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Bozeman, here I come..


foxtrot_xray

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foxtrot_xray,
QX0641'STATION IS THE INITIAL POINT OF ALL G.L.O. SURVEYS IN MONTANA

One hour west of Bozeman to the trailhead,  then a half mile,  400 ft elevation gain, some bushwhacking, hike to the point.  I timed it to be there at apparent noon.  MEL

Edited by kayakbird
To add link to photo.
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I've seen your initials on a LOT of datasheets while looking out there.

 

That one is neat enough to try and attack. I have it mapped out, and see a trail/dim road heading uphill to to coming from the northeast. How are farmers/ranchers up there? I'm used to dealing with them in KS, OK and northern TX, and haven't even had an issue before, but figured I'd check. :D

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foxtrot_xray,

I can't recall for sure just where I headed up the ridge from Yellowstone Trail Rd south of the Montana GLO Initial Point. 

The ownership name in the Montana Cadastral (link below) is different that in a 2010 newspaper article.  I do not use the onX product, by have heard that it is quite good. 

I have not checked on the NONPID Missouri River Commission South Base near the Headwaters State Park in several years.  As noted in Geocache the river took North Base winter 2010-11.

Lots of negative info - hope that it works for you.

kayakbird/MEL

 

https://www.onxmaps.com/states/montana-hunting-gps-maps

http://svc.mt.gov/msl/mtcadastral/

https://missoulian.com/lifestyles/territory/grid-lock-on-a-limestone-hill-southwest-of-three-forks-the-initial-point-divides-defines/article_d91360c0-33a1-11df-97a0-001cc4c002e0.html

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12 hours ago, kayakbird said:

foxtrot_xray,

I can't recall for sure just where I headed up the ridge from Yellowstone Trail Rd south of the Montana GLO Initial Point. 

The ownership name in the Montana Cadastral (link below) is different that in a 2010 newspaper article.  I do not use the onX product, by have heard that it is quite good. 

I have not checked on the NONPID Missouri River Commission South Base near the Headwaters State Park in several years.  As noted in Geocache the river took North Base winter 2010-11.

Lots of negative info - hope that it works for you.

kayakbird/MEL

 

https://www.onxmaps.com/states/montana-hunting-gps-maps

http://svc.mt.gov/msl/mtcadastral/

https://missoulian.com/lifestyles/territory/grid-lock-on-a-limestone-hill-southwest-of-three-forks-the-initial-point-divides-defines/article_d91360c0-33a1-11df-97a0-001cc4c002e0.html

Thanks! I have started reseaching - and yeah, negative info is *better* than none! Appreciated!

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Success.

First day on the job, and after showing up and waiting thirty minutes, I got a call stating that the contractor can't make it, and will meet me tomorrow. So, that gave me a day's worth of pay, with nothing to do.

So about 11:30 I got to the small parking area, and headed on up. Was steeper than I had anticipated. I brought water and trail mix/small snacks, and am glad I did. I am out of shape being a desk-jockey for years now, and about 2/3rds of the way up had to take a good 10-15 minute break. .. I need to get in better shape.

Got up there and could easily see everything. (And in every direction - haze was not bad at all.) Was gorgeous. Took pics, then sat and had a couple snacks for lunch, then headed back down to the car.

 

About 5 minutes after parking and setting off, a local pulled in and got out of his car. He told me to 'be careful, as the snakes are moving up, and may be active. But it's a great view once you get up there.'. About halfway up, I happened to see a white SUV pull in behind my car - an officer got out and looked around my vehicle, then looked up at me. No wave, no calling or anything - he just got back into his vehicle and drove off. Those were the only two people I 'saw' while I was out there. (Not including a farmer bailing and loading hay onto a flatbead.)

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Weather was nice - while the temperature wasn't scorching, I will admit that the sun WAS. I got burnt a LOT more badly than anticipated, and with the calm wind, it was _hot_. The visibility was good - could see for miles, so the scenery stood out.

 

Today, contractor showed up, and after a half-day, called it. So, I headed back over that way and found some other marks (nothing as exciting really, but were personal curiosities) around the area.

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23 hours ago, foxtrot_xray said:

Weather was nice - while the temperature wasn't scorching, I will admit that the sun WAS. I got burnt a LOT more badly than anticipated, and with the calm wind, it was _hot_. The visibility was good - could see for miles, so the scenery stood out.

 

Today, contractor showed up, and after a half-day, called it. So, I headed back over that way and found some other marks (nothing as exciting really, but were personal curiosities) around the area.

Sounds like you are having a fun trip.  I enjoy reading about your daily adventures, so thank you for posting updates.  How did you choose which BMs to look for?  I’m going to try and find some down in SC in a couple of weeks.  But I’m limited by where the family wants to do and see.  So hopefully there are some relatively close to our condo.  

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outdoorsoccer,

I'll take a delayed stab at answering your question based on ten year old information and techniques.

 

The best thing that I did back then was down load most of western states into Excel spreadsheets via GSAK.   I would then do a bunch of sorts for subsets that were of interest to me:  WW II iron caps,  flared stem caps, very short lived depression 'and State Survey' caps,  early 1900's Precise Level Net strings tabulated in Special Publication #18  (foxtrot_xray got at least one this trip),  and of course, Missouri River Commission cap, pipe & stone combinations, along with a few Morc bolts leaded in native rocks.

 

Once I figured out how the true Bench Mark string naming  convention worked it was easier to home in on anything older than I; and if I was mostly on a bird watching trip could  take time to get just the Z - A adjacent pairs.  Just used a basic HH2 GPSr - no smart phones with beep, beep, beep apps.

 

Mostly hunkering out here in the center of Montana and would be happy to attempt to answer any questions - from any one.  kayakbird

 

 

 

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Apologies I fell silent, all - starting Wednesday, the contractor stepped up their game, and the rest of the week was too busy for me to get out. Which really bums me, because I had some others I did want to get.

 

On 9/23/2020 at 8:36 PM, outdoorsoccer said:

How did you choose which BMs to look for? 

Unlike many others here (like Kayakbird here), I don't have a set criteria. I usually start by looking on Google Earth for stations - things I like to see are either stations along old roadways/ole rail beds, or stations with interesting features. Some things I take into account is:

1. whether it HAS been recovered before or not (and how recently. For trips to parts of the country I don't normally go, I stay away from not found marks, because of time.

2. If it's along a roadway, how active/busy the road is. (i.e. two-lane vs 4-lane divided highway) - too much traffic, too much like work.

3. If it's along a railway, whether the line is still active or not (or if I have permission or not - a couple of the ones I found last Tuesday I had legal access to the railroad's ROW.)

4. any other intersting features. (i.e. Near an old school building, the 1936 description lists an 'old road',

 

Again, I usually start on Google Earth with Topo maps, and go from there. :)

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On 9/27/2020 at 5:04 PM, kayakbird said:

outdoorsoccer,

I'll take a delayed stab at answering your question based on ten year old information and techniques.

 

The best thing that I did back then was down load most of western states into Excel spreadsheets via GSAK.   I would then do a bunch of sorts for subsets that were of interest to me:  WW II iron caps,  flared stem caps, very short lived depression 'and State Survey' caps,  early 1900's Precise Level Net strings tabulated in Special Publication #18  (foxtrot_xray got at least one this trip),  and of course, Missouri River Commission cap, pipe & stone combinations, along with a few Morc bolts leaded in native rocks.

 

Once I figured out how the true Bench Mark string naming  convention worked it was easier to home in on anything older than I; and if I was mostly on a bird watching trip could  take time to get just the Z - A adjacent pairs.  Just used a basic HH2 GPSr - no smart phones with beep, beep, beep apps.

 

Mostly hunkering out here in the center of Montana and would be happy to attempt to answer any questions - from any one.  kayakbird

 

 

 

Hi kayakbird,

 

   Thank you for the insight on your BM search planning technique.  Im relatively new, so I have been just looking to see what BMs are local to me that have been found recently (via website or NGS).  Although recently sometimes means 9+ years ago, but there are some within the last couple of years from the NGS database sheets.  Although their are not as helpful  as some of PFF’s (and other geocacher’s) logs and photos from the Geocaching BM site.

 

How is everything in Montana?

 

Take care,

 

  ODS

 

    
 

 

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On 9/28/2020 at 10:57 AM, foxtrot_xray said:

Apologies I fell silent, all - starting Wednesday, the contractor stepped up their game, and the rest of the week was too busy for me to get out. Which really bums me, because I had some others I did want to get.

 

Unlike many others here (like Kayakbird here), I don't have a set criteria. I usually start by looking on Google Earth for stations - things I like to see are either stations along old roadways/ole rail beds, or stations with interesting features. Some things I take into account is:

1. whether it HAS been recovered before or not (and how recently. For trips to parts of the country I don't normally go, I stay away from not found marks, because of time.

2. If it's along a roadway, how active/busy the road is. (i.e. two-lane vs 4-lane divided highway) - too much traffic, too much like work.

3. If it's along a railway, whether the line is still active or not (or if I have permission or not - a couple of the ones I found last Tuesday I had legal access to the railroad's ROW.)

4. any other intersting features. (i.e. Near an old school building, the 1936 description lists an 'old road',

 

Again, I usually start on Google Earth with Topo maps, and go from there. :)

Hi Foxtrot_xray,

 

  sorry to have jinxed your trip.  Lol.  Glad to hear you found some though.  Thank you for the suggestion about using Google Earth.  I’ll definitely try and give it a whirl.  I have been going after the found ones too.  But the terrain and sometimes the actual BM area has changed drastically since it was last found 9+ years ago that I wasn’t able to find them.   Maybe your suggestion About using google earth will help. 
 

  So far my problem is the grass/foliage has grown over the BM that it may require some digging/probing to get to them. I don’t really know who owns the land so I haven’t tried digging for them.    I am waiting for the fall/winter season to see if that will help my find rate.  I just bought some long screwdrivers that some one recommended to use to probe,  I am looking to order a handheld Metal detector (MD)  too.    Do you know if the “capped” ones will register with a MD? I saw a BM pic where it shows they lifted a cover to reveal a metal pin/rod in the ground. 
 

  I have found a couple at some local businesses that someone has taken care to preserve the BM during the construction.   Really like these “easy” ones.  Lol.

 

  Take care,

 

   ODS

   

 

  

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On 9/30/2020 at 8:32 AM, outdoorsoccer said:

Hi Foxtrot_xray,

 

  sorry to have jinxed your trip.  Lol.  Glad to hear you found some though.  Thank you for the suggestion about using Google Earth.  I’ll definitely try and give it a whirl.  I have been going after the found ones too.  But the terrain and sometimes the actual BM area has changed drastically since it was last found 9+ years ago that I wasn’t able to find them.   Maybe your suggestion About using google earth will help. 
 

  So far my problem is the grass/foliage has grown over the BM that it may require some digging/probing to get to them. I don’t really know who owns the land so I haven’t tried digging for them.    I am waiting for the fall/winter season to see if that will help my find rate.  I just bought some long screwdrivers that some one recommended to use to probe,  I am looking to order a handheld Metal detector (MD)  too.    Do you know if the “capped” ones will register with a MD? I saw a BM pic where it shows they lifted a cover to reveal a metal pin/rod in the ground. 
 

  I have found a couple at some local businesses that someone has taken care to preserve the BM during the construction.   Really like these “easy” ones.  Lol.

 

  Take care,

 

   ODS

   

 

  

The capped ones (rods with access covers) will certainly be picked up by a metal detector - those are aluminum access covers, and they'll be picked up. (At least, with a real metal detector. Since they ARE aluminum, it's possible cheaper, iron-only or magnetic-only detectors won't pick them up..!)

 

Some stations will list the ownership of the land the mark sits on Usually if it is along a roadway, but is outisde the right-of-way, I will do searches in someone's yard - but never do any digging or metal-detecting without contacting the owners. And yes, more than a couple times I've walked up to the front door. In the case of a few times, the owner even knew where they were, and pointed me to them.

 

Now, about looking for Found/Not Found stations, in areas I am not familiar with or new to - like Bozeman in this case, I will usually stick to previously Found marks. But in areas I know well (like around where I life, or have lived, or will be in a long period of time for work or vacation), THEN I will pull up Not Found stations, and spend some extra time looking for them. The more familiar you are with the area, the more it helps looking for more difficult marks.

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On 10/1/2020 at 8:09 PM, foxtrot_xray said:

The capped ones (rods with access covers) will certainly be picked up by a metal detector - those are aluminum access covers, and they'll be picked up. (At least, with a real metal detector. Since they ARE aluminum, it's possible cheaper, iron-only or magnetic-only detectors won't pick them up..!)

 

Some stations will list the ownership of the land the mark sits on Usually if it is along a roadway, but is outisde the right-of-way, I will do searches in someone's yard - but never do any digging or metal-detecting without contacting the owners. And yes, more than a couple times I've walked up to the front door. In the case of a few times, the owner even knew where they were, and pointed me to them.

 

Now, about looking for Found/Not Found stations, in areas I am not familiar with or new to - like Bozeman in this case, I will usually stick to previously Found marks. But in areas I know well (like around where I life, or have lived, or will be in a long period of time for work or vacation), THEN I will pull up Not Found stations, and spend some extra time looking for them. The more familiar you are with the area, the more it helps looking for more difficult marks.

I have started looking around the SC area that I will be near and have noticed a few BMs that can be located just walking down the sidewalk.   Im looking forward to hopefully finding them.  Thank you for the helpful advice and hints. 
 

take care,

 

  ODS

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