Old Logs After Replacement In Other Caches

[+KYcachingguy]

I have had to replace several logs for other caches (not owned by me) due to logs being full or too wet to sign. I was wondering what everyone does with the removed logs. Do you keep them? Throw them away?

 

I've seen people leave them in small and larger caches, but that isn't feasible in a micro or nano cache. Just wondering since I have accrued a collection of logs.

 

[+Max and 99]

Since they're not mine, I don't usually take them. On the rare occasion the log really needs to be changed, I will take a photo to send to the CO. 

[+sokrkx]

I leave them unless they are molding and falling apart terribly.  I always leave if a challenge cache. .  

[+KYcachingguy]

21 minutes ago, Max and 99 said:

Since they're not mine, I don't usually take them. On the rare occasion the log really needs to be changed, I will take a photo to send to the CO. 

What about Micro and Nano caches, especially those that are soaked beyond signing? I run into those a lot around my area because of a proliferation of micro/nano caches. 

 

6 minutes ago, sokrkx said:

I leave them unless they are molding and falling apart terribly.  I always leave if a challenge cache. .  

I can understand leaving a challenge cache log. What if the container will not allow it or the log is wet? I always replace with rite-in-rain logs.

[+sokrkx]

Good point, nano I just always make sure my signature fits.  I don’t generally carry mirco logs.  Others, I fit back what I can and remove what I can’t. It’s a case by case basis but I try to leave as much in as possible. 

[+Max and 99]

16 minutes ago, sokrkx said:

Good point, nano I just always make sure my signature fits.  I don’t generally carry mirco logs.  Others, I fit back what I can and remove what I can’t. It’s a case by case basis but I try to leave as much in as possible. 

I completely agree.

[+Deepdiggingmole]

To be honest if the logs are in that condition the container needs to be improved - I don't replace the logsheet, as what i put in will end up the same way - I do an OAR log with a recomendation that the container needs upgrading and let the CO deal 

Edited August 10 by Deepdiggingmole
spelling

[Pup Patrol]

We don't take logs or repair/replace containers.  Some times, we will stick a piece of paper in it with our name.  Some times we won't even attempt to do anything, and will take a photo.

 

Most important is to post a "maintenance required" log.  Old broken mushy logs and containers need to be reported.  If the cache owner is not going to maintain their hides, they need to be archived.

 

This situation is clearly explained in the Help Center:

 

https://www.geocaching.com/help/index.php?pg=kb.chapter&id=107&pgid=434

 

If you have already taken logs, you can try to contact the cache owner.  They probably don't care or haven't been in the game for a while, so you will end up throwing them out.  It's best not to take them at all, and deal with the problem in another way.

 

 

--Pup Patrol

Edited August 10 by Pup Patrol

[+arisoft]

Send photos of the log to the cache owner when replacing the log if there is no space for the old log. 100% of the cache owners are grateful to you for the help you offer.

[+cerberus1]

7 hours ago, KYcachingguy said:

I have had to replace several logs for other caches (not owned by me) due to logs being full or too wet to sign. I was wondering what everyone does with the removed logs. Do you keep them? Throw them away?

I've seen people leave them in small and larger caches, but that isn't feasible in a micro or nano cache. Just wondering since I have accrued a collection of logs.

No, you didn't "have to".  It's nice of you to do so, but it's not a given...   Are you doing maintenance for everyone?   

We have maintenance requirements for our own caches, and finders have a few action logs to add when needed.

We have added strips in different widths of Rite in Rain paper, meant to tide a cache over until the CO can maintain it himself.

If a micro/nano log is simply "full", I'd find a spot somewhere to put at least C1 on it and say in my log it's full.

Folks aren't too quick to put OAR (the old NM) on caches here, and usually I'm the first jack adze to do so.

If it's a moldy lab experiment, I'll take that thing and put it in another baggie, leaving a temp RIR strip in it's place. CO email followed.

Never had a CO want it for some odd reason.     

I get home to find a dozen people "Found It" and some might have mentioned the condition, but not a single OAR...

[+JL_HSTRE]

If I were to remove a ruined logsheet from a cache then ideally I would photograph both sides of the logsheet and attach the photos to my online log where I reported replacing the logsheet. Then I would throw out the ruined physical logsheet.

[+KYcachingguy]

14 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

No, you didn't "have to".  It's nice of you to do so, but it's not a given...   Are you doing maintenance for everyone?   

I don't mind replacing logs that are full or damaged because I feel that helps the game. I am reluctant to replace containers, even though I just did it yesterday, but it was just a pill bottle which my wife and kids can supply to me monthly. What is aggravating is when I message a CO to ask about caches I wasn't finding, and they tell me to "feel free to replace the containers". On one hand I understand them asking for help in this case because it is a Medal of Honor series with almost 500 hides, but when they put in their cache description to "feel free to do maintenance", that bothers me. It's like they already are not planning to keep up with them. I saw a different CO call it "Green Geocaching" like it's somehow helping the environment.

 

If I need to replace containers, then the cache should be adopted to me. 

[+geoBirder]

If the old log is “soup,” then I replace it, and mention it in my log. If there’s a different issue with the old log and I replace it, I contact the CO and ask what they would like done with the old log. Often I receive a “just throw it out” message, but sometimes I get asked to photograph it and send it to them (which I do.)

[+paleolith]

I don't keep my own old logs when I replace them, so ...

[+Om_and_Nom]

Not referencing ANYONE in this chain - I don't know why some players are afraid to do an Owners Maintenance log when there is a full log and/or ruined log.  That's what the option is there for (among other things) is to let the owner know that they need to check on their cache.

 

If the container can support it, I add another log (I never take the current one) and do an maintenance request letting them know what I did.  If it's a micro...since I don't take the log, I sign with whatever tiny room there is and do a maintenance request so the owner can obtain their log and replace it with a new one.  

[+Om_and_Nom]

On 8/10/2024 at 4:12 PM, cerberus1 said:

No, you didn't "have to".  It's nice of you to do so, but it's not a given...   Are you doing maintenance for everyone?   

We have maintenance requirements for our own caches, and finders have a few action logs to add when needed.

We have added strips in different widths of Rite in Rain paper, meant to tide a cache over until the CO can maintain it himself.

If a micro/nano log is simply "full", I'd find a spot somewhere to put at least C1 on it and say in my log it's full.

Folks aren't too quick to put OAR (the old NM) on caches here, and usually I'm the first jack adze to do so.

If it's a moldy lab experiment, I'll take that thing and put it in another baggie, leaving a temp RIR strip in it's place. CO email followed.

Never had a CO want it for some odd reason.     

I get home to find a dozen people "Found It" and some might have mentioned the condition, but not a single OAR...

 

Sounds like you play like I do - I'll come up to a cache, pull up the recent logs...and find a bunch of, "missing cap but signed log", or "logbook full signed where I could", with NO OAR LOG. Much like you, I find myself the first one to slap that on there.

[+KYcachingguy]

6 hours ago, Om_and_Nom said:

I don't know why some players are afraid to do an Owners Maintenance log when there is a full log and/or ruined log.  That's what the option is there for (among other things) is to let the owner know that they need to check on their cache.

I will do an OAR if the container is broke, letting water in, or missing. 

 

The OAR option is not easily available for logging. It is something you have to seek out. I think that may be one reason more people don't use it, especially those who only use the app.  

[+hzoi]

On 8/10/2024 at 7:50 AM, KYcachingguy said:

I have had to replace several logs for other caches (not owned by me) due to logs being full or too wet to sign. I was wondering what everyone does with the removed logs. Do you keep them? Throw them away?

 

Depends on the situation, really.

 

Too full? When I post my "found it" log, I'll note that I replaced the log and let the CO know I'll hang onto it for a bit if they want to see it. In 17+ years, I have yet to have anyone ask me for it back.

 

Too wet? I'm not hanging onto a manky piece of paper. Gone. And unless I happen to have a plastic bag on me as well, I'll only leave a small scrap of whatever paper I have handy, because odds are my replacement log's going to turn into a sponge as well.

Edited August 14 by hzoi

[+Deepdiggingmole]

On 8/11/2024 at 1:22 PM, KYcachingguy said:

I don't mind replacing logs that are full or damaged because I feel that helps the game.

Though I am not putting down your kindness here and  am sure many COs are grateful
Howwever, there is a flip side and I have noticed this trend in more recent years 
New cachers see and read that finders are replacing logsheets and think that is how this game is played - to the point that they do not deal with any maintenance issues as they are now expecting finders to do it - to the point that some COs get annoyed when an OAR log is added saying 'why couldn't you have replaced the logsheet' 
The guidelines do say this is the responsibility of the CO and if an OAR is added they should respond to that and deal 
We should not be saying to folk you must go out and take spare logsheets with you (yes, you see this said a lot in various forums) - if cachers do, that it is a bonus for the CO but it should not be an expectation and those many cachers who do not go out with spares should not be chastised for not doing so - and yes, they are ! which is wrong.

[+Deepdiggingmole]

On 8/10/2024 at 1:50 PM, KYcachingguy said:

I have had to replace several logs for other caches (not owned by me) due to logs being full or too wet to sign

Just a quickie regarding this statement - No, you have not had to replace any of that, it is not your responsibility - doing so is your choice, but you didn't have to replace any of it :-) 

[geobeezo]

On 8/11/2024 at 5:00 PM, paleolith said:

I don't keep my own old logs when I replace them, so ...

Do you ever compare signatures on the logs to what has been entered in the app as far as who found it?

[+paleolith]

On 8/25/2024 at 2:36 PM, geobeezo said:

Do you ever compare signatures

 

No, not worth the trouble. The only times I would care about fake logging are 1) massive armchair logging, 2) logging Found on a cache I think is missing. The first is rare. The second usually doesn't require looking at the log to discern.

[+MNTA]

3 hours ago, paleolith said:

 

No, not worth the trouble. The only times I would care about fake logging are 1) massive armchair logging, 2) logging Found on a cache I think is missing. The first is rare. The second usually doesn't require looking at the log to discern.

 

Yep only deleted two logs that I recall. One a newbie losing a challenge cache. I do check challenge qualifications as mine are travel related like to see where on the map folks have been and are from. The other deletion was my remote cache 60 miles way out in the middle of nowhere on a forest road noticed a new name so checked on them cool they were from England. Then noticed they had not grabbed any other caches along the road or in the area or in the state. Hmmm it's like almost a two hour drive from the airport and not a tourist draw. Then noticed they found a cache in Georgia also remote and 10 in England on the same day. The owner of the Georgia cache asked if he had invented a Tardis and the cacher admitted to logging by accident. I waited a day then deleted.

 

If you are going to cheat don't make it obvious. 

 

After a few signatures they always seem to jumble up and then add in someone adding extra paper or moisture issue because someone ripped the baggie and did not say anything in the log. What's the point. They know if they did it or not. I'll fix a problem but auditing was near impossible. Do you audit a cache that has gone missing? Honor system.

[+baer2006]

2 hours ago, MNTA said:

If you are going to cheat don't make it obvious. 

There are cachers who make it blatantly obvious, but most COs just don't care at all.

[+TOW Vehicle]

Why keep them more than a year?

It's a game.

How many Cache Owners really compare them to  the computer list?  Seems to me many players tent to use one name one the sign in and another on the website.... and then argue that they found it when it gets deleted off the cache site.

[+justintim1999]

I typically don't replace logs.   I'll add a scrap of paper with my name on it to make the find official.    

 

This is what a "Needs Maintenance" log is for.    If the cache owner is still active, they will check up on the cache and make fixes as necessary.   If they are not, the cache will be on its way to being archived and someone else can place a new one in its place.       

[+MuddyWaterGirl]

I don't mind replacing log sheets. I enjoy drying out the wet ones and perusing the signatures. Some are friends I may have cached with in the past, even sigs of some old timers who have passed away. I have decoupaged some on an ammo can that I use as a Travel bug. Its fun to have cachers stop and search the logs for theirs or friends sigs, especially those with log ago dates on them.

[+Deepdiggingmole]

On 8/27/2024 at 4:27 AM, paleolith said:

 

No, not worth the trouble. The only times I would care about fake logging are 1) massive armchair logging, 2) logging Found on a cache I think is missing. The first is rare. The second usually doesn't require looking at the log to discern.

1) Not as rare as you think - but you wouldn't know as you don't check your logs - I have come across several fake and armchair logs on my caches because I have checked the physical log to the online ones - I am not sure how you would know otherwise other than the blatant 500 logs in a day in 15 different countries 

[+paleolith]

On 11/27/2024 at 7:42 AM, Deepdiggingmole said:

I am not sure how you would know otherwise

 

As you say, excessive logs in a day or logs over excessive distance. But more of the online logs I see are for a set of caches in my neighborhood. They are infrequent enough that I generally look at the profile and see if the recent logs are consistent with previous logs. Usually they Find several in the neighbohood and DNF one or two. Very often they write enough of a comment to confirm they actually visited.

All this could be spoofed of course, but fake logs are AFAIK mostly brute force attacks, not carefully programmed or AI-powered.