Separate Lab Account

[+mmmPIZZA]

Hello all. I wanted to ask a question and see what others have done or what others think of this.

 

I personally see Adventure Labs as a separate game to the main Geocaching game we all know and love. And I felt like AL finds should have personally count to my total finds. So I made a second account and I simply log any adventure labs on that account. I was wondering if anyone else did this as well? Or wether others think it is pointless, etc. I’m just curious to what others think really.

 

My accounts:

mmmPIZZA - All geocache finds except ALs

mPZLabs - Only adventure lab finds

[+Max and 99]

18 minutes ago, mmmPIZZA said:

Hello all. I wanted to ask a question and see what others have done or what others think of this.

 

I personally see Adventure Labs as a separate game to the main Geocaching game we all know and love. And I felt like AL finds should have personally count to my total finds. So I made a second account and I simply log any adventure labs on that account. I was wondering if anyone else did this as well? Or wether others think it is pointless, etc. I’m just curious to what others think really.

 

My accounts:

mmmPIZZA - All geocache finds except ALs

mPZLabs - Only adventure lab finds

Do you mean they shouldn't count?

 

The Help Center tells you how to delete your finds for adventure labs, so I delete all but one for each Adventure Lab.  Others choose to use a different account to find adventure labs. I think both ways are just fine. 

Although this is really a non-issue, keep in mind you may confuse a cache owner who has placed a bonus cache to go with an adventure lab. They cannot require you to complete the adventure lab first, and in fact they may not even know if you did, but it just may cause a tiny bit of confusion. Not an issue, in my opinion, I'm just making you aware. 

Edited November 2, 2020 by Max and 99

[+cerberus1]

20 minutes ago, mmmPIZZA said:

Hello all. I wanted to ask a question and see what others have done or what others think of this.

I personally see Adventure Labs as a separate game to the main Geocaching game we all know and love. And I felt like AL finds should have personally count to my total finds. So I made a second account and I simply log any adventure labs on that account. I was wondering if anyone else did this as well? Or wether others think it is pointless, etc. I’m just curious to what others think really.

 

I think that's a good idea.  Logged, and if you care, not affecting "stats".  

 - And if someone's "confused" by your other account claiming a find on a bonus ... you simply explain what you're doing.  

"Explaining why" has been done on back-dating logs of people with new split accounts for years.

[+barefootjeff]

1 minute ago, cerberus1 said:

 

I think that's a good idea.  Logged, and if you care, not affecting "stats".  

 - And if someone's "confused" by your other account claiming a find on a bonus ... you simply explain what you're doing.  

"Explaining why" has been done on back-dating logs of people with new split accounts for years.

 

Yet another step in depersonalising and anonymising the game. A lot of the fun in placing a new cache is knowing the people who log it - that's how a lot of caching friendships are built - but a bunch of logs from alphabet-soup sock puppet accounts kills that off too.

[+cerberus1]

31 minutes ago, barefootjeff said:

Yet another step in depersonalising and anonymising the game. A lot of the fun in placing a new cache is knowing the people who log it - that's how a lot of caching friendships are built - but a bunch of logs from alphabet-soup sock puppet accounts kills that off too.

 

I remembered you said "The depersonalised and almost anonymous way ALs are played is taking that away..."  in another thread too.

This isn't the first time someone said in a forum they didn't consider this thing Geocaching.  

 - If a separate account is what works for him (many posts have said it shouldn't even be on this site...),   so what ?

 

 

[+barefootjeff]

9 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

- If a separate account is what works for him (many posts have said it shouldn't even be on this site...),   so what ?

 

If it works for him, fine, but if everybody does it, the game loses its social cohesiveness and becomes just another app game like Solitaire or chasing Pokemon. Maybe it already has in many places and maybe that really is the way of the future, but what are we supposed to chat about at events if everyone's logging anonymously? The whole thrust of ALs seems to be to minimise or eliminate any interaction between finders and owners or other finders.

[+CAVinoGal]

1 hour ago, cerberus1 said:

1 hour ago, mmmPIZZA said:

Hello all. I wanted to ask a question and see what others have done or what others think of this.

I personally see Adventure Labs as a separate game to the main Geocaching game we all know and love. And I felt like AL finds should have personally count to my total finds. So I made a second account and I simply log any adventure labs on that account. I was wondering if anyone else did this as well? Or wether others think it is pointless, etc. I’m just curious to what others think really.

 

I think that's a good idea.  Logged, and if you care, not affecting "stats".  

 - And if someone's "confused" by your other account claiming a find on a bonus ... you simply explain what you're doing.  

"Explaining why" has been done on back-dating logs of people with new split accounts for years.

 

A good idea, for you.  It works and accomplishes what you need.  There's enough similarities in the geo-names so anyone with enough curiosity will ask if you are the same person, or just assume you are.  

1 hour ago, barefootjeff said:

A lot of the fun in placing a new cache is knowing the people who log it - that's how a lot of caching friendships are built - but a bunch of logs from alphabet-soup sock puppet accounts kills that off too.

 

That doesn't seem to be the case here - the names are quite similar, and really, how many people are going to create a second account just to log the AL's?  I may not LIKE getting 5 "finds" for one AL, it DOES skew my stats, though not substantially at this point (I only have 40/8 AL's logged  in my 2022 total finds, less than 2%) but I am not THAT concerned about it to create a separate account just to log AL's.  I'll do them if I come across them in my normal geocaching activity, and take the 5 finds.  Whatever, it's all just numbers!

 

But for folks like mmmPIZZA (create a separate account to log the AL's) or Max and 99 (delete all but one of the locations so it appears as one find in the stats), or others that choose not to do them at all, that's all fine.  You do what is right for you, and what makes you comfortable with your own stats.  I choose to accept the 5 finds per AL, and will do an AL if it's in the area, and realize it may skew my stats.  Whatever.

Edited November 2, 2020 by CAVinoGal
ugh, typos!

[+Viajero Perdido]

2 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

The depersonalised and almost anonymous way ALs are played

 

Hmm, curious... If this is so, why log in at all?  Is it required? If so, why? 

 

A new app etc. has to be X worthwhile to overcome the hassle factor of creating a new account, remembering a password, etc. I gather our hosts can overcome that, at least for existing customers, by letting folks use their existing logins. But then, it had better be a positive or at least neutral synergy. 5 for 1 dilution, hmm, sounds parasitic. 

 

Why should new folks register? 

[+barefootjeff]

4 minutes ago, Viajero Perdido said:

1 hour ago, cerberus1 said:

The depersonalised and almost anonymous way ALs are played

 

Hmm, curious... If this is so, why log in at all?  Is it required? If so, why? 

 

A new app etc. has to be X worthwhile to overcome the hassle factor of creating a new account, remembering a password, etc. I gather our hosts can overcome that, at least for existing customers, by letting folks use their existing logins. But then, it had better be a positive or at least neutral synergy. 5 for 1 dilution, hmm, sounds parasitic. 

 

Why should new folks register? 

 

That was actually cerberus quoting me, but as an owner I don't get to see who's visited each location beyond the first three or who's completed the adventure beyond the first ten unless they leave an activity log. Likewise, if I look on a friend's profile I can see how many AL locations they've done but I can't see which ones. You can't put an AL on a watchlist and the owner doesn't get any notifications of logs, you have to keep going to look to see what's been happening. It's like we're all playing it in secret and in isolation from everyone else. Using a different account for logging ALs just takes that a step further. But if that's how everyone thinks we should be going with caching, well so be it I suppose. Now where did I put that Solitaire app?

[+mmmPIZZA]

9 hours ago, Max and 99 said:

Do you mean they shouldn't count?

 

The Help Center tells you how to delete your finds for adventure labs, so I delete all but one for each Adventure Lab.  Others choose to use a different account to find adventure labs. I think both ways are just fine. 

Although this is really a non-issue, keep in mind you may confuse a cache owner who has placed a bonus cache to go with an adventure lab. They cannot require you to complete the adventure lab first, and in fact they may not even know if you did, but it just may cause a tiny bit of confusion. Not an issue, in my opinion, I'm just making you aware. 

 

I don't know, I'm very mixed minded on that opinion because in some ways, yeah, they should but at the same time, it feels like a completely different game to me. I see you leave just one find, I think this is also a good way of doing things as I feel AL wouldn't get as much stick against them if they only counted for one find instead of five. But each to their own of course. I have no problem with them as I enjoy finding them and learning new things. Yesterday, I did a set around a town called Kenilworth, a town of which I've lived near to for nearly 23 years. And i learnt a lot that I never knew before. 

 

9 hours ago, barefootjeff said:

 

Yet another step in depersonalising and anonymising the game. A lot of the fun in placing a new cache is knowing the people who log it - that's how a lot of caching friendships are built - but a bunch of logs from alphabet-soup sock puppet accounts kills that off too.

 

8 hours ago, CAVinoGal said:

 

A good idea, for you.  It works and accomplishes what you need.  There's enough similarities in the geo-names so anyone with enough curiosity will ask if you are the same person, or just assume you are.  

 

That doesn't seem to be the case here - the names are quite similar, and really, how many people are going to create a second account just to log the AL's?  I may not LIKE getting 5 "finds" for one AL, it DOES skew my stats, though not substantially at this point (I only have 40/8 AL's logged  in my 2022 total finds, less than 2%) but I am not THAT concerned about it to create a separate account just to log AL's.  I'll do them if I come across them in my normal geocaching activity, and take the 5 finds.  Whatever, it's all just numbers!

 

So with this, I do see it from both points of view. With the bonus caches, they're physical container finds, at least the few I've found have been anyway. So whenever I write my find it log, I log it as mmmPIZZA and I explain to them that mPZLabs is the account I've found the labs on. I usually explain it in a less confusing manner than that, I promise ;)

I've only done a couple of bonus finds so far as my lab total is only 34. But the COs of the couple of bonus caches I've found haven't had a problem with me using two accounts so far. They're just pleased that I write a nice log and spent the time doing their labs :D That is also why I made sure my lab account name was mPZLabs. mPZ is my shorten version of my main name as I can't always write mmmPIZZA in a small log book. And all my online logs end with the quote "All geocaches are signed as mmmPIZZA or mPZ". So people always know it's me (hopefully) ;)

 

[+sernikk]

4 hours ago, mmmPIZZA said:

 

I don't know, I'm very mixed minded on that opinion because in some ways, yeah, they should but at the same time, it feels like a completely different game to me. I see you leave just one find, I think this is also a good way of doing things as I feel AL wouldn't get as much stick against them if they only counted for one find instead of five. But each to their own of course. I have no problem with them as I enjoy finding them and learning new things. Yesterday, I did a set around a town called Kenilworth, a town of which I've lived near to for nearly 23 years. And i learnt a lot that I never knew before. 

 

 

Your vision of the tasks counting as individual finds is something I understand and feel the similar way. But I think that if HQ would make the labs only count as 1 find for the whole scenario, there would be problems if someone couldn't get the right answer for 1 out of 5 for example. Imagine you are trapped on the last question and the whole adventure cannot be finished, counted in the stats. Of course you can contact the CO, but many things can happen to us, and there is not always the possibility to talk to each other. Contact should always be optional.

 

You've said that this is a completely different game and you're right! But... If this game would be completely separated from geocaching itself, it would just be dead.

Existing of AL is also a great opportunity to show places in a different way or places blocked by the 161m / 528ft minimal distance required in regular caches.

[+Max and 99]

11 minutes ago, sernikk said:

But I think that if HQ would make the labs only count as 1 find for the whole scenario, there would be problems if someone couldn't get the right answer for 1 out of 5 for example. Imagine you are trapped on the last question and the whole adventure cannot be finished, counted in the stats.

That's no different than getting stuck on a multi-cache or puzzle, and you only get one Find for completing those.

At least with Adventure Labs the four you did complete show up in your stats, even if you get stuck on the fifth one. You get zero if you get stuck on a multi cache! 

[+sernikk]

Just now, Max and 99 said:

That's no different than getting stuck on a multi-cache or puzzle, and you only get one Find for completing those.

At least with Adventure Labs the four you did complete show up in your stats, even if you get stuck on the fifth one. You get zero if you get stuck on a multi cache! 

 

Yes, but at the end of a multi-cache there is a cache and at the end of an AL there is... nothing, only memories

[+Max and 99]

8 minutes ago, sernikk said:

 

Yes, but at the end of a multi-cache there is a cache and at the end of an AL there is... nothing, only memories

No, there's a +4/+5 on your geocaching account. 

[+sernikk]

4 minutes ago, Max and 99 said:

No, there's a +4/+5 on your geocaching account. 

 

I was talking about a physical experience.

Multi-cache is giving you an opportunity to get a cache after completing all tasks or collecting all data.

Adventure lab is giving you nothing after completion, except of congrats

 

I'm just saying that this +/- 5 founds (or less if you fail) is like a reward for completing the scenario, like the 1 found and physical container in a multi-cache.

Edited November 2, 2020 by sernikk

[+barefootjeff]

4 hours ago, sernikk said:

 

I was talking about a physical experience.

Multi-cache is giving you an opportunity to get a cache after completing all tasks or collecting all data.

Adventure lab is giving you nothing after completion, except of congrats

 

I'm just saying that this +/- 5 founds (or less if you fail) is like a reward for completing the scenario, like the 1 found and physical container in a multi-cache.

 

For me, the reward for any cache type (physical, virtual, EC or AL) is the experience of visiting the places the CO wanted to take me and the satisfaction of overcoming all the challenges he or she has set before me. If I'm defeated by the difficulty of a puzzle, the terrain of a higher T-rated cache or can't find all the waypoints in a multi or answer all the questions in an EC, virtual or AL, then I've failed to overcome those challenges. I still had the experience, though, and sometimes that's enough, or I might be spurred to get some help or be better prepared on my next attempt. I'd say getting a smiley for each stage of an AL lessens the sense of satisfaction from completing the whole simply because it's no longer an all-or-nothing challenge. Some of my most memorable finds are the ones where it's taken a lot of effort and several attempts to finally overcome all the obstacles and claim the find, but that sense of satisfaction would have been lost, at least in part, had they been broken down into separate smaller tasks each rewarded with a find.

 

But I came into caching from a background of hiking where there's no reward other than the experience of the journey and the companionship along the way, so I'm sure that's clouded my view of how the game is meant to work.