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BenRed06

your thoughts on premium only caches

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17 hours ago, Max and 99 said:

I know many many PMO caches that have been found by non PM geocachers. I remember when a new geocacher asked me how a non PM geocacher got FTF on his PM cache. It's not as uncommon as you might think.

 

Someone please tell me how this works.  I have read some people saying that the official app does not show PMO caches, but I use c:geo.  Would that make a difference?  I'd always assumed there were dozens of caches in my area that I've never found because I am not PM, but maybe I am wrong?

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1 minute ago, Ageleni said:

Someone please tell me how this works.  I have read some people saying that the official app does not show PMO caches,

Basic members cannot see PMO cache listings. This has always been the case, whether you're using the web site or an app.

 

In addition, Groundspeak's Geocaching app restricts basic members to traditional caches and events, with difficulty and terrain ratings of 2 or less. API partner apps restrict basic members to downloading 3 full cache listings per day; this is imposed by the API, not the apps themselves.

 

1 minute ago, Ageleni said:

but I use c:geo.

The c:geo app is an unauthorized app. It does not use the authorized API. Instead, it scrapes the web site in violation of the terms of use.

 

It cannot be discussed or promoted here. Check the c:geo forums.

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9 minutes ago, Ageleni said:

Someone please tell me how this works.

 

You have to access the cache page with a browser, not a app (and please avoid talking here in the forums about that one).

Use this page Geocachingadmin, searching for any GCCode of a PMO cache.

Edited by RuideAlmeida
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9 minutes ago, niraD said:

In addition, Groundspeak's Geocaching app restricts basic members to traditional caches and events, with difficulty and terrain ratings of 2 or less.

 

 

I have found higher than that, but after reading the replies I think I understand why.  Thanks.

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10 minutes ago, RuideAlmeida said:

You have to access the cache page with a browser, not a app

 

So if I looked in the browser, found PMO caches, wrote down the coords, and found and signed them, I could come back to the browser and log them? 

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3 minutes ago, Ageleni said:

 

So if I looked in the browser, found PMO caches, wrote down the coords, and found and signed them, I could come back to the browser and log them? 

 

Using the link I provided above, yes.

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20 hours ago, Ageleni said:

Why make your caches PMO?

 

As I've already mentioned, for the most part, it comes down to the cost to keep it active and findable.  I have an entire series that would fall within the D/T rating for free app users and since they're regular sized caches, they'd also be high on the list for new cachers (non-PMO) to visit as well.  It cost me about 60$ between the bingo balls, cards, domino set, Scrabble tiles, 5 pound bag of dice and a bonus cache (NOT within the D/T range for the free app) that cost me close to 20$ to make it how I wanted to make it.  Include small/regular containers to hold the game pieces plus a larger outer container and I'm close to 100$ for the series, 5 of 6 which would be accessible to new cachers using the free app.  Although new premium members have managed to take a few dominoes (which caused this part of the game to have to be replaced) as well as all the dice (luckily got those back) and the cards going MIA (cheaper but still money to replace them), I can't imagine the issues I would have if it were available to everyone, although I have had at least one non-PMO log it.  I couldn't keep this series alive if I continually had to replace pieces, which would inevitably happen.

 

21 hours ago, Ageleni said:

It doesn't benefit the cache....

 

It does if it allows it to stay in play longer than it would if it weren't.

 

21 hours ago, Ageleni said:

It only benefits geocaching.com, because it means that if I want to find it, I have to pay.

 

Not true, unless you're caching by yourself.  If you're with a premium member and can find the cache, you can log it without having to pay.  That's been an option for quite some time.

 

21 hours ago, Ageleni said:

Maybe it's about exclusivity; like being a member of the extra-special subset of the hobby? Or maybe some people are genuinely interested in helping the website succeed, so they make PMO caches so that more people will pay to find them.

 

Nope.  Again, it all comes down to cost for me.

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I am ok with premiums for certian occasions, but I am also ageanst them. I think it's ok to make a golden ammo can a premium, so new cachers don't steal them. I have had a few experinces with brand new cachers stealing my caches. Most new cachers won't become premium right away. Premiums 9in my opinion) should be reserved for very special caches. Good questions

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5 hours ago, Ageleni said:

 

Someone please tell me how this works.  I have read some people saying that the official app does not show PMO caches, but I use c:geo.  Would that make a difference?  I'd always assumed there were dozens of caches in my area that I've never found because I am not PM, but maybe I am wrong?

 

I got nosey and did a quick check using my premium account and a non-premium account. They showed the same number of caches in a 10 mile radius of your town - a VERY different result that I get from doing the same comparison around here.

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I get the impression that in my area, many if not most, newbies are Premium from the get go.

Does Groundspeak have those statistics for various areas?

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19 minutes ago, colleda said:

I get the impression that in my area, many if not most, newbies are Premium from the get go.

Does Groundspeak have those statistics for various areas?

Same where I live. That can a worry, as they can access any cache, even those caches that the COs have a very good reason to make Premium only, such as the unique cache would be hard to replace. Most newbies would not be a problem, but it increases the odds though of those new members who are. So now it can be, not only muggles with apps, but now muggles with Premium. But that's all income to Geocaching, so unlikely to change, or be discouraged.

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I was once a newbie with a Nuvi + Premium from the start. I'm happy to see players contributing to play.

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12 hours ago, RuideAlmeida said:

 

Use this page Geocachingadmin, searching for any GCCode of a PMO cache.

How does this help? I still cannot read the listing (of course). I don't even see the coordinates.

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On 9/18/2020 at 6:12 PM, BenRed06 said:

hey everyone!

what are your opinions on premium only caches?

 

i for one am oposed to them. all my hides are public and will be as long as i live. 

I have put mine public. when they eventually get published. ... as many cannot afford the premium membership. Although I enjoy being a premium member myself. 

Edited by CleverCloggs

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25 minutes ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have put mine public. when they eventually get published. ... as many cannot afford the premium membership. Although I enjoy being a premium member myself. 

But they can afford not only a phone, but data too. Even when I couldn't afford data (up until 2 or 3 years ago), I still had a membership. I figure have data = can afford membership.

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2 minutes ago, Goldenwattle said:

But they can afford not only a phone, but data too. Even when I couldn't afford data (up until 2 or 3 years ago), I still had a membership. I figure have data = can afford membership.

probably!   but in my area.. its not as prevalent, so it seems :) 

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8 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

Same where I live. That can a worry, as they can access any cache, even those caches that the COs have a very good reason to make Premium only, such as the unique cache would be hard to replace. Most newbies would not be a problem, but it increases the odds though of those new members who are. So now it can be, not only muggles with apps, but now muggles with Premium. But that's all income to Geocaching, so unlikely to change, or be discouraged.

I am in a remote part of Alentejo in Portugal.. so slightly different to where you are.. I guess its different for every area... Interesting though. 

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5 hours ago, Aprilscherzen said:

How does this help? I still cannot read the listing (of course). I don't even see the coordinates.

 

This link allows to log a previously found PMO.

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8 hours ago, Aprilscherzen said:

How does this help? I still cannot read the listing (of course). I don't even see the coordinates.

 

As RuideAlmeida says, it's only so you can log that cache found.  Guess I don't understand how that doesn't help you.    :)

You can't, as a basic member, access a pmo cache, but you can at least log it if/when accessing it with a premium member.

I believe that alternate method to log was designed so families don't have to struggle with the cost of multiple pms while enjoying the outdoors together.

 

When we take new folks out (mostly basic members) , and we happen to hit a pmo hide, we hand them a business card with the site's address, and the short how to (to log a found). 

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7 hours ago, CleverCloggs said:

I have put mine public. when they eventually get published. ... as many cannot afford the premium membership. Although I enjoy being a premium member myself. 

6 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

But they can afford not only a phone, but data too. Even when I couldn't afford data (up until 2 or 3 years ago), I still had a membership. I figure have data = can afford membership.

 

Granted, many new members start with a phone today, but this is an assumption that all new members will be using a phone. 

We're seeing some new members buying low-end GPSrs so their data isn't so high.  It's often mentioned in these forums. 

The "once n done" of a handheld GPSr vs the next step up in data usage a cost savings.    :)

 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

Granted, many new members start with a phone today, but this is an assumption that all new members will be using a phone. 

We're seeing some new members buying low-end GPSrs so their data isn't so high.  It's often mentioned in these forums. 

The "once n done" of a handheld GPSr vs the next step up in data usage a cost savings.    :)

 

It's good to budget and prioritize purchases.  I buy a used phone when my phone breaks, an older model.  I have pre-paid phone time so there are no surprise charges.  You can buy 5 brand-new great GPSs for the price of the latest phone.  How people afford their fancy new phone all the time, I can't say.  But they do come into the forum and insist they can't afford Premium Membership.

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3 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

Granted, many new members start with a phone today, but this is an assumption that all new members will be using a phone. 

We're seeing some new members buying low-end GPSrs so their data isn't so high.  It's often mentioned in these forums. 

The "once n done" of a handheld GPSr vs the next step up in data usage a cost savings.    :)

 

I can't imagine buying a GPS receiver to save on phone data plan costs.  I started with a Garmin eTrex H that I found in Best Buy for $40 on clearance, before I had a smart phone, and I used it for many years until it stopped working.  I've considered buying a new receiver but now I swear by my smartphone for geocaching.  The phone is something I use anyway, so it's not like I purchased it for geocaching.

 

Last summer my family went to England for a week, and before I left, I downloaded every cache of each type I enjoy into my Cachly app, and also downloaded the Google Maps map for the entire area I was going to possibly visit.  While in England I kept my phone on airplane mode and was able to use Google Maps and Cachly without any issue at all, as phones still pick up GPS signals when in airplane mode.  I could navigate walking directions with the maps app all around London and the surrounding areas, and anywhere I went I could pull up the local caches.  it was awesome.  If I really needed to check for any updates I could do that with Wi-Fii at the hotel. 

 

I love phone caching.

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20 hours ago, RuideAlmeida said:

 

This link allows to log a previously found PMO.

 

17 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

 

As RuideAlmeida says, it's only so you can log that cache found.  Guess I don't understand how that doesn't help you.    :)

You can't, as a basic member, access a pmo cache, but you can at least log it if/when accessing it with a premium member.

Ok, I knew that.

 

Because the origin was a non PM who found a PMO cache first, I thought that that basic member was able to read the listing.

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