premium caches take priority?

[AA1PR]

I dont understand the site as to how premium caches that do not show on the play map take precedence over those of us that are non paying members when placing a new cache

apparently there are premium caches which dont show to non subscribers which are hidden in some same areas and they take priority?

why dont these at least show on the map but keep the info and exact cords hidden
or a red circle like when I was submitting another cache that told me there was a prem cache already in the area

 

Ive attached a map in my request to mainepublisher  & what it shows me, it shows no caches in the area whatsoever

 

this is totally unfair to those of us that cant not afford to pay to play
I am disabled and I am sadly one of those members that has been here for over a decade

 

Ill move my cache(s) again in an attempt to find another location where I see no caches listed only to hope there are not any premium caches already there

 

I totally oppose this in protest of unjust disqualification because geocaching.com wont show premium caches

 

please correct this issue or find a reasonable resolution

 

thank you for your time & understanding, hopefully things can be changed so we dont run into these issues as I surely must not be alone in this

 

AA1PR

[RuideAlmeida]

Answering the question in your title. No!

Maybe you are talking about the absence of the Final Points and Physical Stages of Multis, Mysteries, Letterboxes, etc.

Every geocacher would go straight to the Final Points of all the caches, if their were visible on the maps, don't you agree?

 

But if you are talking about the few Premium Only Caches... they are decided from each owner, not HQ.

 

And finally, if you are talking about the official app, while being Basic Member, it will show only easy (in D/T) Traditionals close to the location where you use it. If you move, the app will show others. But, that condition is totally absent from the homepage.

Edited October 12, 2021 by RuideAlmeida

[+Max and 99]

22 minutes ago, AA1PR said:

 I dont understand the site as to how premium caches that do not show on the play map take precedence over those of us that are non paying members

Makes sense to me.

[+niraD]

2 hours ago, AA1PR said:

please correct this issue or find a reasonable resolution

The resolution described in the last section of the Help Center article Check for minimum distance seems perfectly reasonable to me.

[+Max and 99]

3 hours ago, AA1PR said:

apparently there are premium caches which dont show to non subscribers which are hidden in some same areas and they take priority?

You do realize that even PM geocachers may see the same blank map as you do?  They don't know either if there are any geocaching conflicts unless they have solved all the local puzzle caches, multi-caches etc. When PM geocachers want to place a new geocache they have the same issue you do. On the website map you can see where these PM T and first stage of multi geocaches are. You just cannot see the final location of multi and puzzle caches, which nobody can unless they have solved or completed them. 

The help center offers a suggestion how you can check a spot with a reviewer. 

[+barefootjeff]

1 hour ago, Max and 99 said:

You just cannot see the final location of multi and puzzle caches, which nobody can unless they have solved or completed them

 

Even then they still don't appear on the planning map (even if the puzzles and multis are yours) and, to make it worse, after you've found a mystery or multi cache, the icon on the map moves back to the original bogus coordinates even if you've put the solved coordinates into the cache page.

[+Max and 99]

13 minutes ago, barefootjeff said:

 

Even then they still don't appear on the planning map (even if the puzzles and multis are yours) and, to make it worse, after you've found a mystery or multi cache, the icon on the map moves back to the original bogus coordinates even if you've put the solved coordinates into the cache page.

Something many of us wish would be changed! 

[+Isonzo Karst]

 ALL published physical caches "take priority". You own a couple of multi-caches. Anyone who tries to place too near their finals will be disappointed.  See nirad's post above, with the link to the coords checking article - it shows the best way to do a first check on coords.

 

Near a Multi you own,  N 43° 39.700 W 073° 04.100     Pretend you're in that area, and see a spot for a new hide.  Before placing, put those coords into search

https://www.geocaching.com/play/search?lat=43.661667&lng=-73.068333&origin=+N+43°+39.700+W+073°+04.100&g=-1&utr=false

 

It will show you that there's a PMO cache way too close.   What it won't show you  or anyone  is where are the stages, where is the final? 

 

Mary Wells --My Guy # 5--Hercule Poirot Multi-Cache | GC6MH2T by bellyrot 91ft NE3  This is a Premium-Only geocache. Upgrade to Geocaching Premium to find it.

 

Edited to add that because the cache is PMO, you can't see it to find it. This is true of all staged PMO caches for Basic members.  But it's a small part of

published caches in most areas.  You can use search to work around PMO traditional caches.

Edited October 12, 2021 by Isonzo Karst

[+cerberus1]

15 hours ago, AA1PR said:

I dont understand the site as to how premium caches that do not show on the play map take precedence over those of us that are non paying members when placing a new cache

apparently there are premium caches which dont show to non subscribers which are hidden in some same areas and they take priority?

why dont these at least show on the map but keep the info and exact cords hidden
or a red circle like when I was submitting another cache that told me there was a prem cache already in the area

Ive attached a map in my request to mainepublisher  & what it shows me, it shows no caches in the area whatsoever

 

this is totally unfair to those of us that cant not afford to pay to play
I am disabled and I am sadly one of those members that has been here for over a decade

 

I totally oppose this in protest of unjust disqualification because geocaching.com wont show premium caches

please correct this issue or find a reasonable resolution

One of the benefits of paying for Premium Membership is the ability to place a premium member-only cache.  We've never placed one.

We haven't found a difference, other than it's only available to PMs, but if you want to see them, then you get yourself a PM...

BTW, we haven't played a single online game that didn't require payment to advance into it.

 

As a basic member, if you're using the app instead of the website, you also aren't seeing any cache over 2 in Difficulty/Terrain.

Those "advanced" caches can all be seen by using the website instead.  Multi, virtual, and letterbox hybrids a few...

I could play the rest of my time for free in this hobby by simply using the website, and enter coordinates manually (and I start at 2+ in terrain).

Free membership, and the option to use the website to find all caches (other than pmo..) has been a thing since the hobby started.

 

Protest all you'd like, but there's been a premium membership since 2002, and that's not about to change anytime soon...

 

[+kunarion]

16 hours ago, AA1PR said:

Ill move my cache(s) again in an attempt to find another location where I see no caches listed only to hope there are not any premium caches already there

 

It's good to know which caches are nearby when placing one.  Attend Events, and ask local cachers, especially people who've found a lot of caches in the area.  If it looks like a great spot for a cache, there may be a cache already.  When I was a Basic member, I appreciated locals mentioning that a place was already pretty full of caches, and especially that it's a place where caches tend to go missing.

 

One important reason that people make their caches "Premium Members Only" is, they had a hard time keeping a cache there.  PMO was the final idea before the cache would need to be archived.  It just gets muggled too often if it's not PMO.  The whole plan is that fewer people will know where the cache is.

 

So beware that if you're intent to place your caches in areas that have PMO caches, you may be dissapointed in the cost and amount of work it takes to keep a cache viable there.

 

 

Edited October 12, 2021 by kunarion

[+coachstahly]

16 hours ago, AA1PR said:

....as to how premium caches that do not show on the play map take precedence....

 

Isonzo Karst already mentioned it but I'm going to follow up a bit.  It's not that they take "precedence"; it's that they fall within the guideline that prevents cache saturation - no physical cache can be placed within 528 feet (.10 miles) of another physical cache, owned by you or anyone else and visible or invisible to you or anyone else.  This particular cache just happens to be a premium cache that prevents you from placing your cache where you wanted it to be.  You would be denied if it were a basic cache that happened to be the physical final of  - a puzzle cache, a Wherigo cache, an offset letterbox hybrid, or any physical stage/final of a multi cache.

 

It's certainly frustrating but niraD provided you a link that should alleviate some of the issues you're encountering here.

[+barefootjeff]

9 hours ago, kunarion said:

One important reason that people make their caches "Premium Members Only" is, they had a hard time keeping a cache there.  PMO was the final idea before the cache would need to be archived.  It just gets muggled too often if it's not PMO.  The whole plan is that fewer people will know where the cache is.

 

Making a problem cache PMO only works if the source of the problem is basic member cachers. I created a multi a few years back with a themed object as the first waypoint. It was defaced a few weeks after publication, which I thought most likely by muggles stumbing across it, so I moved it a bit further from the trail and, just as a precaution, made the cache PMO. All was well until recently when, on a routine check, I discovered the replacement waypoint had been attacked again. This time, though, I'm pretty sure the attacker was a rat and, in hindsight, it seems likely that was also the original attacker. So the waypoint object is now inside a rodent-proof box and the cache is no longer PMO. Time will tell if the problem has been resolved.