[Feature Request] Orange jigsaw piece for corrected multi's

[+CluelessTwo]

I would like to suggest a feature, that will help greatly when planning different cache types.

 

While planning a days caching and aiming for different cache types, including previously solved puzzles and mulit-caches.

 

In particular I'm referring to the blue jigsaw piece which indicates corrected co-ordinates for a cache on the map.

 

Other times there is a multi-cache, in which the final co-ordinates can also be aquired while out and about, but dont want to find at the time.

 

I would like if it were possible for an orange jigsaw piece to be on the map, marking the final location of a multi-cache to be found at a later date.

In fact, I also know a traditional, where the owner has posted new co-ordinates as a log, instead of using the "update" feature. 

I changed the co-ordinates to the new ones, and it now is a blue jigsaw, would be nice to see a green jigsaw piece also.

 

Thanks.

Edited July 25, 2020 by CluelessTwo

[+SamLowrey]

Neat idea.

[+lee737]

That would work for me, I rarely have multis pre-solved though....

 

[+IceColdUK]

Is it just the colour that’s the issue?  (You can correct the coords for a multi, but you get the same blue jigsaw piece as a mystery.)

[+MNTA]

Add a green one too! A quick search says I have 3 with updated coordinates.

 

But definitely the Orange one would be excellent.  Have 140 with updated coordinates. Probably more unfound but archived.

[+CluelessTwo]

3 minutes ago, IceColdUK said:

Is it just the colour that’s the issue?  (You can correct the coords for a multi, but you get the same blue jigsaw piece as a mystery.)

 

The issue is that it can be hard to distinguish solved multi caches on the map in amongst solved mystery caches, and vice versa.

Edited July 25, 2020 by CluelessTwo

[+IceColdUK]

Just now, CluelessTwo said:

 

The issue is that it can be hard to distinguish solved multi caches in amongst solved mystery caches, and vice versa.

Got you.  I guess though, once you have the final coords what is the difference between a mystery and a multi?

[+MNTA]

11 minutes ago, lee737 said:

That would work for me, I rarely have multis pre-solved though....

 

 

In my area had a a series of PBMs Phone Booth Multi's loved them. Rarely did you do one in a day as usually you'd criss cross the metro area. Though several involved driving hundreds of miles in total. One of the series I have not completed has the start on the west coast and the final in Chicago.  

 

Alas most have vanished along with the hardware they were hidden upon. 

[+CluelessTwo]

1 minute ago, IceColdUK said:

Got you.  I guess though, once you have the final coords what is the difference between a mystery and a multi?

It helps plan, we have a challenge cache which needs us to log 5 different cache types on the same day every month for 12 months.

Seeing everything as blue makes it more difficult.

[+MNTA]

4 minutes ago, CluelessTwo said:

It helps plan, we have a challenge cache which needs us to log 5 different cache types on the same day every month for 12 months.

Seeing everything as blue makes it more difficult.

Tough challenge even with the proposed change! Love challenges!

[+TmdAndGG]

It's too hard to take the extra second and just click on it?

I feel like this has been requested recently, but I'm not sure. I feel like that was my answer but I'm not sure. I feel like the idea fizzled but I'm not sure. I'm honestly not sure about a lot of things these days...

Edited July 26, 2020 by TmdAndGG

[+MNTA]

Maybe we should go back to printing cache pages out on paper and manually enter them into a GPSr?

 

Personally I like improvements.

[+TmdAndGG]

13 hours ago, MNTA said:

 

Personally I like improvements.

Me too, just not pointless ones.

[+cerberus1]

17 hours ago, MNTA said:

Maybe we should go back to printing cache pages out on paper and manually enter them into a GPSr?

 

What's wrong with that ?    I've entered caches manually since I started.  I only enter caches I'll do.  

If a lengthy description with needed info, I'll print it, but then that's my note paper (instead of a RiR pad) for the day.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

On 7/25/2020 at 5:57 PM, CluelessTwo said:

It helps plan, we have a challenge cache which needs us to log 5 different cache types on the same day every month for 12 months.

Seeing everything as blue makes it more difficult.

 

I think the OPs idea is a good one but I don't really like the idea of spending development time to make it easier to complete some challenge. 

[+Mudfrog]

On 7/25/2020 at 8:48 PM, MNTA said:

Maybe we should go back to printing cache pages out on paper and manually enter them into a GPSr?

 

Personally I like improvements.

 

I definitely remember those days! I also remember having just an arrow to navigate by and all the wrong turns we made trying to follow it. 

 

Yes, improvements are a good thing but at the same time, some of the adventure/challenge/fun has gone by the wayside because of all improvements and hand-holding we have these days.

[+on4bam]

As I don't use the gc map often I would have no use for it. I do think more pressing stuff needs to be worked on first though. How much would his be used?

 

As a GSAK user I keep all data in database, including all info on WPs, values, tags.... When done the final coordinates are added as final WP.  In case where a multi is not found I have all already found or visited info to try another time by just starting at the last found WP.

I wouldn't like to see the multi icon moved to the cache location instead of the first WP.

[+GeoElmo6000]

On 7/25/2020 at 5:28 PM, CluelessTwo said:

I would like to suggest a feature, that will help greatly when planning different cache types.

 

While planning a days caching and aiming for different cache types, including previously solved puzzles and mulit-caches.

 

In particular I'm referring to the blue jigsaw piece which indicates corrected co-ordinates for a cache on the map.

 

Other times there is a multi-cache, in which the final co-ordinates can also be aquired while out and about, but dont want to find at the time.

 

I would like if it were possible for an orange jigsaw piece to be on the map, marking the final location of a multi-cache to be found at a later date.

In fact, I also know a traditional, where the owner has posted new co-ordinates as a log, instead of using the "update" feature. 

I changed the co-ordinates to the new ones, and it now is a blue jigsaw, would be nice to see a green jigsaw piece also.

 

Thanks.

 

This is a good idea.  I generally don't have partially worked multis or corrected traditionals, but since the ability to correct coordinates results in a puzzle piece icon for all cache types, I can see this being helpful.  Thanks for the suggestion.

Edited July 27, 2020 by GeoElmo6000
Removed pseudocode

[+Hynz]

On 7/25/2020 at 11:28 PM, CluelessTwo said:

While planning a days caching and aiming for different cache types, including previously solved puzzles and multi-caches.

Maybe it's different in other regions but the overly majority of multi-caches will never be previously solved and even situations where you can visit all stages, are solving the final coordinates but then are short of time also visiting the final are extremely rare, aren't they?

So I can't help thinking that in case of implementing this feature it would primarily be used by those cheaters who are grabbing final coordinates from floating around lists of solved mysteries who then can even store also final multi coordinates for optimizing their cache runs.

[+niraD]

1 hour ago, GeoElmo6000 said:

if (cachetype == traditional) color = green 

else if (cachetype == multi) color = orange

else if (cachetype == mystery) color = blue

else print "you can't do that!!!"

Wait, what?

 

It makes sense to edit the coordinates of LBH caches (many are not located at the posted coordinates). It makes sense to edit the coordinates of Wherigo caches (most aren't located at the posted coordinates). And if it makes sense to edit the coordinates of a traditional cache, then it makes just as much sense to edit the coordinates of events and other cache types that are located at the posted coordinates.

[+GeoElmo6000]

26 minutes ago, niraD said:

Wait, what?

 

It makes sense to edit the coordinates of LBH caches (many are not located at the posted coordinates). It makes sense to edit the coordinates of Wherigo caches (most aren't located at the posted coordinates). And if it makes sense to edit the coordinates of a traditional cache, then it makes just as much sense to edit the coordinates of events and other cache types that are located at the posted coordinates.

 

Okay.  Removing pseudocode.

[+on4bam]

1 hour ago, Hynz said:

So I can't help thinking that in case of implementing this feature it would primarily be used by those cheaters who are grabbing final coordinates from floating around lists of solved mysteries who then can even store also final multi coordinates for optimizing their cache runs.

 

Chances are that that will be the primary (mis)use.

Edited July 27, 2020 by on4bam

[+GeoElmo6000]

19 minutes ago, on4bam said:

 

Chances are that that will be the primary (mis)use.

 

You already can correct coordinates for different cache types; the OP just wants to see every cache type with corrected coordinates not look like a mystery cache with corrected coordinates.  That's really useful.

[+on4bam]

7 minutes ago, GeoElmo6000 said:

 

You already can correct coordinates for different cache types; the OP just wants to see every cache type with corrected coordinates not look like a mystery cache with corrected coordinates.  That's really useful.

The fact you can correct coordinates for cachetypes that are not supposed to be "solved" beforehand in itself is a flaw.

[+bflentje]

On 7/25/2020 at 4:57 PM, CluelessTwo said:

It helps plan, we have a challenge cache which needs us to log 5 different cache types on the same day every month for 12 months.

Seeing everything as blue makes it more difficult.

 

I don't care about the relationship to challenges but I do think this might be one of the most useful suggestions to come out of the Geocaching Topics forum in quite some time. I'd use it as I pre-solve multicaches on many occasions.

[+on4bam]

4 hours ago, bflentje said:

 I pre-solve multicaches on many occasions.

 

Then what's the use of going for a multi if you make it a traditional?

 

[+funkymunkyzone]

18 hours ago, on4bam said:

The fact you can correct coordinates for cachetypes that are not supposed to be "solved" beforehand in itself is a flaw.

 

How so? Are you suggesting a multi must always be completed in one go?

 

I know I've been to the start of a multi on one day and found the final days later. Why should I not be able to add corrected coords on the website?

 

Regarding the OP suggestion of changing the color though, I dont see the point. The blue jigsaw piece is not the solved final of a puzzle, it is the corrected coords of any cache type.

 

And I dont agree with modifying the website/app for every challenge that comes along...

 

[+on4bam]

1 minute ago, funkymunkyzone said:

 

How so? Are you suggesting a multi must always be completed in one go?

 

I know I've been to the start of a multi on one day and found the final days later. Why should I not be able to add corrected coords on the website?

Nope.

So have I. The long weekend of July 21st (our national holiday) it took 3 days biking to get all info on several multis. However, my comment was about "pre-solving" which implies not doing a multi WP by WP but getting coordinates any other way (streetview, search engine for QTA).

[+terratin]

18 hours ago, on4bam said:

The fact you can correct coordinates for cachetypes that are not supposed to be "solved" beforehand in itself is a flaw.

 

Not really. I've done a few multies lately where there was no actual starting location. All locations along a long path and the icon in the middle. Turned out the final was close to where I started. At other times I made a mistake, or the CO made a mistake and I could not finish it. With the help of the CO I still figured out the final location and hence corrected the coords. Or I do a multi with multiple choice type answers. At the final station I chose answer a and walk 1km in the wrong direction and find nothing. Figure out that b is wrong anyway, hence c must be correct, which is 2km back. I come back another time. Of course this would not be a problem with blue puzzle icons either. It might just be a bit neater, like: Oh I really want to go out and get this multi done that I enjoyed so much 2 months ago. But which one is it among all those solved mysteries?

[+on4bam]

Should a system be changed for "a few" cases then?

 

Even for mysteries there are cases where the corrected coordinates are just the start of a multi. Maybe there should then even be a different icon for solved final coordinates and one for solved stating coordinates.

 

Then again I'm one of those people who delete the corrected coordinates from the webpage after the build in checker automatically changes them. I  keep all info in GSAK.

 

[+terratin]

43 minutes ago, on4bam said:

Should a system be changed for "a few" cases then?

 

Even for mysteries there are cases where the corrected coordinates are just the start of a multi. Maybe there should then even be a different icon for solved final coordinates and one for solved stating coordinates.

 

Then again I'm one of those people who delete the corrected coordinates from the webpage after the build in checker automatically changes them. I  keep all info in GSAK.

 

 

See, I don't use gsak for this. I mostly look at the (old) map to see where I'm going, plus project gc of course. But yes, I agree that this is pretty niche and there are a lot more pressing issues.

[+funkymunkyzone]

8 hours ago, on4bam said:

Nope.

So have I. The long weekend of July 21st (our national holiday) it took 3 days biking to get all info on several multis. However, my comment was about "pre-solving" which implies not doing a multi WP by WP but getting coordinates any other way (streetview, search engine for QTA).

 

Your comment was about correcting coordinates on the website, suggesting that one should not be able to correct the coordinates for a multi - that somehow that implied cheating was going on...? I think thats a bit of a stretch.

[+on4bam]

37 minutes ago, funkymunkyzone said:

Your comment was about correcting coordinates on the website, suggesting that one should not be able to correct the coordinates for a multi - that somehow that implied cheating was going on...? I think thats a bit of a stretch.

Again, nope.

I see no use to correct coordinates except for mysteries. I see the final of a multi as a WP of a multi as the posted coordinates and other WPs are all part of the multi. Correcting coordinates of a multi seems like making it just a traditional.

 

[+TmdAndGG]

7 minutes ago, on4bam said:

I see no use to correct coordinates except for mysteries.

We've found a couple of traditionals that had coordinates that were a decent ways off, and other cachers posting better ones in the description (Yes, I believe they had a needs maintenance on them) . I like to use the corrected coordinates feature for those, so we can have the right coordinates before we go out there 

7 minutes ago, on4bam said:

Correcting coordinates of a multi seems like making it just a traditional.

How is correcting the coordinates on a mystery any different?

Edited July 28, 2020 by TmdAndGG

[+on4bam]

3 minutes ago, TmdAndGG said:

We've found a couple of traditionals that had coordinates that were a decent ways off, and other cachers posting better ones in the description (Yes, I believe they had a needs maintenance on them) . I like to use the corrected coordinates feature for those, so we can have the right coordinates before we go out there 

How is correcting the coordinates on a mystery any different?

What percentage of traditionals need to be corrected? 0.000*****?

 

Because it's a mystery (corrected coordinates are needed by design), most are solved at home. Multis are not supposed to be solved at home.

 

BTW, don't get started on "some mysteries are at the posted coordinates". I know there are always exceptions to be found for just about everything.

[+TmdAndGG]

2 minutes ago, on4bam said:

What percentage of traditionals need to be corrected? 0.000*****?

 

Because it's a mystery (corrected coordinates are needed by design), most are solved at home. Multis are not supposed to be solved at home.

 

BTW, don't get started on "some mysteries are at the posted coordinates". I know there are always exceptions to be found for just about everything.

Doesn't matter the percentage. Some traditional's coords still need correcting.

Still makes the final like a traditional....

I won't

Does the system really bother you that much?

[+on4bam]

2 minutes ago, TmdAndGG said:

Doesn't matter the percentage. Some traditional's coords still need correcting.

Still makes the final like a traditional....

I won't

Does the system really bother you that much?

Developer's time can be used for a lot of other stuff than to cater for a small minority of cases.

 

It doesn't bother me at all but.. see above.

[+niraD]

18 minutes ago, on4bam said:

Because it's a mystery (corrected coordinates are needed by design), most are solved at home.

Others are solved in the field. Others are at the posted coordinates. Why does editing the coordinates of a mystery/puzzle cache NOT make it "just a traditional"?

 

Quote

Multis are not supposed to be solved at home.

But if some require multiple trips, and others might not require multiple trips, but some seekers might choose to make multiple trips anyway. Why DOES editing the coordinates of a multi-cache make it "just a traditional"?

 

And FWIW, I found a multi-cache where the CO intended it to be solvable both as a multi (by visiting the celebrity grave and collecting information) and as a puzzle (by researching the celebrity grave and looking up information). If someone edits the coordinates of that cache, does that make it "just a traditional"? Does it matter which approach the person is using?

[+funkymunkyzone]

1 hour ago, on4bam said:

Correcting coordinates of a multi seems like making it just a traditional.

 

Just like correcting coordinates of a puzzle make it just a traditional.

 

What a bizarre argument.

[+funkymunkyzone]

49 minutes ago, on4bam said:

Because it's a mystery (corrected coordinates are needed by design), most are solved at home. Multis are not supposed to be solved at home

 

I *always* update the coords of a multi, i do so in the field using my geocaching app on my smartphone, and it reflects those corrected coords back to geocaching.com.

 

If you're suggesting I shouldn't be able to do that, that somehow that is cheating, then I don't know what planet you're on.

[+The Jester]

There are also some Wherigo's that are play anywhere (some at home, some in any field) but then the final co-ords are displayed - these need to be corrected also.

[+barefootjeff]

One of my multis, GC6JMDK, has three virtual waypoints at three different railway stations, followed by a terrain 4 hike up from one of those stations to the final on the cliff-tops above the valley. While it certainly can all be done in one day, some of the finders have visited the waypoints then returned home to plan their hike for another day. For those, being able to adjust the coordinates to see where the cache lies on the map and satellite image might be a useful workflow. Having the cache appear on the map as a puzzle-piece until it's found could also serve as a reminder of unfinished business. In this case, though, there's probably little need to distinguish it from solved-but-unfound puzzles.

[+CluelessTwo]

On 7/28/2020 at 4:09 AM, bflentje said:

 

I don't care about the relationship to challenges but I do think this might be one of the most useful suggestions to come out of the Geocaching Topics forum in quite some time. I'd use it as I pre-solve multicaches on many occasions.

Exactly, Thank you.

[+Goldenwattle]

8 hours ago, on4bam said:

Again, nope.

I see no use to correct coordinates except for mysteries. I see the final of a multi as a WP of a multi as the posted coordinates and other WPs are all part of the multi. Correcting coordinates of a multi seems like making it just a traditional.

 

I don't always complete a multi on the same day, so when I get to the last WP for that day I will put in the coordinates for the worked out next WP and return and continue the multi another day from that point. I have done some very long multies that have taken me months to complete.

On the other hand, some multies are so simple that I have been able to work them out beforehand and then go straight to GZ.

I wouldn't object to having worked out multies and puzzles different colours, but I don't see the need though. I can click on them and see what they are before I go out caching. More useful would be having multies that are only partly completed a different colour from a multi with the final coordinates. When they are completed, what does it matter if the completed cache is a puzzle or multi. Just go find it.

[+funkymunkyzone]

On 7/28/2020 at 3:09 PM, bflentje said:

 

I don't care about the relationship to challenges but I do think this might be one of the most useful suggestions to come out of the Geocaching Topics forum in quite some time. I'd use it as I pre-solve multicaches on many occasions.

Given you can already pre-solve multis and correct their coords on the website, is the changing of the colour from blue to orange, just a change in color, no other useful functionality, really "one of the most useful suggestions to come out of the Geocaching Topics forum in quite some time"? Really?

[+NLBokkie]

Just to make cachers aware, Cachly does just that: it shows the corrected coördinates AND the exact cache type. Only within the app though, as the corrected coördinates on the geocaching.com map show the correction but still don't show the cache type.

Edited July 29, 2020 by NLBokkie

[+funkymunkyzone]

1 hour ago, NLBokkie said:

Just to make cachers aware, Cachly does just that: it shows the corrected coördinates AND the exact cache type. Only within the app though, as the corrected coördinates on the geocaching.com map show the correction but still don't show the cache type.

Other apps do it too.

[+on4bam]

12 hours ago, funkymunkyzone said:

Just like correcting coordinates of a puzzle make it just a traditional.

 

What a bizarre argument.

There's nothing at the bogus coordinates of a puzzle (most of the time), there is at WP1 of a multi.

 

Using corrected coordinates to continue a multi at a later time also seems weird. The times we did that we just go to WPx and continue.

 

BTW, I'm not forcing anyone not to use corrected coordinates on whatever cachetype, it just isn't logical to sort odd delete the "breadcrumbs" leading to a final.

It's also one of the reasons I've never used "next stage" on any of the GPS's I've used, I just create new WPs.

 

[+Goldenwattle]

28 minutes ago, on4bam said:

There's nothing at the bogus coordinates of a puzzle (most of the time), there is at WP1 of a multi.

 

Using corrected coordinates to continue a multi at a later time also seems weird. The times we did that we just go to WPx and continue.

 

BTW, I'm not forcing anyone not to use corrected coordinates on whatever cachetype, it just isn't logical to sort odd delete the "breadcrumbs" leading to a final.

It's also one of the reasons I've never used "next stage" on any of the GPS's I've used, I just create new WPs.

 

It seems weird to me not to use next stage. Then it's easy to still read the cache instructions, etc, without needing to look for the cache to log onto it. Using next stage, you are already using the cache. Also seems a very logical thing to correct the coordinates of a partly finished multi to the stage one is up to, to continue from there next time. I cannot understand not doing this. Why would anyone want the extra effort to work through a cache to see where they are up to? I know where I am up to when I leave the coordinates at where I am up to.

[+barefootjeff]

49 minutes ago, on4bam said:

Using corrected coordinates to continue a multi at a later time also seems weird. The times we did that we just go to WPx and continue.

 

For the type of multis where all the waypoints are visible and you have to collect information from each one to assemble into the final coordinates, it can sometimes be convenient to separate the information-gathering phase from the hike to GZ. An extreme example of this is a multi on Lord Howe Island. On my first visit to the island, I wasn't planning to do that multi as my reading of the logs suggested the final was probably going to be somewhere I couldn't climb to, but as I had a bit of time to kill, I went around and visited the waypoints, photographing the required information at each one. With extremely limited internet access on the island, it wasn't until I'd returned home that I was able to put all that information together and see on the satellite image where GZ was. It turned out to be not as bad as I'd imagined so a year later I went back, did the hike and climb to GZ and completed the find without having to return to any of the waypoints.