THE GEOPIRATE HAS LANDED IN BC, II

September 22, 2003

Can I be Cache-Advance too?

What if this "Captain Urchin" is really a group of people? Why are we just pointing fingers at Jomarac?

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

September 22, 2003

If I go to the main forum page it shows he IS logged in. He just posted here 20 minutes ago. It'd seem strange he hasn't checked back. But seeing as you guys have such a tight network there for calling upon each other I'm sure you could call him to come and read the forums, particularly my question. Maybe I'll answer then.

1.6k · September 22, 2003

The relevance of Cache-Advance being anybody in particular that caches under another handle is a speck of dust compared to the relevance of the question first asked by an administrator of this site.

For some people, it's time to stop walking around with plank-eye.

September 23, 2003

Back to the real topic here. Pirating in BC. If it is my cache to do with as I please, can I post on my page that people who don't like pirates cant hunt my caches?

Sounds fair it IS, after all, my cahce. Better yet can I name names too?

COOL!!!

Hey but wait a minute... What is geocaching.com going to do about these dasturdly ne'erdogooders who violate my caches? Will they babysit for me? Will they right nasty letters to the scoundrels?

It's all good kids, now go outside and play. And remember, PLEASE share your tupperware!!!

Pirates be warned, the British Man O' War has been dispatched!, Resistance is futile!, To the stockades with 'im!, Arrrr!!!

[This message was edited by WCoaster on September 23, 2003 at 12:44 AM.]

September 23, 2003

Hippie likey pirate... Pirate left Hippie some free Tupperware

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

September 23, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SombreHippie & Puppy Dawg:
Hippie likey pirate... Pirate left Hippie some free Tupperware

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

SombreHippie & Puppy Dawg are allowed to do my caches.

You can steer all you want, but it is all for not if your not moving forward!

September 23, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SombreHippie & Puppy Dawg:
Hippie likey pirate... Pirate left Hippie some free Tupperware

RobertM likey pirate too... Pirate did not "plunder" my cache, he merely had some good clean fun and left a free Tupperware for someone

September 23, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by WCoaster:
SombreHippie & Puppy Dawg are allowed to do my caches.

I'm waiting... Can I do your caches too?

September 23, 2003

I don't post much But in my view the game is evolving which is what is stated in the Brief History Page

Since the launch of the web site, the Geocaching sport has grown to caches in all 50 states and over 100 countries. There are now many variations of the game, including virtual caches, offset caches, puzzle caches, and multi-stage caches.( New ideas and new great games crop up every day.)

The idea of stealing is WRONG but I don't think this is theft.Cach is found by pirate (I assume it is logged) Items taken, item left

The original cache still in place.

The next Cacher should be able to read the note and locate the Pirated goodies,follow instructions (left by pirate) and get a cache container to BOOT. Sounds good to me

Send Pirate to the interior we need more caches here ( the coast has to many ) This concept might produce more caches

That,s my thought

lesparrow

1.6k · September 23, 2003

You might assist by placing a cache or two in your area. I put a series of no less than 12 caches out in Abbotsford for under $30.00.

Good to hear from someone who doesn't post all the time!! Cheers.

September 23, 2003

I have plans to bo so but with the Fire and back country ban And PROCRASTINATION(spelling) this might give the extra push I know excuses

off to work

lesparrow

[This message was edited by lesparrow on September 23, 2003 at 08:33 AM.]

September 23, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by lesparrow:
The idea of stealing is WRONG but I don't think this is theft.Cach is found by pirate (I assume it is logged) Items taken, item left

The original cache still in place.

The next Cacher should be able to read the note and locate the Pirated goodies,follow instructions (left by pirate) and get a cache container to BOOT. Sounds good to me

Send Pirate to the interior we need more caches here ( the coast has to many ) This concept might produce more caches

That,s my thought

lesparrow

lesparrow makes a good point here. Something I havent thought of. The pirate(s) may actually help increase cache placements by providing the finder with the free good quality container and hopefully enough enticement and encouragement to fill it up and hide it.

Cache in, trash out.

Find a cache, hide a cache.

Hmmm, interesting idea.

You can steer all you want, but it is all for not if your not moving forward!

September 23, 2003

Well, just when it was getting interesting again, Jeremy has stated his complete abhorrence of the idea. Prepare to be outed, ye would-be knaves! I still think it would have been fun.

"Thank you for calling Mom's Travel Service. Guilt Trips our specialty. Where would you like to go today?"

September 23, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by lesparrow:
I don't post much But in my view the game is evolving which is what is stated in the Brief History Page

Since the launch of the web site, the Geocaching sport has grown to caches in all 50 states and over 100 countries. There are now many variations of the game, including virtual caches, offset caches, puzzle caches, and multi-stage caches.( New ideas and new great games crop up every day.)

The idea of stealing is WRONG but I don't think this is theft.Cach is found by pirate (I assume it is logged) Items taken, item left

The original cache still in place.

The next Cacher should be able to read the note and locate the Pirated goodies,follow instructions (left by pirate) and get a cache container to BOOT. Sounds good to me

Send Pirate to the interior we need more caches here ( the coast has to many ) This concept might produce more caches

That,s my thought

lesparrow

Nice to see you posting, lesparrow. I'm glad you and your family are doing well with all the fires and what not going on there.

I agree that the pirate is not stealing, but the pirate is still unnecessarily moving all the contents of the cache to a coordinate-less location, no longer making it a geocache. Even if the pirate did leave some coordinates, that would turn a simple traditional cache into a multi-cache, even if the owner didn't want it to be.

I do appreciate the pirate’s cache-duplication attempt, but it can be done without moving all the contents and turning it into a multi. The pirate could simply do exactly what he/she is doing now except move nothing, or trade like a normal geocacher, and still leave the hidden treasure map and pirate container as usual. That way geocachers who want to pursue the hidden treasure can do so, and those that don't want to can simply log and trade in the original cache without having to do a second hunt.

_____________________________________________________________________

Please visit the Ham Radio Forums at www.ham-radio.ca. Thank you.

- VE7DPT

Vancouver, BC, Canada

September 23, 2003

Hey, I could use a cache-advance.

$500.?

September 25, 2003

Following the Wet Coast Explorers (I think?) lead, I yoinked and re-hosted this image, which is now sitting in my profile with an explaination.

I have no problem with Captain Urchin.

I suggest the icon be used as a "solution" to the Urchin. There was a pirate free zone icon posted by I think Jomarac as well.

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

1.6k · September 25, 2003

I publicly call on the owners of this site to put an end to the effects of the willful contempt shown by those who advocate the pirate concept in the Vancouver area.

I will not be doing any caches that display the 'pirate zone' logo.

If the folks around here want to play a different game with the para-site, let them list their caches somewhere else.

That this so-called Captain Urchin has been able to round up a small handful of deckmates is astounding.

September 25, 2003

quote:
I will not be doing any caches that display the 'pirate zone' logo.

If the folks around here want to play a different game with the para-site, let them list their caches somewhere else.

Sorry Zuuk, I didn't mean to ruffle your, or anyone else's, feathers. Man, this issue is sure polarizing the community.

I created the Pirate Zone logo because (1) there's a pirate theme to my cache - and others in the area, and (2) I'm okay if someone wants to 'pirate' my cache, as long as they follow the rules as posted at http://www.piratecaching.com/rules_of_lootin.htm. My cache is in a big park, with tonnes of alternate hiding spots and I think this could add some additional/unexpected surprise to someone finding this cache. Do I think that pirate caching is appropriate in any circumstance??? Absolutely not. But maybe, in some cases, it might be okay.

I liked Jomarac5's idea of a Pirate Free Zone, but on the other hand, I don't necessarily want to see his logo posted on 90-99% of caches, or have some cache pirated because someone forgot to post the logo or didn't even know that this was required to protect it from pirates. I thought the idea of saying 'hey, if you want to pirate this cache, go ahead but follow these rules' and also saying 'hey, if you find this cache be warned that someone may have pirated it' was a better approach to take. Maybe I'll be proved wrong and forced to walk the plank or marooned on some island with no caches. I hope not.

Cheers, and happy caching!

No matter where you go, there you are

September 25, 2003

Sorry Zuuky but "Pirating" is welcome at my caches as long as it's done with fun intent.

True pillaging and theft by so called cachers of which has always occurred in this activity will not be tolerated. (though I won't be getting too bent out of shape over an old bucket and a few used McToys etc.)

1.6k · September 25, 2003

My sentiment was inspired by this post by Peregrine007 of course:

quote:
I've been lead to a cache that's already "flagged" as "pirate-friendly", and I think it's a great idea to welcome pirates to your cache - this may well deter anti-pirates from seeking your cache as well

There is no way I will buy into the concept of someone parasiting off the geocaching.com website via such an activity as p#####caching.

September 25, 2003

Hey, I only meant that this could (under certain circumstances) serve to be an added thrill to geocaching. It makes no difference to me whether this is adopted by GC.com or any other site - it's irrelevant. People who may choose not to look for caches that are welcome to Urchin's Pirating ideas can also be forewarned by the cache owner placing the "pirate zone" logo. That was my only intent with that note.

Personally, I'd prefer to see GC.com adopt this as a new twist to geocaching, rather than

"someone parasiting off the geocaching.com website" (Zuuks words). The way things sit now, it doesn't look like that will happen, but who knows. I'm not trying to alienate anyone or any web site here - just showing my support for what I think is a great idea that can really improve an already great "game".

September 25, 2003

quote:
It makes no difference to me whether this is adopted by GC.com or any other site - it's irrelevant. People who may choose not to look for caches that are welcome to Urchin's Pirating ideas can also be forewarned by the cache owner placing the "pirate zone" logo. That was my only intent with that note.

Personally, I'd prefer to see GC.com adopt this as a new twist to geocaching, rather than

"someone parasiting off the geocaching.com website" (Zuuks words). The way things sit now, it doesn't look like that will happen, but who knows. I'm not trying to alienate anyone or any web site here - just showing my support for what I think is a great idea that can really improve an already great "game".

Here, Here Peregrine!

Now people want to tell me what I can and cant put on my cache page? Next they will want to tell me the LAT & LONG to place it too.

I think this new logo is the best idea yet. It is basicaly what everyone in the general forum has been asking for. It could simply be an extra option you click when you create a cache. Then we can all get off this nonsense and go caching.

Well except for Zuuk, he cant do my caches. LOL

Just kidding Zuuk.

You can steer all you want, but it is all for not if your not moving forward!

1.6k · September 26, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by WCoaster:

You can steer all you want, but it is all for not if your not moving forward!

You can press the gas pedal as much as you like, but if you don't steer, you'll end up in a ditch.

Imagine the towing bill.

September 26, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
I publicly call on the owners of this site to put an end to the effects of the willful contempt shown by those who advocate the pirate concept in the Vancouver area.

I will not be doing any caches that display the 'pirate zone' logo.

If the folks around here want to play a different game with the para-site, let them list their caches somewhere else.

That this so-called Captain Urchin has been able to round up a small handful of deckmates is astounding.

Canadazuuk, I'm not too sure what your problem is with the concept of the "pirate zone" logo. It does not interfere with the property of others without their permission. It does not mislead anyone who may be looking for the cache. Caches displaying the "pirate zone" logo have in fact been approved by Geocaching.com. This is "make-beleive" Piracy - not true piracy. I can't see any harm in this. If this "interesting twist" was implemented in this manner in the first place, a whole lot of forum space would have been saved.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.6k · September 26, 2003

It's a philosophical disagreement. I'm wearing MY lobbyist hat for a minute.

I disagree with the way in which this concept was tossed upon the community, and how it seems that those in favor of the concept just keep dodging the many issues until they've so watered down their concept, that no one really cares anymore.

Is the p#####caching website part of the concept that is being officially allowed? Make note that the 'pirate zone' logo is now present on p#####caching.com as well as some of our local caches.

If gc.com admin could confirm this is now acceptable, I'll drop the issue.

September 26, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
If gc.com admin could confirm this is now acceptable, I'll drop the issue.

I don't understand what the "this" is in your sentence. If you clarify, perhaps an admin will comment.

Pan

Profanity is the crutch of the inarticulate, ***hole. - Unknown

1.6k · September 26, 2003

Re: 'this'

Is it acceptable now to have caches listed on geocaching.com with the 'pirate zone' logo, knowing that these caches may also be shown in various pages on p#####caching.com?

In other words:

Is it now officially accepted by geocaching.com that we have a new variant to the game that openly involves p#####caching.com?

To me, it's important to define what is allowed in light of the controversy and confusion. None of the pirate concept advocates appear to be asking for this clarification; it appears to me that they are pushing forward with or without sanction.

September 26, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
To me, it's important to define what is allowed in light of the controversy and confusion. None of the pirate concept advocates appear to be _asking_ for this clarification; it appears to me that they are pushing forward with or without sanction.

Why require a "sanction"? There are many, many caches that are a variation of the original “hide the cache - post the coordinates - find the cache” routine. I have always presumed that these caches were simply the products of creative minds, that were submitted, and accepted without any specific "sanction". I don’t think the board of Geocaching.com ever actually sat down and made a decision to “allow” a new variation. Virtual caches / travelling caches / multi-caches/ locationless caches / off-set caches / puzzle caches / and caches that require you to find other caches, were all created in this manner. I think that my “Robert Burnaby Par 3" cache is kind of a variation - nine phony locations and one real one. It was submitted, and accepted - I never asked for a sanction. Of course, some of the variations, have subsequently been rejected or modified when they have apparently become problematic to TBTB.

The only problems that I ever had with the so called “pirate” Geocaching, are 1. The fact that the perpetrators were interfering with caches without the owner’s consent - to me a fundemental breach of the Geocaching ethic; and 2. The fact that the pirating was causing the posted cache description to be misleading. The “Pirate Zone” logo appears to address both of those issues.

Now of course, Geocaching.com can “disallow” the “Pirate Zone” logo on a cache description (which they don’t appear to have yet done). They have however, allowed other logo links that add new elements to the game such as the “Canadian GeoCoin” logo that you see on many caches, that links you to that site so that you can play the tracking game that Canadian GeoCoins offer.

However, if the “Piratecaching.com” site continued to advocate the non-consensual interference with caches, then if I were TPTB I would probably not allow the “Pirate Zone” logo (linking to that site) to be displayed. But if that site smartened up its act, and made is absolutely clear that no caches should be interfered with, except with the express consent of the owner, I think I would allow it, and let the Geocaching players at large decide if they want to play.

I have no problem with anybody submitting any cache for approval, no matter how much it changes the concept. I am quite prepared to leave it up to Geocaching.com as to whether or not they are going to approve the cache. This will keep the creative juices flowing. If I personally do not like the variation, I simply will not look for it.

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

1.6k · September 26, 2003

Disregarding all the absurdities this whole 'topic' brought out, the only real 'last word' I am waiting for is from the owners of gc.com.

If it's okay with them for p#####caching.com to directly influence the game on THIS site, then that's what I'm waiting to hear.

September 26, 2003

Canadazuuk, I hit the little yeild sign on your post above (with the bold) because I would be interested in an admin comment.

Pan

Profanity is the crutch of the inarticulate, ***hole. - Unknown

1.6k · September 26, 2003

Thank you.

And one thing I really feel I need to say:

I'm not against 'people'. It's the issue that is debated.

September 26, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
I'm not against 'people'. It's the issue that is debated.

If only that were true of everyone.

Pan

Profanity is the crutch of the inarticulate, ***hole. - Unknown

September 28, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by WCoaster:

I think this new logo is the best idea yet. It is basicaly what everyone in the general forum has been asking for. It could simply be an extra option you click when you create a cache. Then we can all get off this nonsense and go caching.

_____________________________________________________________________

Please visit the Ham Radio Forums at www.ham-radio.ca. Thank you.

- VE7DPT

Vancouver, BC, Canada

1.6k · September 28, 2003

The phone rings at the pirate plank factory.

Caller: 'Hi, I'd like to leave a message for Mr. Urchin please.'

Receptionist: 'I'd be happy to assist.'

Caller: 'Please let him know that the message is: there's no message'.

September 28, 2003

Zuuk, I'm happy to relate to you that you've made your point. I feel that it's safe to say that you may stop repeating the same points over and over again.

I will now reply to this by saying:

Just because you don't like something doesn't mean that nobody else should have the right to enjoy it.

With the kaffuffle you've made over this, I'd be perfectly fine if you chose to never seek any of my caches in the future. I'm not in the least offended by your threat to do such. If requested, I can even make you a Canadazuuk Free Zone icon to go along with the Pirate Zone ones...

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

1.6k · September 28, 2003

My question has never been answered. That point has been missed by you it appears.

Feel free to place 'canadazuuk free zone' stickers on whatever caches you would like.

September 28, 2003

What was the question? It seems to have been lost amongst pages upon pages of b#*$@ing.

A great serial killer once said, "Beauty is only skin deep. Trust me, I've looked..."

1.6k · October 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Cache-Advance:

Jomarac5, for the record, are you or are you not Captain Urchin?

Cache-Advance

Geocaching.com Admin

quote:
Originally posted by NJ Admin:
I'm Cache-Advance

I'm Spartacus

I'm not Captain Urchin

Jomarac5, are you any of the above?

There is a question in there somewhere. Albeit rhetorical.

2.7k · October 3, 2003

I don't like Jomarac5's version of 'opting out'. If it HAD to be done at all, the 'opting-in' would be better.

Frankly, the last multi I did was exhausting for me, and if I got to the cache and had to jump around more, I'd give it up. Sorry I am not as fit as the rest of you, but that's the way it is.

So for that reason I'd like the 'opt-in' logo. They'd be the caches I'd avoid.

And besides, isn't a "Pirate-Free Zone" sign basically a 'kick-me' sign?

Pirate Logo = available to raid

no logo = leave it alone

I could live with that, even if it means I'll never visit any of the PL caches.

---------------------

Don't hurt me. I'm new here.

October 3, 2003

Originally posted by GroundClutter:

OH MY GOD somebody please put the lid on the sandbox before someone looses (just for you RobertM! ) an eye!!!

I'm going to go now, and cry for my dictionary.

How much intelligence does it take to sneak up on a piece of tupperware?

1.6k · October 5, 2003

Jomarac5 just phoned me and woke me up this morning, and finally admitted to me that he is Captain Urchin.

Apologies to SeekerBC for posting this on the monster cache thread. The topic could continue here.

1.6k · October 5, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:

Interpret things whatever way you want Zuuky. But you are wrong once again. I don't think that anyone *deserves* to have their caches stolen.

Really? Okay, then please interpret this for me:

quote:
Originally posted by Jomarac5:

It's my understanding that there is only ONE cache owner in Vancouver who's caches are going missing. Perhaps, it has something to do with that cacher? Perhaps, he's been ticking off people for a long time and someone is just fed up with the BS?

That's pretty darned specific for a guess Jomarac5.

You attempt to side-step the issues by discrediting everyone that gets in the way of Jomarac5 doing what Jomarac5 wants to do.

1.4k · October 5, 2003

Let me give you my interpretation of this Zuuky.

I said what I said. Go back and read it again -- it simply states the cacher (I assume that he is the only one who's caches have gone missing) is quite well known for upsetting others and it is possible that he's ticked off the wrong person. I did not say, or even infer, that the reason for the caches being stolen is justified or that anyone deserves to have their caches stolen. As you well know, I do not condone the stealing of caches for any reason.

I could give you a list of at least half a dozen local cachers who have been upset enough that they might do something along this line -- you know who's who and you know the things that have gone on around here. Problem is, that there's so many that have reason to hold a grudge that it would be impossible to even make a quess at who the perpetrator might be.

Discrediting people for getting in the way of fun, Zuuk? I don't think so. Those people generally do a good job of that to themselves, without the help of anyone else.

*****

edit: typo

[This message was edited by Jomarac5 on October 05, 2003 at 09:24 PM.]

October 6, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
Jomarac5 just phoned me and woke me up this morning, and finally admitted to me that he is http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.aspx?A=159336

Canadazuuk, for someone who doesn't like the "Captain Urchin" concept, you are doing an amazing job at publicizing it! You've now posted the link to the profile on at least 3 different threads. I had no idea what the Captain Urchin concept was until you brought it to my attention. As stated in previous posts (on another thread) I am very impressed with the idea (regardless as to who started it), particularly in view of the fact that it does not involve any actual piracy.

Honest creativity is what made Geocaching great!

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

October 7, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by seneca:
Originally posted by canadazuuk:
Jomarac5 just phoned me and woke me up this morning, and finally admitted to me that he is http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.aspx?A=159336

Canadazuuk, for someone who doesn't like the "Captain Urchin" concept, you are doing an amazing job at publicizing it! You've now posted the link to the profile on at least 3 different threads. I had no idea what the Captain Urchin concept was until you brought it to my attention. As stated in previous posts (on another thread) I am very impressed with the idea (regardless as to who started it), particularly in view of the fact that it does not involve any actual piracy.

Honest creativity is what made Geocaching great

_______________________________________________

I'm betting 10 to 1 odds *CANADAZUUK* is the pirate. He has been doing reverse publicing for them, maybe even without knowing it.

1.7k · October 7, 2003

I have been going through the forum posts since my last visit, and two cachers keep showing up, bickering.

You'd think they were a recently divorced "couple".

When someone gets on my nerves, I don't keep posting to encourage them.

You can't force someone to do anything by making a post on a forum.

DustyJacket

Not all those that wander are lost. But in my case...

1.4k · October 8, 2003

quote:
You'd think they were a recently divorced "couple".

That's funny, maybe it was a rest stop divorce.

Whatever the case, what's it to you? You're a little far away from your regional forum aren't you?

*****

THE GEOPIRATE HAS LANDED IN BC, II

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