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Coronavirus and Events


AleksSI

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Every country is different (some have no cases, yet). However, common sense tells me no to go where lots of people gather. "Lots" can be any number you're uncomfortable with.

 

An amateur radio fair in the Netherlands scheduled for next week is cancelled although there's no official order to do so (common sense, you know).

 

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Disagree, it's not for Geocaching HQ to rule the lives of everyone all over the world.

 

People should take responsibility for their own safety so if you think people shouldn't be gathering together in your part of the world then cancel your own events and don't go to anyone elses.

 

Furthermore local authorities will impose their own restrictions on gatherings as required by the local situation.

 

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1 hour ago, OusKonNé & Cétyla said:

To the forum moderator : Maybe this topic should be combined with this one previously created :
https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/355644-coronavirus-covid-19-interactive-map-vs-travels-and-events/

 

This thread is specific to the suggestion that "HQ must suspend and disable all events."

 

The other thread is for general sharing of experiences relating to COVID-19's impact to the geocaching community.

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Just like undertaking a T5 cache is at the geocacher's discretion so should going to an event during this time. If you don't want to go, don't.

I've attended several events in Korea while this has been going on and I've had no problems. I would definitely go to more without anticipating any problems.  

 

Edit: Turns out Korea is about the safest place in the world right now. If I were anywhere else, I would be in isolation. 

Edited by Crazedllama
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4 hours ago, on4bam said:

Every country is different (some have no cases, yet). However, common sense tells me no to go where lots of people gather. "Lots" can be any number you're uncomfortable with.

THIS^^^

 

Just use common sense - go if the event is still on, stay home if you are uncomfortable.  If you are the CO of an event, use your own judgement as to whether you cancel the event or keep it on the calendar and see who shows up.  

7 hours ago, AleksSI said:

HQ must suspend and disable all Events.

I don't think HQ should have that authority - leave it to the locals to determine if that step is necessary.

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IMO, HQ should not be making any determination if any or all events should be cancelled. That doesn't mean that HQ shouldn't do anything. I would suggest to HQ that they e-mail some guidance to the CO of all upcoming events, and post that guidance on their help pages. I'll even go so far as to make suggestions as to what that guidance should look like:

  • CO's are responsible for determining if their event should be cancelled, relocated, or postponed.
  • CO's should routinely check with local public health officials for the latest recommendations or rules on public gatherings.
  • CO's may want to post announcements with updates, even if the update is that we are still going ahead with the event.

For new events, the Reviewer may want to pass that guidance onto the CO in a Reviewer Note, and get acknowledgement before publishing the event.

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Keep in mind things can change fast. Around here, a few days ago there was not too much of a problem and "normal" precautions were sufficient.  In the last 24 hours however, all retirement homes went into lock-down and yesterday official recommendation was events/shows with 1000+ attendees were to be cancelled, today almost all events are cancelled.

Hey, even our local club meeting scheduled for tomorrow  evening is cancelled and attendance is mostly only between 15-25.

 

Common sense will do just fine deciding what to do, unfortunately many seen to miss that and start hoarding. People seem keen on toilet paper which is strange as Corona is kind of a flu, not diarrhea :rolleyes:

 

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7 hours ago, AleksSI said:

Lets behave responsibly. World Health Organisation declared a worldwide epidemic.

HQ must suspend and disable all Events.

 

I'm listening to news  most times while awake, and many doctors have noted that the WHO may be taking an extreme stance on the china coronavirus.

Last year we had a lot of folks with flu in the area.   They simply didn't attend events...

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5 hours ago, Crazedllama said:

Just like undertaking a T5 cache is at the geocacher's discretion so should going to an event during this time. If you don't want to go, don't.

I've attended several events in Korea while this has been going on and I've had no problems. I would definitely go to more without anticipating any problems.  

 

ARRRRGGGHHHH!!!  :o

 

Crazy llamas running wild!

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This was posted in the Portugal sub-forum:

(Translated):

 

As the situation of Coronavirus 2019 (COVID-19) evolves rapidly around the world, Geocaching HQ calls on all hosts and participants of Geocaching Events to prioritize the security of themselves and participating geocachers.

At the moment, we advise the organizers of the event to consult the regional health authorities to be aware of the guidelines on gatherings of people. Geocaching HQ usually leaves the decision for the event hosts to continue to provide the event and, for attendees, whether they will participate or not. Volunteer reviewers may suspend the publication of new Events and/or may disable or archive events already published in accordance with the guidance of health authorities.

For geocachers who want to cancel their events, we suggest that:

- Create an ad/announcement record to automatically notify geocachers that the event has been cancelled;
- Archive the event page;
- If you prefer to reschedule the event, submit a new page for review.

 

 

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There will always be responsible and slightly less responsible people. Even among geocachers. A pandemic is declared globally, regardless of the country's incidence rate.
The HQ has the main responsibility for this activity. And HQ leadership should be an example of good practice and spread awareness. Like CITO. Maybe we could even have a souvenir on that topic. 

Edited by AleksSI
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This is a gloabl issue but the decision must be local. Our events have less than 20 people. 99.9% of the time they are all locals. We are all sensible people. Our country has no restrictions on travel or gatherings as all the cases so far (less than 20 ourt of a population of 50 million) are people that have just returned from Europe, mainly Italy. Their contacts have been traced and tested. The closest case to us is 800km away.  With those facts do you suggest we stop all events? I think not.

 

HQ is doing the right thing. Letting the locals decide.

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The following announcement log has just been published to all active upcoming event cache pages:

 

Quote

Geocaching HQ is posting this Announcement on all future Events and CITOs.

As the Coronavirus 2019 (COVID-19) situation is evolving rapidly around the world, Geocaching HQ urges all Event hosts and attendees to prioritize the safety of themselves and their attendees.

 

At this time, we advise Event hosts to consult their regional health authorities to understand the guidance regarding gatherings of people. Generally, Geocaching HQ leaves the decision to Event hosts on whether to continue hosting the Event and to attendees on whether they will participate. In some regions, community volunteer reviewers may suspend publishing new Events and/or may disable, retract, or archive already published Events, in accordance with guidance from health authorities.

 

For hosts who wish to cancel their Events, we suggest that they:
1. Create an Announcement log to notify users that the Event is cancelled.
2. Archive the listing.
3. If hosts wish to reschedule the Event, submit a new listing.

 

Developing this message and the logistics for getting it posted worldwide has been a priority for Geocaching HQ.  

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There is additional, specific guidance for Community Celebration events.  (Archiving this special cache type and submitting a new page doesn't work well, because the pages were awarded to specific hosts and the cache type isn't available for selection on a new cache submission.)  After the introductory statements, here is what HQ is posting on these events:

 

Quote

We want to allow flexibility for hosts who need to reschedule their published Community Celebration Events due to COVID-19 concerns. If hosts wish to reschedule their Community Celebration Event:

1. Create an Announcement log to notify users that the Event is cancelled and may be rescheduled.
2. Disable the Community Celebration Event.
3. Contact the publishing reviewer to retract the Event. 
4. Update the Event date.
5. Submit listing for publication.

 

Edited by Keystone
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1 hour ago, Keystone said:

The following announcement log has just been published to all active upcoming event cache pages:

 

 

Developing this message and the logistics for getting it posted worldwide has been a priority for Geocaching HQ.  

But not on mega/giga events

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1 hour ago, Keystone said:

The following announcement log has just been published to all active upcoming event cache pages:

 

 

Developing this message and the logistics for getting it posted worldwide has been a priority for Geocaching HQ.  

Thank you HQ for doing this!

 

Oddly though, I received a notice for events in some (but not all) of my notification areas, any regular event that I had logged a WA for, and any regular event that I am watching, but I didn't receive a notice for my own event.  I did check and one was posted.  I wonder why the owners of events don't receive this announcement?  Or why I didn't receive a notice for events in all of my notification areas (even though they were also posted)?

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10 hours ago, AleksSI said:

The HQ has the main responsibility for this activity.

HQ is not responsible for anything beyond being a listing site for caches (and events ). They have legal disclaimers which deny such responsibility ,  this is on the first page of the geocache hiding guidelines:

"Geocaching HQ and community volunteers are not in any way responsible or liable for caches or their placement. All aspects of your geocache and its placement are your responsibility, and you may be held liable for any resulting consequences. ."

 

Pandemic means continent and or world wide, conditions vary enormously country to country, day to day .Groundspeak made a sensible decision for what is a global game, let the locals decide.

Most cachers are not stupid, it is unlikely that anyone would set an event in a place where the risk is high.  And if they did, or if you are in a vulnerable group (principally the elderly and people with underlying medical problems) simply don't go.

 

10 hours ago, AleksSI said:

. And HQ leadership should be an example of good practice and spread awareness. Like CITO. Maybe we could even have a souvenir on that topic. 

 

Would this be a souvenir for not attending an event ?!

 

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7 minutes ago, barefootjeff said:

 

I received an email for the announcement that was posted on my Community Celebration event. Have you checked your spam folder?

Yes - Nothing in spam.  If it matters, mine is a regular event, not a CCE.

 

As noted, I received messages for other events, so am obviously aware of the notice.  Just simply pointing out my observations in case the notification process didn't go as intended.

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Just now, RuideAlmeida said:

 

Hi Steve!

Long time, no see...

 

Just check your Event page... I bet the Announcement is there.

Hi Rui!  Hope all is well! 

 

Yes - It's there. I was simply pointing out that I didn't receive an email notification and also that emails for events in my notification areas weren't consistent in case that's not what HQ intended.  If I wasn't supposed to receive an email as the Owner/Host of an upcoming event, then no worries.  It doesn't matter in my case since I received other notices.  But, I was simply pointing out that there may be Event Hosts that didn't receive the HQ message.

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On 3/13/2020 at 5:49 PM, barefootjeff said:

The Australian Prime Minister has just announced that gatherings expecting over 500 people are to be cancelled. I'm not sure how this will affect the upcoming megas here.

Suggested not decreed as each state has sovereignty. 

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19 hours ago, hal-an-tow said:

 

 

Would this be a souvenir for not attending an event ?!

 

 

No. Maybe souvenir for logging non-event type cache with letters CRG inside text.

(Coronavirus Responsible Geocacher)

CRG would mean that nobody found cache three days before me, and I found it alone or only with family members.

Edited by AleksSI
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51 minutes ago, AleksSI said:

 

No. Maybe souvenir for logging non-event type cache with letters CRG inside text.

(Coronavirus Responsible Geocacher)

CRG would mean that nobody found cache three days before me, and I found it alone or only with family members.

Why 3 days ? WHO says there are as yet no research results on how long the virus persists on impermeable surfaces. Do you have better information ?

What makes you think your family members are OK , but other humans are not ?

How would Groundspeak ensure no-one had found the cache within the time period but simply not logged it online yet ? Plenty of people type their logs days later .

Think it through.

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1 hour ago, AleksSI said:

The HQ call is not enough. Maybe this has already happened, local reviewer should have been instructed to cancel the events if:

- the country called for people not to gather or

- country declared a state of emergency.

I repeat :

 

20 hours ago, hal-an-tow said:

HQ is not responsible for anything beyond being a listing site for caches (and events ). They have legal disclaimers which deny such responsibility ,  this is on the first page of the geocache hiding guidelines:

"Geocaching HQ and community volunteers are not in any way responsible or liable for caches or their placement. All aspects of your geocache and its placement are your responsibility, and you may be held liable for any resulting consequences. ."

 

Pandemic means continent and or world wide, conditions vary enormously country to country, day to day .Groundspeak made a sensible decision for what is a global game, let the locals decide.

Most cachers are not stupid, it is unlikely that anyone would set an event in a place where the risk is high.  And if they did, or if you are in a vulnerable group (principally the elderly and people with underlying medical problems) simply don't go.

 

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23 minutes ago, hal-an-tow said:

Why 3 days ? WHO says there are as yet no research results on how long the virus persists on impermeable surfaces. Do you have better information ?

What makes you think your family members are OK , but other humans are not ?

How would Groundspeak ensure no-one had found the cache within the time period but simply not logged it online yet ? Plenty of people type their logs days later .

Think it through.

 

I wrote "maybe" which means it is not a proposal, it is a thinking under what conditions geocachers could perform activities in a pandemic situation.

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25 minutes ago, hal-an-tow said:

What makes you think your family members are OK , but other humans are not ?

 

How would Groundspeak ensure no-one had found the cache within the time period but simply not logged it online yet ? Plenty of people type their logs days later .

 

Yeah...  I can't get sick right now, and my family's dropping things at the door JIC.

 

We have a cacher here that's so busy, they have a backlog on cache finds from at least two states.     :)

IIRC, a forum regular (or their spouse) was the same.

Ours takes a pic of all logs they sign because they might log over a month later.   

"Not found three days before" for me would be an easy task.  Just moving to 2.5T and up in terrain is almost a given here these days.    :D

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7 minutes ago, AleksSI said:

 

I wrote "maybe" which means it is not a proposal, it is a thinking under what conditions geocachers could perform activities in a pandemic situation.

You are simultaneously suggesting events worldwide be summarily archived by reviewers, because of the possibility of infection, and suggesting a souvenir to encourage people to go out and  find caches . Finders can have no idea what time period has elapsed since the cache was last handled: someone might have visited five minutes before they arrive .

 

I'm done with this thread : the prefix  'pan' in pandemic is derived from Greek and means wide geographical spread, it appears to be interpreted as 'panic' !

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Quote

HQ is not responsible for anything beyond being a listing site for caches (and events ). They have legal disclaimers which deny such responsibility ,  this is on the first page of the geocache hiding guidelines:

 

HQ promotes the social responsibility of geocachers (through CITO and other ways). According to the Gaussian curve, among geocachers are also socially irresponsible geocachers. HQ provides them with logistical support for their activity. Is HQ socially responsible in a pandemic situation?

Edited by AleksSI
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1 hour ago, AleksSI said:

HQ promotes the social responsibility of geocachers (through CITO and other ways). According to the Gaussian curve, among geocachers are also socially irresponsible geocachers. HQ provides them with logistical support for their activity. Is HQ socially responsible in a pandemic situation?

No.

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8 hours ago, AleksSI said:

The HQ call is not enough. Maybe this has already happened, local reviewer should have been instructed to cancel the events if:

- the country called for people not to gather or

- country declared a state of emergency.

Again I have to ask is this your opinion as a healthcare professional?

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