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CleverCloggs

Replacing damp and damaged logs

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I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs. And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...  

It would be a good thing if caches were cared for by the owners of course.... But is this a common thing? 

 

I do love this game, and hopefully will find intact and cool caches soon. 

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I may be watching too many youtube clips on cool caches all over the world LOL ! expectations far too  high! 

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I'll do it sometimes, but I won't go out of my way to do so - it's the cache owner's job to do most of the maintenance. It depends on the cache, the owner and how long it's been a problem for. If it's all just mush in there then there seems little point doing so.

 

Other people will take a pile of logs around with them to replace. It's up to you really - I don't think there's anything wrong with it, but I'd always make it clear that I've done so in a log so that the owner is aware.

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I don't believe that there is a "set in stone" guideline for replacing logs, but it is definitely a done thing.

 

My opinion, is that if there are a few factors as to why that specific cache should remain in play, then it's a nice thing to do. If it's in a good spot that people want to visit, has historical value, the container is interesting and / or in good condition, the CO is active but temporarily absent or a few other factors (does not have to meet all) then I'd say go for it.

 

But if the cache is also in poor condition, has a broken container, is in a "meh" location (carpark, behind a dumpster, magnetic nano on a guard rail, etc) and / or has a CO who hasn't logged in for years - then what I'd do is leave it and put NM / NA tags (as appropriate) to free up that spot. No point in keeping sub-standard or decaying caches in play. Clean out the older ones and allow new caches to be put out.

 

You could try doing "community maintenance" on old caches to keep them in play if the CO's are long gone (which seems to be a common thing where you are), but it's actually a lot easier to archive an old one and set up a new near-identical cache in the same spot because then if there are any issues, you'd get the emails about them rather than having to constantly monitor the logs. Just note details about the old cache and you could put "this cache replaced cache GC1234 after the CO went inactive" since archived caches aren't deleted, people (if they have the GC code) can still find archived caches and see old logs. 

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4 hours ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs. And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...

I carry extra logs (printed on weatherproof paper), and I sometimes leave them in caches as a favor to the owner. As you mentioned, the owner is responsible for maintaining the cache.

 

I've never removed the existing log (which is implied by the word "replacing" in the subject line).

 

Also, I post a NM log if the original log was wet or unusable because the container failed to protect it. Adding a weatherproof log may help for a short time, but the original problem is still there, and the CO needs to do something about it. The only time I add a log and don't post a NM is when the original log is full; in that case, adding another log actually did resolve the problem.

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6 hours ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs. And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...  

It would be a good thing if caches were cared for by the owners of course.... But is this a common thing? 

 

I do love this game, and hopefully will find intact and cool caches soon. 

 

I think all of the substandard abandoned-by-owner propped-up-by-finder caches are the reason the game is not attracting more people.

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6 hours ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs. And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...  

It would be a good thing if caches were cared for by the owners of course.... But is this a common thing? 

 

I do love this game, and hopefully will find intact and cool caches soon. 

 

Cache Owners know which of their caches tend to regularly get soaking wet. The previous logs will have a lot of mentions of "wet log sheet".  If it's a nano or bison tube outdoors in the elements, or especially a foam-sealed pill bottle, it's gonna be soaked frequently.  Prepare for lost of maintenance visits.  Or, as most COs do, ignore it and it magically remains in play.  I can dry a log sheet on the windshield of my car in a few minutes.  Often such caches are close to the parking spot.  Beware that Finders' maintenance is the "magic" that keeps an otherwise unmaintained pill bottle there.  If you can resist fixing it, it may be archived and make a place for a better container and more diligent CO.

 

For my caches, I check the ones I tend to find wet.  Finders don't take care that water drips inside, and one drop destroys a nano log.  O-rings break after a couple of finds.   Cachers  unfortunately mention nothing until it's a soaking wet mess.

 

I have extra log sheets in baggies, but I usually dry the log sheet or write on it carefully with a sharpie.  When there are a lot of unaddressed mentions of "wet log",  I can tell in advance that there's a problem, so I often skip such a cache.  You can, too. :)

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2 hours ago, L0ne.R said:

 

I think all of the substandard abandoned-by-owner propped-up-by-finder caches are the reason the game is not attracting more people.

yes, it is disheartening.. But I have hid some really cool ones, and tend to care for the ones I have found.. bringing extra paper etc... fingers crossed for an upsurge

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2 hours ago, kunarion said:

 

Cache Owners know which of their caches tend to regularly get soaking wet. The previous logs will have a lot of mentions of "wet log sheet".  If it's a nano or bison tube outdoors in the elements, or especially a foam-sealed pill bottle, it's gonna be soaked frequently.  Prepare for lost of maintenance visits.  Or, as most COs do, ignore it and it magically remains in play.  I can dry a log sheet on the windshield of my car in a few minutes.  Often such caches are close to the parking spot.  Beware that Finders' maintenance is the "magic" that keeps an otherwise unmaintained pill bottle there.  If you can resist fixing it, it may be archived and make a place for a better container and more diligent CO.

 

For my caches, I check the ones I tend to find wet.  Finders don't take care that water drips inside, and one drop destroys a nano log.  O-rings break after a couple of finds.   Cachers  unfortunately mention nothing until it's a soaking wet mess.

 

I have extra log sheets in baggies, but I usually dry the log sheet or write on it carefully with a sharpie.  When there are a lot of unaddressed mentions of "wet log",  I can tell in advance that there's a problem, so I often skip such a cache.  You can, too. :)

I now tend to take extra paper logs and tissues to wipe out a cache, just in case... then the next person wont have a soggy log.. LOL 

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2 hours ago, L0ne.R said:

 

I think all of the substandard abandoned-by-owner propped-up-by-finder caches are the reason the game is not attracting more people.

True....

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4 hours ago, niraD said:

I carry extra logs (printed on weatherproof paper), and I sometimes leave them in caches as a favor to the owner. As you mentioned, the owner is responsible for maintaining the cache.

 

I've never removed the existing log (which is implied by the word "replacing" in the subject line).

 

Also, I post a NM log if the original log was wet or unusable because the container failed to protect it. Adding a weatherproof log may help for a short time, but the original problem is still there, and the CO needs to do something about it. The only time I add a log and don't post a NM is when the original log is full; in that case, adding another log actually did resolve the problem.

I added two rolls in my log finds today.. hopefully the next person, will be able to sign and the fun keeps going. 

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9 hours ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs.

And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...  

 

It would be a good thing if caches were cared for by the owners of course.... But is this a common thing? 

I do love this game, and hopefully will find intact and cool caches soon. 

 

Have you read the section in the Help Center titled: "When a cache needs maintenance" ?      :)

Notice it doesn't mention keeping caches maintained for others...

We will leave a Rite in Rain log strip as a means for others to log the find, and might wipe it down if it isn't clear it's a container issue (just get fulla water again...), but only meant to tide things over until the COs can fix it themselves.

 -  Unless we know the CO (and that they will act on our log...) we always follow our Found It with a NM.

 

Not as common as some would like you to believe, but it happens.  Guessing you're in an area with members who've left the hobby ?

 

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1 minute ago, cerberus1 said:

 

Have you read the section in the Help Center titled: "When a cache needs maintenance" ?      :)

Notice it doesn't mention keeping caches maintained for others...

We will leave a Rite in Rain log strip as a means for others to log the find, and might wipe it down if it isn't clear it's a container issue (just get fulla water again...), but only meant to tide things over until the COs can fix it themselves.

 -  Unless we know the CO (and that they will act on our log...) we always follow our Found It with a NM.

 

Not as common as some would like you to believe, but it happens.  Guessing you're in an area with members who've left the hobby ?

 

Yes, i think that is the case.. Although I have hid a few, and the ones that get published are found within hours, so there is still interest... I shall endevour to get some cool ones out there. 

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Is it OK to add a log when you find one full or wet? Yes. Do I ever do that? No. Adding a fresh paper when there's a wet log just means more wet log. Adding more log when there's not enough makes more sense, but I just sign over other signatures and leave it up to the CO.

 

It is fairly common. I don't know any COs that complain (although I've heard in the forums that there are such).

 

*Replacing* a log is a little different, but you didn't ask about that.

 

Keep your spirits up! Good caches are out there, and you can even have a lot of fun with marginal caches if you set you mind to it.

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I only do it when there's enough room for the new log and the old one. I don't take the old log in case the CO wants it. So if it's a nano or something, I just say the log is full and squeeze my initials on it somewhere.

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On 9/27/2020 at 10:51 AM, CleverCloggs said:

Yes, i think that is the case.. Although I have hid a few, and the ones that get published are found within hours, so there is still interest... I shall endevour to get some cool ones out there. 

Looks like your problem stems from most of the 'local' caches having been placed in 2012 by one owner, and it looks like the owner now lives in Lisboa/Lisbon, quite a long distance away.

A whole lot of 3XXXX caches without someone nearby to maintain them won't have provided you with a very nice experience, so I understand why you are seeing what you are seeing out there.

If your caches are being found, you might want to try to get together with those finders to see if you can encourage them to start placing some of their own.

 

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On 9/27/2020 at 3:23 AM, CleverCloggs said:

I have now found a 1/3 of caches hidden have damaged, full or wet logs. And as a courtesy I have added a roll of paper to keep the game going... It is ok to do this?  Iv even dried them out and taken extra plastic bags etc, just in case...  

It would be a good thing if caches were cared for by the owners of course.... But is this a common thing? 

 

I do love this game, and hopefully will find intact and cool caches soon. 

 

Unfortunately it is a common thing. Caused by...

A. Placing containers that are inappropriate for the conditions they are exposed to.  

B. Cachers that are reluctant to, or don't know how to log a need maintenance when they find a damp log.

C. A lack of proper owner maintenance.

 

When I started I would dry wet logs or add dry ones if needed. I soon realized all I was doing was enabling poor cache ownership and poor logging practice. The owner needs to be notified if the cache needs maintenance. Thats exactly why NM is there. The cache needs to be archived if the owner wont respond to NM's. 

 

Sure there are exceptions. Hospitalizations, Illnesses, injuries etc. are all good reasons for the cache community to kick in and help. But generally, maintaining caches for owners is enabling poor ownership habits. You are seeing the results of that practice.      

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On 9/27/2020 at 11:52 AM, CleverCloggs said:

I now tend to take extra paper logs and tissues to wipe out a cache, just in case... then the next person wont have a soggy log.. LOL 

 

If the container is letting water in, then the issue is the container, not the log.  That's a CO issue to fix, not a finder's issue to fix, which is why it would be time to file the NM log along with your found it log.  While what you're offering to do is great, it doesn't address the underlying issue that's causing the problem.  It's only temporarily addressing the effect, not the cause.  However, if the container appears to have no issues and it was due to a faulty closing of the container, then there really isn't much of a problem.  There isn't really a problem doing what you're doing but it's just wasted effort on your part as the cache will revert to what it was like when you found it.

 

As to replacing, unlike others on here, I will replace and take the old log when the old log takes up so much space that a new log (or a temporary filler log) wouldn't fit.  That's also assuming that the container is still a viable one that will keep out moisture.  If not, then I won't replace it at all.  Should I replace the log, I will make mention of it in my log and then contact the CO to let them know I'll be happy to get the log to them, be it in person, via a photograph of the log, or even snail mail.  I've only ever had one (that I remember) CO reach out to me with a request for photos of the log.  If you're really concerned about the old log for the CO, then you can choose to post a photo of the log along with your found it log.  Those COs who are adamantly opposed to finders doing something like that typically have language within the description that states finders shouldn't replace logs.

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1 minute ago, coachstahly said:

 

 Those COs who are adamantly opposed to finders doing something like that typically have language within the description that states finders shouldn't replace logs.

I would never replace the log as that isn't my area or property..but I have on 2 occasions added some clean paper roll :) I always contact the CO if there is any issues. But thanks for the tips.. 

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24 minutes ago, CleverCloggs said:

I always contact the CO if there is any issues.

You should also post a Needs Maintenance log, so that future seekers and the volunteer reviewers are aware of the issues too.

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When we run across a wad of mush that allows for the addition of a fresh log in a zip, we claim the find and throw a NM out along with it.

 

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