gunther Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Just looking in I have noticed that this forum has now been spoiled by a few people... is this a coincidence but the forums on GeoCacheUK seem to be taking off nicely. Maybe I just have a poor opinion of people and their motives but if the cap fits!!!! Quote Link to comment
Morseman Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:Just looking in I have noticed that this forum has now been spoiled by a few people... is this a coincidence but the forums on GeoCacheUK seem to be taking off nicely. Maybe I just have a poor opinion of people and their motives but if the cap fits!!!! Every now and then a topic comes up that gets people started, me included. I wonder if you ever ventured onto UseNet (normally called newsgroups now)? Because, if you think the debate on here is 'heated', it's nothing to some of the debates that rage out there. As I said in another posting, please read this in a calm voice and not an agressive one. --... ...-- Morseman Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 13, 2003 Author Share Posted May 13, 2003 I hear what you are saying but this does not seem like heated debate to me, rather an attempt to undermine anything to do with Geocaching.com (or at least the UK portion). Some people seem to want to be the bastions of freedom and free-speech when it comes to geocaching in the UK and vilify anything to do with geocaching.com. GeocacheUK and N*vic*che members are the worst offenders - as to N*vic@che members I dont know the history, BUT as for GeocacheUK - thats a different story. GeocacheUK started off the back of Geocache.com and even is "approved" by them... funny how their aims seem to be the complete domination of geocaching in the uk - a bit of the Oedipus Complex I would say. GeocacheUK is a parasite living off the back of this very forum - where if it were not for the people who regularly contribute would not even exist. Anyway don't read this as aggressive or ranting, just in a calm and measured manner. Quote Link to comment
+Teasel Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I joined GeocacheUK because I enjoy database programming, not because I wanted world domination! If you think GeocacheUK will come out of this furore unscathed (let alone strengthened!), then you are, sadly, very mistaken. GeocacheUK - resources for the UK Geocaching community. Quote Link to comment
MCL Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 "GeocacheUK started off the back of Geocache.com and even is "approved" by them... funny how their aims seem to be the complete domination of geocaching in the uk - a bit of the Oedipus Complex I would say. GeocacheUK is a parasite living off the back of this very forum - where if it were not for the people who regularly contribute would not even exist." This is a troll, right? GeocacheUk has nothing whatever to do with trying to dominate anything. It is not and never has been an "organisation". It has never sought to represent anyone, or to control anything. Its sole aim in life is to take the data that is available from the GC.COM servers, and re-mould it to provide interesting new charts and tables. In doing this it costs Mark a lot of time and money, something which he has never asked a penny in return. He provides a *service* to you and to me, free of charge, should we wish to use it. If we don't, then we don't have to. Yes there are forums over there on GeocacheUK, primarily set up for people to discuss the things they would like Mark and Teasel to add to the site. It so happens that those forums are unmoderated, which means that no-one controls who or what is posted there. Please don't make the mistake of thinking that the views you get off there are either approved of or disapporved of by Mark. To suggest that GeocacheUK is in any way a hostile organisation to GC.COm or its forums here is just downright wrong. GCUK is neither hostile, nor an organisation. If you have any information that might prove me wrong then I am all ears. If you haven't then please don't make such unfounded suggestions. No trees were harmed during the production of this posting, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.... Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 "This is a troll, right?" - a bit obsessed with trolls this forum!!! Trigpointing - I rest my case m'lud Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote: TheCatAdmin Group Joined: 25 January 2003 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 119 Posted: 11 May 2003 at 03:25 - IP Logged -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for the post Icenians It was better that it came from someone other than the Admin's on this site. __________________ TheCat Administrator. GeocacheUK.com oh and heres another one direct from G:UK forum Quote Link to comment
+Teasel Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 The Icenian's post in question being: quote:T&J are trying to rebuild the thread so please ignore top part but don't forget to vote. which followed an accusation by him that T&J deliberately deleted the thread! TheCat and I have both posted in this forum expressing both support for, and reservations about, GAGB. However, as G:UK admins, we are at least trying to be impartial. The anti-GAGB faction can point at the large link to GAGB on our homepage and say we're using our position to support GAGB. The pro-GAGB faction can point at our reluctance to reprimand Icenians for posting accusations on our forum and say we're trying to undermine GAGB. We can't win - the only question is how much will be lost... GeocacheUK - resources for the UK Geocaching community. Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 Excuse me but how can replying in a forum as "ADMIN" stating that you are glad someone posted something that they couldnt because they were "ADMIN" can be construed as impartial? Also I take it that MCL is mistaken that th eforums on G:UK are unmoderated quote: Yes there are forums over there on GeocacheUK, primarily set up for people to discuss the things they would like Mark and Teasel to add to the site. It so happens that those forums are unmoderated, which means that no-one controls who or what is posted there. As "ADMIN"'s I would think you are in control of what is posted there - no? Quote Link to comment
+Teasel Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Also I take it that MCL is mistaken that the forums on G:UK are unmoderated Yes, and no... The G:UK forums do have a moderator (Washboy), and Mark and I also have the ability to moderate if necessary. However so far, we've never actually had to moderate anything. quote:Excuse me but how can replying in a forum as "ADMIN" stating that you are glad someone posted something that they couldnt because they were "ADMIN" can be construed as impartial? Unsubstantiated attacks, such as the one originally posted by Icenians are not something we like to get involved in, as they can do nothing but harm. I therefore second Mark's thank-you to the Icenians for his retraction. We could not have posted a retraction for what he said; we could only have joined in the argument and supported T&J. Are we pro-GAGB for being glad he retracted his accusation? Or anti-GAGB for being glad we didn't have to post a "hey, steady on, T&J wouldn't do that sort of thing" response? The admins got involved only by saying they were glad they didn't have to get involved! I'm sorry if this counts as impartiality, but it's the best we can offer! [This message was edited by Teasel on May 14, 2003 at 04:52 AM.] [This message was edited by Teasel on May 14, 2003 at 05:09 AM.] Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 If somethings worth saying , its worth saying twice, I tell you worth saying twice... Quote Link to comment
+The Bennett Family Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Sadly however, Your first point was so unfounded it wasn't worth saying at all.... We take our children everywhere, but they always find their way back home... Quote Link to comment
+DerekReed Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Because yesterday was a nasty day weather-wise, and I was feeling quite unwell , I thought I'd take a look in here at the forums for the first time, instead of doing a few local caches that I've been looking at. I really wish I'd braved the hailstorms, and gone out. I'm very sorry to see all this upset, and it'll be a shame not to see it for a while, but maybe someone could send me an email when it's all gone quiet. See you later if you're at a local cache bash even. Hoping to go to Winchester on 19th July, and hope the language is calmer there than it is here. Tara... Derek Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote: Sadly however,Your first point was so unfounded it wasn't worth saying at all.... And yours is? Quote Link to comment
+Teasel Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:If somethings worth saying , its worth saying twice, I tell you worth saying twice... Sorry! Keyboard attachment error my end! That "D'Oh duplication" wasn't aimed at you, but at myself. I'd tried to do a minor edit to my original post (to change "accusations" into "such accusations"), but ended up with a duplicate post instead! I've since re-edited my edited duplicate into into a reply to your reply to my original reply. Confused yet? 'Cos I am! There's a lot of grief been caused by problems with Infopop recently! GeocacheUK - resources for the UK Geocaching community. Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Unsubstantiated attacks, such as the one originally posted by Icenians are not something we like to get involved in, as they can do nothing but harm. I therefore second Mark's thank-you to the Icenians for his retraction. I'm sorry if I misunderstood TheCat here. I thought he was refering to the post and not the reply - thank you for clearing up the ambiguity. Quote Link to comment
el10t Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:I'm sorry if I misunderstood TheCat here. I thought he was refering to the post and not the reply - thank you for clearing up the ambiguity. Same here. Rich mobilis in mobili Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote: posted May 14, 2003 05:08 AM quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Gunther: I'm sorry if I misunderstood TheCat here. I thought he was refering to the post and not the reply - thank you for clearing up the ambiguity. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Same here. Rich Though it would have been a lot simpler if this could have been stated originally in the same thread as you challenged the statement and not waited for this forum to bring it up!! Quote Link to comment
Mudplugger Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Suspicions as to the real Agenda of G:UK have probably been heightened after the Trigpointing scenario a short time ago where a perfecly good site was replaced and incorporated into G:UK. I guess Mark and Teasel should self-moderate their posts (on both forums)in the future to prevent threads like this. My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right. Quote Link to comment
+washboy Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Might I suggest that anyone who's motivated to slag off G:UK do it in the G:UK forums instead of here? There is unlikely to be any censorship there and you can receive the robust response that, I'm sure, many would like to offer you but prefer not to further disturb the equilibrium around here. ===== There's no such thing as a free lunchbox! Quote Link to comment
Mudplugger Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 I was not slagging off G:UK and apologise to all if this was read into my post. Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote: Might I suggest that anyone who's motivated to slag off G:UK do it in the G:UK forums instead of here?There is unlikely to be any censorship there and you can receive the robust response that, I'm sure, many would like to offer you but prefer not to further disturb the equilibrium around here. No further questions from the prosecution m'lud, I think the jury now can see exactly what has transpired here. Quote Link to comment
+washboy Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Mudplugger:I was not slagging off G:UK and apologise to all if this was read into my post. Thanks, Mudplugger My post was directed primarily at the originator of this thread. ===== There's no such thing as a free lunchbox! Quote Link to comment
+washboy Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:No further questions from the prosecution m'lud, I think the jury now can see exactly what has transpired here. Hmmm! My recollection is that the counsel for the prosecution began by making inflammatory accusations and insinuations, not by asking questions! Justice or prejudice? ===== There's no such thing as a free lunchbox! Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 14, 2003 Author Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote: Thanks, Mudplugger My post was directed primarily at the originator of this thread and your comment as I have said just about sums it all up. Although it is OK to use this forum to blantantly plug G:UK it is not good enough for a debate on the motives and aspirations of G:UK. Quote Link to comment
+washboy Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:and your comment as I have said just about sums it all up. Although it is OK to use this forum to blantantly plug G:UK it is not good enough for a debate on the motives and aspirations of G:UK. Clarification please? Are you insinuating that my suggestion to spare the good people of this forum further offence/boredom/you-name-it by taking this nonsense to the g:uk forums is a blatant attempt to plug g:uk? If you want to debate the motives and aspirations of g:uk here (and others want it too) then go ahead. But bear in mind that g:uk is not an organisation or a company. It is merely a web site which hosts a few free services for the benefit of UK-oriented geocachers. TheCat pays for it and it is only because of his generosity that it exists. Teasel developed and maintains the stats database (which, for me, is 50% of my enjoyment of caching) and, latterly, t:uk. Teasel has already explained his involvement. Me? Well, last year, when g:uk was in its infancy and the stats pages were all but homeless, I happened to meet TheCat. I asked if there was anything I could do to help out with g:uk (I really wanted the stats pages back on-line). Teasel had already volunteered to resurrect the stats pages and TheCat asked if I would be willing to keep an eye on the forums for him. Now, I may be a naive sort but, in my few dealings with TheCat, I've seen no evidence of empire-building or megalomania. If ever I do, I shall join the lengthening ranks of ex-cache forum moderators TheCat has been quiet, so far, in this thread. I don't blame him. I don't know what his feelings are but I wouldn't be surprised if his silence has not a little to do with a reluctance to see gc.com stirred up any more than has been done already. Hence my invitation to take your concerns to a less delicate place. ===== There's no such thing as a free lunchbox! Quote Link to comment
+Brenin Tegeingl Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 In reply to Mudpluggers commement, jeramies Trigpoint site is still active and the loging of trigpoints was replicated on G:UK and not replaced, which created some bad feelings at the time. In reply to Gunthers last comment about the blatant plugging of G:UK this forum, Mark and Ian tried to avoid blatant pluging before official recognition. And when our retiered admin thought overwise they steped in and publicly said so. You seem to be one of the very small minority who are trying to use these forums to drive geocaching underground in the uk, with all your criticism rather than helping this sport to evolve in the uk. This is just my personal oppinion, but thats how your posts come across as. I burn to cache! Quote Link to comment
MCL Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:"This is a troll, right?" - a bit obsessed with trolls this forum!!! Trigpointing - I rest my case m'lud Ah thats probably because we have had rather a lot of trolling in the past. I did actually take your post at face value which is why I replied sensibly to it. I notice that from all I said in it, all you could come up with as a reply was the above. You don't actually have any hard evidence to back up what you say do you? No I am not mistaken in saying that there is no moderation on G:UK. Washboy is indeed empowered to moderate, but in practice he doesn't. So therefore they are unmoderated. Gunther, what the hell is it you have against G:UK? Have they done something horrible to you? Have they sent you a caching bill you can't afford to pay? Have they cut off your access to the GPS satellites? Do they sap the life out of your Duracells while you sleep at night? I am trying hard here to grasp why it is you are going down this path. Please tell us all, just what it is you have against Mark, Ian and Washboy. No trees were harmed during the production of this posting, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.... Quote Link to comment
MCL Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:GUNTHER: No further questions from the prosecution m'lud, I think the jury now can see exactly what has transpired here. There is no jury, and no-one is on trial, so stop trying to metaphorically put anyone in the dock. Apart from what anyone else has said, the main reason not to slag off other organisations on these forums is that it puts GC.COM's moderators (who are now all over in the US, don't forget) in a potentially awkward position. To use an analogy, you don't walk into Tescos and start slagging off Sainsbury's at the top of your voice. If you do, Tesco's managers get a bit edgy and politely ask you to desist, becuase they don't want to be seen by Sainsburys as stirring up trouble. Besides, its just plain rude, EVEN THOUGH you are quite within your "legal" right to free speech. By the same token, it was pointed out on here a while back that to start to discuss other website's business/problems/etc on here was not the best move, and might even lead to Jeremy Irish (The US boss) taking action from afar. This is even more the case when the website in question has a free and open forum of it's own, so it just makes good sense to put your greivances over there, rather than here. We do not wish to attract the ire of our US overlords on here. THATS why the recommendation is that you desist here and take your problem over there. You can still post here if you want, but frankly this is not the best place to do so. There are other better ones. Doesn't that make sense to you, Gunther? Quote Link to comment
+Omally Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by MCL:<snip> I am trying hard here to grasp why it is you are going down this path. Please tell us all, just what it is you have against Mark, Ian and Washboy. I concur: From my viewpoint, GC:UK is as neutral as Switzerland and simply a repositrory of information. Gunther, just what is your beef, man? What shade of rose-tinted are your glasses? Methinks a trip to the optician is in order. Quote Link to comment
MCL Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Actually I think Gunther has given us the clue in his original post. He said: "Maybe I just have a poor opinion of people and their motives" I think that you are right, Gunther. You *do* just have a very poor opinion of people. And you seem to have no idea of their motives either. And the more you speak your mind on here, the more obvious it becomes that you have a problem of some sort with how you view your fellow man. Deal with it. Because *we* can't, until *you* do. No trees were harmed during the production of this posting, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.... Quote Link to comment
gunther Posted May 15, 2003 Author Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:Geocacher posted May 14, 2003 05:59 PM Actually I think Gunther has given us the clue in his original post. He said: "Maybe I just have a poor opinion of people and their motives" I think that you are right, Gunther. You *do* just have a very poor opinion of people. And you seem to have no idea of their motives either. And the more you speak your mind on here, the more obvious it becomes that you have a problem of some sort with how you view your fellow man. Deal with it. Because *we* can't, until *you* do. Sorry but I just really started reading this forum recently and after when the GAGB thing I thought this is the sort of thing we do. Just following other peoples example. Quote Link to comment
+Omally Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gunther:Just following other peoples example. Well, maybe it's a better idea to set your own example to us all and behave in a more gentlmanly manner. You don't have to do as everyone else does, y'know. If you saw a lemming throw itself off a cliff, would you follow that example too? I think not! Quote Link to comment
+DerekReed Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Omally:If you saw a lemming throw itself off a cliff, would you follow that example too? I think not! If it had a GPSr in one hand, and a Geocaching Waypoint sheet in the other hand, I *might* possibly (read probably) just throw myself after it. Quote Link to comment
+The Bennett Family Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:If you saw a lemming throw itself off a cliff, would you follow that example too? I think not! Hmmm...i dunno, was the Lemming following a 'free beer here' sign? 'cos if it was then I just might. We take our children everywhere, but they always find their way back home... Quote Link to comment
MCL Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Omally:If you saw a lemming throw itself off a cliff, would you follow that example too? Oh, we can but hope... No trees were harmed during the production of this posting, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.... Quote Link to comment
Rockratgirl Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Omally:If you saw a lemming throw itself off a cliff, would you follow that example too? Oh, we can but hope... Nope, but I might just tell Fangmonster that there was a brilliant cache to find over that cliff ... Sam ~ Love many, trust few, learn to paddle your own Canoe ~ ~ We can't run away for ever ... but theres nothing wrong with getting a good head start ~ Quote Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.