Caches Premium

[+AronDaCunha]

Hello,
I've been wondering for a while now, why do people create premium caches? What do they gain from it? Why do they do it? I've seen people with around 800 caches and all of them are premium.

[+JL_HSTRE]

Usually it's to limit visitation, especially by newbies or cache thieves.

 

I set my Earthcaches and Challenge Caches to Premium because I was tired of newbies who couldn't understand they were different from Traditionals.

[+NanCycle]

As protection from those "newbies" who just discovered the app on their phones and don't know anything about how the game is supposed to be played.  For instance, often they think the cache is supposed to be taken and rehid somewhere else.  There is a cache now "somewhere in Alaska" that was taken from its location in Colorado by someone who didn't know better.

[+kunarion]

1 hour ago, AronDaCunha said:

Hello,
I've been wondering for a while now, why do people create premium caches? What do they gain from it? Why do they do it? I've seen people with around 800 caches and all of them are premium.

 

Of my 84 caches, only 5 were PMO, and I adopted two of those as PMO.

 

One was in a place where nobody could keep a cache. At times, hundreds of kids descend on the place for soccer, which is so boring to watch, the kids end up exploring the forest area, and they destroy anything they find.

 

So I decided to see if I could make a cache that endures.  I planned my new cache for 5 years.

It must be very aggressively hidden.  This makes it less likely to be found by walking past it.

It must have a high difficulty.  This makes it not show up as readily in The Official App.  But since it still would show up on the web site,

It must be PMO.  Now someone very bored who wants to do anything but watch soccer, who installs The App without any idea what Geocaching is, they are locked out.  Anyone can still find and log my PMO cache, but they almost certainly will learn some Geocaching etiquette before they find it.

 

This has made a spot that otherwise cannot have any cache at all into a quiet cache that is found and enjoyed, is in good shape when found, and has Favorite points.

 

Sometimes PMO is the reason there is a cache in a place.  I decided a cache is better than no cache.  PMO being just one part of the plan.

 

AND since the Official App blocks "Advanced Caches" with higher D/T, I've since removed PMO and it's doing OK.  But not every placement can survive that way.

 

Of the two that are still PMO, I've asked veteran local cachers, and when they say to keep it PMO, I keep it PMO.  

 

Edited August 24 by kunarion

[+GeoElmo6000]

31 minutes ago, NanCycle said:

As protection from those "newbies" who just discovered the app on their phones and don't know anything about how the game is supposed to be played.  For instance, often they think the cache is supposed to be taken and rehid somewhere else.  There is a cache now "somewhere in Alaska" that was taken from its location in Colorado by someone who didn't know better.

 

Unfortunately GCHQ made the decision that app users can't see any non traditional caches with terrain or difficulty above a 2, so just making a cache stat greater than 2 works the same as making it premium.  Unless they know to use the website from their computer or phone, which I've been teaching others about for some time.

[+NanCycle]

5 minutes ago, GeoElmo6000 said:

 

Unfortunately GCHQ made the decision that app users can't see any non traditional caches with terrain or difficulty above a 2, so just making a cache stat greater than 2 works the same as making it premium.  Unless they know to use the website from their computer or phone, which I've been teaching others about for some time.

But if the cache isn't really above 2 T or D,  that is misleading to "real" cachers.  And the ones who have learned enough to be able to use the website are not the ones who are the problem here.  

[+kunarion]

7 minutes ago, NanCycle said:

But if the cache isn't really above 2 T or D,  that is misleading to "real" cachers.  And the ones who have learned enough to be able to use the website are not the ones who are the problem here.  

 

+1

 

Not every cache can be adjusted to be actually above T2/D2.  And PMO means one doesn't need to keep current on what causes a cache to become an "Advanced Cache", or who can view it or under which circumstances they can view it.

 

Edited August 24 by kunarion

[+barefootjeff]

45 minutes ago, NanCycle said:

As protection from those "newbies" who just discovered the app on their phones and don't know anything about how the game is supposed to be played.

 

Unfortunately a lot of those newbies, at least around here, start off with premium membership before they've even found their first cache. That said, I currently have two of my 52 active caches set to PMO, one that I'd thought had gone missing but which I subsequently found rehidden inside a hollow tree some 50 metres away, and the other in a somewhat precarious location that could be dangerous for kids just downloading the app.

[+kunarion]

11 minutes ago, barefootjeff said:

 

Unfortunately a lot of those newbies, at least around here, start off with premium membership before they've even found their first cache.

 

Right.  PMO by itself may not be enough to make a cache safe, especially if it is easily found by muggles.  PMO can be a tool used as part of a bigger plan.

 

But it also seems like many caches acquire PMO just because.  Maybe because the CO thinks his cache is cool, and wants to reserve it for PM cachers.  But I've noticed that people like to click web site buttons without an understanding of the consequences ("Collectible", anyone?).

 

Edited August 24 by kunarion

[+paulohercules]

On 8/24/2024 at 9:31 PM, AronDaCunha said:

Hello,
I've been wondering for a while now, why do people create premium caches? What do they gain from it? Why do they do it? I've seen people with around 800 caches and all of them are premium.

Because of everything written above, and maybe more...

Edited August 25 by paulohercules

[+paleolith]

And the closely related issue that someone who just loads the app and goes, has not provided an email address, and likely cannot be contacted.

[+cerberus1]

On 8/24/2024 at 4:31 PM, AronDaCunha said:

I've been wondering for a while now, why do people create premium caches? What do they gain from it? Why do they do it? I've seen people with around 800 caches and all of them are premium.

Used to be newbies were terrible at not reading up on how to play this hobby, and pmo was a way of shooing them away. They don't see them.

Now, many newbies start with PM accounts, so a PMO hide means nada...   Some would be better off raising the D/T they're hiding in.

 - To be clear, we never "adjusted" a cache to keep "weekend n done" kids away, our caches were all rated correctly for D/T in placement. 

Currently, 2 in D/T is the limit.

[+AronDaCunha]

Ok thanks, I think I understand the concept.

[+Saenger]

On 8/24/2024 at 10:31 PM, AronDaCunha said:

Hello,
I've been wondering for a while now, why do people create premium caches? What do they gain from it? Why do they do it? I've seen people with around 800 caches and all of them are premium.

My first years as a cacher were as a normal user, my first hides as well. As I don't use an Apple, I had no problems with all cache-types and D/T-ratings, as long as the cache was not PMO.

Then I showed my godson the game, and I had to readjust, as he's an apple-kid. On the holiday next to no interesting caches showed up on his iPhone, so I granted him a premium account as a birthday present.

With his data I found out, that there are more caches ion my homezone then previously seen, so I got myself a premium account as well. But I would never hide a cache as a pmo, as a) for Apple users pmo ist anyways the only valid way of caching, so they have it asap, so the "no noobs"- reason is in reality non-existent, and b) I'd like to give normal users access to my caches with a higher rating as well, not just the boring 1/1ers. If noobs are exposed to more interesting caches from start, methinks they will stick with geocaching better and longer, and that's what we want after all: Happy noobs to continue with our hobby.

[+GeoElmo6000]

1 hour ago, Saenger said:

My first years as a cacher were as a normal user, my first hides as well. As I don't use an Apple, I had no problems with all cache-types and D/T-ratings, as long as the cache was not PMO.

Then I showed my godson the game, and I had to readjust, as he's an apple-kid. On the holiday next to no interesting caches showed up on his iPhone, so I granted him a premium account as a birthday present.

With his data I found out, that there are more caches ion my homezone then previously seen, so I got myself a premium account as well. But I would never hide a cache as a pmo, as a) for Apple users pmo ist anyways the only valid way of caching, so they have it asap, so the "no noobs"- reason is in reality non-existent, and b) I'd like to give normal users access to my caches with a higher rating as well, not just the boring 1/1ers. If noobs are exposed to more interesting caches from start, methinks they will stick with geocaching better and longer, and that's what we want after all: Happy noobs to continue with our hobby.

 

It's not Apple vs. Android, it sounds like you're using an Android-only app (that cannot be named here) that isn't approved by Geocaching HQ as a partner app and it's scraping data off the internet for your benefit to get around the rules set in place by Geocaching HQ for app use.  I don't agree with Geocaching HQ's rules for their apps, as I believe that whatever caches we can see on the website should be visible on the app, but that's another topic of discussion, and as a premium member I can see all caches using my approved partner app Cachly.

 

If you don't agree with hiding a cache as PMO, then don't.  I don't have any PMO, and my earlier comment about the D/T 2+ was just an example of how people who follow the rules of app use are limited into finding non-premium caches only with a premium account (which again I disagree with).

 

There are reasons to hide a cache as PMO, as mentioned above, but I personally don't hide them PMO as I want as many people to find them as possible.