No. They are both illegal. Why include them in the same sentence as the other items? Smacks of politically correct do-gooding to me.

 

So - because I disagree with those points does that disqualify me from being a geocacher from now on? If it does then anyone is free to come round to my house and pick up a number of unwanted metal boxes as I shall not be needing them from now on. No charge, just help yourselves.

 

I don't think that will be the case as I have, as suggested, read the guidelines and the Guide to Creating and Hiding a Cache. Yes there are 'Rules' but these define what constitutes a cache, mostly though, contents are covered by 'Guidelines'. As it says at the very top of the Guidelines page - 'These are listing guidelines only. As the cache owner, you are responsible for the placement and care of your cache.'

 

I will continue to place caches and I will continue to adhere to my one golden rule/guideline - Do I consider what I am doing to be reasonable?

 

I don't know if this is really the best thread to continue this discussion but I would really appreciate feedback - positive and negative so I can judge the general mood of our geocaching community.

 

Second rant over icon_wink.gif Thanks for reading this far.

 

_________________________________________________________

 

It is better to regret something you did, rather than to regret something you didn't do.

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quote:
Originally posted by The Good Shepherds:

quote:
2) Alcohol?? I see nothing wrong with a small bottle of something 'reviving'. After all it is perfectly legal and IN MODERATION has been proved to actually benefit your health.

 

All of the above is true.... BUT, isn't there a legal issue with making alcohol freely available to under-18s?


 

I'm not suggesting making alcohol available to all under-18s. I am suggesting a little parental responsibility to supervise their own children when caching.

 

I happen to believe that a reasonably early introduction to alcohol helps develop a sensible approach to its use. My children were offered small quantities of wine (and beer) from a youngish age (around 10-11) which is actually legal. It is the sale that is illegal. They grew up into model citizens (I know - unlike their dad icon_wink.gificon_wink.gif) but that was my position. Other people think differently, fine - but it is up to them to control their own children.

 

_________________________________________________________

 

It is better to regret something you did, rather than to regret something you didn't do.

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Seen on US forums (fora ?)

 

"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, Who's bringing the dips?"

 

I haven't cached all that much but I have found gooey ex-sweeties in a cache.

 

While I initially thought a drink would be nice I left a sachet of drink powder and hinted that the next finder bring their own hot water. Leaving water would seem fine until it freezes, and breaks its container - In this case alchohol would be an advantage. icon_smile.gif

 

The Merikans discussing this simply ask would you eat foodstuff left by a stranger? A little paranoid, maybe, but it has value.

 

My view - surely there is enough stuff to choose from without having to leave items from the forbidden list.

 

On second thoughts maybe not....

"don't leave stuff unsuitable for children"

"There are too many kids toys"

"improve quality"

"don't leave business promos, religious items, perishables, smelly stuff, liquid stuff, sharp stuff, flamable stuff, plastic bags, plastic strips, pornography, aforementioned ATF, drugs"

 

I've got it TNLN

 

Lance

It's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.

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Originally posted by Lance Ambu:

 

On second thoughts maybe not....

"don't leave stuff unsuitable for children"

"There are too many kids toys"

"improve quality"

"don't leave business promos, religious items, perishables, smelly stuff, liquid stuff, sharp stuff, flamable stuff, plastic bags, plastic strips, pornography, aforementioned ATF, drugs"

 

I've got it TNLN

 

Lance

QUOTE]

 

Nice one!!

 

I have always said the joy of geocaching is in the finding of the cache, not the contents, (or the statistics ; icon_biggrin.gif)

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quote:
Originally posted by The Hornet:

I'm not suggesting making alcohol available to all under-18s. I am suggesting a little parental responsibility to supervise their own children when caching.


 

This is all well and good when there ARE parents around to exercise discretion - the problem is, can you guarantee that every cache is always going to be found in the company of an adult? I would guess that the vast majority of caches that go missing are found by gangs of kids. (case in point - there's a huge thread over on the "general" board right now concerning a log book that a mother found in her 12-year old son's bedroom - she saw the geocaching URL in the book, and logged on here to find out what the book was to do with. Turns out that a gang of kids (son included) had accidently found a cache, taken it away and split the booty between themselves(!)).

 

Suppose the cache was full of alcohol, knives and condoms? Bad press waiting to happen, IMHO icon_frown.gif

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There is a thread in the "Dicussion" forum about "adult" caches.

 

See this thread.

 

In this case it is about caches with, shall we say "more explicit" adult content and not the sort of thing "The Hornet" is considering at all (at least, I hope not, Peters too upright for that sort of idea).

 

Anyway, Jeremy say's "I'd apply the same reasoning regarding food in caches to adult toys". True, he didn't mention alcohol but if food is such a no-no ...

 

Plus, I didn't really want to go through a long description here. Oh well !

 

In the USA, there are very tough regulations placed by the authorities on geocaching. No caches are allowed in National Parks and loads of other state parks. In some states you have to get permission from the Rangers before you can place a cache in a state park. In other states, you have to get a licence for each cache you place, full details must be given and approved. The licence lasts just four months after which the cache must be removed or re-licenced. There are LOADS more.

 

We want to prevent that happening in the UK. June and I have been trying to get a form of blanket approval for caching in the UK. At the moment we have been working on "Forest Enterprise" (who oversee the Forestry Commission) and "English Nature". These two bodies are the largest land managers in the UK. If we win agreement with them, all others should be easy because we would have something of a strong precident.

 

Now, if both of these have said they don't want Food, Alcohol, drugs (prescription or otherwise), explosives, matches, cigarette lighters, knives etc in caches on their land, should we not comply ?

 

If we cannot take police ourselves, what chance of getting an agreement, even in principle from these bodies ?

 

Perhaps we should give up trying and just let things take their course in the UK like it has in the states.

 

Tim & June (Winchester)

 

See June, I told you that sign which said 'Unsuitable for Motor Vehicles' was wrong ! icon_smile.gif

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quote:
Originally posted by Tim & June:

 

In this case it is about caches with, shall we say "more _explicit_" adult content and not the sort of thing "The Hornet" is considering at all (at least, I hope not, Peters too upright for that sort of idea).

 


 

Don't know about 'upright' icon_wink.gif but, no, I'm definitely NOT advocating explicit material.

 

_________________________________________________________

 

It is better to regret something you did, rather than to regret something you didn't do.

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It's amazing with all this furore over a little alcohol that something like this hasn't come up:

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=19929

 

I think it's important to remember that the US has a slightly different culture to the UK. I've been known to take a penknife from a cache...and very handy it is too, but big, pointy dagger-like things wouldn't be acceptable contents here.

 

I have only found alcohol once and that wasn't even in a cache...it was just a nice bonus for the first finder. As was the case in this instance, it's probably sensible to locate it away from the cache and in an area that isn't really accessable to children...unless they steal a car, but that's entirely different!

 

I wouldn't leave sweets, not only because critters may find them attractive, but also because of the fact that they are liable to go soggy...and no, I wouldn't eat anything that was left in a cache...I would drink something though if it was in a can!

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I personlay see nothing wrong with adult content, being a new cacher and a perent of two. But I do have a couple of consirnes.

 

Alchole and Adult content(adult books)

My kids are only 2 1/2 and 5 months. but whathappens when they reach 14-16 an acceptable age to find caches in my oppinion. If we dropped them off and picked them up in a certain area or at a certain time. I would not like them to find alchole or porn. But I would hope they were responsible enough to handle a penknife or simular object.

Theire was a thread written about caching with kinds in the new cachers section, and they said check contents before letting your kids see whats inside. I don't think this is always posible, especially when you lett the kids find the cache.

I can see it now. Sorry little Joney I know you found the cache but mummy or daddy ( cairer ) has to check the cache before you can look in it."

Could you emagin the dissapointment they would have.

But if the caches were marked addults only then their would not be a problem would there.

 

The Targett Family

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We are always with our children when they open the cache and tell them what they can and can't take. Providing the contents are the sort of things children have access to on any shopping trip then we've got no problem.

 

We don't agree with leaving food, drinks (including alcohol - kids might find a cache) and wouldn't want anything which could get infected or spread disease.

 

Dave

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I can sympathise with both view points on cache conents. On one side will a kid get drunk on a minature? Secondly if you child is so young that the amount would harm them then surely they are too young to be out playing in areas where caches might be by themselves.

If they are old enough to be out and about by themselves they will most likely have tasted alcohol before! and it is not a minature secreted away somewhere you have to worry about it will be the £2 for a 2 litre bottle of 9% strenth blow your head off cider that they manage to obtain from the oldest looking friend that they have. Surely you all remember at school?You know "your turn to try the off licence, you are the tallest/oldest most stubble covered least spotty etc etc. Girls are the worst, a bit of make up high heel shoes and some smart clothes and it is difficult to tell how old they are these days.

A child that gets picked up by the police or ambulance staggering around the street at night causing trouble is not the cause of a cache treasure.

Knives on the other hand can be dangerous in the wrong hands and I dont think they are a good idea.

But then again it is clearly stated in the rules that we all read when we signed up to the site.

 

Hear about the 2 blondes that walked into a bar?

You would of thought at least one of them would of seen it!!

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